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petition on knife law changes

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dont know if anyone here is interested, there is a petition aginst the proposed changes to knife laws (not being able to post knives) if they can do this with knives i can see rifs going down same route.

 

https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/222776?utm_source=Heinnie+Haynes+-+2018&utm_campaign=e093588ac8-EMAIL_CAMPAIGN_2018_06_29_11_31_COPY_01&utm_medium=email&utm_term=0_15c01d759b-e093588ac8-147031737&mc_cid=e093588ac8&mc_eid=98a7c84fec

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 Cheers bud, already signed 👍🏻

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Can I just point out this has nothing to do with airsoft. This is legislation to cut down on the knife crime problem. 

 

Has there been 51 people shot to death on the streets of London with an airsoft gun so far this year? No there has not.

 

This is just airsofters sticking their nose where it doesn't belong. 

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Yup already signed as well . 👍

Usual response to a serious situation by ANY Gov , knife crime is rocketing they know exactly what’s happening and where the blame really lays but won’t say anything in case they get accused of being racist ! “What can we do ?” Says the Cabinet ,  “Oh I know what we can do” says some snivelling little shit in Whitehall .

“Let’s make a song and dance about a toothless lion of a legislation on knife crime and hit an easy target so it looks like we’re doing something !” 

Take these two photos as the perfect example , first is the newest knives on Heinnie Haynes and the second is knives taken by the police in a single wk in Bethnal Green ! Wonder how many came via mail order and how many from Poundland ? At those prices ? 

Edit 

id say yes it is relevant as there’s also a fair few Airsoft guns getting pulled in at the same time (apparently the young kids in the gangs use them in muggings !) 

so how long before they do start tightening the noose on us again ? 

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Knives are not airsoft, so moved to Off Topic section

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Actually I think the police are backing this because knives are being sold online to under 18s.

 

As someone who does use bladed items in my job I don't see the big issue. If I want something I can just go to a store and buy it. If I buy it online I can pick it up at a post office after showing ID.

 

While there will obviously need to be amendments made at least it is some attempt at control. Yes kitchen knives will still be the main thing used and the punishments should be more severe but every step taken to make it harder is plus point.

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Do agree with you legislation needs to be brought in to try and help control the spiralling use of knives but I genuinely believe this’ll have absolutely no effect on it . Couple of wks ago my local police (SW con stab) did an underage sting operation on local shops/cheap discount shops and the result was as you’d expect , time and time again they sent kids in who were blatantly under age but they were still sold the knives I just can’t believe these gang members are going to spend £25,£35,£45,etc on an on-line knife when they can pick up a kitchen devil type knife for £3.99 as they know if the police arrive on site there going to have to ditch it ? 

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33 minutes ago, Druid799 said:

id say yes it is relevant as there’s also a fair few Airsoft guns getting pulled in at the same time (apparently the young kids in the gangs use them in muggings !) 

 

And exactly the same argument applies.  It's already an offence to sell to under 18s, but do retailers check, or care?  I'd expect that the 'BB' ones at least don't give a stuff.

 

Furthermore, they are set to ban private possession of all of the prohibited-to-sell offensive weapons.  That list includes all curved swords with a blade length over 50cm.  I followed that particular piece of legislation through its committee stages, where they intended to ban "samurai swords" and instead managed to stuff reenactors by banning the sale and manufacture of sabres, cutlasses and falchions, but the eBay tat sellers just switched to straight bladed "ninja swords" overnight.

 

So yes, I am very wary of Parliament legislating on weapons, as once they get the bit in their teeth, they tend to start broadening definitions willy nilly.  Note that they are going to ban .50 cals by the back door of "muzzle energy", despite the vast majority of respondents noting that such a weapon had never been used in a crime.

 

On the efficacy of a postage ban, one of the responses to the consultation noted that the main source of knives will remain the kitchen drawer, knife block, or just shoplifting the things on demand.

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11 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

And exactly the same argument applies.  It's already an offence to sell to under 18s, but do retailers check, or care?  I'd expect that the 'BB' ones at least don't give a stuff.

 

Furthermore, they are set to ban private possession of all of the prohibited-to-sell offensive weapons.  That list includes all curved swords with a blade length over 50cm.  I followed that particular piece of legislation through its committee stages, where they intended to ban "samurai swords" and instead managed to stuff reenactors by banning the sale and manufacture of sabres, cutlasses and falchions, but the eBay tat sellers just switched to straight bladed "ninja swords" overnight.

 

So yes, I am very wary of Parliament legislating on weapons, as once they get the bit in their teeth, they tend to start broadening definitions willy nilly.  Note that they are going to ban .50 cals by the back door of "muzzle energy", despite the vast majority of respondents noting that such a weapon had never been used in a crime.

 

On the efficacy of a postage ban, one of the responses to the consultation noted that the main source of knives will remain the kitchen drawer, knife block, or just shoplifting the things on demand.

Spot on bud , my Napolionic dragoon sabre that’s been frame mounted for over a hundred yrs will now become illegal! . 

A team mate is on chatting terms with the guy who runs Parbelum consultanting , and had a very interesting discussion about the amazing amount of hoops you have to go through to get a 50 (was curious how many they sold) of any sort .

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37 minutes ago, Druid799 said:

 Couple of wks ago my local police (SW con stab) did an underage sting operation on local shops/cheap discount shops and the result was as you’d expect , time and time again they sent kids in who were blatantly under age but they were still sold the knives 

 

Meanwhile I couldn't buy a pack of firelighters for a BBQ without ID (which I conveniently left at home) despite being 19 and with £20 worth of food in my basket. 

 

By the time I got back some cunt had taken the last of the sausages. Grr.. <_<

 

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To be honest I wonder if anybody who has ever been a victim of knife crime would ever sign this thing.

It is all well and good people moaning about how it affects them but it affects the poor sods getting stabbed a lot more. 

 

As for having swords in your house being affected by the laws on bladed items that sucks but I wonder how many have been stolen in burglaries and then ended being used in a crime.

 

There is no easy answer. I don't like the draconian laws but at the end of the day I would happily live by them if it meant my kids were safe in the street.

 

The obvious answer is draconian responses to crime. But unfortunately people moan about mutilating and hanging people, right up until they are the victim themselves.

 

It will never be sensible because those in charge have no real understanding of normal life.

 

 

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All valid points but in the end it won’t change a thing , it’s the culture now , untill society is prepared to ignore the PC brigade and point fingers and actually allocate the blame where the problem is coming from then it will never change . if the Gov banned all knives the gangs would just make shanks like they use in prison . This legislation isn’t even a sticking plaster it’s a nothing , just a balloon full of hot air nothing more nothing less .

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All I’m gonna say is, legislation, in general, prevents normal law abiding citizens from enjoying their hobbies and pastimes.It almost never affects the nefarious from being shady.

 

If you want to affect people’s behaviour, educate them, don’t legislate.

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19 minutes ago, Druid799 said:

All valid points but in the end it won’t change a thing , it’s the culture now , untill society is prepared to ignore the PC brigade and point fingers and actually allocate the blame where the problem is coming from then it will never change . if the Gov banned all knives the gangs would just make shanks like they use in prison . This legislation isn’t even a sticking plaster it’s a nothing , just a balloon full of hot air nothing more nothing less .

Agreed it will probably change very little. Bur when all these things have been tried and if they don't work then hopefully it will sink in that only thing that will work is real punishments. 

 

Difficult to make a shank with no hands.

1 minute ago, rocketdogbert said:

All I’m gonna say is, legislation, in general, prevents normal law abiding citizens from enjoying their hobbies and pastimes.It almost never affects the nefarious from being shady.

 

If you want to affect people’s behaviour, educate them, don’t legislate.

We do educate them, most drug dealers are good at maths.

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13 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

 

We do educate them, most drug dealers are good at maths.

 

OK I’ll bite. I’m pretty sure you know exactly what I mean, but I will spell it out with an example.

 

Up to the late fifties/early sixties, driving a motor vehicle under the influence of alcohol was socially acceptable.

After a long and expensive campaign to educate the general public, it is no longer socially acceptable.

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1 hour ago, rocketdogbert said:

 

OK I’ll bite. I’m pretty sure you know exactly what I mean, but I will spell it out with an example.

 

Up to the late fifties/early sixties, driving a motor vehicle under the influence of alcohol was socially acceptable.

After a long and expensive campaign to educate the general public, it is no longer socially acceptable.

That is a totally different thing. 

 

Stabbing people has generally been frowned upon for a few centuries already so guess they already know.

 

The only way to educate the antisocial scum wandering around is by using a blade of french design. Chop off a few heads in public view and then they might start to learn. Anything else is a waste of time as prison is not a deterrent. 

 

Not all blades are kitchen knives either. My brother is a copper and he has told me some of things they come across. Anyone know what a klingon bat'leth is?

 

 

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If you're buying an item online that is age restricted you should have to have a credit card to verify your age.

 

Pretty simple. Post what you like to whom you like as long as they're making adult decisions. Cos we all know adults don't make stupid decisions and end up in jail.

 

7 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Anyone know what a klingon bat'leth is?

 

 

 

How often has that line got you laid?

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19 minutes ago, Duff said:

Pretty simple. Post what you like to whom you like as long as they're making adult decisions. Cos we all know adults don't make stupid decisions and end up in jail.

And no adult has ever stabbed anyone, ever....... 

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Bout TWELVE years ago A&E docs around the country petitioned parliament on a similar matter, wanting a ban on sales of all knives that blades came to a point on the end, they wanted everything to have a large flat area on the end that was incapable of penetration injuries......... obviously it got thrown out, anybody with a modicum of common sense knows its not the knives that need "fixing", & as we've all pointed out, scrotes will just reach for a kitchen knife or screwdriver, or grind new tips.

Also indicates it was a problem 12 years ago, nothing new, but the cynical amongst us might suggest that maybe the government is happy for us to be up in arms about this "problem", & maybe be less aware of what they're getting up to, or more to the point, failing to do ?.

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https://www.parliament.uk/business/news/2018/june/have-your-say-on-the-offensive-weapons-bill/

 

As per the URL.  My experience has been that these consultations are a waste of time and an exercise in nodding along while swinging the rubber stamp, but maybe this will be the one that changes my mind.

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On 30/06/2018 at 23:03, ImTriggerHappy said:

To be honest I wonder if anybody who has ever been a victim of knife crime would ever sign this thing.

It is all well and good people moaning about how it affects them but it affects the poor sods getting stabbed a lot more. 

 

As for having swords in your house being affected by the laws on bladed items that sucks but I wonder how many have been stolen in burglaries and then ended being used in a crime.

 

There is no easy answer. I don't like the draconian laws but at the end of the day I would happily live by them if it meant my kids were safe in the street.

 

The obvious answer is draconian responses to crime. But unfortunately people moan about mutilating and hanging people, right up until they are the victim themselves.

 

It will never be sensible because those in charge have no real understanding of normal life.

 

 

 

 

I've been held up at knife point when I used to work in bars and walked home from work in the early hours but I still collect a fair amount of decent knives made by UK knife makers. I can see the point the litigation is trying to make but unfortunately as has already been said most of the knife crime if not all the perps have either got the knife from home or from a high street shop with the zombie knife and machetes being the exception but even then some places like go outdoors and smaller hobby shops have and do sell the bigger type of bladed articles seen in some of the crimes committed. Hell I remember buying my first boker knife (which I still have and use it almost daily) from some dodgy little shop in southend that also sold airguns and similar to pretty much anyone!

One thing I have noticed and correct me if you think this is unfair but the amount of young shop staff that seem to feel scared to ask people for ID and so people manage to get things they shouldn't because its all to easy for them to do so, I even know some places locally that I'm sure if you asked them what year someone was born could figure out how old they are from that!

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Another utterly ridiculous kneejerk reaction by a government that doesn't have a damn clue what it's doing. All the Dindu Nuffins are busy Dinduing, so let's ban private ownership of classical and historical swords on display in the privacy of your own home... Because that's what the Dindus are using.

 

Oh wait.. no they're not. They're using Poundland kitchen knives and.. according to Harrow MPS, pencils.

 

 

harrow-mps-mpsharrow-jul-17-anes-harrow-mpscadets-local-police-confiscated-31601742.png

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On 10/07/2018 at 08:11, Rogerborg said:

https://www.parliament.uk/business/news/2018/june/have-your-say-on-the-offensive-weapons-bill/

 

As per the URL.  My experience has been that these consultations are a waste of time and an exercise in nodding along while swinging the rubber stamp, but maybe this will be the one that changes my mind.

It worked for the skirmisher Defence under the VCRA 

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