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Super l33t old skool coolness courtesy of @heroshark!

I have done the same and agree with you on this.

Think we’ve reached the “put up or shut up” point , general consensus seems to be we do need something now so me personally I’m going to start pushing UKAPU as my chosen option from now on so I’ve up’ed my membership from the free one to the gold membership to give them more funds . May not be the ‘perfect’ answer or solution but they’ve got an established organisation in place (They’ve been around since 2010 , in airsoft turns that’s bloody historic !) and if everyone joins then they’ve got the backing to OFFICIALLY represent us as a sport/recognisable hobby/leisure activity .

Heheheh @Tacklemight be a idea of asking/getting @proffrink to set up new section/corner “Sewing with @Druid799 & @MiK“ I’m almost done with mine, just need to decide on the back panel - solid or strapping, if I want to put a radio holder on the back shoulder and some place for a patch or two.

Me personally I’d rather not have a full blown governing body overseeing airsoft , but I now realise we do need a visible national ‘organisation’ (nothing to do with this ‘open/not open sites debacle , think this has just galvanized the discussion)representing us to the Gov/local Gov/local councils/etc hence I’m now fully supporting UKAPU , as I said earlier ATB definitely has its place(representing the people who make a living from the sport) but I don’t want them to have overall control as I genuinely believe it’s not in my or my fellow players best interest to have that happen . Where as UKAPU is a player based organisation so one would think they’d be out to safeguard the players best interests over fiscal interests like ATB would be ?

A pointer about the free memberships: Free is nice. But free does nothing for them but getting numbers, for any official government body or sports England etc overlooking it doesn’t show ‘true’ committed members (UKARA is better on that front as it is people who have committed a level of playing and joined a site) Delta Force (Tesco’s of paintball) attempted to make a claim with sports England by counting everyone who has played their rental sites calling them ‘members’ - they were laughed out. The UKPSF made a move to boost membership with a free option, it was a terrible struggle to get people to put their name on a piece of paper. Either valuing it as nothing because it was free or wondering what the con was It was known that sport England would not recognise free members, but the intent was to hook people and try to gain upgrades later. It’s only been in the last year with Covid that players have paid attention again. (From the 90s the UKPSF was one man, it took him stating that he was going to step down in 2014 to make people realise that it was about to become nothing, and for the last few years it has had a true committee and is making slow progress) Airsofts main action was probably 2006 & 2007 with the VCR bill/act, and is behind in those terms. But airsoft players have not been able to just totally sit back due to the need for UKARA etc - so there’s a possible advantage there that may beat player apathy If you can do so, sign up with a paid option. The money is probably all spent on the patches etc, or a tiny element remains - but it shows commitment from you to the game. If they get a penny left over per person then that will eventually make a £1 and they can afford a phone call to government

The EAA (European Airsoft Association.) Which are UKAPUs partner. Stopped a bill going ahead in the EU that came very nearly to passing, that would ban Airsoft entirely within the EU. Instead they turned it around so that Airsoft was recognised as a non Firearm's "activity". Which has made Airsoft more secure then ever before in the EU. So a Players Union really does make a difference if given the power.

@AlphaBear You can join UKAPU for nowt ie zero, nothing, nada, zilch but there is a £5/year sub and a £10/year sub (yes, you do get a patch for £5 and get two for £10!) If a £10 a year secures Airsoft’s future from some knee-jerk shitkicking cause some fool has gotten hold of a RIF and got the law involved I think a tenner isn’t that much and imagine if everyone here had a £5 or £10 sub (thats’s like 1 or 2 less grenades/pints/Maccie-Dee’s a year) the amount of funds available to fight/lobby the powers that be in Westminster for the “sport” we all love ?

Well you kind of answered your own question! Who would run it? I dont know. Someone smarter then I. I think UKAPU have the right people in charge personally and would do a reasonable job. As we pay in our subs, they would be accountable to it's members as a union. It's better then the "nothing" we have representing us now.

"I know you are, but what am I?"😛

I have ordered from them several times this year and it has not been an issue. Next day or 2 at most. Yes, this was on the BBC website as a scam. Royal mail will never ask you anything like this via text.

I would also say that the “two-tone” for non defence sales also needs tightened/looked at - all it takes is another 12yr old being given/getting hold of a pistol and being raided by the police like last year or the lad stopped in Brum a few years back, this will do so much damage to anything that is tried to make Airsoft legit. I’m not pointing fingers at the vendors to be at fault but parents also need educating more at point of sale/be held responsible when they buy their “innocent little angel” a two-tone or allow one to be brought into their household. I am a realist and I know bad things could happen if someone picks up a rif who isn’t meant to but not having a “body” who will speak on our behalf or for the rights of the sport things like everyone has mentioned in this thread or another pandemic and us not being counted as a sport will only keep repeating.

I just signed up with a free account to at least show my intent to UKAPU and I also have two sons (over 18) who both play and will recommend they do likewise. As someone relatively new to the sport and to UKAPU it would be nice if someone (apologies if they already have I missed it) said that in principle, that they (UKAPU) would be willing to represent the sport as a governing body. I would happily up my membership to paid to help facilitate that happening and them having a true voice to represent us all.

I can run a 4 minute mile But not necessarily in 4 minutes

Aluminium isn't great as a conductor and isn't going to stand up to much mechanical abuse in that application. Better to get a ring crimp like @Hudson suggested.

Paintball fully has RIFs ((in my opinion - others may like to disagree)) Its been ‘tested’ a number of times. Not just the obvious magfeds, but also hoppers that look like firearms and a police study highlighted almost the whole stock of a retailer - anything black. In the early days of VCRA a least one batch of pistols to a distributor was ceased & destroyed. With the UKPSF nothing has proceeded against paintball RIFs or potential RIFs, and though not strictly to the absolute word of the VCRA & skirmishing there has been feedback from the Home Office that UKPSF may pass the test in court. (Preferably that home office guidance prevents something getting as far as court to get tested) The look of paintball, plus the two images of either rambos or stag/hen parties hasn’t prevented any progress with Sport England etc A benefit to paintball is the well established tournament formats, which aid the competition element with an international flavour. If recognised status is achieved then recreational paintball will benefit as the grass roots feed to the ‘sporting’ element —— that’s government and lottery grants etc Airsoft could equally follow a similar path. On a sporty look there is speedsoft, which I think mostly remains a style rather than an established ‘sport’ version, but there’s also competition shooting with airsoft which aligns nicely with other shooting sports

In addition. I am seriously thinking of throwing my hat in the ring for the vacant London Representative of UKAPU post. Though I somehow think doing the site reviews would not be possible if I did! I keep forgetting that the UKAPU Consultant Matt Furey King's Father was my wood working teacher at Secondary school back in Bristol! Matt is was also the president of the European Airsoft Association for many years.

It's not that UKAPU is ready to go to be that representation. It's that I believe they are the closest thing that we have now that could become that representation. Who are they? UKAPU Committee Biographies | UKAPU Why are they the right people? From a personal standpoint, they helped me get a RIF into the country that had been seized by border force. They have been a source of sensible legal advice for airsofters playing in the pandemic and have been almost always been correct. They have a code of Conduct, Rules of Affiliation and more. They help not only the common Airsoft player, but also site owners and retailers. Yes you could create a company no problem. But you don't already have thousands of members already signed up? UKAPU have some sort of legitimacy and outreach within the Airsoft community that others including the Airsoft Trade Federation simply don't have. ---------- I would hate if a commercial entity represents us. Imagine if Frank at FireSupport succeeded all that time ago to get the importation of Airsoft RIFS banned unless it was imported through them? (It was a possibility!). Imagine if the exclusive club, the old triumvirate of retailers who run UKARA represented the hobby as a whole? UKAPU is my preference over all other candidates. They are not perfect and need some work, but they are in a far better position then anyone else.

Many people know my opinion in the need for a bonified license, which would only come with a governing body and recognition as a valid hobby/sport. However some people don't want this recognition because people don't like change and oversight. It works for them right now, so why change? The answer is, Airsoft has been in or around part of this grey area of legality and acceptability for a very long time, which cant last forever. Are we allowed to continue, be visible and be legitimate, or not be legal and become underground? The risk of trying to find out once and for all is that we might get the wrong answer. But I think it's something we really have to deal with as Airsofters and get a definitive answer. If we come out of the gate wanting to become legitimate, it would give us an advantage in negotiations, rather then skulking around in the shadows waiting for an "incident" to bring the problem to us completely unprepared to deal with it. I support some form of recognition and legitimate representation, as it would help legitimise Airsoft in the eyes of lawmakers and set us apart from the idiots with RIF's in public that you find in the newspapers. Airsoft itself may come across a bigger (Unspecified) threat in the very near future which if we had representation in place, could help fight off whatever it is more effectively; rather then scramble around at the last minute fighting amongst ourselves to organise. If we have no representation in place to already deal with an (unspecified) threat, we would in a far worse position to defend Airsoft. Airsoft is already or will become political for those outside of the hobby, we need to acquire the tools to negotiate, defend and come out the other side as a legitimate sport or hobby. It might mean it would be harder to get into the sport as a new player, it might mean paying a regular yearly fee and as a result might mean less money flowing to retailers, but at least it will save the hobby as a whole which is far more important. Bottom line. I don't mind paying more money to help safeguard what we do.

Looks to me like some people think it’s a good idea and some don’t. End of the day until everyone agree that it’s a good thing we won’t have real representation as players. If we can’t even agree ourselves how the hell are the site owners, retailers and authorities. i know airsoft is expensive but it’s hardly going to cost hundreds a year to join the governing body (maybe save the takeaway money for a couple of weeks ). Plus there could be sponsorship etc. frankly I’m a little baffled as why people would be so against it. Makes sense to me and legitimatises airsoft as a sport. Surely a good thing?

If it ain't broke don't fix it! I know that maxim goes over the head of a lot of you who buy a brand new gun and proceed to tear it apart lol. Another good old saying.. too many cooks spoil the broth....think about it! Regards

Nothing's changed. The rules always stated that that date referred to organised team sport which has always been defined previously as having a governing body.

Does anyone have news on this? King Arms stated the long-awaited reissue of their FAL/SLR rifles were due last year but I guess COVID put a stop to that. Haven't heard anything since but I hope they still are coming as I've probably been waiting for them to restock for like 8 years haha.

Thanks for that. Yeah, they posted endlessly about their new Thompson, M4s and that weird looking modernised M1 carbine yet totally neglected their promised FALs. Seems stupid considering how much people love the FN rifles but like you said let's hope that LCT gives them the nudge. Will take a look at that questionnaire.

King Arms said in 2019 that they would be re-releasing the Fal line in 2020. Well Covid hit and the release date was pushed back into the end of that year. It was then given as early 2021. Since then info has been fairly scarce, there was then a social media post claiming it would now be 2022. On the other hand without any particular fanfare the company's Galil ARM showed up restocked at WGC shop recently so there may still be hope. VFC have a FN FAL (VFC LAR model)which they are claiming will be out in September or October, it's a GBBR so might reduce the usefulness. The company has released GBBR and AEG models of the same type in the past like the HK 416. So if it sells well or they get enough feedback it they might pursue it in electric form. Other companies might opt to release a version. G&G have their Type 64 and LCT have their extensive G3 range. So one of them might get brave and decide to go down the FAL route. At the moment if you go to the LCT facebook page they have a questionnaire that they are requesting people fill out. One of the questions is what one replica would you like the company to produce. A couple of hundred airsofters suggesting a FN FAL might help draw their attention to it. One last point is a successful launch of VFC LAR might finally nudge King Arms to re-release their bloody FAL. At the moment they seem content to be cranking out pistol calibre M4 GBBRs and M1 carbine. Still hope springs eternal...

fingers crossed can get some news on them one of the rifs im really looking forward to owning

Very grown up! Lol 🤭😀 Do you mean cellotex? That stuffs bloody expensive lol.

Naughty! No firing in the safe zone.lol 😉 Regards

Nowt much difference to this place then!

they are a scam matey it’s usually for £2.99 or something little and they link to a fake royal mail site you should report them ”Text message Suspicious text messages should be forwarded to 7726. This free-of-charge short code enables your provider to investigate the origin of the text and take action, if found to be malicious.” I usually copy the text you get and then start a new text to 7726 and type in the number it came from and then paste the message in and then copy it all again and hit send it will then ask you to add then number so I just paste the whole message in again - the number 7726 works for all mobile carriers

Balystik reg will do dual line no problems. you could tap your mags for cheap dual wielding but I've heard it isn't as effective or fun as you'd think. I absolutely guarantee you that the Battlecats are blocking the suez right now. That's just the luck we've had with them.

yeah baby

beware of those royal mail texts saying your short on postage - it won’t end well

The other benefit alongside how consistent HPA is, is with tuning your trigger. That consistency means you don't have to account for cool down leading to it suddenly wanting to run away from you, so to speak. I tried it and simply found it wasn't for me, with the reasons being very much specific to me, the big two being: It just felt weird to hold both because of the bulk of the adapter and the AR mags themselves. I find the same with extended pistol mags (tapped or not), I just can't get on with something protruding that far out of the grip. Having to run a tank on my kit. In general I like to run chest rigs with nothing bulky on my back, and that never felt like an option with HPA and is largely the reason I've left it behind. Can't fault the benefits when it comes to overall performance, and the 'downsides' are well documented at this point. Edit: I tended to use a 36" line with HPA'd stuff, when using a pistol 42" felt like a better length. Just gave a bit more freedom of movement. Mileage will likely vary based your exact set up but felt worth mentioning/thinking about.

Fan boi'ing aside, HPA gives a far more consistent and cleaner propellant in a hi capa (well most gbb's). The M4 mag thing does get frowned at but you need to use one to appreciate it and then it just becomes "your thing" and you end up "that guy". A fried of mine, staunchly against HPA and certainly against M4 mags into pistols played 1 day against me using mine and was sold.

He said “shag” Funar Funar ! 🤤

I never thought of the extra bulk of the poly mags. I’ve just had another look and noticed the extra thicker body construction of them. There is a lot more bulk and overhang that’s for sure and looking at the photos they do stick out a tad more. And if one rolls with a single point sling I expect ones RIF will be clanking against them too. Food for thought.... I play exclusively woodland ( for the moment ) so no speedy type running around lark.

You can always get a small ring connector for the wire and use the little screw to secure it that way.

I like your solution, and it looks pretty sturdy... But check out what I did. I started making these back in 2012, and it's a "drop in" part that fits inside of the void of the buttplate. The only tool needed to install these is a screw driver, and that makes it really easy for the end user. Every once in a while I'll run a production batch of them as a solution to the sling problem. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYfXFbvzgxo

a very valid question, and i suspect the single biggest barrier any organisation is going to have at the outset. once it's established, well known, and has the majority of the player/site/retailer base behind it then it'll be an organisation with weight like the fia or (i don't know football so just pretend i put a football appropriate acronym instead of this long-ass bracket) as you say initially such an organisation is going to have no power, no weight, and very little efficacy when it starts out. hence the initial questioning of what organisations already exist that perhaps could be transformed into the role rather than starting afresh.

interested to see how it goes, it's gonna be hit hard with active brake and precocking- i am not a kind man to motors. gonna have a very similar build to my akm too, so a good side by side comparison. tbh i'm glad someone's taking a serious go at bringing brushless to the airsoft world, i mean brushed motors were old hat in rc when i started and that was over a decade ago. but then this is a hobby where nimh's still exist (nicads even)......

are you meaning sites that are run by airsoft players as opposed to businessmen? because from what i've seen those kinds of sites can have issues of becoming cliquey/unwelcoming to folks outside the core group. there is value in the owner/marshall staff of a venue having a certain impartiality to the player base. as i mentioned in the op it's more than just the lockdown issue, although that is a symptom that highlights the problem. the main thing (for me at least, others will have their own opinions) is the airsoft lottery where sites can be pretty decent to woefully bad, with the most common symptom being very weak organisation/enforcement of rules with chronic lack of marshalling. there's also the issue of fighting the legal battles, say the government decides a flat 1j limit would be a good idea- who have we got to fight that? if they see one too many daily fail article about some chav and his pew being dumb and decide to bring in all the 2-tones, that kind of thing. in the long run a site should want to sign up to the governing body, make it a badge of honour, if you're part of that network is means you're site is going to have systems in place to be consistent, and players will want to play at your site because they know you're able to offer them a good time. additionally a body representing hundreds of sites that follow a consistent ruleset will probably have a better chance of getting a good insurance bulk deal than a bunch of independants. i for one don't like walking off-site before lunchtime because a group of arseholes has picked to play at that field and the site won't or can't do anything to address the issue. that's kind of our point, currently every site owner is his own cook, does things his own way. what we want is mcdonalds- it might not be the best, but you know what you're getting. i hate how much i agree with this

UKAPU would be the obvious choice

Old blackout curtains. If you can find the double lined velvet ones they should be heavy enough not to move a lot, and with a dense ruffle I doubt a bb will even make them move. https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Fabulous-1970s-Vintage-Curtains-Brown-Velvet-Velour-Retro-210-drop-228-width/254912494297?hash=item3b59f7fad9%3Ag%3A0fQAAOSwLEJgT2Ab&LH_Auction=1

suddenly i understand why the WE luger's hop unit is upside down......

Fresh from Mark at FMJUK, here’s my crack at building a DMR Semi only, chronos in at 430-435 with 0.2’s. Started life as a two-tone Cyma that needed some tlc. Fresh spring, new hop unit+barrel, changed the motor to a higher torque Infinity and rewired it for standard Gate-style mosfets. Picked up a wooden stock from Airsofttiger. Sanded, stained and finished etc. Sanded off seam lines, got some slightly unusual (but real-steel accurate) Winchester trades cut and sent it off for a coat of Cerakote E110 Midnight.

Now that is UGLY as sin, but I like it!!

I have had a good day.