Sniper backup???

[LJ-Tactical]

I'm looking at what would work best as a sniper backup rather than my current TM HK45 Tactical pistol.

I'm considering potentially an MP-7, MP-5K or a P-90

Edited December 10 by LJ-Tactical

[MrTea]

TM Mk23. There's a reason so many people suggest this one. Your MED with a sniper is 30m so you really only need something effective within the 0-30m range which is almost any pistol in airsoft.  I personally use one just because of the range, accuracy and consistency it gets.

With a Hadron TDC plate and Flamingo 60 degree (or your preferred) hop rubber you can throw BBs for miles (not literally but you get the idea) as well as being one of the quietest pistols on the market.

You should ask: what's wrong with your current TM HK45? Is it too loud? Inaccurate? Unreliable?

Edited December 10 by MrTea

[Rogerborg]

Yup, if you want to stay stealthy, any Mk23.

 

If you want to sling more balls, then, sure, an AEG SMG is a good shout.

 

It's a shame that the plastic Galaxy MP5K (G5K) is out of stock, as it's ideal as a cheap, light, auto-capable sidearm.  But it is, so you'll likely have to look at:

 

CYMA (heavier, but spicier)

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/cyma-cm-041k-smg-5k-submachine-gun

 

Jing Gong (lighter but weedier)

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/jing-gong-jg-smg-5k

 

If you don't mind slinging a secondary, any shortish, lightish AEG will do. I run a mix of Galaxy MP5K, a Jing Gong G36C with the stock taken off, or a CYMA M4 with the barrel cut down and the stock lopped right off (battery in a PEQ box).  Whatever works, works.

 

If you want something a little different, this is a genuine bargain price for a Double Eagle UMP 45: https://bbguns4less.co.uk/products/double-eagle-m89-ump-45-electric-airsoft-gun-in-black.html - you can ditch the stock, and bin off any rails that you don't need to bring the weight down.

[MrTea]

Polenar Tactical also have been showing a belt/QLS mounted MP5 holster if anyone's interested.

It's kinda goofy but I like it.

Edited December 11 by MrTea

[ruskitseller]

How about an M202? 

But seriously, I was going to use a TM MP5. Very light weight and ideal for CQB spray and pray without having to upgrade. 

 

 

Edited December 11 by ruskitseller

[Cannonfodder]

It really depends on what you want from your back up gun. If you want something to use within the MED of your bolt action while staying hidden then definitely go for a Mk23 socom. However if you want something than let's you put rounds out before buggering off then a small AEG would be better. As @Rogerborg postedthe galaxy MP5K would be perfect for this if you can find one in stock.

 

 

[Fatboy40]

8 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

CYMA (heavier, but spicier)

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/cyma-cm-041k-smg-5k-submachine-gun

 

I bought a boneyard CYMA MP5K, that came with a few mags, just for this reason. It works beautifully now with a GATE Titan v3, XT brushless motor and 7.4v LiPo's, however it's become an ornamental pew pew that I use rarely just as a novelty.

 

It's just so HEAVY as a sidearm and to be honest gets in the way more than a pistol does if I'm crawling through bushes and undergrowth  So, 100% a pistol all the way for me (although using an AAP-01 it's not the quietest).

[Impulse]

It basically comes down to what you want it to do and in my opinion it comes down to three categories: stealth, loud and proud, and lightweight generalist.

 

If you want stealth, the mk23 is unrivaled. It's a NBB gas pistol which means that it's incredibly quiet with a suppressor, and they can be tuned to hit ranges well past your MED with the aftermarket parts available. However, if you need to shoot them fast, they have a really squishy trigger which has an awful trigger pull on double action, and the force required to pull the trigger will usually shift your barrel ever so slightly and cause you to miss a lot of shots if shooting it fast.

 

If you want a bit of firepower and going the loud and proud route, a compact SMG or SBR is great. Lots of people have recommended the Cyma mp5k and I can wholeheartedly agree with them; I have one and while it's a bit heavy, they can shoot phenomenally well. I'm also looking at my boneyard JG skorpion AEP and thinking about getting it fixed up and tuned to be a nasty lightweight BB hose for Vietnam games; make the GIs think twice about charging this sniper!

 

Otherwise I'd stick with the TM HK45 for a lighter weight alternative to the compact SMG. GBB pistols are great as generalist sniper sidearms as they're very small and easy to carry, and you can still put a good amount of rounds down at anyone who gets within your MED. I frequently use my TM hi-capa when sniping. You could also look at getting a Glock 18 or AAP-01 for a full-auto GBB pistol, but they tend to need durability upgrades if you want to use them full-auto a lot, as well as more efficient parts because it chews through a lot of gas and loses all consistency. Or you could look at a Cyma AEP, but they don't shoot over ~0.5J due to the limitations in design (they're so small and have a tiny gearbox); basically, full-auto on a GBB pistol isn't too practical, and AEPs lack punch to where you need to put a few BBs into people for them to notice them; a 0.2 or 0.25 BB at 0.5J doesn't make much impact.

 

Personally, I tend to only use the compact SMG at larger or special events like AI500 or Vietnam filmsim games. At regular skirmish days, I don't tend to need the extra firepower and it's a lot of added weight, so I typically bring either a mk23 if I want to be sneaky or my hi-capa if I want a bit more punch.

[Enid_Puceflange]

Yup

I agree with the Mk23 suggestion if you want to remain stealthy

Add a Crazy Jet barrel and a Flamingo bucking along with a Hadron TDC and “I” key and it’ll throw .4’s further than any AEG on the field

 

Or go the noisy route, and get a TM Scorpion 

A nice lightweight small AEP, which is capable of around 40m and full auto

 

[PopRocket123]

There's the MPX sportline. The size of an MP5, polymer body, easy reloads and Luke from negative airsoft was pretty positive about the one he got his hands on. And with the picatinny rail on the back it's easy to just take the stock off and run it with a single point sling, maybe use a bungie cord on your belt to keep it secure when you're running

[Lozart]

14 hours ago, MrTea said:

Polenar Tactical also have been showing a belt/QLS mounted MP5 holster if anyone's interested.

It's kinda goofy but I like it.

 

I was all excited by that until I found out it's 170 Euros!

[Rogerborg]

17 minutes ago, Lozart said:

I was all excited by that until I found out it's 170 Euros!

 

You could probably knock one up in your shed. Kydex is cheap, and really easy and forgiving to work with, just heat and form.

 

[El Zomba]

I know this is putting the cart before the horse, but seeing that Polenar holster has made me want to pick up an MP5.

 

Seeing as I'm about to dip my toe into the murky world of bolt actions, I'm going to give lugging my MP7 around as a secondary a go.  My thinking being that if I fancy being sneeky I can set up the rifle, but can switch to the 7 if I feel like being lairy.

 

I give it two games max before I'm sick of the weight and one of the two is getting left in the car for the rest of the day.

[MrTea]

2 minutes ago, El Zomba said:

Seeing as I'm about to dip my toe into the murky world of bolt actions, I'm going to give lugging my MP7 around as a secondary a go.  My thinking being that if I fancy being sneeky I can set up the rifle, but can switch to the 7 if I feel like being lairy.

A MP7 holster does exist.

[Impulse]

6 minutes ago, Lozart said:

 

I was all excited by that until I found out it's 170 Euros!

 

That definitely dampens the mood on it, but... I still kinda want one.

 

13 minutes ago, MrTea said:

A MP7 holster does exist.

 

And it's really good. I sometimes use it for my mp7 and I have no complaints about it.

[ButcherBill]

or...

 

Use a P90 as a backup?

 

The sling will hook up to any molle gear you're wearing & can be placed anywhere on it with no mag sticking out to catch barriers, bushes etc.

[Galvatron]

As a regular P90 primary user, I'd say you should be mindful that its trigger, like real steel bullpups, can be a pain in the arse when it's the original TM spec or one of the TM clones i.e. Cybergun, CYMA, Double Bell, JG, etc.

 

If you're a stickler for a consistent trigger response, you should consider either buying the TM P90 Plus, upgrading the TM clones with a MOSFET/ETU or if you really want to spend more, there is the Krytac P90.

[Anonymoose]

I'd just take any normal pistol really. Maybe an 18C if you want full-auto ability. MK23 for all-out stealth probably only worth it if you're fully ghillie'd up?

[LMKipper]

I've been thinking about picking up a Mk23 for a while - interested in thoughts on whether it's worth the extra for the TM or just pick up an ASG/STTI? Or god help me, the Novi clone.

[Hudson]

I've had both the clones and TM, and tbh. I'd never go back to a clone nowadays.

 

The trigger isn't as good, the mags are finicky, and the feed lips are more fragile -  they don't load as smoothly.

Plus, I've always had issues with performance of the clones after a while, where the power drops, and often doesn't feed.

 

Contrast that with the Marui versions that I've had for several years, and had no issues.

Edited December 15 by Hudson

[MrTea]

1 hour ago, LMKipper said:

I've been thinking about picking up a Mk23 for a while - interested in thoughts on whether it's worth the extra for the TM or just pick up an ASG/STTI? Or god help me, the Novi clone.

Might as well go with TM tbh. You know they're going to work and you get a good foam filled suppressor included with it.

I've read that the ASG magazines are the best of the lot however I would definitely suggest getting 'low profile' magazine followers as this allows and extra 4-8 BBs per mag (depending on brand) and they're super cheap without causing feeding issues.

Edited December 15 by MrTea

[LMKipper]

All good points. A TM with some hop bits it is!

[Skara]

Remember that the mk23 is the size of a small SMG, especially with the suppressor on.

 

This makes it not ideal for mounting on a belt, drop leg holsters are a no go because you'll be burying the front end into the ground every time you take a knee unless you are very tall.

So you're left with chest/armpit holsters and there aren't many options available that don't involve modification.

 

Regarding the pistol, TM is the way to go, all you need to add is a tdc cover, tensioner and hop rubber of choice, that's it.

Stock gun can somehow lift up to 0.28s but can't go heavier, which is where the pistol truly shines as a pocket sniper rifle. A TDC will get 0.48s going for very silly ranges and being a NBB, once you get past the horrible trigger, means you'll be consistently hitting people at ranges above what a 1.13J AEG can reach.

Magazine wise, I found TM mags to be the overall best, but I've been told the new gen 3 Nov mags are also very good, so next time I'm shopping for gbb parts I may get a few of those and transfer the TM internals (routers, feed lips, follower and springs) into them.

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, Skara said:

This makes it not ideal for mounting on a belt, drop leg holsters are a no go because you'll be burying the front end into the ground every time you take a knee unless you are very tall.

So you're left with chest/armpit holsters and there aren't many options available that don't involve modification.

 

If you can find a holster that can attach to molle (or are prepared to make it attach with paracord or cable ties or what-not) then I'd recommend a thigh panel as a compromise between belt and drop-leg. I find these ideal in both height and security for mounting, as you say, an SMG sized gat.

 

Real-pretend world example (just add holster).