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Lord_Metile

How come you aren't allowed to spray a gun but allowed to own a RIF?

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Hi, just been thinking, if there is no law on ownership. Then why can't you buy a two tone gun and spray it? I mean sales wise it makes sense; but if you can own one, why can't you spray paint a two tone gun? Sorry if I'm being really dumb but I'm curious.

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From my limited understand you'd then be producing a RIF, bypassing the bit where you need a valid reason for purchasing it, which is what the entire system kind of revolves around.

 

Yeah, doesn't make a huge amount of sense. The laws are a bit mad, but I suppose they sort of do their job..

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It's legally manufacture, manufacture is limited by the VCRA in the same ways as selling...

 

The details of this though, are open to interpretation, I don't believe manufacture to be restricted by age, some do, the question is, do you feel lucky?

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From what i understand, if you can prove you skirmish with it then, yes you can spray it black.

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From what I understand, the public need to be educated and the laws need to be more clear.

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I agree, I just think that the public should be made aware as it is about violent crime reduction, hence the name VCRA.

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As long as you can prove a defence you can manafacture a RIF. For example I had 2 IFs both bought by my parents, as I have a defence (being a member of a skirmish site and go regularly) I painted/replaced parts to convert them to RIFs as there is no age limit on manufacturing

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I agree, I just think that the public should be made aware as it is about violent crime reduction, hence the name VCRA.

 

Why? Why do the public need to be aware?

 

I would suggest you read the whole VCRA, but that'd be cruel, needless to say it covers a LOT more than just Imitation Firearms. There's a lot of laws that people aren't particularly well informed about, generally people only look into things when it directly affects them, like the VCRA does with airsoft.

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I think everyone who intends to buy their own gear should read through the relevant parts of VCRA and the commencement order. These two parts of the law are important to read as they tell you not just the letter of the law but also some of the intent as well. The commencement order for example is clearly saying that it expects that airsofters will have membership photo ID cards, even though UKARA never ended up implementing such a thing that was the expectation when the law was commenced. But the general public doesn't need to know this and in my experience you shouldn't expect the rossers to know it either.

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The VCRA defence is all about the ownership of an IF and a RIF. By painting an IF into realistic colours you are technically manufacturing a RIF, which is not covered by the defence. The main difference is ownership and manufacturing. It is illegal to manufacture a RIF unless you have the appropriate legal authority. That's probably one of the reasons there are no U.K airsoft manufacturers, because getting the legal stuff sorted is such a pain.

 

That's about as simple as I can explain it, to my own understanding anyway.

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The VCRA defence is all about the ownership of an IF and a RIF. By painting an IF into realistic colours you are technically manufacturing a RIF, which is not covered by the defence. The main difference is ownership and manufacturing. It is illegal to manufacture a RIF unless you have the appropriate legal authority. That's probably one of the reasons there are no U.K airsoft manufacturers, because getting the legal stuff sorted is such a pain.

 

That's about as simple as I can explain it, to my own understanding anyway.

 

???????

 

Where are people getting this info? Its all there in black and white on the gov.co.uk page

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"a mate of mine heard at this site that...."

 

turns into

"THE UKARA LICENSE LAWS SAY THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE A RIF UNLESS YOU'VE BEEN AIRSOFTING FOR 3 YEARS AND HAVE A SECTION 1 FIREARMS CERT".

 

People need to read the fucking law, it's not hard to find.

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???????

 

Where are people getting this info? Its all there in black and white on the gov.co.uk page

VCRA Section 39, (2) ( b )

Specification for imitation firearms

A person is guilty of an offence if

he modifies an imitation firearm so that it ceases to conform to the specifications so required of it;

 

The question was how come you aren't allowed to spray a gun, therefore changing an imitation firearm into a realistic imitation firearm. Both are separate entities under the legislation. This is the section in law that technically prevents you doing this.

 

But, another question is will you be arrested for doing this and charged to court? Very, very unlikely. Not by any of the cops I know anyway, and trust me, that's a lot.

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VCRA Section 39, (2) ( b )

Specification for imitation firearms

A person is guilty of an offence if

he modifies an imitation firearm so that it ceases to conform to the specifications so required of it;

 

The question was how come you aren't allowed to spray a gun, therefore changing an imitation firearm into a realistic imitation firearm. Both are separate entities under the legislation. This is the section in law that technically prevents you doing this.

 

But, another question is will you be arrested for doing this and charged to court? Very, very unlikely. Not by any of the cops I know anyway, and trust me, that's a lot.

 

Thats not what I highlighted. I highlighted Two points.

 

1. The VCRA defence is all about the ownership of an IF and a RIF - Wrong. There is nothing in the VCRA about ownership. It concerns Import, Manufacture and Sale

 

2. manufacturing a RIF, which is not covered by the defence - It is,

 

It shall be a defence in proceedings for an offence under section 36 of the 2006 Act or under paragraph 4 of Schedule 2 to that Act for the person charged with the offence to show that his conduct was for the purpose only of making the imitation firearm in question available for one or more of the purposes specified in paragraph (2).

 

(2) Those purposes are—

 

(a)the organisation and holding of permitted activities for which public liability insurance is held in relation to liabilities to third parties arising from or in connection with the organisation and holding of those activities;

 

(b)the purposes of display at a permitted event.

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I stand corrected mate.

 

But it does highlight one point and that is if we as active skirmishes have difficulty with the law then how the hell is anyone else supposed to know what they are doing. As per usual, law makers make things to damn complicated, even for people like me who use the law every day.

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"a mate of mine heard at this site that...."

 

turns into

 

"THE UKARA LICENSE LAWS SAY THAT YOU CAN'T HAVE A RIF UNLESS YOU'VE BEEN AIRSOFTING FOR 3 YEARS AND HAVE A SECTION 1 FIREARMS CERT".

 

People need to read the f*cking law, it's not hard to find.

 

What??!!

 

You mean I went through all that hassle getting a firearms cert all for nothing?!

 

 

:(

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But it does highlight one point and that is if we as active skirmishes have difficulty with the law...

As I believe has been pointed out by a couple of people within this thread, the reason airsofters 'have difficulty with the law' is often because they haven't actually read the bloody thing and have just repeated what someone else who hasn't read it told them (after that person heard it from someone else who hadn't read it as well).

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