Restrictions on Gatherings and Airsoft?

[Cromulon1994]

Had a number of proposed rideouts cancelled this weekend and this is apparently due to the police now having the power to enforce restrictions on gatherings of more than 30 people or 6 different households. 

 

Does this screw us for the time being?

[Shamal]

Hope not!

Might just apply to street gatherings and raves.

Regards 

[Nick G]

My local site is just running days with a max number of 30, and running game days pretty much every week at the moment. Have to plan games accordingly to account for the lower numbers but seems to work OK

[Robert James]

7 hours ago, Cromulon1994 said:

Had a number of proposed rideouts cancelled this weekend and this is apparently due to the police now having the power to enforce restrictions on gatherings of more than 30 people or 6 different households. 

 

Does this screw us for the time being?

Because its Notting Hill weekend. They are trying to stop unofficial music events from happening, spreaing virus' etc. Im sure itll be fine by next weekend or the one after. 

[Tommikka]

Each site will be running a restricted service anyway, depending on their Covid risk assessment and national & local government restrictions 

 

eg central government give the leading guidance, the site prepares its plan, their insurers decide if they are happy, the local

council etc gives authority to reopen

 

Sites are likely to be operating at lower number caps, prebooked players only, they may have group restrictions to household groups etc 

 

The situation may keep changing due to local circumstances 

 

 

 

[Rogerborg]

The latest diktat for England is here: https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/684/regulation/5

 

tl;dr version - the 30 person limit does not apply outdoors if the gathering has been organised by a business, they have done a risk assessment and the gathering organiser has taken all reasonable measures to limit the risk of transmission of the coronavirus, taking into account the risk assessment.

 

Hugely open to interpretation, but if you wave a pile of paper at Dibble and say "Risk assessed, distancing in place", I can't see him touching it.

 

Indoors appears to have a hard 30 person limit, but give it 5 minutes and see if that changes.

 

As regarding bike rides, rattle a tin for chaaaridy, say "Don't hug each other at the destination" and you should be OK too.

 

I really don't see this being a problem for airsoft, particularly outdoors.  The police aren't actively seeking out private gatherings, they're being called to them.

[Albiscuit]

I have played more games this year during Covid since restrictions have eased and if I’m honest a game that probably shouldn’t have gone ahead than I have all of last year I think. I have yet to come across a site I have not felt safe at, all but one had measures in place and made a point of mentioning guidelines (some more than others admittedly).

Sites are still advertising games so I think they must generally be ok or feel they have done enough to be allowed to run.
I personally feel generally safe out and about now and follow guidelines and end up closer to the public at Tesco’s than on an Airsoft field so will continue to play whilst able.

 

I doubt Airsoft is likely to get the brunt of anything. It’s more the unsocially distanced illegal raves they want to cut down on, and I can see why (even though I normally love an illegal rave pre Covid).

[Everz88]

Hi all, trying to dig down into the new rules that come into affect Monday, as usual info from government is fluffy and probably won’t be ironed out until Sunday evening! Has anyone worked out how it will affect skirmishing? Planned to attend a week on sat but wondering if I should try to get to one this Saturday instead!!? 

[XanderShadow]

Part of the wording we've seen so far is distanced sports wont be effected by this.. so sports where players don't come into close contact.

I'd assume airsoft comes under that as we're a non contact, ranged sport, following current guidelines for distancing and such that sites have been using.

[Everz88]

My thoughts and hopes are the same, I think if Sunday league football is to continue and my contacts are suggesting it will then I will call victimisation if airsoft gets canned!! 

[Rogerborg]

14 minutes ago, XanderShadow said:

Part of the wording we've seen so far is distanced sports wont be effected by this.

 

Where are you seeing that?  Al Beeb are saying "organised team sports".  I know it's likely to change nine times before next Monday, plus the regional mayors will be coming up with their own spin on it.

[Tommikka]

1 hour ago, XanderShadow said:

Part of the wording we've seen so far is distanced sports wont be effected by this.. so sports where players don't come into close contact.

I'd assume airsoft comes under that as we're a non contact, ranged sport, following current guidelines for distancing and such that sites have been using.

Let’s not forget that airsoft is not a ‘recognised sport’ under Sport England criteria 

 

If they stick to the line of ‘organised team sports’ then airsoft doesn’t qualify, if it extends to other leisure activities then airsoft may qualify 

 

It takes us back a few months to when sites began to plan reopening for July, followed by backtracking 

Airsoft does have representative bodies, but not to the degree of recognition that the UKPSF have for paintball.  UKPSF recognition didn’t give ‘sport recognition’ but their discussions did result in paintball being named in supporting materials on what criteria were required to reopen

 

Would you honestly say that there is no close contact in airsoft?

You don’t routinely come right up to each other, but there is safe zone staging, briefs, all hiding behind one tree, etc 

[Cr0-Magnon]

45 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Would you honestly say that there is no close contact in airsoft?

 

Player 1 has COVID, coughs into his hand. Pours BB's in to his palm and pushes them in to his mag.....

[Rogerborg]

51 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Let’s not forget that airsoft is not a ‘recognised sport’ under Sport England criteria 

 

Hilariously, they do seem to recognise darts as a "sport",  Maybe we could lob the BBs by hand?

[AlphaBear]

25 minutes ago, Cr0-Magnon said:

 

Player 1 has COVID, coughs into his hand. Pours BB's in to his palm and pushes them in to his mag.....

Hopefully one won’t swallow any of those ‘touched’ said bbs or worse still gets stuck up ones nose. Imagine that eh? 

But, yeah the whole can or can’t or should or shouldn’t is open to too much interpretation. It’s only gonna get stricter so enjoy the games as much as you can until we get told otherwise. 
 

 

25 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Hilariously, they do seem to recognise darts as a "sport",  Maybe we could lob the BBs by hand?

There’s a team art and spirit to pouring those beer glasses whistle partaking in throwing darts yes? So it must be a sport on that grounds? Surely?

[Tommikka]

44 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Hilariously, they do seem to recognise darts as a "sport",  Maybe we could lob the BBs by hand?

There’s a simple reason for that - darts has a governing body who gathered their evidence and presented an application for recognition 

 

Darts requires skill to compete, has a recognised body, formal rules, a qualifying level of participation across the country etc

Darts is a recognised sport in a number of countries, but not enough to qualify as an international sport

 

 

[GeorgePlaysAirsoft]

I'm probably going to regret posting this but I'm not that concerned, well, I'm not concerned to the point where I'm happy to wait until 4 for the details. 

 

I think there has been a lot of confusion about what a "social gathering" is. The short version is that it's not like a.. congregation of people in a given area.  Here's the definition of the law:

 

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2020/684/regulation/5

 

As far as I can tell previously the guidelines were no "social gatherings" of more then 6 people (and bubbles, households..etc) - but the police only had powers to enforce dispersal of social gatherings of more then 30 people. The law is being changed to put police powers in line with the guidelines, so I guess the 6 person (bubble, household..i don't know!) is no longer a "guideline" but something that can be enforced by the police.

 

What this means in practice: If you meet up with friends in the park, or garden, you weren't really supposed to do so in a group of more then 6. but the police were powerless to do anything about it unless there was more then 30 of you. Now they have the power to do so.

 

Likewise, you can go the pub, or for the sake of it, a skirmish site. But that isn't a "social gathering". Its lots of social gatherings, in the same place. This article has someone from BEIS explaining it:

 

https://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/Article/2020/06/26/Do-pubs-have-to-limit-numbers-to-30-people

 

I assume the same is for airsoft.

 

People may ask "why can't I meet up with more then 5 other people in the park, but I can go to the pub/airsoft/gym/etc?" The answer from the government (not necessarily scientific) is that because the latter are, or at least, should be "covid secure", in a way that say your garden bbq isn't (again, just technically speaking, I'm sure people have had bbqs that would be considered to be "covid secure" if whichever h&s bod came round to check)

 

As ever just my assumptions/thoughts. I'll wait until 4. I'm very aware by typing this out i've jinxed it and airsoft is banned for ever but we will see. 

 

edit: a take from Andy at UCAP: 

https://www.facebook.com/groups/UCAPAirsoft/permalink/10160454182945031/

 

[Rogerborg]

2 hours ago, Tommikka said:

There’s a simple reason for that - darts has a governing body who gathered their evidence and presented an application for recognition 

 

I found it notable (in the sense of not noting it) that there's none listed in that document.

 

And right at the start we have a bunch of "air sports" that appear to be just chaps larking around in planes (or jumping out of them).  Also: competitive caving?  But they do have an association.

 

We do have UKAPU, but they don't appear to have made the argument, and nor does paintball.  But that list is 4 years old.  Can anyone turn up a newer one?

[Schnakey]

The solution here seems simple. Ref gets ordained online, marry two players at the start of the day and you have an Airsoft themed wedding on your hands rather than a day of Airsoft.

[Tommikka]

1 hour ago, Rogerborg said:

 

I found it notable (in the sense of not noting it) that there's none listed in that document.

 

And right at the start we have a bunch of "air sports" that appear to be just chaps larking around in planes (or jumping out of them).  Also: competitive caving?  But they do have an association.

 

We do have UKAPU, but they don't appear to have made the argument, and nor does paintball.  But that list is 4 years old.  Can anyone turn up a newer one?

My reference point to check the list was pole fitness, but a bit of double checking shows that they gained ‘provisional status’ with the International GAISF, so the 2016 list might still be the newest recognised

list.

 

I know the UKPSF are in communication with Sports England, and have commissioned a series of academic studies with a university.  But in membership participation are nowhere near being considered.  In July there were approx 500 UKPSF active player members with a minimum required of 1850.

There are a lot more than 500 actively competing in the CPPS national tournaments, but they aren’t all signed up as UKPSF members (and renewing) Let alone walkon/own gunners who play the various flavours

 

Delta Force were laughed out of Sport England when they put in their Olympic bid campaign trying to use their mailing list of everyone who had signed a rental waiver.

 

Speedsoft looks tiny compared to tournament paintball, but overall airsoft  must have the numbers as it appears to have a larger player base ‘regularly’ playing along with print magazines in WH Smiths, I’ve seen the numbers that are needed to get a magazine distribution deal - so the airsoft magazines are selling to someone, (or the companies are a loss leading front for a orgainsed crimes money laundering operation) 

1 hour ago, Schnakey said:

The solution here seems simple. Ref gets ordained online, marry two players at the start of the day and you have an Airsoft themed wedding on your hands rather than a day of Airsoft.

Someone will have to pay for the marriage licence and accredit the venue.

 

I can conduct a ceremony in California, but I don’t like heat

 

 

 

[Rogerborg]

4 hours ago, Tommikka said:

I can conduct a ceremony in California, but I don’t like heat

 

Northern California is surprisingly clement.

 

Universal Life Church, by any chance?  I haven't seen you at the meetings.  But then we all wear those hoods and cloaks.

[Tommikka]

35 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Northern California is surprisingly clement.

 

Universal Life Church, by any chance?  I haven't seen you at the meetings.  But then we all wear those hoods and cloaks.

I’m the one in the black 

[Rogerborg]

1 minute ago, Tommikka said:

I’m the one in the black 

 

Bonum commune communitatis.

 

No clarifications yet, other than to re-iterate "organised team sport", but no mention of numbers or distinction between indoors and outdoors.

[Shamal]

On 09/09/2020 at 15:37, Schnakey said:

The solution here seems simple. Ref gets ordained online, marry two players at the start of the day and you have an Airsoft themed wedding on your hands rather than a day of Airsoft.

I'm taking no chances for my game at green ops on 20th..I've got my vcam laid out and also a suit and some confetti and a nice salt and pepper set for the happy couple.lol 👬👭👫just to cover all permutations 

😉

Regards 

[Albiscuit]

I would argue Airsoft is a Team Sport, not sure about Organised though.