Comfort levels in CQB

[Adolf Hamster]

1 hour ago, PureSilver said:

The problem with lower energy limits is most people don't want to open up their non-QSC AEG just to play at one site. Most people typically build their guns to 1.1J/350fps with 0.20g, and sites with lower limits (e.g. The Mall, which strictly enforced 1.0J/328fps) were a pain to play at as a result. 0.1J difference is negligible, but many more hits because full-auto is permissible isn't. Incidentally the same problem comes up a lot with DMRs, which can vary from 1.5J/400fps to 2.3J/500fps from site to site - a very significant 25% increase in power, which usually throws carefully-tuned hop-ups completely out of whack...

 

 

yeah it's a tricky one, i was thinking more of a "if it's under this limit you get to use full auto" kind of deal, like the way the whole dmr thing works outdoors just scaled down.

[Musica]

19 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

 

yeah it's a tricky one, i was thinking more of a "if it's under this limit you get to use full auto" kind of deal, like the way the whole dmr thing works outdoors just scaled down.

 

An "SMG" class so to speak. I think it's too much hassle to police on walk on days IMO. If a marshal hears any full auto they can go investigate currently as it shouldn't be happening. 

[Adolf Hamster]

7 minutes ago, Musica said:

 

An "SMG" class so to speak. I think it's too much hassle to police on walk on days IMO. If a marshal hears any full auto they can go investigate currently as it shouldn't be happening. 

 

good point, well made 

[Tackle]

14 minutes ago, Musica said:

 

An "SMG" class so to speak. I think it's too much hassle to police on walk on days IMO. If a marshal hears any full auto they can go investigate currently as it shouldn't be happening. 

the theory sounds feasible, especially for stock aep's that come up lower fps, I can see some players carrying multiple guns in order to keep using full auto as their environment changes, as is the case on some of the larger sites.

[Aengus]

2 hours ago, Tackle said:

 if some fuckwits can't control their trigger finger then maybe they shouldn't be on site.

People that randomly twitch their finger have far more of a place on an airsoft site than people who assault people for shooting them on an airsoft site.. 

 

But hey that's just me I guess.

 

Contact sport player or not. Getting shot a few times in an ouchie place up close isn't quite as bad as a no arms tackle above the neck (something where I would deem your response justified) and in truth you really should've been kicked off for laying hands on another player.

[Adolf Hamster]

9 minutes ago, Tackle said:

the theory sounds feasible, especially for stock aep's that come up lower fps, I can see some players carrying multiple guns in order to keep using full auto as their environment changes, as is the case on some of the larger sites.

 

can't really see a problem with that, after all the price they'll pay is the weight.

 

would maybe make more sense in a milsim environment- set fps limits by caliber and let the smg guys run full auto in buildings, could be an interesting squad dynamic.

 

 

 

 

[heroshark]

We run this rule at my teams private games. Not many bother to carry an extra gun for the purpose. A gbbp with a reasonable trigger response is as good as. 

[Musica]

 

do you really want to be on the receiving end of this? 

[Lozart]

1 hour ago, L3wisD said:

 

Not to try and nit pick, and it doesn't actually change your point at all, but the mall was always a 340 limit, wasn't it?

 

Officially it was 328 with a hard limit of 340 for "variance".

 

I've played at Strike Force when they introduced the burst thing, they had to endlessly explain it then (well over a year ago) so if they're still having to clarify it I fail to see why they still allow it to be honest. If you can't double tap someone with a pistol then you need to either a) be better or b) go find something else to do on a Sunday. As for that particular site there's three parts of fuck all sight lines of more than 5m anyway!

[Tackle]

1 hour ago, Aengus said:

People that randomly twitch their finger have far more of a place on an airsoft site than people who assault people for shooting them on an airsoft site.. 

 

But hey that's just me I guess.

 

Contact sport player or not. Getting shot a few times in an ouchie place up close isn't quite as bad as a no arms tackle above the neck (something where I would deem your response justified) and in truth you really should've been kicked off for laying hands on another player.

Here we go again, assault is a strong word, clearly your snowdrop definition of assault differs from mine, but heyho, jump on the bandwagon with the other trolls & attempt to vilify me for having a spontaneous human emotion, apparently a burst of around 8-10 bb's from less than a foot & at angle upwards in to my face, just below (but not on) my eyepro, counts as an "ouchie" butt hurt thing, maybe I should have immediately apologized for being around the corner in the first place, that's the British way after all, "think nothing of it old chap, obviously I'm in the wrong for getting in the way of your bb's"

 

now you've got me thinking though, all the times I've gone to the aid of others, administering first aid, & in some cases physical support to prevent injury or harm, what I was actually doing was assauting them............SHIT, what if in years to come I'll be embroiled in some kinda "historical assault" witch hunt.

 

clearly I've offended so many people, tell you what, if you see me on site come & say hi 👋 & we'll hug it out.

but don't shoot me, that just makes me mad ggrrrrr

 

 

 

[Aengus]

28 minutes ago, Tackle said:

Here we go again, assault is a strong word, clearly your snowdrop definition of assault differs from mine, but heyho, jump on the bandwagon with the other trolls & attempt to vilify me for having a spontaneous human emotion, apparently a burst of around 8-10 bb's from less than a foot & at angle upwards in to my face, just below (but not on) my eyepro, counts as an "ouchie" butt hurt thing, maybe I should have immediately apologized for being around the corner in the first place, that's the British way after all, "think nothing of it old chap, obviously I'm in the wrong for getting in the way of your bb's"

 

now you've got me thinking though, all the times I've gone to the aid of others, administering first aid, & in some cases physical support to prevent injury or harm, what I was actually doing was assauting them............SHIT, what if in years to come I'll be embroiled in some kinda "historical assault" witch hunt.

 

clearly I've offended so many people, tell you what, if you see me on site come & say hi 👋 & we'll hug it out.

but don't shoot me, that just makes me mad ggrrrrr

What I consider has more to do with context than an actual action. At an airsoft site I'd consider laying hands on anyone in an aggressive manor an assault (albeit minor), more a demonstration of your inability to control your anger than actual assault, as that is not expected or a normal part of the game never mind for the crowd airsoft attracts. You think Steve from the office who's only sport he's ever played is badminton expects or can deal with someone grabbing him in an aggressive way? or 13 year old James that only leaves his house once a week to play airsoft, wheezing as he goes, could?

 

tl;dr this is not a rough sport, not the rules, not the setup and especially not the people, you can reasonably expect some push and shove, maybe a fist, in rugby. Not bloody airsoft hence the lower boundary for what I'd consider an "assault".

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, Aengus said:

in truth you really should've been kicked off for laying hands on another player

 

I'm so glad that our local Major McShouty won't be back on site this year thanks to laying hands on what turned out to be a 14 year old.

 

So glad.

[Tackle]

7 minutes ago, Aengus said:

What I consider has more to do with context than an actual action. At an airsoft site I'd consider laying hands on anyone in an aggressive manor an assault (albeit minor), more a demonstration of your inability to control your anger than actual assault, as that is not expected or a normal part of the game never mind for the crowd airsoft attracts. You think Steve from the office who's only sport he's ever played is badminton expects or can deal with someone grabbing him in an aggressive way? or 13 year old James that only leaves his house once a week to play airsoft, wheezing as he goes, could?

 

tl;dr this is not a rough sport, not the rules, not the setup and especially not the people, you can reasonably expect some push and shove, maybe a fist, in rugby. Not bloody airsoft hence the lower boundary for what I'd consider an "assault".

Let me see, who was harmed 🤔?, did he leave the site with a single mark on him from our encounter, nope, or did I leave looking like I had a bad case of the clap across my mush that my wife gave me hell for.......yeah that was it.

me grabbing him was both instantaneous & spontaneous, it was like "ffs take that thing away from my face you twat", in all the time I've been playing I can' honestly say I've never been witness to someone getting "shot" in that manner so close, so while my reaction may not have been to everyone's liking, I don't think people should be so quick to judge until your in a similar situation, which is unlikely (hopefully)

there were many witnesses to it, including the organizers, none of whom felt my response was over the top, & in fact they were more concerned with my wellbeing & that I hadn't sustained more serious injuries, bust teeth etc.

the response here, to what was me agreeing with another player to his negative experience of being "laced up" in cqb, & sharing my own painful experience, just highlights to me why some long term members here have recently left/taken a break, fed up with trolls & keyboard warriors, some of you have chosen to rather pettily focus on one small aspect of a larger scenario, which is what the thread is about after all.

 

[Sawyer]

17 minutes ago, Tackle said:

Let me see, who was harmed 🤔?, did he leave the site with a single mark on him from our encounter, nope, or did I leave looking like I had a bad case of the clap across my mush that my wife gave me hell for.......yeah that was it.

me grabbing him was both instantaneous & spontaneous

 

In a previous life I'd had people spit in my face, punch me, bite me, kick me or worse. In all circumstances I've had to respond in a reasonable manner, or risk losing my job. Those situations put your adrenaline higher than any game of airsoft. This is a game. If you're worried about BBs getting past your eye pro, wear full seal. Worried about your nashers, wear full face. These things exist to mitigate the risk in situations that shouldn't happen, but do. Kids play Airsoft, you expect them to have logic and forethought when they get jumped?

 

What I'm saying is, you can't excuse violence, especially when there's no further threat to your life or safety beyond that point. If airsoft makes you that worked up, you're taking it too seriously.

 

Not here to vilify, but grabbing someone around the throat is enough to land you in court, even if you think it doesn't count as assault in this modern crazy crazy world.

 

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll or keyboard warrior.

[Aengus]

1 minute ago, Sawyer said:

In a previous life I'd had people spit in my face, punch me, bite me, kick me or worse. In all circumstances I've had to respond in a reasonable manner, or risk losing my job. Those situations put your adrenaline higher than any game of airsoft. This is a game. If you're worried about BBs getting past your eye pro, wear full seal. Worried about your nashers, wear full face. These things exist to mitigate the risk in situations that shouldn't happen, but do. Kids play Airsoft, you expect them to have logic and forethought when they get jumped?

 

What I'm saying is, you can't excuse violence, especially when there's no further threat to your life or safety beyond that point. If airsoft makes you that worked up, you're taking it too seriously.

 

Not here to vilify, but grabbing someone around the throat is enough to land you in court, even if you think it doesn't count as assault in tis modern crazy crazy world.

 

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll or keyboard warrior.

Why can other people say the things i think better than I can??? 😂. Dead on.

[MAX DICKER]

Sorry, I have to say...... expecting airsofters to have TD 😂

 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

see the problem here is a case of expectations, it's reasonable to assume that being on an active airsoft field means you're going to get hit by bb's, anywhere, any time.

 

what is not expected is to have someone attempt to attack you with their hands in a serious manner, regardless of how much or how little actual harm is done, if you want to have fisticuffs with random strangers i'd suggest boxing might be a more appropriate hobby.

 

of course we've all had our lapses of judgement, this hobby can be very frustrating at times, and it's easy to get worked up over these things which only makes it seem even stupider in retrospect, but as with everything in life there's a line between what's acceptable and what isn't.

 

i'm sure tackle's making it sound worse than it was, this is the internet after all and things tend to get blown out of proportion.

[Tackle]

1 hour ago, Sawyer said:

In a previous life I'd had people spit in my face, punch me, bite me, kick me or worse. In all circumstances I've had to respond in a reasonable manner, or risk losing my job. Those situations put your adrenaline higher than any game of airsoft. This is a game. If you're worried about BBs getting past your eye pro, wear full seal. Worried about your nashers, wear full face. These things exist to mitigate the risk in situations that shouldn't happen, but do. Kids play Airsoft, you expect them to have logic and forethought when they get jumped?

 

What I'm saying is, you can't excuse violence, especially when there's no further threat to your life or safety beyond that point. If airsoft makes you that worked up, you're taking it too seriously.

 

Not here to vilify, but grabbing someone around the throat is enough to land you in court, even if you think it doesn't count as assault in this modern crazy crazy world.

 

Not everyone who disagrees with you is a troll or keyboard warrior.

WHAT FUCKING VIOLENCE, if I'd been intent on harming him I would have done, & I too have been in jobs where I have had to endure verbal abuse, & on occasion physical abuse, but I've had to limit my response for fear of loss of job, court martial or even prison.

as for airsoft, ffs I've lost count of the times that arrogant arsehole walts have shouted abuse, called me every shade of cnut, all because they can't shoot straight & it's beyond the comprehension of their tiny Walt minds that maybe they actually aren't hitting what they aim at, but do I react, no I laugh in their faces, mouthy twats.

but even now I choose to wear mainly just high quality eyepro, that's my choice, but then I don't expect such an incident to occur again, I would hope the odds are stacked in my favour.

as for real genuine violence, of course I don't condone it, on or off the field, but what we're talking about here is not violence, it's little more than testosterone/adrenaline fueled handbags 👜, that was over as quickly as it started, but you know what, if anyone thinks I'm a bad boy for my reaction, fine, fill yer boots, vent away, most of you know fuck all about me except what you've pounced on today, I'll not lose any sleep about it.

 

incidentally, with reference to the various contact sports I've been involved in, including the boxing, I gotta say I detest with a passion the new breed of mma/cage fighting crap, one of the worst things to happen to sports, taking nothing away from the skills of those involved, but I do feel that there have been many incidents of street fights where the level of physical violence & the way it's executed have shown that many young men feel it's acceptable to go too far, seriously wonder if the fact that it's hit mainstream tv hasn't given it an Ian of acceptability ?.

yep that's off thread but I thought I'd get that thought off my chest while we're discussing violence, as a parent it's been troubling me for a while.

 

back on topic, single shot everywhere in cqb , would sort so many issues ?

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

see the problem here is a case of expectations, it's reasonable to assume that being on an active airsoft field means you're going to get hit by bb's, anywhere, any time.

 

what is not expected is to have someone attempt to attack you with their hands in a serious manner, regardless of how much or how little actual harm is done, if you want to have fisticuffs with random strangers i'd suggest boxing might be a more appropriate hobby.

 

of course we've all had our lapses of judgement, this hobby can be very frustrating at times, and it's easy to get worked up over these things which only makes it seem even stupider in retrospect, but as with everything in life there's a line between what's acceptable and what isn't.

 

i'm sure tackle's making it sound worse than it was, this is the internet after all and things tend to get blown out of proportion.

Lol, I'm trying to play it down, every other fuckers trying to make me out to be Hannibal Lecter.

now where's me chianti gone 🍷

[Sawyer]

1 minute ago, Tackle said:

WHAT FUCKING VIOLENCE

I'm out, seriously.😂

[Tackle]

Just now, Sawyer said:

I'm out, seriously.😂

Don't go, we're just warming up 😜

[Badgerlicious]

@Tackle you seem to have a pretty poor understanding of what assault really is. You both went to an airsoft game, you both expected to be hit with BB's, even at close range with full auto, which sucks, but it's why we wear protection. What I'm sure no one goes to an airsoft game expects, is...

 

6 hours ago, Tackle said:

made me grab the offender by the throat

 

That's assault, and probably battery too. I'm glad you feel guilty about it, and I sincerely hope you don't do such a thing again, because frankly that's taking it way too far in any situation besides you not being the instigator of physical contact. 

 

And try not to dismiss people calling you on your mistakes as "trolls". Your original comment tries to paint your grabbing of someone by the throat as not a big deal, when it is, which is the main issue I believe other posters have with your comment and your attitude in defending yourself. 

[Musica]

2 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

I'm so glad that our local Major McShouty won't be back on site this year thanks to laying hands on what turned out to be a 14 year old.

 

So glad.

spill the goss.

[Guest DrAlexanderTobacco]

2 hours ago, Tackle said:

just highlights to me why some long term members here have recently left/taken a break, fed up with trolls & keyboard warriors

 

❄️

[Tackle]

28 minutes ago, Badgerlicious said:

@Tackle you seem to have a pretty poor understanding of what assault really is. You both went to an airsoft game, you both expected to be hit with BB's, even at close range with full auto, which sucks, but it's why we wear protection. What I'm sure no one goes to an airsoft game expects, is...

 

 

That's assault, and probably battery too. I'm glad you feel guilty about it, and I sincerely hope you don't do such a thing again, because frankly that's taking it way too far in any situation besides you not being the instigator of physical contact. 

 

And try not to dismiss people calling you on your mistakes as "trolls". Your original comment tries to paint your grabbing of someone by the throat as not a big deal, when it is, which is the main issue I believe other posters have with your comment and your attitude in defending yourself. 

When did I mention feeling guilty, I said or intimated nothing of the sort, because I don't.

i didn't harm anybody, & maybe the guy in question later thought more about trigger control etc, who knows.

everyone can keep bleating on about the finery of what legally constitutes an assault, who cares, it was a long time ago & I quickly forgot about it & got on with the gameday, even if I did have a face that looked like a smack arse lol.

[Aengus]

1 hour ago, Musica said:

spill the goss.

Was it the bald one? Please say it's the bald one @Rogerborg