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OK so further to discussion elsewhere on the forum, if I can get patches made for about £8 posted, how many of you will want 1 or more? My plan is to have a bit less margin and have the finished article being about 65mm high, with a plain black edge and velcro on the back. I've redone the pic in higher quality as a pdf for the manufacturer's software to deal with easier. You can see that here. I have asked for a price for a few sized batches and to have about 5mm extra margin all around the pdf image. Any ideas, things i've missed, etc please don't hold back. For now, guessing by other patches i know have been similar i'm guessing at about £8 posted per unit, but depending on take up, it could be a shade more, but then again if it goes monster it will be less...

Legal to own... illegal to import without a suitable defence. Which as far as customs are concerned is UKARA or nothing. No such thing as a license, never has been, never will be.

Here's the rub: - There is no such thing as a a UKARA "license". You can become a UKARA registered skirmisher however... - It's NOT illegal to own or buy a RIF, whether you are a registered skirmisher or not. End of story. - It IS illegal for a retailer to sell you a RIF if you are under 18 or cannot provide a defence against prosecution under the VCRA - which is where becoming a registered skirmisher comes in. - It IS illegal to "manufacture" a RIF without the aforementioned defence. - Two tones are not considered realistic and therefore as long as you are over 18, a retailer can sell you one. This stuff has been covered countless times elsewhere...

CYMA AK?

^ The 'point of putting them in there' is to ensure that entitled groups (those with the 'specific defences') are not prosecuted, but not being prosecuted for something is not the same as not having committed an offence. What jcheeseright is suggesting is also my interpretation of the law. The VCRA clearly defines importation of a RIF as an offence. Therefore it is illegal. It then goes on to note that those groups who have a specific defence against prosecution will not be prosecuted for this offence if they can demonstrate such as defence (such as the much touted 'airsoft defence' which is not one of those defences found in the original VCRA anyway but was later added here: http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2007/20072606.htm). The fact that you will not be prosecuted for an act does not mean that act wasn't an offence, and therefore against the law. It may render it 'de facto legal,' in as much as you can seemingly do something illegal whilst knowing you won't be prosecuted for it, but that doesn't actually make the act any less of an offence. The term you used yourself, "answered for," highlights this; you can't answer a question if the question hasn't first been asked, and you can't answer for an offence with a defence against prosecution unless you have first committed an offence.

there's no part under that which makes the import of a RIF legal under any circumstances. It's ALWAYS illegal, much like the sale is ALWAYS illegal, we simply have a defence against prosecution for committing that crime.

Yup. I once brought a 20 foot long braided leather bullwhip back from Spain, for a former girlfriend who collected them (don't ask lol). I walked through Customs in Spain with it wrapped in thin tissue paper, and was duly stopped by them. 'You cannot have that in the cabin senor, since it is classed as a weapon.' say they. 'How could I hijack an airliner with a whip? Who do you think I am, Indiana Jones?' say I. Customs do not like jokes by the way. So, the whip had to be handed to a Cabin Crew member for the duration of the flight. Now, picture the scene. There I am coming off the plane at Manchester airport, and I pass through Customs, and there is my girlfriend waiting for me, I walk across the concourse toward her, when this drop dead gorgeous stewardess who I had been chatting to on the flight back comes running up to me, shouting 'Al, Al, you forgot your whip!'

That guy is an airsofter. Clothes are too clean. (Yes, I know he is'nt.)

I'll stop you right there. THERE IS NO REQUIREMENT FOR A REASON TO OWN A RIF. NONE. You can OWN as many RIFs as you want, unless you commit a crime with them the police cannot do anything. The things legislated against are SELLING, IMPORTING, and MANUFACTURE. Posession of a RIF is not something you require a defence for. EVER.

Yeah, sorry that was a little facetious of me. Top right corner of the forum is a little envelope. Click on that and it'll show you your inbox. Click on the title of a conversation and you'll see the messages, that's where you'll be able to reply. The green tick thingy is like a "like", yes. Like "like" on Facebook, like.

Chock, 'Special Forces' when referring to US military units ( certainly with official sources) almost always means US Army Special Forces, other wise known as green berets. They're a specific unit split into 7 groups. It's a common misconception that the term special forces refers to all SOCOM and JSOC units, or anyone that's not conventional infantry... But with the yanks, it's just that one unit; US Army Special Forces.

gave in & bought 2 x CM122 pistols on offer at Gunfire @ 40Euro or about £32 each that a47 was blue and after sanding (fairy ain't shifting that amount of paint) it came out with a sort of light faded or aged look - still plastic but smooth as a baby's ar$e coat of varnish to finish and she will do me - still got a touch of blue on bottom of stock (looks better/darker is wiped with damp cloth hence a coat of varnish will be sweet) pic may appear bluey in places on some parts of stock but trust me it ain't like that at all - no sirs (seriously was on an OCD mission to get every possible bit off - took hand guard off too & de-blued the holes etc..) wasn't too bad really - heavy/medium/fine sandpaper & a bit of elbow grease

Aaaand I'm out.

Cheers Mack, looks like you're on the money

Hi. Your wallet is already weeping.

Add an order for me mate Easy to remove if someone gets offended - if so they really shouldn't be airsofting though haha

Having a defence against prosecution is not the same as not having committed an offence. Not being prosecuted for an offence does not make it any less illegal to commit that offence just that you will not be punished for that offence.

Umarex don't actually make any of those guns, they are chinese clones of other makes which Umarex rebrand with trademarks (H&K etc), although they are supposedly made with better quality control than the standard Jing Gong (or whatever make) versions. Also they are marked as 350fps+ so they may be too "hot" for your local site, meaning you'd have to get them downgraded. G&G do various guns (mainly M4 variants) which come highly recommended by many on here, but as I don't have any experience of that make I'd have to leave it to others to recommend a particular gun (which I'm sure they will ).

this: plus this: 100% head protection, chuck a scarf on and your neck is covered as well. The goggles are a set of ESS profile turbofans with a 'sansei' style lower trimmed and cable tied on. Helmet is a repro crye airframe, but a fast style helmet will work just as well, Peltor Comtac headphones on arc rail adapters protect ears from BBs and loud noises.

Any TM high cycle and you're set for life.

Thanks I appreciate all the help It would be easier just to get a defence then go against the law. This is all i wanted to know

These are made with Hocks Noise Brakers http://www.hocksproducts.com/hocks_noise_braker%C2%AE so they claim to reduce high SPL sounds while still allowing normal hearing of speech. We'll see. If that doesn't pan out I'll be looking at the Peltor electronic 6S ear defenders which I know work well having used some for shooting.

Yes, illegal, not 'considered illegal', actually properly written down in law illegal, as in against the law. IMPORTING A RIF IS AGAINST THE LAW. Regardless of your chances of being caught, it is still a crime.

It is absolutely illegal, importation is importation!! driving over the border with a RIF is AGAINST THE LAW. Even for those of us with a valid defence, it is still illegal, it's just that defence means that you cannot be prosecuted for breaking that law, doesn't mean we're not breaking it!

No. That would not be illegal, although you could understand that obviously there would be questions asked if you walked through the scanners at Heathrow with a RIF in your bag. Specifically, the law on the matter says that it is illegal to import a RIF, unless it is for one of the following reasons: A It is for the purposes of a museum or gallery; B It is for the purposes of theatrical performances and of rehearsals for such performances; C It is for the production of films (within the meaning of Part 1 of the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 (c. 48)_see section 5B of that Act); D It is for the production of television programmes (within the meaning of the Communications Act 2003 (c. 21)_see section 405(1) of that Act); E It is for the organisation and holding of historical re-enactments organised and held by persons specified or described for the purposes of this section by regulations made by the Secretary of State; F It is for the purposes of functions that a person has in his capacity as a person in the service of Her Majesty. Reason E is the one related to airsoft, and the easiest way to demonstrate that, is with a UKARA registration number, which is why people get them. So if you were stopped at Customs, it would obviously be most expedient to say 'here is my UKARA number, go ahead and check it'. I'm willing to bet that it would not be a five minute wait before you got waved through with a cheery smile, but that is nevertheless the law as it stands.

Haha the bottom one!

Yeah, on the obscenity issue - we are simulating killing people with assault weapons. I know it's a game and it is just a laugh, but if anyone seriously thinks that the word "fuck" is more offensive than assault weapons, real or imaginary, then they can indeed fuck right off.

Go - on then put me down for one heck make that two - one front & one on back for when my dumb a$$ team shoot me (yeah I know sometimes I deserve it) serious - you got 2 orders from moi if you get them off ground some people may find it a little offensive perhaps - well yeah we are attacking this round ffs but if they really find it offensive reading the patch on front - I will point them to the other one at the back Would be a sure fire way of all meeting up at NAE - easy to identify AF-UK miserable old farts (though don't think Dev will be sending these out to all - only grumpy bastids can apply)

mechanix are top notch, if you get fastfits they're cheap too.

You need to reply through the messenger section of this website, not email.

politely - if possible if a discussion is starting to get little heated, always best to pm your feelings rather than 8itch and have ego's dented etc..... and say cheers for them taking time to message/reply to you (unless you are calling each every name under sun then that is fine coz ya both already rude)

True

Would rather use the money to get my usual blasters than to just piss about in the garden.

Not really. It's just a cupboard full of toys which I have a site membership card to prove I play with. I don't shoot them in the garden (mainly because I hate BBs being everywhere) so no reason for neighbours to complain.

Pair of spangly dangly SureFire earplugs to try and stop my tinnitus getting any worse. Nice and comfy!

TM Recoil SCAR-H with genuine Trijicon ACOG or Elcan SpectreDR. mmmmmmm......recoil SCAR......

Hi and welcome to the forums. I'm also from Manchester (Stockport), so I will no doubt see you at some point at a skirmish. With regard to First and Only, as I'm sure you noticed, they have a lot of sites around the NW, and if you are in Manchester or the surrounding area, it means there's a lot of scope, but some of their sites sort of stretch the notion that they are in Manchester, for example, their Manchester Woodland site is actually out past Bolton up in the Hills next to Delph Reservoir, and two of their other sites are in Swinton. The only one that I would say genuinely is near the centre of what I would regard as Manchester, is their indoor CQB site at Middleton. Of course if you have a car, then it's not a big deal. The site in Middleton incidentally, has midweek evening skirmishes, so is convenient for fitting in a bit of fun after work. I went to the First and Only Manchester Woodland Site on the Sunday after Christmas (think it was December 27th), when it was snowing and pretty cold, but even though it was right in the hangover period right after Christmas, and a cold day, I estimate that there were 50-60 people there, many of whom were regulars (many F&O patches on uniforms were in evidence). That gives you an indication of the loyalty of F&O's regular attendees, which is always a good sign. The organisation of the event was top notch, very professional (you can usually tell that from the safety briefing at the start of the day). They took particular care to ensure that any sniper rifles and DMRs running air tanks were competition locked to site power limits (which is another sign of a professionally run site). New players who were renting gear were well looked after, which is always nice to see, and it was obvious that care was being taken to ensure they felt included, and they were given very thorough briefings on how to get the best out of their hired G36 assault rifles. There was a shop on site, set up in a tent, where you could buy everything from weapons to protective clothing, dinner was included, free tea and coffee was available, toilet facilities were good. It's also worth noting that the staff were ready to help people who had any issues with their gear, for example, one of my M4 rifles had the rear stock come loose, and they helped me to sort it out, even though I actually ended up using my other M4 anyway. Battles were good too, quite varied and always with an eye on keep the action going. That woodland site is very muddy in places and a large amount of fallen trees mean that it can be quite arduous to get from one place to another (which is good, especially in terms of available cover). But because of that, it is worth being aware that if you spend all day at a woodland site at this time of year, to make sure you wrap up warm and dry, and unless you are fit and healthy, you will probably end up knackered by the end of the day, so it's a great way to keep fit. The shower you have when you get home will probably feel like the best shower you have ever had lol. Your other option for skirmish sites in and around Manchester, is Trojan Airsoft, who have an indoor CQB its in a six storey mill in Stockport town centre, literally spitting distance from the Bus Station and about a three minute walk from the railway station, so if you are without transport, that one is dead easy to get to and from, and they too have midweek evening skirmishes, which I often go to. Much of that takes place in very low light conditions, with battles ranging across all six storeys of the mill. CQB like that is not everyone's cup of tea of course, since if often ends up with grenade and pistol battles around the stairways, as opposed to fights at woodland sites, where there's more sniper and assault rifle action. Because of that, Trojan also have a woodland site out near Macclesfield, which is okay (not as good as the F&O one, but still pretty good), but it is kind of hard to find and, like quite a few woodland skirmish sites, not easy to get to if you don't have a car. Trojan's mill site has a pretty decent shop (although it was in fact broken into earlier this week, so stock might be a bit ropey at the moment), their woodland site usually sells ammo and a few bits and pieces too, although unlike at F&O, you'd be well advised to take what you need.

From here: http://www.bbguns365.co.uk/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=59&products_id=512 Which means it is a two tone, but I have it on good authority from Sitting Duck on this forum that the blue is sprayed rather than moulded material, and under the blue it is a wood colour, so it's just a case of removing that and it'll be a RIF, although apparently it was a bit of an arse ache to remove the blue according to SD. It appears that site had three for sale yesterday at that price, and I bought one, so if you fancy one, then that presumably means they have two left, and that is definitely the cheapest place to get hold of one, they are around 150 quid everywhere else.

All it needs is a middle finger instead of the crown and it would make a great patch.

Warhead 9mm Conversion Kit and Magpul PTS MOE Grip

G&G Combat Machine M4s. That's the best for a beginner.

Had a little organise after nightshift today. Just need to stain the wood to blend it in;

Let us know how you get on with that, please. Looks like good kit, but @ £80 + P&P i'm wondering if it is really worth it compared to Ohshibooms...

Marui based G3 build with full metal body and original wood kit

I'm a tech based in Dorset and do a few custom builds. I'll pop some up here (a mix of personal guns and customers) let me know what you think To start.. Steampunk M14

No doubt after some more Tesco-style creative accounting to placate the shareholders, your £2.50 windfall will show up on Tesco's books as profits having increased by approximately 250 million pounds or so.

Let's be honest. Once you've bought the first one, it gets easier and easier to justify buying more guns. Get something cheap and cheerful to begin with and before long you'll have a veritable arsenal! My first was a CA M15A4 for which I paid the grand sum of £120 and 3 years later it still has a regular outing for CQB, despite the fact I have 5 others to choose from...

No idea what could be causing that. I've had 18650 batteries getting really quite warm in normal use before, so that wouldn't necessarily be a problem if it was happening. Do you have the other eye lens from the goggles you used and can I buy it if so?