An interesting view of airsoft

[sonofsammo]

 

Someone's very grumpy about some airsofters.... (The title is hate airsoft/mil-sim, which is what he talks about in the video....)

So what do you think? Has he got a point?
Or is he suffering from the elitism he's criticising airsofters of succumbing to?

[Eenthuncob]

I get some points he's putting across such as some airsofters being snobby over gear, but to say that if you take it very seriously why don't you join the military! That seems a daft thing to say as people enjoy airsoft very differently and that the beauty of the game.

[jcheeseright]

I don't think they're annoyed about the regular guy at a skirmish who wants to sling some plastic, they ARE those guys.  They're annoyed about the people who think because they've played a few milsim games they're somehow better.  

 

I can see their point. 

[Rogerborg]

I like the irony that their channel name is "MILITARY GROUP", when they're advocating against using military tactics.

 

Eh, Walts gotta Walt. and milsim events are going to attract them.  I've not seen much of it around my parts, so it doesn't bother me.  If I do run into a Delta Elite Ranger Green Beret Commando SAS Squad all wearing Colonel badges, I imagine I'd just have a good laugh at their antics, same as the lead-from-behind heroes screeching "Move up!" from 10 yards behind you in a typical woodland game.

 

You can't change the way they choose to play their game, but you can choose to not let them change the way you play yours.

[Samurai]

I can see their point.

99% of the milsim elitists think they want to imitate special forces but they actually want to imitate the characters in action movies about special forces. This mix up leaves the bad taste after them.

[Rogerborg]

3 minutes ago, Samurai said:

they actually want to imitate the characters in action movies about special forces

 

This is so incisive that it practically cut me.  Well spotted.

[cropzy]

In all my experiences of milsimmers. They have all been wannabes. They take the fun out of the sport and are tossers to everyone else.

[Rogerborg]

Oh, obligatory Spaced.  I imagine most paintball Walts have migrated to airsoft since then.

 

 

 

[skintrade]

Mil sim can be a total blast, IF you remember it's still a game, a lot of people take it too seriously. The guy in the vid makes great points, especially as he's serving currently, and just wants a great cardio fun time. The one thing that a lot mil sim fanatics (read 'wannabe soldiers of fortune') forget is the reality of combat is that one BB in reality is one round that can end not just your day, but your existence. 

 

Keep the "military tactics" for sim/roleplay, that's fine with me, and there's nothing wrong with playing smart at a skirmish as there's no fun in constant respawning. But dress how you want, run what works for you, and remember the game aspect. I do agree with not wearing patches or insignia you haven't earned, hence I'll run with pop culture or similar references on my kit just to add flavour.

 

Johnny Wannabe always makes me laugh, most have never held real steel let alone fired one. 

[Adolf Hamster]

54 minutes ago, skintrade said:

The one thing that a lot mil sim fanatics (read 'wannabe soldiers of fortune') forget is the reality of combat is that one BB in reality is one round that can end not just your day, but your existence. 

 

indeed, mil-sim to me is an attempt to try and impart some of that mentality by the use of complicated medic/spawn mechanics and dangles the threat of sitting out the day as a faux motivation to not get shot in the first place.

 

 

being a lazy sod who doesn't want to walk back to respawn constantly i've found my growing airsoft experience hasn't increased my kills, but it has drastically reduced my deaths, hell i went to a totally new site yesterday and in the first round in their cqb zone i was only killed once by friendly fire, although admittedly later rounds i was not so lucky due to having perhaps too much confidence (or not enough grenades, i blame the grenades)

 

[Hami]

There's always someone that forgets it's just playing army man, like when you were a kid 

[Adolf Hamster]

21 minutes ago, Hamisakim said:

like when you were a kid 

 

what's this "were" business?

 

we still are kids, we just have more expensive toys.

[AK47frizzle]

I simply don't understand the appeal of being pretend soldiers at all. That's why I just have plain outdoor wear and a vest to hold my necessities. I care much more about the technicalities of the pew pew power.

[Rogerborg]

42 minutes ago, AK47frizzle said:

I simply don't understand the appeal of being pretend soldiers at all

 

While it's not for me, I have done pokey-stick era reenactment and I can see why folk might enjoy shining their buttons regulation style.  No problems, play dress up the way you want to play dress up.  The OP video's two real complaints are:

 

1) "Stolen valour", and I can see why that would piss off serving and veteran military if they spot someone wearing contemporary insignia.  Contrast with Lindybeige on YouTube who has deliberately chosen a set of costume medal ribbons that couldn't possibly represent a real service record.

 

2) Trying to make other people into bit part players in their dress-up story.   That would be annoying to everyone, although perhaps easier to laugh off.

 

Actually, we had a right Shouty McLeader at CQB last time I was out, all "Right, you lot with me! Move!" and "Breach! Breach! Breach!"  The more folk just ignored him, the more strident he got, until he packed it in sometime after lunch.  I guess it was funny in isolation, although I can see why it would get less so if it were a whole squad giving it Billy Bigguns all day and re-enforcing each others' delusions.

[KendoKhan]

I have no right to comment on what people chose to wear or look like when playing a game that involves expensive toy guns that shoot plastic pellets. But I agree that people should not pretend to be something they are not, i.e. lying about military experience or wearing patches/qualification badges they have not earn't etc. 

 

Why someone would want to spend £15 to buy and eat greasy MRE's ie beyond me, especially when TESCO do a deal on x2 Grenade Protein bars for the price of 1. But hey, ho. Their money, their choice! 

 

 

6 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

While it's not for me, I have done reenactment (swords and axe stylee) and I can see why folk would enjoy shining their buttons regulation style.  No problems, play dress up the way you want to play dress up.  The OP video's two real complaints are:

 

1) "Stolen valour", and I can see why that would piss off serving and veteran military if they spot someone wearing contemporary insignia.  Contrast with Lindybeige on YouTube who has deliberately chosen a set of costume medal ribbons that couldn't possibly represent a real service record.

 

2) Trying to make other people into bit part players in your dress up story.  Annoying to everyone, although perhaps easier to laugh off.

 

Actually, we had a right Shouty McLeader at CQB last time I was out, all "Right, you lot with me! Move!" and "Breach! Breach! Breach!"  The more folk just ignored him, the more strident he got, until he packed it in sometime after lunch.  I guess it was funny in isolation, although I can see why it would get less so if it were a whole squad giving it Billy Bigguns all day and re-enforcing each others' delusions.

 

I take serious exception with his description of recipients of the T.A. medal! What a Supercilious wanker! 

[Druid799]

The big thing we all need to remember from the start is this chap’s NOT talking in his mother tongue (but saying that his English is better than a LOT of uk citizens!🤦‍♂️) so I think it’s not quite as much of a ‘hate on’ as it comes across as . Now from the point of view of someone who’s done it for real I can totally relate to basically all of what he’s saying , I’ve tried a couple of milsim events (one was local site organized and the other by a big nationally recognised company) and both of them were utter clusterf**k’s from what I saw of them . One was just a total abortion from top to bottom , from the organization to the players taking part , total bag of tits . At the other event the organisers were trying to make it work but it just wasn’t working due to the players not following the game plan but diverting from it as they thought they knew better . Unless you’ve had real and prolonged military training you just can’t do it . Now don’t take this as I’m totally against them I’m not I just think they shouldn’t be called milsim events , they bare absolutely no similarities to any military operation I’ve ever been involved in . I think they should just be called ‘immersive games’ and yes you do see a much larger fuckwit ‘special farces experts’ quota at them . Open scurmish days ? Again like he said it’s predominantly players that just want to have a fun day out with likeminded weirdo’s ! 

At these events you can always tell the ex-forces , no matter how long they’ve been out or what there wearing , they may have been out for 20yrs or there still in and wether there wearing a rental jump suits/jeans and hoodies or full camo kit the way they play is total chalk and cheese to the ‘civilian’ at the game , the modern buzz word for it is muscle memory , me ? I just call it ingrained drills , once you’ve learned them enough times it’s there for good , you just don’t forget how to do things like that .

but ultimately it comes down too play how you want , you gonna be a thread counter ? Then crack on but don’t expect a lot of players to like you while your playing .👍

1 hour ago, KendoKhan said:

I take serious exception with his description of recipients of the T.A. medal! What a Supercilious wanker! 

Perhaps this twat could tell Steven Boote’s family this , he was a guy who worked in a tesco in Liverpool . He always had wanted to joint the army but due to several different reasons he never did but was able to join the TA , he was killed on active duty in Afghanistan in 2009 . 

Agree , what a complete wanker ! 

[EDcase]

18 hours ago, Druid799 said:

Agree , what a complete wanker ! 

I don't think he was bashing the TA.

He was just talking about the medal insignia being less controversial.

[Druid799]

54 minutes ago, EDcase said:

I don't think he was bashing the TA.

He was just talking about the medal insignia being insignificant.

Weather it was conscious or not , the off hand flippant way he commented on it was still bloody insulting to any one who had it , yes pre 2000’s the TA was a bit of a “I’m in the army!” (No your not!) drinkers club but since the Americans started the shit storm in the Middle East the British army would have been on its fucking knees without the TA . 

So yea he’s still an insulting twat . 

[KendoKhan]

1 hour ago, EDcase said:

I don't think he was bashing the TA.

He was just talking about the medal insignia being insignificant.

How is service 'insignificant'? Pray tell?

[Huxley]

7 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

Oh, obligatory Spaced.  I imagine most paintball Walts have migrated to airsoft since then.

 

 

 

Don't forget Drop the Dead Donkey

 

 

 

 

[Callyourhits]

8 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

Oh, obligatory Spaced.  I imagine most paintball Walts have migrated to airsoft since then.

 

 

 

 

18 minutes ago, Huxley said:

 

Don't forget Drop the Dead Donkey

 

 

 

 

 

All they need to do is modify and bring back X-fire for airsoft use. Then all the melty commands can test their metal against each other with an insanely brilliant production value. 

 

[Tommikka]

 

@Rogerborg

Cheers for be Spaced reference, you saved me from posting it myself (though you did do the short version, I could still post the full sequence!!!)

 

Also - nice to find another Lindybeige fan, also saved me from posting his recent ‘dressing up’ video

 

To answer the point on all paintballer Walt’s  moving to airsoft.... that’s true for many but not all of them

 

@KendoKhan

Where is the ‘TA medal’ reference, I missed that

 

Much of his video is really just complaining about the dickheads. It’s a common problem in all hobbies.

 

In Paintball about a decade ago there was a very small ‘milsim’ community.  These were people who played what I would call proper Milsim, not just in their dressing up or choice of gun but fully in their style of play and preferred games & rule sets.  Since then we have had the rise of MagFed paintball which has generated two sides of the MagFed community - one half who enjoy the limited capacity & more realistic look, the other who veer to MilSim

I like to play any type of paintball, with any type of gun (often using limitations such as MagFed, pump action, single and twin pistols in ‘normal’ games) and though I still haven’t played airsoft I’m perfectly happy running an airsoft or a paintball game.

 

The core of Paintball is the punter, who just as in Spaced is few blokes (and women) who are going for a day out shooting their mates.  In the UK they are more likely to go for paintball, even if that’s all they have heard of so far.

From what I have seen of airsoft it aligns with walk-on Paintball, and is more likely to be the regular local player with their own gear (or building up to their own gear)

Then there are the bigger games, both in airsoft and paintball - which can be either just size & organisation or my favourite which is scenario

 

MagFed / MilSim is there in paintball, but those who are very strict on verging to the more serious ‘reality’ have seemed to be suffering on numbers in the last year or so.  There may be strong local groups on some sites, but with a small community and internal politics airsoft provides the answer and has pulled a lot of paintballers - whether they leave paintball or do a bit of both

 

 

With regard to walts, I am a member of a certain Army based forum where everynow and then someone puts up some Walt hunting outrage, often getting it wrong (even falsely accusing a WW2 SAS original because they had the ‘wrong’ beret, badge and medal combination)

In general they don’t care about walting, they approve of “over exaggeration” particularly in a good cause such as to impress the ladies, feel

sorry for those with issues in the head, and condem those who do so for fraudulent purposes (which is illegal already)

 

 

 

 

 

Hopefully no one posts this video before I’ve finished typing, but this sums it up for me.

We are all just going out and playing a game:

 

 

[E21A]

Seems he’s just having a grumble about the milsim variety of dickhead (other varieties are available) which is fair enough. I’ve personally not come across many but when I do I usually have a little chuckle to myself or a few looks exchanged with players around me then carry on my day. 

[Rogerborg]

9 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Where is the ‘TA medal’ reference, I missed that

 

https://youtu.be/cqhZCt5bgNU?t=1806

 

Although now that I look, he's pointing at what appears to be either a purple-green-purple ribbon which would be a 1918-1961 General Service Medal, or blue-green-blue which would be a Viscount Mint Cream biscuit wrapper.  So, joke's on him.

[Tommikka]

1 minute ago, Rogerborg said:

 

https://youtu.be/cqhZCt5bgNU?t=1806

 

Although now that I look, he's pointing at what appears to be either a purple-green-purple ribbon which would be a 1918-1961 General Service Medal, or blue-green-blue which would be a Viscount Mint Cream biscuit wrapper.  So, joke's on him.

Got you - I was looking for it in the original airsoft video

 

It’s a very Lindybeige jokey/flippant comment more directed at the ‘long service’ side rather than the TA when he was explaining precidence.  It could just as well have been a Regular LSGC - which is a “not getting caught” for years medal as opposed to actual good conduct (or the recent new Officers LSGC, whereas Good Conduct was always meant to be implied for officers)