Imax B6s Are S**t: Change My Mind....

[Speedbird_666]

 

I see it daily on the various forums and social media.

 

Little Johnny asks: ‘What am bestest charger’ – the answer more often than not from people that are self-professed ‘experts’ will be ‘Imax B6’.

 

Little Johnny runs off to Amazon or eBay armed with this advice, punches in the search term, finds the cheapest result and orders it. Problem is – it’s more than likely a fake – knocked-off to the extent that even the logos and holograms are the same on the outside. Unbeknownst to little Johnny, the inside of said charger is a shit-show of cheap and nasty components that will likely at some point fail.

 

Hopefully, the failure will be benign – maybe a little pop, or a little puff of magic smoke, leaving a dead charger to be consigned to landfill. On occasion though, the failure can be catastrophic, leading to fire, property damage or worse.

 

Oh, little Johnny picked up a real one from a reputable source? Surely that’s safe...right?

 

Erm…no.

 

Here, dear reader, is a story of the catastrophic failure of a real Imax B6 belonging to a fellow (long-time) RC Flyer and Club member local to me. This happened in 2017.

 

The following emails were sent to the club’s email distribution list. Some information has been redacted for his privacy but spelling/grammar unchanged  - I added the bold:

 

Hi All

After flying at [Redacted] yesterday I was recharging 3 lipo batteries. Batteries are put into a heavy highly fired pot and lid to contain the battery and reduce fire damage from any flare-up. 

 

I was close bye to this area when I saw white smoke, then flame and the next instant big flames.

 

My garage is now a pile of rubble, the fire brigade took 12mins to arrive. The entire roof was gone within 7 minutes of the fire starting; all my rc and models stuff with it.

 

I hope to see you for our Wednesday meeting and will update you then. I've have spoken to BMFA, my Morgan insurers and hiuse insurers from which I have a suspicion I will not get anything like value back.

 

He clarified in subsequent emails the following:

 

My Charger was an iMax just as you've quoted [Imax B6 AC quoted in a previous email] Mine was the true Chinese original: note that Hobbyking and eBay did offer a lesser cost replica by the same name /ref. Mine was c £60  the imitation more like £45. I will go for a better EU origined unit in future, havingnint3rnal resistance of cells - the good wqy to check up on capacity decreasing and therefore health. 

Only 1 lipo 2S 20C 2200mAHrs is every kept near my charging area and is always charged at no more than 1.5Amps. I carefully monitor health by physical inspection of case and leads for damage and capacity check by flight time then checking remaining capacity / cell volts remaining.

The fire spread in a standard brick detached garage with slate double hipped roof, was too intense and too rapid to deal with by far.  I had a fire extinguisher CO2 right beside my charger but in turning to pick it up the heat was too intense to stay there.

The battery on charge was always put into a fireproof heavy highly fired pot with lid!

The garage was roofless in 7mins. The firebrigade arrived 12mins after their call; the station is part time non retained staffed and only 0.4miles away.

I'm fairly sure the fire started with the charger so its an electrical fire

My guess is that even with 1hr fire resisting an integral garage to the home would have taken some part of the home with the fire.

 

And finally:

 

1. The Garage Fire

I'm fairly sure now that my fire started with the iMax battery charger while charging my known to be healthy lipo, housed in a heavy earthenware highly fired trough with its  heavy cover over.

 I still can't reconcile myself to the fact that there was so much heat and flame so soon: it was far more than Ive ever seen on YouTube. 

 The battery, receiving electrically erroneous charging - not to its liking - fired very soon after the charger set fire. That's my best guess. 

NOTE: All my stored batteries were on the floor of the garage in a tin box with tight fitting lid with a large stone on it - these batteries survived even though they were well baked but did not add to the fire. These were 2 half discharged and the rest not used that day fully charged.

 

Now, being realistic, the vast majority of genuine Imax B6 chargers will be fine. Mediocre, but fine.

 

The knockoffs will likely work for a bit. Some will last years, some will only last months. Those that fail will likely do so without harm, but there will be some that will be catastrophic.

 

If YOU own a B6, genuine or not, and works great - kudos! But new people, who don't know any better, will be exposed to greater risk with your so-called 'advise'.

 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

it's an interesting story, and the question of fakes is very much a valid one.

 

however at the risk of sounding too contrary we are talking about a sample size of 1 catastrophic failure, and ultimately any device regardless of quality can fail.

 

by contrast for example i've heard of at least 5 seperate instances of nuprol 3-led type lipo chargers failing (fortunately all safe failures of a single charging circuit that merely killed the charger and battery), which is why i recommend users to avoid buying/using them.

 

from the other thread you do have a very valid point though about the b6 being an older design now, although given airsoft tends to be a few years (if i'm being generous) behind the curve of rc when it comes to technology specification wise at least it still fits the bill.

[Rogerborg]

I have a degree in self professed expertise, chap.

 

So, what buy instead?

 

22 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

At the cheap end of the scale, SkyRC S65 or T100.

 

Thanks, genuinely.  I'm always happy to learn.

[Speedbird_666]

11 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

however at the risk of sounding too contrary we are talking about a sample size of 1 catastrophic failure, and ultimately any device regardless of quality can fail.

 

 

That's a fair comment. I can only go by what I've heard talking directly to the person, and the photos that he showed me. It scared the shit out of the club, we put in a massive bulk-buy order for LiPo safe 'Bat-Boxes' for charging and storage, i still use mine to this day.

 

I believe that if a genuine B6 can fail, the risk is an order of magnitude greater with the fake ones, even if the risk of catastrophic failure is still relatively small.

 

4 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

I have a degree in self professed expertise, chap.

 

Please, and I mean this genuinely, just be constructive and suggest a better alternative.  Be the change you want to see.

 

I actually did originally put some alternatives in my original post, then removed them because I thought it might descend into 'mine's better than yours'. Hindsight being 20:20 I should of offered alternatives which I did in a later post.

 

 

[Rogerborg]

12 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

I actually did originally put some alternatives in my original post, then removed them because I thought it might descend into 'mine's better than yours'.

 

Honestly, I'm delighted to suggest better alternatives.  All I can say is that my particular SkyRC branded B6 work and hasn't exploded yet.  But if the S65 and T100 are more robust and less infested with hooky clones, I'm all for moving on.

[Adolf Hamster]

10 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

That's a fair comment. I can only go by what I've heard talking directly to the person, and the photos that he showed me. It scared the shit out of the club, we put in a massive bulk-buy order for LiPo safe 'Bat-Boxes' for charging and storage, i still use mine to this day.

 

I believe that if a genuine B6 can fail, the risk is an order of magnitude greater with the fake ones, even if the risk of catastrophic failure is still relatively small.

 

i suppose really what it boils down to is a case of how can we ever be sure that to paraphrase your example little johnny doesn't go and get himself a fake skyrc charger with the same risks.

 

technology is ever changing, the skyrc you recommended does look like a perfectly suitable alternative and reasonably priced from reputable retailers (assuming msuk is still reputable). tricky thing really to be fighting against the pretty common mentality of folk dropping £200+ on a gat but only £10 on charging equipment.

 

ultimately at some point there is an element of personal responsibility when you're working with these things, best we can do is try and help folk make a more informed decision (which i guess is the point of this thread).

[Rogerborg]

3 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

a fake skyrc charger

 

Anecdote involves a genuine B6.

 

I won't be recommending them again, one catastrophic failure is too much.  I cannot over-stress how much I am not wedded to any particular technology or product just because I happen to own one.

 

On the issue of "advice", I'm not sure what else we're meant to do other than repeat what we know.  If we don't listen and learn, we can't improve that advice. I'm always delighted to be wrong, it's the only way to improve.

[Guest]

My facetious response, and one I 100% stand by, is stick to gas guns. Absolute, total guarantee your charger will never burn anything down.

 

You may have 99 other problems, but lipo’s isn’t one 😂

[Adolf Hamster]

5 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

Anecdote involves a genuine B6.

 

true, hence my original point about any device having the potential to fail, but the bigger issue for the b6 seems to me to be the prevalence of clones.

 

but you're right that it's worth having these discussions and being open to changing our minds about things.

[Speedbird_666]

3 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Honestly, I'm delighted to suggest better alternatives.  All I can say is that my particular SkyRC branded B6 work and hasn't exploded yet.  But if the S65 and T100 are more robust and less infested with hooky clones, I'm all for moving on.

 

To be fair SkyRC have updated the B6 with their 'V2' - but in reality it is a different charger altogether (hardware and firmware) just sharing the design aesthetic of the originals in a smaller form factor. It's also harder to find in the UK from reputable sellers - you tend to still find 'new old stock' of the two iterations of the V1. I'm not aware of any clones for the other models I mentioned (but I'm happy to stand corrected).

 

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

tricky thing really to be fighting against the pretty common mentality of folk dropping £200+ on a gat but only £10 on charging equipment.

 

 

This 1000%. I've come across several people in my time with their stupid-money uber-guns, but have no means to check muzzle velocity at home as they think that a £50 Chronograph is too expensive. Then wonder why their gun is running hot when checked. Hey-ho.

 

14 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

On the issue of "advice", I'm not sure what else we're meant to do other than repeat what we know.  If we don't listen and learn, we can't improve that advice. I'm always delighted to be wrong, it's the only way to improve.

 

That's a great attitude (genuinely). But not everyone works that way ('mine is bestest'). If more people did seek to learn, improve, and be open to civil discourse that may be contrary to their beliefs, the world would be a better place. My original post on the other thread came over with a degree of elite-ism that wasn't intentional, which in hindsight was not the best way of articulating myself.

 

13 minutes ago, rocketdogbert said:

My facetious response, and one I 100% stand by, is stick to gas guns. Absolute, total guarantee your charger will never burn anything down.

 

You may have 99 other problems, but lipo’s isn’t one 😂

 

I like the cut of your jib sir.

 

13 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

but the bigger issue for the b6 seems to me to be the prevalence of clones.

 

but you're right that it's worth having these discussions and being open to changing our minds about things.

 

Thanks for being open to discussion. The prevalence of the clones is the main driver for my little tirade.

 

[hitmanNo2]

This seems like a good alternative.  I have one and it's decent

 

https://www.componentshop.co.uk/accucel-6-digital-charger-with-5a-power-supply.html

[Spartan09]

Do we know if the charger in the openinv post was a v1 or v2?

 

Im asking because i bought a B6 AC v2 from hobbyking after seeking advice on this forum a couple of weeks ago after my nuprol charger and battery blew up.

 

I havent used mine yet as i am waiting for an adapter to arrive to change the charging lead from deans to mini tamiya.  (And yes, i do have a lipo bag at home too)

[AlphaBear]

I've had my iMax B6 since 10 yrs (the first version) and touch wood it's been superb. It's got the genuine hologram sticker, the prerequisite yellow instruction card and a shed load of leads, well 5 to be precise which technically covers all battery types except wait for it... mini deans! Which I then had to cobble together.. The point is when I bought it many moons ago, there were hardly any fakes around so one was safe in the knowing the product you'd get was genuine.... But still when I balance charge my batteries I do so in an open space (my kitchen) in a Lipo safe bag sat in a tin biscuit barrel (Well the charger and batteries and Lipo bag that is!)...

 

So recently I thought I'd get a new charger coz things move on say 10yrs down the road and bugger me which one do you get? It's literally a mine field and horses for courses.... Buying something off Amazon is no guarantee of quality due to the marketplace.... so the only options are remote control hobby shops! 

[Rogerborg]

22 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

My original post on the other thread came over with a degree of elite-ism that wasn't intentional, which in hindsight was not the best way of articulating myself.

 

My huff was better than your huff.

 

Getting advice from the future, so to speak, is great.  I'd rather learn from someone else's misfortune than my own when it comes to burning my house down.

[Speedbird_666]

4 minutes ago, hitmanNo2 said:

This seems like a good alternative.  I have one and it's decent

 

https://www.componentshop.co.uk/accucel-6-digital-charger-with-5a-power-supply.html

 

AFAIK that one has been discontinued - it's not even a listed on Hobbyking's site now - I think it's been replaced with the Accucel S60 - which I think is a SkyRC S60 re-brand (which ain't a bad charger - it's been superseded with the S65 model which has been mentioned earlier).

 

3 minutes ago, Spartan09 said:

Do we know if the charger in the openinv post was a v1 or v2?

 

Im asking because i bought a B6 AC v2 from hobbyking after seeking advice on this forum a couple of weeks ago after my nuprol charger and battery blew up.

 

I havent used mine yet as i am waiting for an adapter to arrive to change the charging lead from deans to mini tamiya.  (And yes, i do have a lipo bag at home too)

 

I believe - but would need to check with the chap - that it was the second iteration of the V1 (circa 2013), which has been prolifically cloned and knocked-off across eBay and Amazon. If your V2 is genuine, from a reputable seller, the chances of a catastrophic failure are extremely small. Watch some YouTube videos from RC channels on the basics of charging (C rating, balancing, voltage etc) and always treat the charger an batteries with respect - you should be fine.

 

9 minutes ago, AlphaBear said:

 

So recently I thought I'd get a new charger coz things move on say 10yrs does the road and bugger me which one do you get? It's literally a mine field and horses for courses.... Buying something off Amazon is no guarantee of quality due to the marketplace.... so the only options are remote control hobby shops! 

 

I would recommend the shops that sell racing drones (HobbyRC is excellent) - they are well ahead of the technology curve compared to the old-school model shops with stock that's been sat on shelves for years.

 

If I had £50 to buy a charger - I would gravitate towards the SkyRC T100 as it would allow me to balance charge two LiPos (on separate charge circuits) at the same time. Disclaimer - I don't own one, but the reviews are decent and I was toying with the Idea of buying one.

 

I always run two chargers - have done for years - because it halves the time (obviously) to charge your battery collection, but if one fails, I still have backup. It's more than annoying when the skies are clear, the wind is low - a perfect day to fly your RC models (which in some years has been pretty rare!), but you can't - because you can't charge your batteries. Same principle for airsoft I suppose.

 

 

 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

35 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

This 1000%. I've come across several people in my time with their stupid-money uber-guns, but have no means to check muzzle velocity at home as they think that a £50 Chronograph is too expensive. Then wonder why their gun is running hot when checked. Hey-ho

 

no hobby is immune from it, i tend to find it amusing for example people speccing themselves £1000+ pc's and then spending £80 on the monitor, i mean they're scrimping on the one thing they're actually going to spend all their time looking at....

 

36 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

That's a great attitude (genuinely). But not everyone works that way ('mine is bestest'). If more people did seek to learn, improve, and be open to civil discourse that may be contrary to their beliefs, the world would be a better place. My original post on the other thread came over with a degree of elite-ism that wasn't intentional, which in hindsight was not the best way of articulating myself.

 

it can be a hard thing for folk to hear something that flies in the face of entrenched beliefs, for sure i know i've been one of those who's oft defaulted to suggesting the b6 and it feels bad thinking i've potentially been steering folk down the wrong path (regardless of intentions).

 

but what's done is done, better to pick up new information and move forward, at least now we've a nice discussion to link back to on the topic to highlight the potential seriousness of cutting corners.

[Cyberlawyer]

My personal experience is that the genuine B6 is a perfectly adequate charger for Airsoft, but the clones are effectively playing Russian roulette with the chances of a big fireball.

 

However as an RC flyer myself the B6 is only really adequate for charging low discharge batteries such as transmitter or receiver batteries (which are about equivalent to airsoft AEG batteries). The batteries used by the RC Flying community for actual motive power are absolute monsters by airsoft standards and I would have limited confidence using a B6 to charge one of them (To put it in context some of the batteries in the biggest RC helicopters I fly deliver more peak power than 230v mains at 13A, albeit for a short time). In this application I completely agree with the original post that a much more substantial charger is required to manage the power and heat.

[Shaydee]

44 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

This 1000%. I've come across several people in my time with their stupid-money uber-guns, but have no means to check muzzle velocity at home as they think that a £50 Chronograph is too expensive. Then wonder why their gun is running hot when checked. Hey-ho.

 

This is my biggest pet peave in the hobby alongside "I'm using the cheapest eye protection I can find on ebay". Mental.

 

I will say I'm also using an imax but this is a few years old now and I made sure to check everything was legit when I purchased it - holograms, packaging and the like, it's all about researching and sifting through the ungainly amounts of bullshit on the internet really. I'm also only using lower power batteries due to this being airsoft so a simple 1 - 1.2 amp charge does the job for me as I'm never truly in a rush.

 

It's always nice to get alternate recommendations for newer products though and that T100 certainly looks like a great alternative. Two batteries charging on the go, who'd have thunk it! 😄

[Shamal]

Sorry to hear that terrible story.

I have had a IMAX b6 clone for three years now.i knew it wasn't genuine when I got it.

I use it regularly and have never had a problem with it.

That being said I am never more than five yards from it when charging and keep checking temp of charger and battery

Regards

[Caj109]

I'm new to airsoft and like you said before about being new to the game and getting a charger for lipos I saw most people always mentioning the B6

 

I bought the IMAX B6 off hobbyking uk version and checked the hologram which come back all good. So am I assuming that hologram is correct? As it directs me to the website to say its genuine.

 

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/imax-b6ac-v2-professional-balance-charger-discharger-uk-plug.html?___store=en_us

 

 

 

[Nick G]

My B6 stopped recognising 2S lipos which is a bugger 'cos all my airsoft ones are 7.4s 🤣 Still works for the 11.1's I fly with , so I wonder if it could be a fault in the balance circuit that caused the issue the OP mentioned. I got myself an Overlander as a replacement which has been absolutely spot on so far. I do sit the batteries in an old cam cover when charging so they are on a non flammable base and I store them in an ammo box. It's very easy to take Lipo's for granted and forget just how volatile they are, gives me the willies when I see how some folk treat them at games !

[Speedbird_666]

1 hour ago, Caj109 said:

I'm new to airsoft and like you said before about being new to the game and getting a charger for lipos I saw most people always mentioning the B6

 

I bought the IMAX B6 off hobbyking uk version and checked the hologram which come back all good. So am I assuming that hologram is correct? As it directs me to the website to say its genuine.

 

https://hobbyking.com/en_us/imax-b6ac-v2-professional-balance-charger-discharger-uk-plug.html?___store=en_us

 

 

HobbyKing (confusingly) sell both the genuine and knock-off versions. The knock-offs will be marked as 'copy' on their website, with the SkyRC logo removed and considerably cheaper.

 

If yours is from Hobbyking, marked SkyRC, ordered from an SKU that's for the non-copy version and with a SkyRC hologram, I'm sure you'll be absolutely fine, particularly if it's the V2.

 

34 minutes ago, Nick G said:

My B6 stopped recognising 2S lipos which is a bugger 'cos all my airsoft ones are 7.4s 🤣 Still works for the 11.1's I fly with , so I wonder if it could be a fault in the balance circuit that caused the issue the OP mentioned. I got myself an Overlander as a replacement which has been absolutely spot on so far. I do sit the batteries in an old cam cover when charging so they are on a non flammable base and I store them in an ammo box. It's very easy to take Lipo's for granted and forget just how volatile they are, gives me the willies when I see how some folk treat them at games !

 

Before the Imax B6 was readily available in the UK, J Perkins distribution imported and marketed them as the 'JP EnErG Pro LiPro Plus 5' which I had for a year or so - back in 2008 (hence my 'old tech' comments). Mine stopped recognising 3S LiPos - with balance connection errors. I binned it. Most Overlander stuff is rebranded SkyRC stuff - which is no bad thing.

 

 

 

[FreeFrag.UK]

In the interest of clarity and providing full disclosure, it might be worth editing your original post with a few alternative chargers. It may also be worth listing a few reputable UK sources. Admittedly the final stop ends with the buyer taking responsibility but it might be worth considering disclosing the previously mentioned information in your original post at the end.

 

Overall a very interesting story and it sounds like it could have been a lot worse given the severity of what happened.

 

I'd also like to echo @Rogerborg's sentiment of one catastrophic failure report being more than enough to warrant recommending (and seeking) better alternatives.

 

@rocketdogbert - Admittedly I'd be sorely tempted to go to GBBR's but part of me can't imagine parting with what I currently have and I imagine the return would be dreadful. Especially given the current circumstances faced by the airsoft community. Plus GHK seem to cost an arm, a leg and whatever else a retailer can get their hands on here in the UK, especially with mag prices.

[PureSilver]

On 05/08/2020 at 14:16, Adolf Hamster said:

however at the risk of sounding too contrary we are talking about a sample size of 1 catastrophic failure, and ultimately any device regardless of quality can fail.

I agree completely with this. There must be tens if not hundreds of thousands of B6s out there; it is one of the most common hobby battery chargers. The law of averages demands that eventually at least one (even one of the real ones) is going to go up in smoke and take someone’s garage with it.

 

With such a small sample size we don’t know whether the charger or the battery caused the fire; even the victim isn’t entirely sure. If a battery blew up on me I would always assume I had mis-set the charger or let a cell drop into DDS, both factors that are known to cause charging fires, rather than blaming the charger. I’m not saying the charger wasn’t at fault - see above comment on the law of averages - but LiPo charging fires almost always start in the comparatively volatile battery as a result of a mis-set charger, DDS or an internal short.

 

Bluntly the bloke’s garage burning down would have happened regardless of the cause of the battery igniting; once it was lit, it was going up - no charger could possibly make the situation worse at that point. This is a salutary lesson in exercising extreme caution when charging LiPos in close proximity to other extremely flammable things like model aircraft and associated materials.

While we can all take that valuable reminder to use fire-safe pouches and storage and supervise batteries while charging, I’d hesitate to get alarmist about this. In more than a decade of airsoft I’ve never seen a battery fire nor, to my knowledge, had one happen to any friend or teammate. Plenty of them have used B6AC-type chargers from various manufacturers for longer than I’ve been playing. While I have absolutely no doubt B6s fail, I see no evidence of any inherent flaw, or any reason to assume a different charger type would automatically be any more immune to manufacturing defects and/or neglectful or careless owners and/or damaged batteries than a genuine B6 V2 would be.

 

That doesn’t by any means mean a genuine B6AC V2 is the be-all and end-all of chargers, nor that we shouldn’t find a more modern replacement, but I wouldn’t start yelling through a megaphone in the safe zone about the risk the B6 in particular poses to everyone’s garages.

[Rogerborg]

 

Quote

In more than a decade of airsoft I’ve never seen a battery fire nor, to my knowledge, had one happen to any friend or teammate.

 

I've never been eaten by a lion, so...

 

 

Quote

I wouldn’t start yelling through a megaphone in the safe zone about the risk the B6 in particular poses to everyone’s garages.

 

This subject started with some clickbait and handbags, but I'm glad that it's been raised.  Aside, are we all aware of Cunningham's Law? "The best way to get the right answer on the internet is not to ask a question; it's to post the wrong answer."

 

That said, I do take all your points, and I am going to keep using my B6, and not yelling at anyone to bin theirs (unlike Nuprol nimh chargers, which do alarm me when folk ask "Is 12 hours too long to charge at 1C?").

 

That said, if the Glorious RC Master Race reckon the S65 is newer, better, by the looks of it no more expensive, and less prone to being knocked off, I know which one I'll be mentioning from now on.

 

That said, it's a tricky call to know whether to: 1) recommend what we've got, 2) recommend what we've been told about, or 3) say nothing and hope that someone who knows more might weigh in, which they might not.  We have to make our own decisions on that.