AI500 2022

[Cannonfodder]

8 minutes ago, wicksy101 said:

threatening to call the police for harassment over some memes

😂😂😂

Jesus christ, what a bunch of muppets. I kind of hope they try it and get told where to go

[Rogerborg]

18 minutes ago, wicksy101 said:

the organisers threatening to call the police for harassment over some memes

 

This thread is now worthless without said memes.

[Skullchewer]

On 02/05/2022 at 17:55, Dalerj94 said:

 

Following above Day 2 of the event from perspective of CT17 Charlie division is up now - thanks again to all for watching and giving it some love!

 

So, how about now?

[wicksy101]

23 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

This thread is now worthless without said memes.

👀👀

 

 

from what I can tell the mood yesterday was set from the starting brief.  It was massively overbooked and they said in the brief ‘we didn’t expect this many to turn up’ 

 

loads of rule changes that were made that nobody was aware of and some questionable marshalling. The organisers turned around and basically said it’s the players fault😂

Edited October 2, 2022 by wicksy101
Meme

[Speedbird_666]

This just showed up on FB:

 

 

Can't say I'm at all shocked. Seems like par for the course for the AI500.

[Cannonfodder]

3 hours ago, wicksy101 said:

 It was massively overbooked and they said in the brief ‘we didn’t expect this many to turn up'

Bullshit. They knew how many tickets they'd sold so they knew how many would turn up, how many people regularly pay £100 to go to an event and not bother turning up? Yes some people may have an unexpected turn of events meaning they can't go but they would be a minority 

[Impulse]

There were too many players for the site and it would've been way better with half the players (again. Like the Citadel) and marshalling could've been done better as CQB is a lot harder to marshall than woodland and they definitely didn't have enough experience on the marshall team nor the numbers to deal with the absolute asshats who were taking the piss when it came to hit-taking. However, what isn't being shared in this is that the most experienced marshall who was directing the games took a really nasty tumble, dislocated his knee and had to be rushed to hospital on the first day. He was back on crutches on day 2, which went a lot smoother.

 

The Facebook drama went way, way too far in my opinion. Sure, there were some people offering constructive criticism, but there were others just dogpiling on the staff for player-led problems and as soon as that started happening, you lost me; the non-apology post by the staff wasn't great, but the response to it was a lot worse. At the end of the day, blaming marshalls for players not taking their hits is a bit weak; if players took their hits, marshalls don't get tied up in resolving the (countless) times non-hit taking was observed and can focus on keeping the game dynamic and interesting. If they had more numbers I think they could've done more about it (and that is where I think the blame there falls with them as you're always going to get at least some godmode meal team nine oper8rs at large events and need to plan for it), but I'll direct my annoyance more at the players who were taking the piss; probably about an 80:20 split of my ire for players and staff respectively. Seriously, the non-hit taking was absolutely awful at this event and was probably my biggest gripe; I personally saw a lot of it because I was silly(?) enough to bring a magnified optic to a CQB event and 5x zoom was helpful in spotting the BBs hitting their targets. Again, 2nd day was waaaaaaaaay better for hit-taking, though there were still some instances of clear piss-taking.

 

Outside of that my only other gripe was their rules being a bit silly but I've already elaborated on that multiple times. I wanted to bring one of my (many) 1J bolt action builds, but they weren't allowed for reasons that still elude me.

 

I went in with no expectations apart from the fact that I would make of the event what I would and I would find ways to enjoy myself. Honestly, I thoroughly enjoyed my weekend and had many good laughs. Did my sniper-y thing and crept into positions where I was either concealed in shadow (like a true edgyboi) or to where the target I was presenting the enemy was so tiny that it was never getting hit at those distances and just used the MWS for what it's great at. Next time (doubt there will be one at that venue though) I'll bring a bolt action if I'm allowed (😡) or at least my HPA m21 even if it's a CQB venue like that. Also, it was a fantastic workout because I used my heavy setup with the weighted plates in my plate carrier as well as a LOT of gas magazines; probably about 20kg of gear I was lugging around all weekend and I managed it! Didn't lighten my load or give up on the idea, and I was a lot more active on day 2, running around the place to get to positions or across an area being fought over.

 

Met lots of great guys there and really enjoyed the social aspect too. Also, we found a pile of abandoned clothing in our day 2 CP and decided that we would have a bit of fun. We rocked up to the morning brief on day 2 like this:

 

Anyway, I'm tired after a lovely 6 hour trip back down to the south coast and I'm going to go collapse into a pile and not wake until work on Tuesday!

[Rogerborg]

This event seems like an exemplar that hope is not a strategy.

 

I'd offer up for consideration an alternative way that these large events could go, one which accepts reality without approving of it.

 

 

[Cannonfodder]

Exactly this ^^^^

 

While problems with cheating is caused by the players it's the marshal's job to stamp it out. If they're unable or unwilling to do so then that's on them

[Tackle]

All very well, assuming the team behind the event, possibly the same people marshaling it, aren't themselves a notorious bunch of cheats on the playing field ?, & probably don't give a fuck. 

 

 

Allegedly 😏

[Rogerborg]

22 hours ago, Tackle said:

[are] themselves a notorious bunch of cheats on the playing field

 

And then they told players to STFU and follow the rules.

 

[TheFull9]

People really must vote with their wallets on these events, I've never heard of one going remotely well.  Maybe some years ago I missed one, but I'm pretty sure for the past few years they've been both really terrible and expensive?  I only had that once myself (the mythical blue fox 2) and it made me extremely wary I'd have to say.  There's zero chance I'll put my faith in any organiser without a track record of both decent length and solid quality.  Granted my feasible opportunities to attend multi-day events are probably a lot rarer than some so I'm extremely cautious, but even if the time and effort were immaterial (which they really aren't), when you're paying something like £80-150 just for the entry let alone fuel and supplies, the experience simply can't be an unpleasant mess.

[Alpha.s1]

A bit confused how they manage to find 400 odd people to give them money tbh, as far as i can remember these events, have the worst possible reputation, the last 3 at the very least have the exact same issues, 8 Marshall's - 400 players, unique site, but no idea how to actually run the site, weird inconsistent rulesets.

1 time it could be forgiven, if they improved, but doing it over and over is ridiculous.

by the stories coming out each event you'd think this was their first run, not going on for 7 years now.

[Skullchewer]

I would imagine, as with many non Airsoft events, people go for the event itself, much like NAF. It's not just the airsoft, it's the size of it, the social aspect etc.

And then, taking music festivals in as an example, some can be utter shit shows but still make money every year.

There's one metal festival I won't go to for various reasons, but the final deciding factor for me is that the regular crowd consists of utter tossers. And I'm not the only one that feels that way. 

But it's a big event, makes loads of cash, despite even the regulars thinking the organisers are assholes and complaining vociferously about the event on social media.

But they all go again next year.

 

Airsoft events as big as NAF and AI500 aren't really that widespread, as they're a ball ache to put on, so for those that want a BIG experience they don't have that much choice.

 

None of the above excuses the poor organisation I've been hearing about from AI500 AGAIN, just musing on why people keep going back.

 

Edited October 3, 2022 by Skullchewer

[Rogerborg]

13 hours ago, Skullchewer said:

But it's a big event, makes loads of cash

 

I'd be fascinated to know how the financials work out.  We're looking at about £50K gross income, but I have no idea what site rental would be like, or liability insurance (if they had any - who exactly would you sue in the event of an avoidable injury?), or whether they were even paying marshals.

 

What I do know is that 1 marshal per 50 players is farcically inadequate, just from a bare safety perspective, let alone gameplay. Cease-fire / man-down shouts, hearing and finding injured players in a complex structure, performing the most cursory sweeps in the event of a fire evacuation, you're not getting that done with 1 in 50.

 

Given that we know, we absolutely know, that hot-shooting and cheating does occur at every event, and given their documented response was "Not our problem", I can see a fair case for claiming breach of contract. You don't have to be injured to claim: loss of enjoyment is actionable.

 

Not that I would, but then I wouldn't go to this scale of event because I know exactly what to expect.  What I would say is that the only way it will actually change is when it costs them more to do it wrong than to do it right.

[Skullchewer]

For perspective I know of a site that recently rented their site for a weekend long private event, for £3k.

Edited October 4, 2022 by Skullchewer

[Rogerborg]

10 minutes ago, Skullchewer said:

For perspective I know of a site that recently rented their site for a weekend long private event, for £3k.

 

I'd guess that mall site is into five figures for a weekend, with the usual hair-splitting over whether it's in-use and non-derelict for purposes of paying rates or not.

 

I'd be looking at bare minimum £200 per marshal for the weekend, so maybe £2000 for those who showed up.  That's where I'd want the money to have gone, and it seems that's exactly where they skimped and saved.  Of course, it's entirely possible that their marshal team (such as it was) were doing it at mates-rates or were mugged off into volunteered their time.  Anyone know?

 

Liability insurance, phew, no idea.  I mean, if they had any. At least they wouldn't need weather cancellation cover.

 

Running events this size is a thankless, grinding task, and I can see why Sharon there got a bit tetchy. There's a Facebook thread about bookings where she says "email me, DO NOT reply to this post", and of course, it's full of replies.

 

But it's not like she's doing this as a charity gig, right?  This is money for what are ostensibly professional services, not the kitty for some local club.

 

Imagine you'd paid £100 for weekend entry to some amusement park that was overrun with ferals jumping the queues and spitting in your chips, and that this was a known problem that went on weekend after weekend.  Do you think the site could shrug it off by saying "Blame the other customers, nothing to do with us."

[magaz]

On 03/10/2022 at 00:34, Impulse said:

There were too many players for the site and it would've been way better with half the players (again. Like the Citadel) and marshalling could've been done better as CQB is a lot harder to marshall than woodland and they definitely didn't have enough experience on the marshall team nor the numbers to deal with the absolute asshats who were taking the piss when it came to hit-taking. However, what isn't being shared in this is that the most experienced marshall who was directing the games took a really nasty tumble, dislocated his knee and had to be rushed to hospital on the first day. He was back on crutches on day 2, which went a lot smoother.

 

The Facebook drama went way, way too far in my opinion. Sure, there were some people offering constructive criticism, but there were others just dogpiling on the staff for player-led problems and as soon as that started happening, you lost me; the non-apology post by the staff wasn't great, but the response to it was a lot worse. At the end of the day, blaming marshalls for players not taking their hits is a bit weak; if players took their hits, marshalls don't get tied up in resolving the (countless) times non-hit taking was observed and can focus on keeping the game dynamic and interesting. If they had more numbers I think they could've done more about it (and that is where I think the blame there falls with them as you're always going to get at least some godmode meal team nine oper8rs at large events and need to plan for it), but I'll direct my annoyance more at the players who were taking the piss; probably about an 80:20 split of my ire for players and staff respectively. Seriously, the non-hit taking was absolutely awful at this event and was probably my biggest gripe; I personally saw a lot of it because I was silly(?) enough to bring a magnified optic to a CQB event and 5x zoom was helpful in spotting the BBs hitting their targets. Again, 2nd day was waaaaaaaaay better for hit-taking, though there were still some instances of clear piss-taking.

 

Outside of that my only other gripe was their rules being a bit silly but I've already elaborated on that multiple times. I wanted to bring one of my (many) 1J bolt action builds, but they weren't allowed for reasons that still elude me.

 

I went in with no expectations apart from the fact that I would make of the event what I would and I would find ways to enjoy myself. Honestly, I thoroughly enjoyed my weekend and had many good laughs. Did my sniper-y thing and crept into positions where I was either concealed in shadow (like a true edgyboi) or to where the target I was presenting the enemy was so tiny that it was never getting hit at those distances and just used the MWS for what it's great at. Next time (doubt there will be one at that venue though) I'll bring a bolt action if I'm allowed (😡) or at least my HPA m21 even if it's a CQB venue like that. Also, it was a fantastic workout because I used my heavy setup with the weighted plates in my plate carrier as well as a LOT of gas magazines; probably about 20kg of gear I was lugging around all weekend and I managed it! Didn't lighten my load or give up on the idea, and I was a lot more active on day 2, running around the place to get to positions or across an area being fought over.

 

Met lots of great guys there and really enjoyed the social aspect too. Also, we found a pile of abandoned clothing in our day 2 CP and decided that we would have a bit of fun. We rocked up to the morning brief on day 2 like this:

 

Anyway, I'm tired after a lovely 6 hour trip back down to the south coast and I'm going to go collapse into a pile and not wake until work on Tuesday!

I was standing next to you guys in that second day safety brief! I thought you'd come on a stag do or something!