Umarex/VFC/Elite Force MP7 AEG - Any info?

[Rogerborg]

14 hours ago, PopRocket123 said:

The gears are actually proprietary since there's 4 of them, an extra short motor and cut down cylinder and piston 

 

So... just like the AEP setup in the TM / Well? 🤔

[Musica]

40 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

So... just like the AEP setup in the TM / Well? 🤔

not a tech to understand the differences on the gearbox level but it's touted as being the first "AEG" not "AEP" MP7 so would be very misleading if it's not at all. 

 

Hoping someone lets me hold a Mp7 at the depot so I can decide if I like the feel of them. Can't spend this type of money without knowing how it feels. 

[Rogerborg]

Well, they're fairly arbitrary categories.  The existing TM (and clones) electric version are under-scaled and use a tiny 4-gear gearbox that's commonly referred to as an AEP, even though it's a different configuration to the 4-gear gearbox / motor arrangement found in the TM electric pistols (and clones).  I believe that the pistons and springs are the same though and that's what's producing the modest amount of puff that gives you ~200fps.

 

Something that's putting out over 300fps is going to have a significantly bigger piston.  It'll be interesting to see what's driving that, particularly their use of a 4 gear solution rather than the typical 3 gears of an AEG.

 

There was a nice young lady with an electro-MP-7 at the Depot the session before last, so keep an eye out for that.  I'll stress that it's under-scale though, and looks a little toy-ish.  Given that it performs much like a bulky AEP, it's never been hugely popular.  A full scale one that puts out over 1J might find a market, if it wasn't at that crazy price point.

[Musica]

Hmm might be best not asking if I can touch the nice young lady's toy. 

 

My friend has a TM GBBR MP7 it's only 95% scale but best I'm going to get. I would assume it's full metal where I'm not sure what the VFC one is made out of. 

 

Still need to hold an EVO but I think there might be a shop in glasgow that sells them https://www.adventure1.co.uk/contents/en-us/p35982_ASG-CZ-SCORPION-EVO-3-A1-2018-UPGRADE..html  Might only sell the airsoft online not sure. 

[Eenthuncob]

It's 330-340 fps using 0.12g bbs according to jetdesertfox if that helps.

[Musica]

30 minutes ago, Eenthuncob said:

It's 330-340 fps using 0.12g bbs according to jetdesertfox if that helps.

see I replayed that part of the video 3 times I'm sure it's actually 0.20g bbs but I did hear it as 0.12g first. 

[Rogerborg]

Seems unlikely that anyone (other than Sweaty Dom at BBgunz4lezz) would test with 0.12g.

 

4 hours ago, Musica said:

Still need to hold an EVO but I think there might be a shop in glasgow that sells them https://www.adventure1.co.uk/contents/en-us/p35982_ASG-CZ-SCORPION-EVO-3-A1-2018-UPGRADE..html  Might only sell the airsoft online not sure.  

 

They have stock in the shop, and a small target range to try them out.  The downstairs staff are friendly and helpful, but there's an evil goblin that lives upstairs who shouts at them if they spend too long doing their jobs.

[Wo1f]

[Skara]

1 minute ago, Wo1f said:

Ugly picture of ugly gearbox

V2 compatible my ass.

Proprietary cylinder, cylinder head, piston, gears, nozzle, selector and tappet plates.

Good luck finding spares..

[Wo1f]

37 minutes ago, Skara said:

V2 compatible my ass.

Proprietary cylinder, cylinder head, piston, gears, nozzle, selector and tappet plates.

Good luck finding spares..

Seems that way. I was told otherwise, but nothing V2 would fit in there. It’s just an upscaled (slightly) AEP

[FreeFrag.UK]

I wonder if sales of the GBB versions will increase once this becomes common knowledge?

[Musica]

6 minutes ago, FreeFrag.UK said:

I wonder if sales of the GBB versions will increase once this becomes common knowledge?

Doubt it.  GBB lovers wouldn't even look at the AEG and people who want the AEG probably just buy something else electric.  Seems pretty die hard camps mostly. 

 

 

@Rogerborg sounds decent cheers. Wish they had more stock but got some big names to be fair. 

 

[emilianoksa]

It's Umarex.

 

It's expensive.

[Wo1f]

Well the VFC gbb version is crap. The only good one is the TM. The cheapo AEP serves a purpose for a sniper backup to some I suppose. 

[FreeFrag.UK]

Perhaps a topic for discussion elsewhere but can anyone explain why Umarex/VFC are considered to be of sufficient quality to qualify as "high end"?

 

This is something I've seen thrown around a lot to justify their price tags.

[emilianoksa]

Is the smaller by 5% size of the TM very noticeable?

[Crazy_Crystal]

20 minutes ago, FreeFrag.UK said:

Perhaps a topic for discussion elsewhere but can anyone explain why Umarex/VFC are considered to be of sufficient quality to qualify as "high end"?

 

This is something I've seen thrown around a lot to justify their price tags.

 

I think that it is mostly down to the high quality externals, some of their newer rifles are pretty well built by all accounts. although I have only ever owned the m40a5 which actually I really like and is a really solid rifle. by all accounts their hk417 and G28s are pretty nice too, although their sr25 is on another level I believe. (at that price I would hope so )😂

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, Wo1f said:

It’s just an upscaled (slightly) AEP

 

That looks like a full size cylinder.  AEP cylinders are teeny in comparison.  Bear in mind that 340fps (with 0.2g) is close to 3x the energy of 200fps.

 

Lots of meat in front of that cylinder too, no reason to think it won't be robust enough.

[Wo1f]

1 hour ago, Rogerborg said:

 

That looks like a full size cylinder.  AEP cylinders are teeny in comparison.  Bear in mind that 340fps (with 0.2g) is close to 3x the energy of 200fps.

 

Lots of meat in front of that cylinder too, no reason to think it won't be robust enough.

In terms of diameter? My concern is being so short it won’t have the volume to retain joules with heavier ammo

[Musica]

6 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

In terms of diameter? My concern is being so short it won’t have the volume to retain joules with heavier ammo

 

I really have no idea how this effects this you have some science to back it up? Just feel like if it pushes 330fps~  on 0.20s it has the power.

[PopRocket123]

33 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

In terms of diameter? My concern is being so short it won’t have the volume to retain joules with heavier ammo

With such a short barrel that should be enough and it's apparently an aluminium barrel anyway so accuracy will not be its forte. It must be a beefy arse spring to push 330 with so little volume so the 4 gears makes sense when you consider the mini motor is going to be underpowered plus just fitting the gears in there in the first place means smaller gears so to get the ratio back up you need the extra. As for price yeah I'm not bothering to get one new. Give it a bit of time and I'd love to pick one up second hand, throw a decent r hopped barrel and hop into, maybe rebuild the motor and all the airseal components have a decent cqb or sniper sidearm. It's not going to be a trigger response beast but it sounds snappy enough on the 11.1. Like with any mechanical system it's a compromise.

[Wo1f]

47 minutes ago, Musica said:

 

I really have no idea how this effects this you have some science to back it up? Just feel like if it pushes 330fps~  on 0.20s it has the power.

It’s all down to joule loss/creep. A gun can fire 330 FPS on a .20 and hit 1j, but if it’s not got enough air volume, when you put a .30 in it, it won’t be firing 1j, it will most definitely be less because the Air has all been used up before the BB has left the barrel. (This is all in 100ths of a second)

 

conversely.. my TM MWS fires 310 FPS on a .20 which is 1j (more or less).. if I were to put a .45 in the gun, the BB would have nearly 2J of energy because of joule creep.

 

if you ever venture into places like airsoftsniperforum, you’ll see lots of people building SR-25 AEG’s with 250mm inner barrels, just so they can utilise the particular BB weight they’ve chosen while still being under their needed FPS limit.  

 

In regards the VFC.. a tightbore barrel that’s a few MM shorter would help this gun greatly.

3 hours ago, emilianoksa said:

Is the smaller by 5% size of the TM very noticeable?

Having owned a WE mp7 which is full sized and the TM, it’s definitely noticeable and more like 10%. I much prefer the TM’s size tbh.

[emilianoksa]

Thanks.

[Musica]

1 hour ago, PopRocket123 said:

With such a short barrel that should be enough and it's apparently an aluminium barrel anyway so accuracy will not be its forte. It must be a beefy arse spring to push 330 with so little volume so the 4 gears makes sense when you consider the mini motor is going to be underpowered plus just fitting the gears in there in the first place means smaller gears so to get the ratio back up you need the extra. As for price yeah I'm not bothering to get one new. Give it a bit of time and I'd love to pick one up second hand, throw a decent r hopped barrel and hop into, maybe rebuild the motor and all the airseal components have a decent cqb or sniper sidearm. It's not going to be a trigger response beast but it sounds snappy enough on the 11.1. Like with any mechanical system it's a compromise.

so you want the shell ?

[PopRocket123]

2 minutes ago, Musica said:

so you want the shell ?

It's what I do. They always get torn apart and rebuilt straight away anyway so may as well but something that needs the work. Picked up a VFC SCAR H off here for £150 with 5 mags and a hard case for a DMR project because it locked up due to a crap VFC motor and since then I've spent more on the BTC CHIMERA and scope than the original gun.