Dangerous eye protection

[Tommikka]

Another set of non compliant goggles / eye protection identified by site staff

I know that I’m preaching to the converted, but keep your eyes out for new players with their ‘nice cheap’ Temu/AliExpress/eBay goggles

 

Observant site staff noted these ones

 

https://www.facebook.com/share/12CBYwpEZa8/?mibextid=WC7FNe
 

[strykerles]

My local has caught a few "amazon specials" before they could be used thankfully.

 

I carry spares aswell just in case someones is unfit for purpose and they need some

[The_Lord_Poncho]

Yet every field I go to is quite happy to allow standard shooting glasses/non full seal safety glasses that are rated yet provide a clear line of sight to the wearers eyeballs from multiple oblique angles.....

[Tommikka]

1 hour ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

Yet every field I go to is quite happy to allow standard shooting glasses/non full seal safety glasses that are rated yet provide a clear line of sight to the wearers eyeballs from multiple oblique angles.....

Which annoys me too

 

There’s no official standard for airsoft face protection other than impact, whereas the paintball goggle standard goes into the various components / parts of the facemask including up/down via vents etc 

 

[Rogerborg]

This is why I write "EN166B" on my home-made eye-pro, to ensure that it meets all safety standards.

[Colin Allen]

35 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

This is why I write "EN166B" on my home-made eye-pro, to ensure that it meets all safety standards.

What a brilliant idea!  It is almost Trumpian in its genius.

[Chev Chelios]

15 hours ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

Yet every field I go to is quite happy to allow standard shooting glasses/non full seal safety glasses that are rated yet provide a clear line of sight to the wearers eyeballs from multiple oblique angles.....

 

You have to be 18 to wear glasses. You signed your life (eye balls) away when you arrive if you choose to wear non full face in the designated game area. Being an adult you get to choose if you want to risk it for a biscuit. If by wearing glasses you put someone else's safety at risk it would be a different story but am very much "if what you do is not hurting anyone else and it makes you happy, crack on". 

 

What Tommikka posted is disgusting. Selling something marked as PPE when its in fact not is criminal.  

Edited March 12 by Chev Chelios

[Speedbird_666]

Saw this on FB - thankfully the Ambush Activites/Super5ives guys (and girls) are old school paintball that have moved into Airsoft and picked up on these very quickly.

 

I wouldn't play BBwarz with anything less than full (legit rated) paintball goggles/mask these days - LARPing tacticool realz be damned.

 

 

[The_Lord_Poncho]

I do agree with the logic. In the event of an incident I can't help worry that a sites reputation, insurances, and a whole load of other more human factors could conspire to screw a site over - we already know that many are run on rather marginal grounds, which is why I'm surprised than most don't have a full seal rule.

[Tommikka]

4 hours ago, Chev Chelios said:

 

 

What Tommikka posted is disgusting. Selling something marked as PPE when its in fact not is criminal.  

The thing is though - the post stated that they are not marked, and having found it on Temu, they are not sold as PPE

 

Only the spammed listing title mentions paintball, the activities don’t have any impact related activities, the product details call them ‘decorative glasses’ and the safety statement has no safety claims

 

They aren’t sold as PPE - buyer beware …… and the buyer should certainly have ‘bewared’

[Chev Chelios]

4 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

The thing is though - the post stated that they are not marked, and having found it on Temu, they are not sold as PPE

 

Only the spammed listing title mentions paintball, the activities don’t have any impact related activities, the product details call them ‘decorative glasses’ and the safety statement has no safety claims

 

They aren’t sold as PPE - buyer beware …… and the buyer should certainly have ‘bewared’

 

 

 

 

 

Is it not implied by calling it a "Paintball Mask" it is fit for purpose and use? For instance to sell something and call it "Bicycle Helmet" it needs to carry the CE mark and be fit for use. 

[Tommikka]

4 hours ago, Chev Chelios said:

 

You have to be 18 to wear glasses. You signed your life (eye balls) away when you arrive if you choose to wear non full face in the designated game area. Being an adult you get to choose if you want to risk it for a biscuit. If by wearing glasses you put someone else's safety at risk it would be a different story but am very much "if what you do is not hurting anyone else and it makes you happy, crack on". 

 

.  

That certainly appears to be the opinion of some sites.

But there is a duty of care with the site - the disclaimers do not remove any duty of care.

 

This channel has a good series of site safety / insurance videos.

Its from the land of litigation and focuses on paintball (and flags implications of multi activities) but covers the issue of waivers being worthless if you don’t think ahead and assess/mitigate/minimise risks

 

 

6 minutes ago, Chev Chelios said:

 

Is it not implied by calling it a "Paintball Mask" it is fit for purpose and use? For instance to sell something and call it "Bicycle Helmet" it needs to carry the CE mark and be fit for use. 

It could be taken as implied - but ‘buyer beware’ is a valid legal argument, headline titles may or may not be taken as a safety claim

Not to mention overseas goods not falling within domestic legislation - and the importer being responsible for imports 

 

Not much help when you don’t have an eye

(Back in the days of a long gone US forum there was a member who went by the name OneEye - his story was pinned to the safety section)

[Chev Chelios]

3 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

That certainly appears to be the opinion of some sites.

But there is a duty of care with the site - the disclaimers do not remove any duty of care.

 

This channel has a good series of site safety / insurance videos.

Its from the land of litigation and focuses on paintball (and flags implications of multi activities) but covers the issue of waivers being worthless if you don’t think ahead and assess/mitigate/minimise risks

 

 

Like some boxing gyms. You have to wear head gear if under 18 and are strongly advised to wear it regardless of age but the waver lets you box without. 

[Rogerborg]

23 minutes ago, Chev Chelios said:

For instance to sell something and call it "Bicycle Helmet" it needs to carry the CE mark and be fit for use. 

 

Same with motorcycle gear since 2018, although it's widely ignored and I doubt that it's ever enforced.

 

I'd say "This is another reason to have a national body, be recognised as a sport, and have well defined minimum standards", but...

 

 

20 hours ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

Yet every field I go to is quite happy to allow standard shooting glasses

 

... often to be seen on marshals and site owners. I've even fingered someone for wearing non-protective sunglasses at chrono, and had a site runner just shrug it off as "their risk".

 

That's why it's remarkable to see site that is taking eyepro seriously.  Good for them.

 

 

[Chev Chelios]

Off on a tangent - in my 24 years playing with toys I have seen more accidents due to fogging then inadequate eye protection. Hopefully that implies we are doing something collectively right at least.  

[The_Lord_Poncho]

8 minutes ago, Chev Chelios said:

Off on a tangent - in my 24 years playing with toys I have seen more accidents due to fogging then inadequate eye protection. Hopefully that implies we are doing something collectively right at least.  

This is the logic i employ too when i have inexperienced mates and their kids coming airsofting with me - I always lend them full masks, with mesh goggles so they aren't tempted to lift them mid game to wipe away the fog. I appreciate that mesh has its drawbacks, but I have concluded the likelihood of a BB fragmenting AND having enough retained velocity for the particles to do some damage on the other side of the mesh is much lower than the likelihood of the mask being lifted by a young kid due to fogging.

[Rogerborg]

4 hours ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

the likelihood of a BB fragmenting AND having enough retained velocity for the particles to do some damage on the other side of the mesh

 

I have seen it happen, and the mask reflexively raised to rub at the eyes.

 

Once, point blank, with a bad batch of 0.2g ASG Blasters.

 

 

4 hours ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

is much lower than the likelihood of the mask being lifted by a young kid due to fogging.

 

... which I see all the time, despite all exhortations not to do it.

[Gryph]

15 minutes ago, The_Lord_Poncho said:

the likelihood of the mask being lifted by a young kid due to fogging.

 

Thankfully my local is pretty harsh on that sort of thing. You get a warning followed by the boot if you start lifting your eyepro mid game.

 

[Galvatron]

I had a look for the FMA F1 mask on Ali Express and it lived up to expectations.

 

 

It mentioned being suitable for airsoft and paintball but the specs were predictably vague. The Engrish specs state the impact protection is up to 600 ft/s without saying the mass of the projectile so that 600 ft/s rating means sweet Fanny Adams.

 

Sometimes what's not mentioned is crucial and that lends well to "buyer beware". No mention of EN166B, ANSI Z87+ or any worthy rating standard should be a big red flag.

 

Unfortunately, we have the luxury of knowing what to look out for but Amazon Marketplace, Temu and Ali Express prey on the ignorance of newbies, especially parents who don't know what to look out for.

 

You've also got to be wary of clones that falsely declare being compliant, unlike the real ones.

 

 

1 hour ago, Gryph said:

 

Thankfully my local is pretty harsh on that sort of thing. You get a warning followed by the boot if you start lifting your eyepro mid game.
 

 

You have to be. I gave a mate of mine bit of a bollocking when he'd walked just 10m into the game area and took his eye pro off as it was fogging up despite having had two safety briefings. He knows now either to ask for help from another player or a marshal to get back to the safe zone if he fogs up and can't see.

[TheFull9]

On the one hand, definitely worrying to think about how many temu unsafe masks/rusty 10 year old mesh masks are probably floating around out there. Fortunately we seem to be pretty lucky, as I think anyone actually getting an eye punctured at a game would probably get well publicised and I don't know the last time I heard of it happening; though if I'm just living under a rock and it's happening every week at different sites I'd definitely like to know of confirmed instances that people have seen.

[heroshark]

This is a good point. In 25 years playing I've seen bbs get in nonsealed or I'll fitted eye protection around 10 times at a game . 2 of those incidents leaded to lasting reduced vision which did improve with time. And I've only read about one other well documented case, although there has to be more. The worst ones are usually when there is a direct line to the eye like over the top of glasses when going prone. 

Edited March 13 by heroshark

[Speedy Sloth]

Will say I've been ambush multiple times and they are great for checking eye pro wish more sights were as on it as they are.