Hop...

[ButcherBill]

I'll start with an apology... I'm 100% certain there is at least one other thread asking the same question & I'm 100% certain I've either started it or commented in it but for the life of me I can't find it.

 

My situation is... I usually use .2's in all my toys but I know the fps & j's of nearly all of my toys and have the one's I'm likely to use in a game recorded on my phone so I can easliy check while at the signal black hole that is my local site. I've crono'd them & rounded them down to the nearest fps/j so they don't go above site limits but...

 

If I adjust my hop with each one so it fires straightest for longest with the bb weight as in my little pic it won't push any toys over the site limit will it?

 

This always confuses me, I'm pretty sure adjusting the hop for certain bb's will improve performance to a degree but a pew (my mk18 mod1 for example) crono'd on .2's resulting in 1.09j & 305fps won't suddenly jump over the sites 350fps if I use .3's with hop adjusted accordingly?

 

fyi, I won't be swopping out hop rubbers, barrels etc as it's not something I'm comfortable doing when I can simply use another toy.

[EvilMonkee]

Firstly, stop using .2s.  You will get much better range and performance with a heavier BB.  Hop applied will affect FPS downward.

 

Secondly, what you are referring to is Joule creep with a heavier BB.  It will retain more of its energy (cos physics and stuff) and therefore maybe result in a creep up in power.  Now, this is usually more of a GBBR problem than an AEG one but if you do change weight of BB be sure to rechrono your gun so that the new weight of ammo comes in under the Joules limit.  This is why Joules are better than using FPS as its frankly too much of a ballache to try to figure out if my .3 is doing the correct FPS compared to a .2 out of the same rifle.  

 

So, simply, put heavier ammo in, read the Joules score, if its under the site limit you are golden.  If not, well then a test and adjust is needed.  

[ButcherBill]

I'll be cronoing them with the heavier bb's anyway before I use them in game.

[Cannonfodder]

Definitely switch to heavier bbs if you're playing outdoors, the lightest I'd go is .28g. Leave the. 2s for CQB where IMO they're a better choice 

 

Joule creep is definitely a thing, although it affects gas guns (especially nbb) more than AEGs or springers. For AEGs I wouldn't be worried if they're not already close to site limits but for gas guns I'd be wanting to be a little more cautious.  

 

Unfortunately the only way to be 100% sure is to try it

[Skara]

Piston mass has an impact on JC too.

 

I run pretty heavy piston assemblies in my guns (even in DSGs) and the increment in energy when running 0.3/0.32s, especially when applying hop, is enough to get laughed at when I chrono at tournaments..

on 0.2s, with hop off (as per rule set) all my guns chrono at roughly 0.75/0.8J, but then on "game setup" I'm pretty damn close to the 1J limit I have, sometimes even too close... But hey, rules are rules huh?

 

Also yes it's pointless to use 0.2s even indoors, 0.25 is the absolute lightest I use, with 0.28/0.30/0.32 being the most common bb weight I run. Better trajectory, better effective range, less spread way over there.

[Rogerborg]

20 minutes ago, Skara said:

I run pretty heavy piston assemblies in my guns (even in DSGs)

 

<but-why.gif>

 

True though, and Novritch has a video (which currently escapes my search skills) where he demonstrated that by building a short-barrelled sniper with a heavy piston wrapped in wire that crept to a crazy degree when fed heavier BBs.

 

The indoor sites that I play at with a 0.25g limit still put 0.2g BBs into our mags for chronoing. I mean... why?  Ancient habits?  Put in 0.25g, eat that extra 20p cost for the entire chrono session.