First rifle advice.

[Fly Si]

Hi folks,

 

I've signed up for the forum hoping for some advice. 

 

I would like to buy a rifle for a bit of fun and target practice in the garden. I don't want to spend much as I'd like to make sure I'm enjoying it and actually getting use out of it first. Therefore I'm aiming around the £100 mark.  

 

I'd like to be able to shoot as accurately as possible (within the confines of budget), but also let rip from time to time! So something that will do full auto preferably. 

 

I've been on a few websites and decided on 2 different rifles so far, only to discover they are out of stock everywhere. 

 

I'm wondering what rifle would be recommended by those in-the-know for my needs and budget? And also importantly, in stock somewhere. 

 

Many thanks for any help. 

[Asomodai]

46 minutes ago, Fly Si said:

Hi folks,

 

I've signed up for the forum hoping for some advice. 

 

I would like to buy a rifle for a bit of fun and target practice in the garden. I don't want to spend much as I'd like to make sure I'm enjoying it and actually getting use out of it first. Therefore I'm aiming around the £100 mark.  

 

I'd like to be able to shoot as accurately as possible (within the confines of budget), but also let rip from time to time! So something that will do full auto preferably. 

 

I've been on a few websites and decided on 2 different rifles so far, only to discover they are out of stock everywhere. 

 

I'm wondering what rifle would be recommended by those in-the-know for my needs and budget? And also importantly, in stock somewhere. 

 

Many thanks for any help. 

 

That is an incredibly low budget especially in this time of price rises and low stock. 

 

I would suggest getting at least doubling your budget so you can get something that could be skirmishable, be somewhat reliable, pay for it to be painted two toned, along with eye protection, BBS and a decent charger/battery.

 

Spending less will likely not give you a pleasant experience and will discourage you from the hobby. Airsoft does require some reasonable expenditure from the outset. 

 

I suggest you go to a skirmish and rent a rifle first and see how you feel, that's the main reason why rentals exist.

 

 

 

Edited May 21, 2022 by Asomodai

[Guest]

What @Asomodaisaid, at £100 you’re wasting your money

[Tackle]

@Fly Sias the extremely learned gentlemen above have pointed out, at that budget you'll not find anything worth having, your alternative is to look at the secondhand classifieds, here is very good & pretty busy, but even secondhand you may have to up your budget a bit to get something you like.

The other issue is finding someone to sell to you, as I'm guessing you don't have any type of reasonable defence under the vcra rules, but that's not to say a seller might two-tone something, assuming your over 18 ?. 

We might be able to give you better advice with more information from you, such as what rifles your interested in, your location in the UK, & anything else of relevance ? 

[Fly Si]

Thanks for the advice guys. I knew I was at the very bottom of the budget range, but I was hoping that there might be a bit of a hidden gem of a buy somewhere. 

 

Sadly I am considerably north of 18, but no I haven't taken part in any airsoft events so I can't own a RIF. 

 

As I said before, I'm only looking to shoot in the garden. When I was younger I used to shoot air rifles which I enjoyed immensely.  I live in Scotland so can no longer own an air rifle without applying for a certificate. Besides which I only have the garden to shoot in. 

 

I was looking for something safe and legal to enjoy the satisfaction of plunking away at targets. I've no problem with the gun being blue or orange etc. 

 

Perhaps you guys could point me towards a rifle that would be an acceptable compromise between cost and function? 

Edited May 21, 2022 by Fly Si

[Floperator]

£100 is a bit too low, but you don't need to double your budget imo. Another £30-£50 and you're getting into reasonable entry level stuff perfectly suitable for light back garden use. You could pick up a cyma p90 or ak74 for that. 

Good points above about budgeting for eye pro, BBs, charger if not included etc. 

[BigStew]

32 minutes ago, Fly Si said:

Thanks for the advice guys. I knew I was at the very bottom of the budget range, but I was hoping that their might be a bit of a hidden gem of a buy somewhere. 

 

Sadly I am considerably north of 18, but no I haven't taken part in any airsoft events so I can't own a RIF. 

 

As I said before, I'm only looking to shoot in the garden. When I was younger I used to shoot air rifles which I enjoyed immensely.  I live in Scotland so can no longer own an air rifle without applying for a certificate. Besides which I only have the garden to shoot in. 

 

I was looking for something safe and legal to enjoy the satisfaction of plunking away at targets. I've no problem with the gun being blue or orange etc. 

 

Perhaps you guys could point me towards a rifle that would be an acceptable compromise between cost and function? 

if you can find one CYMA M14 is an excellent AEG can be got for £150/170. I will add unless you live in the middle of nowhere with no neighbours back garden target shooting can get you in a lot of trouble.

[Rogerborg]

What sort of ranges are we talking?  If it's a few tens of metres or less, then pretty much anything with a hop unit is viable.

 

Any electric rifle with a metal gearbox, a gas pistol (non-blowback should be more efficient and consistent, blowback is much more fun), a bolt action sniper, or even a cheap pump action single barrel shotgun with a variable hop unit.

 

You don't have to throw upgrade money at them, just clean the barrel and hop rubber and feed them the heaviest BBs that they'll hop.

 

Just be aware that airsoft guns are never that consistent or accurate, and you'll always get the occasional flyer.

[EDcase]

Adding my 2p

 

I don't think you need to spend much more than £100 for a basic rifle to do target practice in the garden.

Any of these will be OK for plinking: Two Tone Airsoft Assault Rifles | Buy Now Pay Later | Patrol Base  (Don't know about Lancer but CYMA and Specna are decent)

Low stock is a problem everywhere 🤔

 

Be aware though, airsoft weapons are nowhere near as accurate as air rifles.  Especially above 30m.

 

Get some 0.28g BBs to help with accuracy and you should have some eye protection just in case.

Check the one you want comes with a battery and charger although a better battery (LiPo) and intelligent charger will be good investments later if you wish to continue with airsoft.

 

 

Edited May 22, 2022 by EDcase

[Fly Si]

Many thanks for the comments and advice everyone. 

 

 

My garden is about 30m long and well enclosed with walls/fences/trees/bushes etc. It's unlikely that I'll have BBs leaving my property. Particularly if I put in some kind of back stop. The garden is only overlooked by my immediate next door neighbours and they cannot see the area I would be firing from. I also have the option to shoot from inside the house through patio doors. 

 

There really is a chronic shortage of products in stock. I have found a Cyma CM011 - G36C though, which is the front runner at the moment. Any thoughts on this one? 

[Rogerborg]

14 hours ago, Fly Si said:

There really is a chronic shortage of products in stock. I have found a Cyma CM011 - G36C though, which is the front runner at the moment. Any thoughts on this one?

 

Go for it.  I have a Jing Gong G36C which is essentially a clone of the CYMA (or vice versa). It was bought as a reliable backup gun (they're site rental favourites), but shoots so well that it's actually the one that I use most often now.

 

CYMA gear tends to be basic but robust. They're better known for AKs and M4s, but the G36 has a V3 gearbox, similar to their AKs, so should be a solid choice.  G36s have a decent rotary hop unit that tends to be more consistent than basic dial or slider units.  It even comes with a basic nimh battery and dumb charger which will be fine for plinking. Just don't leave it plugged in for more than a couple of hours, and keep an eye - well a hand - on the battery temperature while charging.

 

The only thing I'd flag up is the two part V3 trigger and mediocre motors and batteries on stock guns can leave them slightly vulnerable to locking up if you trigger-spam on semi and don't fully complete a cycle.  This is more of an issue while skirmishing, it shouldn't be a problem while target shooting.

[Fly Si]

5 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Go for it.  I have a Jing Gong G36C which is essentially a clone of the CYMA (or vice versa). It was bought as a reliable backup gun (they're site rental favourites), but shoots so well that it's actually the one that I use most often now.

 

CYMA gear tends to be basic but robust. They're better known for AKs and M4s, but the G36 has a V3 gearbox, similar to their AKs, so should be a solid choice.  G36s have a decent rotary hop unit that tends to be more consistent than basic dial or slider units.  It even comes with a basic nimh battery and dumb charger which will be fine for plinking. Just don't leave it plugged in for more than a couple of hours, and keep an eye - well a hand - on the battery temperature while charging.

 

The only thing I'd flag up is the two part V3 trigger and mediocre motors and batteries on stock guns can leave them slightly vulnerable to locking up if you trigger-spam on semi and don't fully complete a cycle.  This is more of an issue while skirmishing, it shouldn't be a problem while target shooting.

Great! Thanks very much. 

 

And with regard to BBs. Should I go with the standard 0.2 or something heavier?

 

I understand that heavier ones might be a bit more accurate, but that cheaper guns might struggle with them? I'm not sure if I've picked that up right though. 

[Rogerborg]

48 minutes ago, Fly Si said:

And with regard to BBs. Should I go with the standard 0.2 or something heavier?

 

I understand that heavier ones might be a bit more accurate, but that cheaper guns might struggle with them? I'm not sure if I've picked that up right though. 

 

Generally, go with the heaviest that the gun can lift.  That's determined by a complicated relationship between nozzle energy, bucking shape and material, nub hardness, and hop arm pressure, which boils down to: it depends.

 

Pretty much any stock gun should hop 0.25g.  Most can hop 0.28g, although it's not guaranteed.  What I would always suggest is cleaning the hop rubber and the barrel before use - hopefully the CYMA will come with a cleaning rod, although you can push a patch down the barrel with any 6mm-ish plastic rod.

 

Ideally you'll clean from rear to front so as not to push any barrel shipping oil back into the bucking, although it's not super critical as long as you get it all clear all the way.

 

If you do fancy diving inside, this is a fairly decent disassembly video.

 

 

 

Or you can remove the inner barrel by taking off the handguard, removing the three screws shown in red here, and the whole inner barrel assemble will slide out forwards, giving access to the hop unit and rubber.

 

 

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

At the risk of going against the grain here I'd say that there are plenty decent beginner AEGs for around the £100 mark and absolutely go for it.

 

Anything by CYMA or JG is a safe bet and my Lancer 933 was about £100; my first gun and quite frankly I still love it. Its reliable, decently put together and happily lobs .25s in the woods I skirmish in. Nice and lightweight too and accepts most mags without fuss. The Core Specnas are much of a muchness and probably worth a punt too.

 

I hear lots of put downs regarding Lancer online but I have to say mine has been perfectly good. There again, same with my UAR; very marmite but I've had no bother with that either.

 

I echo above regarding ammo choice, using 25s or 28s is one of the most effective (and cheapest) upgrades you can make.

 

Good luck with your choice.

 

Eezer G

[Fly Si]

Thanks. I'm definitely going to go for the Cyma and I'll get some 0.25 BBs. 

 

Is BB choice very important? I'd like to get biodegradable ones so my wife complains less about them ending up all over the garden!

 

The ones available in the same shop as the gun are Angry Balls, Snow Wolf and ASG Open Blaster. 

 

6 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Generally, go with the heaviest that the gun can lift.  That's determined by a complicated relationship between nozzle energy, bucking shape and material, nub hardness, and hop arm pressure, which boils down to: it depends.

 

Pretty much any stock gun should hop 0.25g.  Most can hop 0.28g, although it's not guaranteed.  What I would always suggest is cleaning the hop rubber and the barrel before use - hopefully the CYMA will come with a cleaning rod, although you can push a patch down the barrel with any 6mm-ish plastic rod.

 

Ideally you'll clean from rear to front so as not to push any barrel shipping oil back into the bucking, although it's not super critical as long as you get it all clear all the way.

 

If you do fancy diving inside, this is a fairly decent disassembly video.

 

 

 

Or you can remove the inner barrel by taking off the handguard, removing the three screws shown in red here, and the whole inner barrel assemble will slide out forwards, giving access to the hop unit and rubber.

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the video. I must say that looks a bit daunting. As a general rule of thumb, if I take something to bits it doesn't end well! 

[EvilMonkee]

Don't be conned by Bios, they don't really break down that much quicker.

[Floperator]

8 hours ago, EvilMonkee said:

Don't be conned by Bios, they don't really break down that much quicker.

Actually worse for the environment too because they break down into microplastics and get into the food chain quicker.

 

 

Further to the above I have a Lancer M4 and JG G36c and they've both performed well in skirmishes, no issues at all as yet. Both can be picked up for around £120ish if you shop around.

[Ebeneezer Goode]

Your choice of BB will often show on whether your site insults on Bio or not. My site mandates Bio as its within Forestry land. Although they do take literally years to degrade.

 

.25 is generally a good all rounder but depends on the play style (outdoor/indoor) and the gun. If you're plinking in the back garden though may as well save cash and just use .2s, keep the heavier stuff for skirmishes. (Said like a true canny Scotsman)

[Rogerborg]

40 minutes ago, Ebeneezer Goode said:

If you're plinking in the back garden though may as well save cash and just use .2s

 

I'd go the other way.  Given the low number that you'll get through while plinking, and the cost of the gun itself, the extra cost per bottle is negligible.

 

And I agree on bios, PLA breaks down in an industrial composter at 60C, not lying on the grass in Scottish weather.  The "BIO" label is really just for fooling landowners and wives.  

[Fly Si]

Well, I wasn't expecting that. I was kind of hoping the bio balls might dissolve away after a month or two. I suppose it would be a good idea to have the bottle marked biodegradable though, for the purposes of "wife fooling" if nothing else. Tbh I can see a fair bit of moaning coming my way very soon, once the little balls start collecting in the flower beds. The Mrs. principal hobby seems to be complaining about my hobbies!

 

OK, so list of stuff to buy. 

1 x rifle

Some 0.25 BBs 

Some kind of eye protection (what?)

Anything else? 

 

Thanks guys.

[EDcase]

19 minutes ago, Fly Si said:

...I can see a fair bit of moaning coming my way very soon, once the little balls start collecting in the flower beds...

Tell her they're good for soil drainage 😆

 

For garden plinking you can use any eye protection.  Even the work glasses from a pound shop will be OK.

 

Anything else? :  You might want to get an extra magazine or two?

Note there are mid capacity (about 120BBs) that must be loaded with a special loader (cheap to buy) and High capacity which hold up to 400BBs loosely and must be wound after a few shots.

Edited May 24, 2022 by EDcase

[Enid_Puceflange]

10 hours ago, Fly Si said:

 

 

OK, so list of stuff to buy. 

1 x rifle

Some 0.25 BBs 

Some kind of eye protection (what?)

Anything else? 

 

Thanks guys.

Get a reasonable battery and matching charger 
The ones that come with the lower level RIF’s in the box are not to be left unattended whilst charging , plus they are shite 😂

 

[Rogerborg]

On 24/05/2022 at 23:50, Fly Si said:

Well, I wasn't expecting that. I was kind of hoping the bio balls might dissolve away after a month or two.

 

The problem is that if they were that degradable, then they'd start to break up on the slow boat from China.  The last thing you want is BB's shattering while being shot.  I've had some biodegradables start to surface-craze about 2 years after being opened and first used, but actually breaking down meaningfully takes much, much longer.  Here's what landowners and wives shouldn't read about PLA:

 

https://www.biosphereplastic.com/biodegradableplastic/uncategorized/is-pla-compostable/

 

https://www.researchgate.net/publication/304615824_Mineralization_of_Poly_lactic_acidPLA_Poly_3-hydroxybutyrate-co-valeratePHBV_and_PLAPHBV_Blend_in_Compost_and_Soil_Environments

 

And that's pure PLA.  As you go heavier - which means anything above 0.2g - then you have to start adulterating the plastic with heavier Mystery Mass, like ceramic or metal.  Some heavier grey BBs actually have iron in them, which I'd reckon is more degradable than PLA.

 

So if possible, I'd suggest a net and some sort of tray or tarp to collect the buggers.  12" sticky targets are available which actually work quite well: the BBs stick, then (slowly) roll down them and into a tray.  BBs get everywhere even when you're trying to be careful: I need to give my garage a good sweeping up before Mrs Borg gets that look again.

 

And yes, any safety glasses will be fine for self protection, i.e. DIY or even sports glasses as long as they're polycarbonate and not perspex.

 

A mid capacity magazine or two is a decent shout, but I'd see how you get on with the supplied high capacity magazine.  It will hold hundreds of BBS, but needs winding up with a wheel underneath it.  Not actually that onerous, plenty of folk use them in skirmishes.  But mid caps still hold over a hundred BBs, and are load-and-shoot without the winding.  You'll need a "speedloader" to fill them.

 

E.g. https://bbguns4less.co.uk/products/cyma-g36-mid-cap-mag-also-fits-src-g36-130-rounds.html and https://bbguns4less.co.uk/products/vigor-bb-speed-loader-150rd-in-clear.html (larger loaders are available, I'm just guessing about where you're likely to be buying, and looking at what they have in stock).  I'd sound a note of caution though that airsoft magazine compatibility isn't brilliant, even within brands.  My JG G36 fed fine from its supplied hi-cap but didn't like the mid caps that I bought for it.  Much of airsoft is a gamble.

 

 

23 hours ago, Enid_Puceflange said:

Get a reasonable battery and matching charger 
The ones that come with the lower level RIF’s in the box are not to be left unattended whilst charging , plus they are shite 😂

 

 

True, but you're looking at £45-50 including delivery for a SkyRC S65 and a decent capacity 7.4V lipo.  I'd say that's required for skirmishing, but for plinking the provided nimh will actually work just fine.  It's not like trigger response and ROF are critical.  As with the magazines, I'd say: run it as it is out of the box, and see if you enjoy it.  Then consider a 2nd round of purchasing.

 

Or consider dropping by a skirmish with it - folk of all ages and abilities enjoy airsoft, and plenty of us here play at a very placid pace.  

 

[Ebeneezer Goode]

I find a cardboard box with the target taped/pinned to it works well at catching BBs. Stops our cats trying to eat them 🙄

 

Would echo everything Rogerborg has suggested. And above all, have fun!

[Fly Si]

When I signed up for an airsoft forum I didn't expect to be reading papers on researchgate! That's fantastic info, thanks @Rogerborg. 

 

Well, there doesn't seem any point buying the bio ammo. I'll maybe just tell the wife that it's all biodegradable and not to worry about the stray ones. 🤫

 

I'll have to give a bit of thought to making some kind of ball trap, and maybe give these sticky targets a go. 

 

I've got safety glasses I use with my grinder so I'll just use them in the garden. I'd love to have a go at skirmishing but I don't think I'd ever get a chance. Maybe if I can get my daughter involved in shooting she would ask to go and we'd get a pass from the boss! 

 

 

1 hour ago, Ebeneezer Goode said:

I find a cardboard box with the target taped/pinned to it works well at catching BBs. Stops our cats trying to eat them 🙄

 

Would echo everything Rogerborg has suggested. And above all, have fun!

I've got two cats. I hope they don't take to munching them!