Novritsch's New Heavier Full Thrust Bb's.

[Cr0-Magnon]

Just when you had thought (hoped), they'd gone away, he's back now offering a whopping 0.62g (non bio) 6.44mm projectiles. 

 

Does anyone on here use this system? Do UK sites allow it?

 

0.62g seems getting in to the realms of the rediculous now. I appreciate there's a joule restriction but what are people's thoughts about getting hit right in the boat with these Kicking Mustang style? 

[Adolf Hamster]

the problem i can see is that as a general rule, heavier ammo holds it's energy better at range.

 

when i last ran the numbers on it it turned out that a .5g (the heaviest ammo in 6mm) fired at 2.5j has about 1.3j left at 20m which fits with most mainland sites med's and the equivalent non med limit, ie point blank range for a sniper hits as hard as point blank for anyone else.

 

not sure if this would breach it, yes it's heavier but probably no denser so maybe with the ratio of surface area to mass being similar it might work out the same, haven't ran the numbers of course.

 

ultimately for me at least it boils down to how much energy can you hit someone with at your MED, for example where i am our flat 1j limit means that no matter how close i get or what ammo i'm using i'm never hitting people with more than 1j of energy, so i don't see a problem in running heavier ammo in that scenario.

[Skara]

https://stipsniper.com/2018/05/24/balls-so-heavy/

 

Just some thoughts on going full ham on weight.

 

I think increasing the bb size to make it heavier will not sort any magical effect, as the drag is also increased.

 

 also found this.

[Cr0-Magnon]

Sorry but even I can't bring myself to watch a livestream on joules (especially with the pun that doesn't work in the title). 

 

My other issue would be the price €18 for 444. I can just imagine "right, I've chronoed, adjusted my hop and zeroed my scope...shit, I've only got 50 BB's left best start saving again"

[XanderShadow]

Also, it's a non standard ammunition size, which most sites wont allow as it messes with the chrono readings and settings. Thus making it very hard to properly test/gauge... especially as that spanner is the only one even using it. Doubt many if any sites over here are gonna bend over backwards just so some kid with his shiny 'Shit Show Guarantee' can shoot folks with... one of the ugliest snipers I've ever seen.

[sonofsammo]

2 hours ago, Cr0-Magnon said:

My other issue would be the price €18 for 444.

Fuck that. 🤣
I get pissed off enough when people don't take their hits at 2.5p a shot, never mind 3.5p a shot!

[Tackle]

3 minutes ago, sonofsammo said:

Fuck that. 🤣
I get pissed off enough when people don't take their hits at 2.5p a shot, never mind 3.5p a shot!

Never thought of how much 💷 I'm "chucking" at people during games, good job I'm a tightwad & only use semi, even in my aeg's 

[Cr0-Magnon]

Not actually full thrust related but I've just noticed on his site the spring options for the SSG10 A1 are 460fps/2.2 joules or 500fps/2.8 joules.

Do those numbers sound right?

[Skara]

10 minutes ago, Cr0-Magnon said:

Not actually full thrust related but I've just noticed on his site the spring options for the SSG10 A1 are 460fps/2.2 joules or 500fps/2.8 joules.

Do those numbers sound right?

No, they're bollocks.

if the FPS readings are on 0.20s:500 equals 2.3J, 460 equals 1.96J.

[sonofsammo]

19 hours ago, Cr0-Magnon said:

Not actually full thrust related but I've just noticed on his site the spring options for the SSG10 A1 are 460fps/2.2 joules or 500fps/2.8 joules.

Do those numbers sound right?

Nope.

[Sneaky]

Another bb!......

[lukeB]

When you drop .48+ bbs it does feel like you're dropping money on the floor.

 

 

[Steveocee]

Full thrust is just going to be a headache that sites either say "don't bother" using them or will skate thin and "won't bother" considering the chrono differences.

[Shamal]

On 15/04/2020 at 13:02, sonofsammo said:

Fuck that. 🤣
I get pissed off enough when people don't take their hits at 2.5p a shot, never mind 3.5p a shot!

Shit! 2.5p? Deffo gonna start picking them up from now on!!

[qyuubi786]

On 06/08/2020 at 20:21, Shamal said:

Shit! 2.5p? Deffo gonna start picking them up from now on!!

I know it was probably a joke! 🤦‍♂️ But I'd put them in a separate pouch so you can inspect them with a magnifying glass to search for any scuffs, because it can wear down your hop rubber!

[Rogerborg]

48 minutes ago, qyuubi786 said:

But I'd put them in a separate pouch so you can inspect them with a magnifying glass to search for any scuffs, because it can wear down your hop rubber!

 

Ah, but every Full Thrust BB is lovingly hand picked by Novritsch himself off of his Ball Bushes, carefully polished by rolling it around in genuine TM Magic Dust^tm under the light of a gibbous moon, and then each ball is sucked clean and given a thorough but tender licking to put that final shine on it.

[Brophy]

2 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Ah, but every Full Thrust BB is lovingly hand picked by Novritsch himself off of his Ball Bushes, carefully polished by rolling it around in genuine TM Magic Dust^tm under the light of a gibbous moon, and then each ball is sucked clean and given a thorough but tender licking to put that final shine on it.

 

Does that include a normal sheen or a full Barry Sheene?

[Cannonfodder]

Aren't most airsoft barrels a smaller bore than 6.44mm?

[qyuubi786]

1 hour ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Ah, but every Full Thrust BB is lovingly hand picked by Novritsch himself off of his Ball Bushes, carefully polished by rolling it around in genuine TM Magic Dust^tm under the light of a gibbous moon, and then each ball is sucked clean and given a thorough but tender licking to put that final shine on it.

I hear he is doing research in this for his next BB:

😅

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, Cannonfodder said:

Aren't most airsoft barrels a smaller bore than 6.44mm?

 

Yes, this requires a new barrel, hop, and magazines, all of which Novritsch will be happy to sell you.

 

The "science" behind it isn't completely woo.  Higher mass + lower velocity will bleed energy more slowly than a lighter, faster BB even with the increased surface area.  But it's marginal.

 

The real point is to make Novritsch money, by selling the components, and then by flogging the BBs as a monopoly seller.  Once sales of the kits dries up (if it hasn't already) then he'll squeeze the price of the BBs higher and higher until even the most zealous of true believers gives up on them.

[GeorgePlaysAirsoft]

Novstritch's done WHAT!?

 

On 15/04/2020 at 07:36, Cr0-Magnon said:

0.62g seems getting in to the realms of the rediculous now. I appreciate there's a joule restriction but what are people's thoughts about getting hit right in the boat with these Kicking Mustang style? 

 

Absolutely zero problem with it - if its legal and sites allow it, great. I think it would be better if we had high power limits in the UK, with the law setting out a maximum and allowing sites/organisers and their patron's to make a decision about joules and minimum engagement distances and all that sort of stuff - especially for "Milsim" events where you could have a higher joule limit for a machine gun then you did,  say an SMG  - not for the sake of any perceptions of "realism" but rather the number one important thing -  "fun",  and in this particular case more fun then say, a binary trigger (which I can see being banned by sites as soon as they reach a popularity threshold).

 

Sure, this could be a grift, but my snap response is "innovation is good".  Not to mention in the event it was a successful system there'd be a bunch of clones out in no time. 

 

As for the cost of bb's im always reminded of a letter in Viz which was something along the lines of "I don't understand why people are complaining about the cost of fuel - I only put in £20 at a time anyway". 

[AlphaBear]

I had tears paying 1.75p a shot for 0.4 Geoff’s (that includes Factoring in postage too)!

 

The Thing you need to worry about IMHO is those people who have r-hops in their 350fps AEGs who can auto fire heavy ammo. Will they bother about MED on full auto?

[Adolf Hamster]

On 19/08/2020 at 17:11, Rogerborg said:

The "science" behind it isn't completely woo.  Higher mass + lower velocity will bleed energy more slowly than a lighter, faster BB even with the increased surface area.  But it's marginal.

 

i havent bothered running the numbers, but i'd wager the density isn't far off the current 0.48g 6mm offerings, and the only mass increase is from the volume increase.

 

of course with volume increasing as a cube whilst cross section (which is what drag cares about) increasing by a square it makes sense that higher caliber is still going to have an advantage.

 

On 19/08/2020 at 17:23, GeorgePlaysAirsoft said:

Sure, this could be a grift, but my snap response is "innovation is good".  Not to mention in the event it was a successful system there'd be a bunch of clones out in no time. 

 

wouldn't say it's all that innovative, i mean 8mm was a thing years ago.

 

On 19/08/2020 at 18:05, AlphaBear said:

The Thing you need to worry about IMHO is those people who have r-hops in their 350fps AEGs who can auto fire heavy ammo. Will they bother about MED on full auto?

 

if they can point blank at 1.3j on 0.2g then point blank with 1.3j on 0.48's isn't going to be any different feel wise.

 

heavier ammo doesn't have any more muzzle energy point blank, it just holds it better with range.

 

that said, last time i ran the numbers it was interesting that ~0.48g at 2.5j had pretty much bang on 1.3j at 20m which afaik is a pretty common MED, of course the heavier the ammo the more it'll have at that same MED range.

[alxndrhll]

Replacing internal parts with proprietary internal parts just seems like a change I really can’t wrap my head around. Perhaps I’ve just been scared away by the dreaded ‘p’ word when it comes to internal parts because I’ve been stung by them before I knew any better, so I’m making more of it than need be. But at least you’re covered by that wonderful warranty 👀.

 

Once the r&d is finished on these I wouldn’t be shocked if the long term plan is to start throwing these into everything they make so at the very least they have an actual USP and a ‘nice’ reason to have everything, that isn’t a battery, proprietary for the bulk of the RIFs they sell.

[Adolf Hamster]

7 minutes ago, alxndrhll said:

Replacing internal parts with proprietary internal parts just seems like a change I really can’t wrap my head around. Perhaps I’ve just been scared away by the dreaded ‘p’ word when it comes to internal parts because I’ve been stung by them before I knew any better, so I’m making more of it than need be. But at least you’re covered by that wonderful warranty 👀.

 

Once the r&d is finished on these I wouldn’t be shocked if the long term plan is to start throwing these into everything they make so at the very least they have an actual USP and a ‘nice’ reason to have everything, that isn’t a battery, proprietary for the bulk of the RIFs they sell.

 

you're not being over-cautious proprietary parts are a bad thing.

 

it's the same argument i use for example against apple, yes on paper the end product is better, but it forces you into the entire ecosystem.

 

for example i like geoffs bb's, i find them to be of good quality, well what if they start turning out crap? well i just start buying another brand of bb's problem solved.

 

whereas with this, well, if novritch's QC slips on the bb's then you're stuck, your gun will perform like crap no matter how good it is on paper.

 

not to mention once there's a captive audience that needs his ammo to run their kit, well that's a great excuse to ramp up them prices.