What Are People Doing for UKARA Nowadays?

[rj1986]

So i didn't get much of a chance to play in 2019 and the world stopped in 2020 so any chance of me having UKARA is gone.

 

Not too bad for my usual forum surfing, but that tasty mk48 coming out, means I need the UKARA digits.

What are people doing to go round this?

 

I'm hoping to get my 3 games in this summer before going to Japan in the Winter and nabbing a VFC psg1 on the cheap, maybe.

[Cr0-Magnon]

I'm using UKARA as managed to renew mine in September. I know some retailers are accepting recently expired UKARA numbers, due to the current situation but sounds like you wouldn't be eligible for that?

[rj1986]

8 minutes ago, Cr0-Magnon said:

I'm using UKARA as managed to renew mine in September. I know some retailers are accepting recently expired UKARA numbers, due to the current situation but sounds like you wouldn't be eligible for that?

Nope, my last Ukara was from a site that closed down a while ago. Tried it with JDAirsoft over Xmas for a pistol and it was computer says no.

 

My logic has always been the more you spend, the less likely you need Ukara.

Like £20 springer = 100% need ukara.

£800 Silverback HTI with £400 worth of extra's = legit.

[concretesnail]

It depends on who and what site your members of. I had my ukara through first and only and recently if they said that if you have had it with them in the past then they would look at reactivating your ukara if you pay your membership fees again.

[Guest Mr. No_Face]

I'm in the same boat. I had just quit paintballing and attended my first two games to get my UKARA, but shit went to hell. All of that has now been undone and I'm stuck with two tone guns. What's even worse is when you see a gun that's super rare get re-stocked and you're forced to sit and watch the stock deplete since you don't want it ruined with two tone. I bought a Ronin TK45c in two tone which luckily those parts can be switched out when receiving the UKARA membership, but I would never ever think to purchase a umarex MP7 aeg in two tone. I planned to run that as my secondary and it sucks to see it re-stocked and sell out instantly.

[Dentonboy]

My UKARA elapsed in Feb' 2020 (why does it elapse?) and have been quoted £25 to become a member of a site franchise I haven't played on/with for 4 years just to renew it. Strikes me as a money grab as one cannot imagine it is that costly to run?! 

 

I have long thought the scheme to be an unnecessarily pricey endeavour as, by my reckoning, it is a scheme to keep the retailers on the right side of the law.

 

Maybe I am wrong, but the constant process or renewal and fees strikes me as greedy.

[benno996]

3 hours ago, Dentonboy said:

My UKARA elapsed in Feb' 2020 (why does it elapse?) and have been quoted £25 to become a member of a site franchise I haven't played on/with for 4 years just to renew it. Strikes me as a money grab as one cannot imagine it is that costly to run?! 

 

I have long thought the scheme to be an unnecessarily pricey endeavour as, by my reckoning, it is a scheme to keep the retailers on the right side of the law.

 

Maybe I am wrong, but the constant process or renewal and fees strikes me as greedy.

I’m by no means the UKARA police or an expert on the subject but I think it’s right it should expire. I didn’t play for 5 years, therefore theoretically lost any right or defence to own a RIF? 
 

The time to expire perhaps the subjective point, but on the note of paying, that’s the equivalent to a day’s game fee roughly, which you’d have to do under normal circumstances to renew anyway? 
 

Some sites having to cancel site insurance and cost cut with everything going on, so on reflection I guess not a bad time to support sites through this rather shite period. 
 

Do I agree that UKARA should be the dominating factor in being able to buy a RIF? Not at all. But it is and it allows us to generally go about our business without too much hassle so I’ll roll over and take the hit. 

[Sneaky]

My Ukara has expired, which I got an email from my local site. I will renew it and my membership at some point, but I am in no rush. Also more importantly I have all the RIF’s I want, hence why I am fussed to renew it now. When we do start playing, then I will reconsider.

[Lozart]

Fire Support have widened their criteria for being able to prove a defence https://www.fire-support.co.uk/buyingagun.php

[Dentonboy]

How do you prove 'Cosplay'?! Surely that is an open invitation for any over 18 to get a RiF without UKARA?!

[mirinjawbro]

i still find weird to this day its only 18+ to buy an "airgun", but airsoft needs the UKARA. 

[Tommikka]

1 hour ago, Dentonboy said:

How do you prove 'Cosplay'?! Surely that is an open invitation for any over 18 to get a RiF without UKARA?!

With Cosplay not being an activity under the VCRA, and the terms & conditions of entry for CosPlayers to a ComiCon event it becomes a very shaken defence.

If say for example Cosplay insurance was brought in by a BB retailer then it would look more of a dodgy defence and just a method for a retailer to try and work around the law

 

’Professional’ cosplayers that present on stage, perform, are ‘celebrity guests’ etc more easily fit the theatrical defences. Established cosplay groups with membership abs PLI may also fit the theatrical defence.

(By ‘present on stage’ I don’t mean the dress up competitions at comicons) 

24 minutes ago, mirinjawbro said:

i still find weird to this day its only 18+ to buy an "airgun", but airsoft needs the UKARA. 

That’s because an airgun is a firearm, and that airsoft guns aren’t (unless they exceed the defined power limits etc and may be a firearm)

 

In Scotland you now need a new basic entry level firearms certificate for air guns

[Dentonboy]

1 hour ago, Tommikka said:

With Cosplay not being an activity under the VCRA, and the terms & conditions of entry for CosPlayers to a ComiCon event it becomes a very shaken defence.

If say for example Cosplay insurance was brought in by a BB retailer then it would look more of a dodgy defence and just a method for a retailer to try and work around the law

 

’Professional’ cosplayers that present on stage, perform, are ‘celebrity guests’ etc more easily fit the theatrical defences. Established cosplay groups with membership abs PLI may also fit the theatrical defence.

(By ‘present on stage’ I don’t mean the dress up competitions at comicons) 

That’s because an airgun is a firearm, and that airsoft guns aren’t (unless they exceed the defined power limits etc and may be a firearm)

 

In Scotland you now need a new basic entry level firearms certificate for air guns

But Fire Support, arguably the proponents of UKARA, have cosplay as a defence to buy a RiF, so my point is, it seems like a very loose term that anyone could use.

[AlphaBear]

There are various official cosplay clubs in the UK. If you can prove you belong to one of these clubs with evidence of you on their official events then that may well work. I find it hard to believe that any Tom Dick or Harry who has attended a comic con, as a paying public guest and not part of an official club, can then say it’s a defence. It’s not. Let’s be pragmatic here. However if you belong to an official club then that’s another matter (I’ve repeated myself). Let’s give Fire Support a little more credit. They have been retailers for 20plus years and they do know if people are trying to take the mickey. 

[gunbod007]

I have a "Just Cos" account. Cost me like £20 and ordered a RIF that day. It's accepted by more and more sites at the moment but for those who don't then I am considering Sportsmans association.

[Lozart]

1 hour ago, Dentonboy said:

But Fire Support, arguably the proponents of UKARA, have cosplay as a defence to buy a RiF, so my point is, it seems like a very loose term that anyone could use.

One of the founding members in fact!

 

48 minutes ago, AlphaBear said:

There are various official cosplay clubs in the UK. If you can prove you belong to one of these clubs with evidence of you on their official events then that may well work. I find it hard to believe that any Tom Dick or Harry who has attended a comic con, as a paying public guest and not part of an official club, can then say it’s a defence. It’s not. Let’s be pragmatic here. However if you belong to an official club then that’s another matter (I’ve repeated myself). Let’s give Fire Support a little more credit. They have been retailers for 20plus years and they do know if people are trying to take the mickey. 

 

Exactly. There's plenty of people that will accept JustCos insurance as a valid defence for buying a RIF. Like @AlphaBear says, if you're a registered member of a proper club/organisation (like the 501st or Rebel Alliance) then that's good enough.

I mean, re-enactors are just cosplayers at the end of the day. SERIOUS cosplayers but still...

[ak2m4]

2 minutes ago, gunbod007 said:

I have a "Just Cos" account. Cost me like £20 and ordered a RIF that day. It's accepted by more and more sites at the moment but for those who don't then I am considering Sportsmans association.

 

So all you had to do is upload a picture of a photo ID, upload a picture of you in a costume, and pay your £20 ?

[gunbod007]

20 minutes ago, ak2m4 said:

 

So all you had to do is upload a picture of a photo ID, upload a picture of you in a costume, and pay your £20 ?

Yep exactly, now I know I am a legit airsofter. And the pic was me at a game when I used to play more.

 

But to be honest I would totally understand if sites stopped accepting it. It is way too easy to get. But right now I didn't feel like I had an alternative. 

[Dentonboy]

1 hour ago, AlphaBear said:

There are various official cosplay clubs in the UK. If you can prove you belong to one of these clubs with evidence of you on their official events then that may well work. I find it hard to believe that any Tom Dick or Harry who has attended a comic con, as a paying public guest and not part of an official club, can then say it’s a defence. It’s not. Let’s be pragmatic here. However if you belong to an official club then that’s another matter (I’ve repeated myself). Let’s give Fire Support a little more credit. They have been retailers for 20plus years and they do know if people are trying to take the mickey. 

 

I am not knocking FS at all, just surprised such a seemingly easy thing to do would be accepted by them, knowing how rigorously they investigate other defences.

[Dogsbody100]

Funny this, seems a while back there was a thread on just cos where everyone poo pood it as bollocks, seems to have worked here so what gives? 

[gunbod007]

1 minute ago, Dogsbody100 said:

Funny this, seems a while back there was a thread on just cos where everyone poo pood it as bollocks, seems to have worked here so what gives? 

Yeah it is accepted by quite a few sites at the moment

 

Zero one

Wolf Armouries

Airsoftworld 

Action hobbies - I think

[Adolf Hamster]

the reason it expires is simply that people quit the hobby.

 

all things considered £25 a year is a drop in the ocean compared to the level of spending this hobby sucks up and to my mind it is worth it for the benefits of adding legitimacy to our hobby.

 

the issue is that for airsoft specifically, is there any other alternative? this cosplay malarkey as has been mentioned is pretty shakey and afaik (read: citation needed) the re-enacement memberships are supposed to be limited to stuff that's relevant to that particular group (ie if you're a ww2 re-enactor it doesn't cover post 1945 kit). i can see why some shops are folding to it though, for them it's a case of survival.

 

arguably the current situation should merit some extensions to current ukara memberships because not everyone had the chance to renew last summer/autumn during the 2 days we were allowed out to play.

[gunbod007]

8 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

the reason it expires is simply that people quit the hobby.

 

all things considered £25 a year is a drop in the ocean compared to the level of spending this hobby sucks up and to my mind it is worth it for the benefits of adding legitimacy to our hobby.

 

the issue is that for airsoft specifically, is there any other alternative? this cosplay malarkey as has been mentioned is pretty shakey and afaik (read: citation needed) the re-enacement memberships are supposed to be limited to stuff that's relevant to that particular group (ie if you're a ww2 re-enactor it doesn't cover post 1945 kit). i can see why some shops are folding to it though, for them it's a case of survival.

 

arguably the current situation should merit some extensions to current ukara memberships because not everyone had the chance to renew last summer/autumn during the 2 days we were allowed out to play.

I agree that UKARA should consider the situation when considering renewals, It's a shame there is seemingly no guidance on new applications or amendments to the entry criteria.

 

I think it will put off a lot of people from entering the sport/hobby, but then covid did that anyway.

 

 

[Lozart]

At least JustCos gives you PL insurance for your £25.

50 minutes ago, gunbod007 said:

Yep exactly, now I know I am a legit cosplayer

 

FTFY

[AlphaBear]

49 minutes ago, Dentonboy said:

 

I am not knocking FS at all, just surprised such a seemingly easy thing to do would be accepted by them, knowing how rigorously they investigate other defences.

I must admit even I was a tad surprised when I logged on the other day but hey ho. Sales are needed. I’m sure the proper due diligence will be done. 
.

.

 

Anyway,  UKARA is there for a reason. It’s our way of self regulation to a degree. Otherwise we will end up like Australia and running around with Gel Blasters. It just takes one person to act like an idiot and bring our hobby into disrepute.