Why do techs not like gate titans

[Darbanator]

Why is it that some techs don’t like gate titans

[ImTriggerHappy]

10 minutes ago, Darbanator said:

Why is it that some techs don’t like gate titans

 

Because most techs are not really techs so fuck up the install and then try and claim that the Titans are at fault when something doesn't work properly.

Fitted plenty and never had one fail.

 

A few do just prefer the basic mechanical way of doing things which is fair enough, but most are just stupid.

 

[ak2m4]

4 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Because most techs are not really techs so fuck up the install and then try and claim that the Titans are at fault when something doesn't work properly.

 

That's a little harsh.  From speaking with about a dozen or so techs on a regular basis their main dislike is the relative high number of issues that CAN go wrong with them.  It's a high cost item, fitting and tuning can take longer, more things to go wrong etc.  They want to provide their customer with the utmost reliability.  They don't necessarily dislike the product but for some techs it's not economically viable for them to fit if that makes sense.  

[Skara]

2 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Because most techs are not really techs so fuck up the install and then try and claim that the Titans are at fault when something doesn't work properly.

Fitted plenty and never had one fail.

 

A few do just prefer the basic mechanical way of doing things which is fair enough, but most are just stupid.

Can't agree enough on this!!!!

 

 

Although Luke explains pretty well why he doesn't like it (unless it's a super high budget build)

[Sitting Duck]

Opinions are like arseholes - everybody has one etc....

 

Ask say 10 people to tweak the same gun and you will likely get a number of variations of what stuff is kept/replaced (and what with) depending on the Tech's personal preference and what the spec of gun is in their opinion/arsehole

 

eg:

Gear ratio, Motor, rewire/keep loom, mosfet or no mosfet plus which one blah x 3

What parts & manufacturer used & where

Hop/rubber/barrel upgrade possible or absolute must

Various tweaks/tricks/methods AoE, shimming methods, to be a tart or not to be a tart etc...

 

If people saw some of the stuff I might do, they might think WTF !!!!

But that don't mean I'm correct & they are wrong - or vice versa etc...

Just we might do things slightly differently according to own personal choice/preference etc...

 

Why do people buy £500 guns & others £100 or £200 guns for that matter

(Some people like Waitrose, some go to Sainburys & others go to Aldi)

 

Titan or Warfet - can understand some the reasoning for a Warfet instead of Titan

But full Warfet is like £75 or base unit is £50 still over the ASR £23

I could say I like to keep it minimal, but efficient than a cost issue I could argue

but then I would end up wasting more time and perhaps money (time=money)

piss balling about on some stuff others would not feel the need to fuck about with

(So in honesty, me saying it is a money/time fitting issue kinda falls flat)

 

Me personally I can't see me buying either Titan or Warfet as I personally ain't fussed about bells/whistles/features too much

But if others have them and love them - good on them, their gun, their choice, their money

(I still can't master the Virgin V+ box though)

 

End of the day - whatever upgrades you do, whatever glitter you sprinkle on a turd of a gun

it is usually the player not the gun( or its whistles) that wins the game

 

Some stuff is like the "Madbull effect", where often people (many newcomers), really think they need all these MUST HAVE upgrades on their

"BEST GUN EVVVVVAAAAAA" wishlist, gonna be sick owning the field crap

(c'mon, be honest most of us have been there)

 

UPGRADES COMPLETED

 

"How does it shoot ???" they asked

 

Dunno - can't fucking lift the fucker

 

[PopRocket123]

57 minutes ago, Sitting Duck said:

UPGRADES COMPLETED

 

"How does it shoot ???" they asked

 

Dunno - can't fucking lift the fucker

 

I had this happen to me on my first gun. Used it for one game then went straight back to the safe zone to take all the crap off and ran it with iron sights the rest of the day

[Iceni]

2 hours ago, Sitting Duck said:

Why do people buy £500 guns

Only £500 lol. I think my G3 rinsed me for far more than that! I mean there's a £450 scope on it And yes it does get skirmished with the scope.

I think the titan is kind of a melting pot of ideas. It does a lot of things well, but it also doesn't.

 

It's kind of making excuses for a badly built gun. You ROF is too high, Titan will fix that, You need a trigger delay, Titan can fix that ect ect.

The trouble is all of the problems it fixes are not problems if you know how to tech a gun. So asking a gun tech to fit one is kind of insulting.

You want the highest RPS - HPA engine.
You want the best trigger - GBB or Jefftron leviathan
You want a durable gearbox - Build the fecking thing right in the first place.
You want to protect the contacts - Dumbfet
You want battery protection - Buy a second battery and swap it at lunch.

Every problem it fixes has already been fixed.

[E21A]

 

Quote

 

 

You want the highest RPS - HPA engine.
You want the best trigger - GBB or Jefftron leviathan
You want a durable gearbox - Build the fecking thing right in the first place.
You want to protect the contacts - Dumbfet
You want battery protection - Buy a second battery and swap it at lunch.

Every problem it fixes has already been fixed.

 

Just a quick counter point, the Titan will do all of those things in one gun. What you’ve listed is at least 3 different guns/systems 

 

4 hours ago, Skara said:

 

 

Although Luke explains pretty well why he doesn't like it (unless it's a super high budget build)

 

His reasons are perfectly true and valid, but only apply to those who can’t do it themselves (which lets be honest is most people) or don’t have backup guns. 

[Iceni]

59 minutes ago, E21A said:

the Titan will do all of those things in one gun. What you’ve listed is at least 3 different guns/systems 

LMFAO.

Actually a titan isn't needed for any of those things, And a titan certainly doesn't add those things, the build of the gearbox does. It's not a magic box - It's more a wetware redundancy.

 

[PopRocket123]

It definitely works best with a build designed to complement it. I see so many people just chucking them in an otherwise stock gun and then wondering why it doesn't work or make any difference. I built my gun around the titan so it's got 13:1 gears, 16tpa motor with upgraded magnets running off a 7.4v lipo with the cylinder volumed for the most efficient barrel length, the AOE sorted and near perfect shimming and airseal. Realistically I don't need the titan but it makes a difference, mostly to the feel of shooting the gun more than the actual performance. Most techs won't build a gun to this level though as it's a lot more time consuming and it'd be harder to justify the appropriate cost

[Sitting Duck]

Luke sums it up reasonably well regarding Warfet vs Titan in his opinion

(which I tend to agree with, but don't own either so can't comment as an owner)

A number of Titan features = Warfet

& ASR>Warfet & back again Warfet>ASR etc... if wish to sell on/retire gun as spare

 

But there are numerous factors - not just price/preference

(try fitting a chunky Warfet in a titchy arse space like say PDW, MP5k)

So internal has the space saving & neatness feature you could argue

But then you got the 30 second change out on Warfet/ASR type of setups

 

At the moment I'm toying with a project that I'd probably just chuck in a cheapy 3034

but wire it up with deans to mosfet to deans at both ends plus a 2 pin connector like Gate's

Then I could say "WARFET READY" and slap extra money on for being so fucking clever

(well no not really but just makes sense if you think about it long term perhaps)

 

Now me personally, on rear wired M4's I like to run BOTH wires down back of motor

so widen the channels & rear wire entry hole slightly on grip

so the only wires going near motor/pinion/motor collar are the two thin mosfet/trigger wires

Also I've found that both motor wires at back helps with a slightly better motor angle to bevel

(in most instances, but depends on grip being used)

 

Not everyone does this, some have a wire either side in grip

& others in certain instances run a wire in front of motor in gearbox case

BUT, then bring the wire back as it enters the grip, so both run at back

NB: depends on each individual instance, gun/grip as well as personal preference etc...

(Remember we might all do shit a bit differently - but what works for you)

 

I'd like to see at some point them knock out say a Warfet or Warfet lite for £50 tops

have most if not all Warfet features, but instead of the programming card

chuck in the Phone/PC link app - but make sure it fucking works properly

 

Yeah - a £50 Warfet lite usb phone app bollox (that works) and I might be tempted

actually - yeah I could see myself getting 1 or 2 for some instances

then unplug my diy 3034 "WARFET READY" Blue Peter sticky back plastic 'fet & off I go

 

I actually think it could be a new standard for guns & good opportunity for Gate

a few bells & whistles, without too much extra glitter that works & easy to install/upgrade basic fetted guns

 

Even if the Titan & Warfet with all the bits n bobs were both £50 - I'd probably still lean mostly to Warfet

(sounds bollox perhaps but really not heavily into bells/whistles myself, just basic stuff that is easy & reliable)

 

but to each their own & one man's meat etc....

 

peace

 

 

[E21A]

22 minutes ago, Iceni said:

LMFAO.

Actually a titan isn't needed for any of those things, And a titan certainly doesn't add those things, the build of the gearbox does. It's not a magic box - It's more a wetware redundancy.

 

I didn’t say it was needed, I said it will do multiple things (admittedly not all) you’ve stated. For the record I’m not a titan fanboy, of the 7 rifles I own only one has a titan and I don’t plan on buying more.  

[Zarrin]

3 hours ago, Iceni said:

You want the best trigger - GBB or Jefftron leviathan
 

 

That G3 is a thing of beauty mate, it might be one of a few things in life I would hurt someone for..

 

Btw have you used the Leviathan? How's it stack up to the Titan and other switch unit models.. Jefftron are my go to for stand alone harness mosfets these days, price to performance and reliability, cant be beaten from my exp... yet to have one die on me. Quite honestly they make me question why i'm building my own.

[Iceni]

26 minutes ago, mzjango said:

Btw have you used the Leviathan?

Not owned one yet, my shooting partner picked one up and got it installed on his 416.

It's really nice. He has it set up with a little travel on the trigger, then the microswitch just gives a little resistance before the shot.

Not sure how hard they are to set up, My shooting partner is an ex-Armex/Umarex tech so he makes everything look effortless.

 

[ImTriggerHappy]

9 hours ago, ak2m4 said:

 

That's a little harsh.  From speaking with about a dozen or so techs on a regular basis their main dislike is the relative high number of issues that CAN go wrong with them.  It's a high cost item, fitting and tuning can take longer, more things to go wrong etc.  They want to provide their customer with the utmost reliability.  They don't necessarily dislike the product but for some techs it's not economically viable for them to fit if that makes sense.  

 

Nope I stick by my point as most so called techs have no real engineering background. Seems all it takes for someone to claim to be a tech is watching a few youtube vids and fixing/fucking there mate Jeffs gun in their moms spare room.

 

Titan is an absolute piece of piss to install and set up, takes about 45mins on bad day. Seen far more sick guns caused by being badly set up and poor soldering than decent quality ecu/etu failures.

 

The main thing about a titan is you can take any bog standard gun and get instant trigger response just by fitting a titan.

[Sitting Duck]

Gate has a new unit due out soon called the WARMITE...

 

 

(Think this thread has demonstrated this quite well tbh)

 

PS for the record I fucking love Marmite, but not spread with a plasterers trowel ffs...

 

 

but not missus who has to have the butter spread thoroughly, then scraped off (not too much butter)

then same to Marmite, spread properly then almost completely scraped off

(fuck it - make your own if you are gonna be that fussy)

 

Once, many years ago when I lived at home, my GF (now Mrs Duck) complained the Marmite on toast was way too much

 

So my dear ol' mum bless her, said yeah you put way too much on, she doesn't like it too thick

I know what you mean luv, I'll do ya some Marmite on toast...

 

FUCKING LAID IT ON twice as thick, absolutely covered it, more like Toast on Marmite

and GF was trying to not offend and stay polite she had to eat it trying not to hurl

 

So on that note, Titans are like Marmite shall we say ???

[Adolf Hamster]

40 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

The main thing about a titan is you can take any bog standard gun and get instant trigger response just by fitting a titan.

 

This is to my mind the entire point of the titan, I've yet to meet anything without an airline that can match a good titan build for trigger response.

 

I can understand negative airsofts view on the matter in terms of giving a non tech savvy customer a more basic yet robust setup, but that's not to say its a bad tool when employed correctly and given the correct supporting build.

[Iceni]

38 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

I've yet to meet anything without an airline that can match a good titan build for trigger response.

The jefftron beats it.

You can set binary trigger with pre-cocking and AB.

Watch this at 11:30
 

 

[AK47frizzle]

2 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

 

Nope I stick by my point as most so called techs have no real engineering background. Seems all it takes for someone to claim to be a tech is watching a few youtube vids and fixing/fucking there mate Jeffs gun in their moms spare room.

 

Titan is an absolute piece of piss to install and set up, takes about 45mins on bad day. Seen far more sick guns caused by being badly set up and poor soldering than decent quality ecu/etu failures.

 

The main thing about a titan is you can take any bog standard gun and get instant trigger response just by fitting a titan.

Well, that's why they're called techs and not airsoft engineers. You don't need an engineering background to be hired as a tech for anything either.

[Sitting Duck]

2 hours ago, AK47frizzle said:

Well, that's why they're called techs and not airsoft engineers. You don't need an engineering background to be hired as a tech for anything either.

 

Ahhh but the best tech's end up becoming airsoft engineers in the end due to TM compatibility BS

 

In an ideal world, stuff would drop in and work like it should 99.99999% of the time

however due to gearboxes among so many other things being so fucked up

files & dremels are not so uncommon sorting out stuff to make shit happen coz wanky tolerances

 

A couple of boxes need modding slightly to fit in Titan's due to switch area being wanked or extra casting that fouls it

plus sticky bits coz different selector plate differences and ensuring optical sensors work as they should

 

We shouldn't have to do this (so much), but at times it seems to get shit to work flawlessly most shit needs a tweak

(or at least thorough checking to ensure it will fucking work as it should)

 

For the record - I'm still a trainee apprentice, but one day hope to attain apprentice trainee tech status

 

For the CD - I've met plenty of people label "tech's" in various industries

some of them just inform you something is fucked - job done

 

"It is fucked mate" they say

 

"So how can it be fixed ???" I ask

 

"Don't know, not my department, you need to speak to one of our engineers" came the reply

 

"Oh - thanks, I did wonder if it was fucked, but thank you so much for clarifying that" - jeeeez

 

Then again the term "engineer" is way too overly used at times...

 

[AlphaBear]

7 hours ago, Iceni said:

The jefftron beats it.

You can set binary trigger with pre-cocking and AB.

Watch this at 11:30
 

 

 

What was that bit in the video about potentially breaking micro switches if you spam the trigger incessantly? Is that a limitation of certain mosfets? He did then go onto to mention that optical sensors just need cleaning and you're good to go referring to the those mosfets which don't using micro switches but optical sensors? 

 

The only disappointment about a Titan that I can see is the potential extra work you need to do to a gear box to make it fit a Titan build such as milling out the back end of the gear box to feed the extra wires or cutting off gearbox support struts (or whatever they are called) and so on..... that's the only bit I don't like personally....

 

And more importantly have you seen the colour of that rifle!! It may as well be 2 tone...! lol 

 

 

[EvilMonkee]

I don't appear able to fit a Titan in my GHK can someone advise plix? 

[Zarrin]

8 hours ago, Iceni said:

The jefftron beats it.

You can set binary trigger with pre-cocking and AB.
 

 

Looks impressive, I may get round to putting one in my mod 0's Lonex gb one day.. the app looks really easy to use too and has pretty much every feature you could want.

 

I swore off these kind of switch computer units after two failed G&G ETUs, but this peaks my interest tbh.

[Skara]

25 minutes ago, mzjango said:

two failed G&G ETUs

Actually, if you have the ETU trigger still inside the gearbox, Perun makes an upgrade kit for roughly €50, it replaces the mosfet so you don't have to open the box and gives functions like binary trigger (which I absolutely love), tuneable precocking, AB, tuneable burst fire (1-5 burst) on both semi/auto switches, plus a number of QOL settings like battery savers and such..

[AlphaBear]

OK chaps.... simple question then.... to protect the trigger contacts from arching and causing potential damage which mosfet should one install?  I get the optical sensor ones like the Titan as there is no longer a mechanical trigger contacts involved so the current can't bugger up the contacts.  Ergo, am I right in saying that if the trigger contacts cannot be replaced by the said mosfet then even that mosfet will cause the mechanical trigger to fail at some point?

 

Oh if there is one that doesn't involve soldering then even better as I'm rubbish at it....