The 'How Did Your Airsoft Day Go? Thread

[Tommikka]

Barrel sock / condom - I’m not surprised that it was brought up at an airsoft & paintball site.

 

The surprising thing would be that it’s not more common.

Basic rental paintball tends to have gun racks on the way out to play, and safety keeps them out of the safe zone 

When you bring in own gunners then you need to keep the safe zone safe - my first experience of this was that we were required to leave ours in the staff shed (we were playing at a rental site with our own guns, mixed among the rental players)

 

Event & tournament paintball requires barrel blocking as well as degassing etc before leaving the game area - and the standard is battle socks

They are also useful for dead players - put it in the rules that the barrel blocker must be fitted when eliminated and the casually wandering sneaky player without their barrel blocked should be more obvious to challenge them 

 

Once they are known of its hard to argue against them as a safety product 

They come for free as standard with a new paintball gun, or around £5 or £6 to buy at retail prices

[Rogerborg]

I'd (sadly) be in favour of them, since I've seen far, far too many instances of "no firing at all in the safe zone, no exceptions" being interpreted as not applying to regulars, marshals'-mates, marshals, the site owner...

 

Which is the even sadder part, that you can mandate anything you like, but if it's not actually enforced - with penalties beyond a token yell from the site shop - then the problem people will continue to create problem situations.

 

I just switch to more casual eyepro in "safe" zones now. 😢

[Colin Allen]

1 hour ago, Rogerborg said:

I'd (sadly) be in favour of them, since I've seen far, far too many instances of "no firing at all in the safe zone, no exceptions" being interpreted as not applying to regulars, marshals'-mates, marshals, the site owner...

 

Which is the even sadder part, that you can mandate anything you like, but if it's not actually enforced - with penalties beyond a token yell from the site shop - then the problem people will continue to create problem situations.

 

I just switch to more casual eyepro in "safe" zones now. 😢

Pulling the trigger should result in the player's day ending immediately.  Eyes are too valuable to take chances and there is no valid reason to take a gun off 'safe' and pull the trigger in the safe zone.

[JinxDuh]

5 minutes ago, Colin Allen said:

Pulling the trigger should result in the player's day ending immediately.  Eyes are too valuable to take chances and there is no valid reason to take a gun off 'safe' and pull the trigger in the safe zone.

I was in one of the safezone containers at splatoon yesterday and there was a few guys firing inside, barrel socks off. Luckily the mags was out and the chambers empty but as they was rentals, that was definitely due to luck rather than them checking it was clear etc (Not that it excuses it) admittedly they was taken care of by a marshal, but still not ideal.

 

Prior to the barrel sock rule, somebody was shot in the safe zone during an airsoft event which is why I think it was introduced. Personally I'm a huge fan of it as it does eliminate a lot of the risk, but only if people use their due diligence and actually adhere to the rules set by the site.

[Tommikka]

Just a little scary story about dry firing ……. New marshal blinded in one eye with CO2 from an empty paintball gun ……

 

 

https://www.scotsman.com/news/paintball-gun-shot-leaves-ex-soldier-blind-in-one-eye-2444047

 

 

 

Safe zone has a clue in its name 

 

 

Health and safety has a bad name from the over zealous clip board brigade, but the HSE are the primary source of exposing H&S myths.

Prior to Health and safety being put into legislation it was a matter of routine to die in the UKs building sites and factories.  That has mostly been stopped

The most simple form of safety is to apply common sense - which is extremely uncommon

When a site cannot be bothered to enforce dry firing & unloading discipline in the safe zone, that’s when you need to wonder about other basics

[Rogerborg]

57 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Just a little scary story about dry firing ……. New marshal blinded in one eye with CO2 from an empty paintball gun ……

https://www.scotsman.com/news/paintball-gun-shot-leaves-ex-soldier-blind-in-one-eye-2444047

 

Not quite. He'd dry-fired gun he'd just checked into another marshal's face. Then that marshal shot him back with an "empty" gun that wasn't empty.  Cocking around, in other words: it's all fun and games until someone does lose an eye.

 

This here:

 

Quote

Gordon Reid, site manager of Ape, said it was a one-off. He said: "Health and safety at Ape is paramount. This sort of incident has never happened before or since."

 

As we like to say in Jockland to double confirm that we believe something: Aye. Right.

 

Although I'm sure their accident book (if they even have one) was completely empty, until suddenly it wasn't.

 

This is why I don't trust anyone at sites now, up to and including owners.  It shouldn't be that way, but it do.

[RostokMcSpoons]

I nearly got hit by a very close range ricochet in the safe zone at Spec Ops, an incident I mentioned a while ago.   Happy to say that Carlos now shouts very loudly at anyone who dry-fires in the safe zone.  But with the number of rentals fiddling with their triggers, and people on the wrong place on the good ol' Dunning-Kruger graph still thinking 'no mag = safe' then things will still go wrong and I feel better when I have some eye pro on.   I have a pair of Bolle glasses which I now use for the chrono / range test, and they often stay on at other times too, if the kiddies are getting a bit hyperactive.

 

And hey, nobody's perfect + "shit happens".  Even safe, sensible people can make a mistake or slip or do something momentarily idiotic.   I managed to shoot someone (out in the game zone) in the "Gentlemen's Particulars" from about a foot away because I hadn't cleared my pistol properly and managed to pull the trigger when it wasn't pointed safely.  (Honestly, I was still aiming for the ground... but missed!)
Poor bugger was in a lot of pain, and I'm grateful he forgave me, rather than punching me straight in the chops.

I'm not saying I'm necessarily "safe and sensible", maybe I'm an idiot , but I have spent an lot of time around various firearms so I'm supposedly well trained.  But that one time I messed up and I still burn with a sense of shame over it.

 

All in all, I'd be happy to use a barrel sock in the safe zone (and indeed between the safe zone and the game area)

Edited August 21, 2023 by RostokMcSpoons

[Haru]

6 minutes ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

I need got hit by a very close range ricochet in the safe zone at Spec Ops, an incident I mentioned a while ago.   Happy to say that Carlos now shouts very loudly at anyone who dry-fires in the safe zone.  But with the number of rentals fiddling with their triggers, and people on the wrong place on the good ol' Dunning-Kruger graph still thinking 'no mag = safe' then things will still go wrong and I feel better when I have some eye pro on.   I have a pair of Bolle glasses which I now use for the chrono / range test, and they often stay on at other times too, if the kiddies are getting a bit hyperactive.

 

And hey, nobody's perfect + "shit happens".  Even safe, sensible people can make a mistake or slip or do something momentarily idiotic.   I managed to shoot someone (out in the game zone) in the "Gentlemen's Particulars" from about a foot away because I hadn't cleared my pistol properly and managed to pull the trigger when it wasn't pointed safely.  (Honestly, I was still aiming for the ground... but missed!)
Poor bugger was in a lot of pain, and I'm grateful he forgave me, rather than punching me straight in the chops.

I'm not saying I'm necessarily "safe and sensible", maybe I'm an idiot , but I have spent an lot of time around various firearms so I'm supposedly well trained.  But that one time I messed up and I still burn with a sense of shame over it.

 

All in all, I'd be happy to use a barrel sock in the safe zone (and indeed between the safe zone and the game area)

i always keep my eye pro on in safezones, so many dry fires from the rentals when i last went on a skirmish

[Rogerborg]

14 minutes ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

Happy to say that Carlos now shouts very loudly at anyone who dry-fires in the safe zone

 

Thereby demonstrating loudly that there are no actual consequences for it.

 

I don't want to see people sat out of games, or invited to leave the site, but I think it's worse to have rules-that-are-more-what-you'd-call-guidelines.  Either mean what you say, or don't waste everyone's time by saying it.

[gavinkempsell]

Got to admit I fired my rif once to check the battery within the safe zone on my second skirmish day, I had checked the rif was empty & no mag & pointed at the ground & away from any other players and I got a well deserved bollocking. you live & learn...

[Dan Robinson]

24 minutes ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

I managed to shoot someone (out in the game zone) in the "Gentlemen's Particulars" from about a foot away because I hadn't cleared my pistol properly and managed to pull the trigger when it wasn't pointed safely.  (Honestly, I was still aiming for the ground... but missed!)
Poor bugger was in a lot of pain, and I'm grateful he forgave me, rather than punching me straight in the chops

 

I think I remember that incident - it was rather funny.

 

8 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

Thereby demonstrating loudly that there are no actual consequences for it

 

To be fair Carlos only shouts at you once.  it tends to stick in the memory.

 

 

Having said that I was trying to fix the boy's Specna not that long ago and a lose wire on the mosfet meant the gun cycled when I wasn't expecting it in the safe zone.  Luckily it was cleared beforehand after leaving the chrono; but the barrel was pointing directly at someone who happened to be watching, and it made both of us jump.  Thankfully he saw I was nowhere near the trigger so explanations were short....  But it shows shit can happen when you least expect it.

[Jacob Wright]

Out on the game zone at Combat Airsoft Thetford a couple of years back and I loaded my RIF and blatted some shots off before the marshals had told us we could. I assumed because we were in the game zone people would have eyepro on, but fair play to the marshals they do a final check on everyone once they pass a certain flag.

 

I was immediately escorted back to the safe zone and removed from site. And I'll tell you now, I'll never do it again!

[Shamal]

56 minutes ago, Jacob Wright said:

Out on the game zone at Combat Airsoft Thetford a couple of years back and I loaded my RIF and blatted some shots off before the marshals had told us we could. I assumed because we were in the game zone people would have eyepro on, but fair play to the marshals they do a final check on everyone once they pass a certain flag.

 

I was immediately escorted back to the safe zone and removed from site. And I'll tell you now, I'll never do it again!

That sounds a bit harsh?

☹️

[Colin Allen]

1 hour ago, gavinkempsell said:

Got to admit I fired my rif once to check the battery within the safe zone on my second skirmish day, I had checked the rif was empty & no mag & pointed at the ground & away from any other players and I got a well deserved bollocking. you live & learn...

You did; sadly, some do not.

1 hour ago, Dan Robinson said:

Having said that I was trying to fix the boy's Specna not that long ago and a lose wire on the mosfet meant the gun cycled when I wasn't expecting it in the safe zone.  Luckily it was cleared beforehand after leaving the chrono; but the barrel was pointing directly at someone who happened to be watching, and it made both of us jump.  Thankfully he saw I was nowhere near the trigger so explanations were short....  But it shows shit can happen when you least expect it.

I had something similar happen; I plugged the battery in while the RIF was on a table in the safe zone and the mosfet failed, resulting in it going full auto.  I quickly disconnected the battery and explained the situation to the site owner, who did not have the look of a very impressed chap and is not someone you would want to mess with.  Once I had explained what had happened, supported by other players, he was cool about it.  Sometimes, things like that happen and it is not the player's fault.

On another day at the same site, a player was being a dick (thus breaking the first rule of airsoft) and let off a round in the safe zone which pinged off the wobbly tin; the owner came storming over and told him to pack his gear and leave.  His mates tried to remonstrate with the owner and were told that they could also leave if they disagreed with his decision.

[Colin Allen]

20 minutes ago, Shamal said:

That sounds a bit harsh?

☹️

Very harsh; I have never been to a site that penalises players for shooting in the game zone.

[The_Lord_Poncho]

On 20/08/2023 at 22:41, EDcase said:

By 'gun sock' I presume you mean one of these

An actual sock wouldn't stop a BB at all.

 

That's the one good thing Absolute Airsoft insisted on having.

Driver Wood too - strongly enforced, and the safe zone feels so much, well, safer as a result. One of the reasons I take mates to Driver Wood for their first experience of the game. I find it bonkers that all sites don't do it.

 

For something so cheap (I knocked up four of them on the sewing machine for pennies, but should be free to borrow from sites with a small deposit put down), there really is no excuse. Unless people are lunatics about the sleek lines of their gats fore ends being disrupted....

[Cannonfodder]

On 20/08/2023 at 22:41, EDcase said:

That's the one good thing Absolute Airsoft insisted on having

We all know why that is

 

Sunday's trip down to Ambush started off badly as the gods of public transport were clearly in a bad mood that morning. One bus that was replacing a train was a no show and another train being 25 minutes late meant that I missed the first couple of games.

 

Fortunately things did start to pick up and the rest of the day went well with some well fought games and no obvious cheating or people playing silly buggers. To top it off I also managed to get caught on film by the site photographer so that's always a bonus 

[Rogerborg]

15 hours ago, Colin Allen said:

Very harsh; I have never been to a site that penalises players for shooting in the game zone.

 

Yup, I'll now rant the other way about having a not-safe-not-game zone.  The delineation should be absolutely clear to everyone, including and especially first timers.

 

I'm baffled by why so many sites seem to make such an absolute hash of the basics.

[EDcase]

19 hours ago, Colin Allen said:

Very harsh; I have never been to a site that penalises players for shooting in the game zone.

Wycombe Airsoft ask players not to shoot walking on the way to the game area (out of the safe zone) because they also have junior paintball games nearby.

 

 

Edited August 22, 2023 by EDcase

[Colin Allen]

5 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Yup, I'll now rant the other way about having a not-safe-not-game zone.  The delineation should be absolutely clear to everyone, including and especially first timers.

 

I'm baffled by why so many sites seem to make such an absolute hash of the basics.

Probably because a lot of site owners/managers would be incapable of looking after a piece of gravel.

It really is quite easy, isn't it?  There is the safe zone and areas where BBs might be flying (chrono/range and game zone).  All of my regular sites manage this well; there is good signage and the delineation between the areas is very clear.  In addition, the transitions between safe and non-safe are designed such that a random BB shot towards the safe zone gate from non-safe cannot make its way in without making at least one 90 degree turn.

2 hours ago, EDcase said:

Wycombe Airsoft ask players not to shoot walking on the way to the game area (out of the safe zone) because they also have junior paintball games nearby.

 

 

Which is absolutely reasonable if that is made very clear to players and there is highly visible signage.

[Adolf Hamster]

a site can have all the clear signage, shouty marshalls and mandatory things you stick on the end of it.

 

the question is:

do we trust the average airsofter to do it?

 

the answer?

 

[Colin Allen]

Just now, Adolf Hamster said:

the question is:

do we trust the average airsofter to do it?

No, which is why sites need to deal far more robustly with the fuckwits.

At one of my regular sites, part of the safety brief warns players not to shoot towards the few adjacent properties and sets out the consequences.  They can only be shot towards from a very small area of the very large site and are situated such that they are not in the line of fire for any games; you have to make a conscious decision to shoot at people's homes.

Just before the last game, a player started shooting towards them; a very angry site owner told him rather forcefully to leave the site.  One of the things that I like about the site is that they are not afraid to throw out people who are behaving like idiots or ruining the day for other people.

[Beorn]

23 minutes ago, Colin Allen said:

No, which is why sites need to deal far more robustly with the fuckwits.

At one of my regular sites, part of the safety brief warns players not to shoot towards the few adjacent properties and sets out the consequences.  They can only be shot towards from a very small area of the very large site and are situated such that they are not in the line of fire for any games; you have to make a conscious decision to shoot at people's homes.

Just before the last game, a player started shooting towards them; a very angry site owner told him rather forcefully to leave the site.  One of the things that I like about the site is that they are not afraid to throw out people who are behaving like idiots or ruining the day for other people.

You probably know yourself @Colin Allen but there are playing fields very near to Red1 Chislehurst and there will often be kids playing footy on a Sunday morn, both times I've been down there marshals made a point during briefing of telling players not to shoot out into the playing fields on purpose. The fact people need to be told (and will still subsequently ignore it if they think they can get away with it) does indicate the generally pitiful state of the moral and intellectual playing field.

As a relatively new player I find the 'safe' zone to feel quite unnerving most of the time and I do find myself worrying about how blasé other people are r.e safety. Making those barrel socks mandatory in the safe area seems like a no brainer. It almost seems like the sort of thing that airsofters and site owners should throw their weight behind en masse. Seems like such a simple and effective solution to make things safer

[Colin Allen]

26 minutes ago, Beorn said:

You probably know yourself @Colin Allen but there are playing fields very near to Red1 Chislehurst and there will often be kids playing footy on a Sunday morn, both times I've been down there marshals made a point during briefing of telling players not to shoot out into the playing fields on purpose. The fact people need to be told (and will still subsequently ignore it if they think they can get away with it) does indicate the generally pitiful state of the moral and intellectual playing field.

As a relatively new player I find the 'safe' zone to feel quite unnerving most of the time and I do find myself worrying about how blasé other people are r.e safety. Making those barrel socks mandatory in the safe area seems like a no brainer. It almost seems like the sort of thing that airsofters and site owners should throw their weight behind en masse. Seems like such a simple and effective solution to make things safer

The less said about Red1 Chislehurst, the better.  In my opinion, it is a potentially excellent site which is ruined by very poor management, organisation and marshalling.

The boundary with the sports field is a case in point.  The site owners need to put up a proper barrier to prevent BBs straying onto it; it is their responsibility to take every action possible to ensure that it cannot happen.  Not only is there a potential risk to the football playing children and their families, but shooting BBs onto or over someone's property without their permission is potentially a criminal offence.

Unfortunately, airsoft does seem to attract a fair few people whose knuckles drag across the floor when they walk and who struggle with basic morality and empathy.  A little while ago, I was berated by a group of players for pointing out that one of them had just pulled the trigger in the safe zone for the third time in a few minutes, after I had already told him not to on the previous two occasions.  Apparently, pointing it out in a rather pissed off tone was disrespectful and out of order, but repeatedly pulling the trigger in the safe zone was not.

Having encountered barrel socks, I am also convinced that they should be mandatory.
 

[Cannonfodder]

Being good mates with the guys who basically set up the school for the owner of Red1 and were subsequently screwed over by him, I'm not surprised that they don't have a clue about running a bath let alone a decent airsoft site. There's reasons why I don't shop at his store despite it being the closest to me