POSSIBLE RIF BAN

[shortman]

The part you have quoted is merley the definition of what that will stand for when the words "replica firearms" is used in the directive. The whole directive is aimed at fire arms and anything that can be converted to be used as an actual fire arm. You have misinterpreted the above quote in the assumption that "replica firearms" are to be included in the tighter restrictions they are trying to impose.

[Yams]

The whole point here is that this is a massive ammendment to existing EU firearms legislation.

 

The part that affects us is that they are trying to add replica firearms to category C weapons. That would be a massive burden and potentially impossible to implement. If we are agreed that airsoft guns fall into the definition of "replica firearms" then please be specific on where I am misunderstanding things.

[Marco]

Hi guys,

 

an update from the European Airsoft Association

 

Airsoft players of Europe - this is it! This is the big push, this is where you can save airsoft in Europe or let it be crushed. As you probably already know, the EC has presented a proposal to amend the firearms directive. There's some really heavy handed stuff in the proposal, but the worst for airsofters is that they want ALL REPLICAS to be classed as firearms. This is going to make most airsoft replicas prohibited, make the few remaining ones licensed, and this will kill airsoft. This is how we fight it:

TASK 1: SEND LETTERS NOW! On the link below is a pre prepared letter which you can copy and send to your MEPs. Search on-line, find your MEPs email addresses, copy and paste this letter (and modify it however you like).

TASK 2: SHARE THE HELL OUT OF THE PAGE! Make sure your friends, everyone you play with and interact with knows about this draft letter, let the shops know, the sites, the forums, everyone! Too many people are in the dark about this sudden and huge problem.

TASK 3: TRANSLATE! We've started with the English version but within a week I would like to see the post available in all of the 23 recognised languages of Europe. If the letter is not available on the page in your language, translate it and email the translation to us ASAP [email protected] and we’ll add it to the site.

It would really help if you posted the replies you receive on this page https://www.facebook.com/groups/455851477935788/ or email them to [email protected] so we can see how things are going and spot supporters in particular committees.

Don’t forget to insert your name, and add your MEPs name. Don’t forget to add your address to the top if you are posting a letter.

Here’s the link to the letter:

http://www.euroairsoft.org/index.php/additional-documents/operation-mep

Dear INSERT MEP NAME HERE,

As a constituent, I would like to raise my concerns regarding the recent proposal to amend the so called firearms directive. Specifically Proposal COM(2015)750/F1, on Page 17 where it is stated

(13) in Annex I to Directive 91/477/EC part II is amended as follows:

(a) point A is amended as follows:

………

(iii) In Category C, the following points are added:

“5. Alarm and signal weapons, salute and acoustic weapons as well as replicas;”

I am a hobbyist who enjoys ‘airsoft’ events in which opposing teams compete in military and law enforcement scenarios. These events require the use of relatively low powered airsoft replica firearms. These events are a commonplace, well-regulated and physically demanding team activity with many positives for the individual and society. There is also an industry surrounding the airsoft hobby which employs many people. The classification of replicas as category C firearms would destroy my beloved pastime.

If replicas became category C firearms it would mean that manufacturers, retailers and owners of these replicas would be subject to all the obligations of the directive. This disproportionate measure would mean that replicas would become restricted or illegal firearms in most countries due to local laws restricting automatic firearms and limiting magazine capacity. At best, some countries would allow some replicas to be serialised, held on a certificate and registered. Other parts of the proposal would simultaneously make internet sales illegal and ban firearms of military appearance. In essence, the vast majority of airsoft replicas would be banned and the few remaining ones would be heavily restricted or licenced to the point where it would not be worth the hassle of obtaining or owning one. The airsoft hobby would soon cease to exist and the industry would collapse (which would have been highlighted if the normal economic impact assessment had not been bypassed in the case of this proposal). Inevitably, many replicas would remain uncontrolled out of ignorance to the drastic changes, turning the owners into criminals.

The vast majority of replicas are in no way convertible to fire real ammunition. They have the appearance of a firearm on the outside but the type of replicas we use for airsoft do not have any components which would be useable in a firearm. No justification has been presented in the text of the proposal for the inclusion of replicas in the scope of the directive. Member states have not expressed any major problems relating to public order caused by the use of replicas nor have replicas been implicated in terrorist acts.

In fact, after an extensive study in 2010 (COM(2010)404) the European commission itself recommended that “replicas, with their various characteristics and purposes, should not be included in the field of application of Directive 91/477/EC (Firearms Directive), especially as those which can be converted to a firearm and therefore treated as one are now covered by Directive 2008/51/EC.”

I also believe that the category change will be impossible to implement. Most replicas do not have a serial number, and some are children’s toys. Replicas can be produced from almost any material by any person, for example by carving wood into the shape of a gun. I don’t think it would be possible to register and control such a broad category of items. The cost of serialising and registering all replicas would be enormous, as would be the compensation costs for confiscation of the many replicas which would become prohibited. By EU estimates there are hundreds of millions of replicas in Europe. The governments of Germany, Czech Republic and Austria have specifically objected to the reclassification of replicas, and I do not believe that the Police force will find the measure sensible, achievable, enforceable or a good use of resources.

I support sensible controls, such as ensuring that readily convertible replicas, alarm and signal weapons are classed as firearms. I support robust mandates to ensure standardised irreversible deactivation of firearms across the EU. What I don’t support is heavy handed curtailing of law abiding citizens pastimes under the guise of preventing terrorism.

Please seek the amendment of the proposal COM(2015)750/F1 so that replicas will not be classified as firearms by being added to Category C (Firearms subject to declaration) of directive 91/477/EEC.

Yours Sincerely,

YOUR NAME HERE

Like us on Facebook for more information as it comes in https://www.facebook.com/europeanairsoft/.

Matt Furey-King
President
European Airsoft Association

[Jedi_Master]

Another good reason to vote on leaving the EU.

[Aengus]

Hi guys,

 

an update from the European Airsoft Association

 

Airsoft players of Europe - this is it! This is the big push, this is where you can save airsoft in Europe or let it be crushed. As you probably already know, the EC has presented a proposal to amend the firearms directive. There's some really heavy handed stuff in the proposal, but the worst for airsofters is that they want ALL REPLICAS to be classed as firearms. This is going to make most airsoft replicas prohibited, make the few remaining ones licensed, and this will kill airsoft. This is how we fight it:

TASK 1: SEND LETTERS NOW! On the link below is a pre prepared letter which you can copy and send to your MEPs. Search on-line, find your MEPs email addresses, copy and paste this letter (and modify it however you like).

TASK 2: SHARE THE HELL OUT OF THE PAGE! Make sure your friends, everyone you play with and interact with knows about this draft letter, let the shops know, the sites, the forums, everyone! Too many people are in the dark about this sudden and huge problem.

TASK 3: TRANSLATE! We've started with the English version but within a week I would like to see the post available in all of the 23 recognised languages of Europe. If the letter is not available on the page in your language, translate it and email the translation to us ASAP [email protected] and we’ll add it to the site.

It would really help if you posted the replies you receive on this page https://www.facebook.com/groups/455851477935788/ or email them to [email protected] so we can see how things are going and spot supporters in particular committees.

Don’t forget to insert your name, and add your MEPs name. Don’t forget to add your address to the top if you are posting a letter.

Here’s the link to the letter:

http://www.euroairsoft.org/index.php/additional-documents/operation-mep

Dear INSERT MEP NAME HERE,

As a constituent, I would like to raise my concerns regarding the recent proposal to amend the so called firearms directive. Specifically Proposal COM(2015)750/F1, on Page 17 where it is stated

(13) in Annex I to Directive 91/477/EC part II is amended as follows:

(a) point A is amended as follows:

………

(iii) In Category C, the following points are added:

“5. Alarm and signal weapons, salute and acoustic weapons as well as replicas;”

I am a hobbyist who enjoys ‘airsoft’ events in which opposing teams compete in military and law enforcement scenarios. These events require the use of relatively low powered airsoft replica firearms. These events are a commonplace, well-regulated and physically demanding team activity with many positives for the individual and society. There is also an industry surrounding the airsoft hobby which employs many people. The classification of replicas as category C firearms would destroy my beloved pastime.

If replicas became category C firearms it would mean that manufacturers, retailers and owners of these replicas would be subject to all the obligations of the directive. This disproportionate measure would mean that replicas would become restricted or illegal firearms in most countries due to local laws restricting automatic firearms and limiting magazine capacity. At best, some countries would allow some replicas to be serialised, held on a certificate and registered. Other parts of the proposal would simultaneously make internet sales illegal and ban firearms of military appearance. In essence, the vast majority of airsoft replicas would be banned and the few remaining ones would be heavily restricted or licenced to the point where it would not be worth the hassle of obtaining or owning one. The airsoft hobby would soon cease to exist and the industry would collapse (which would have been highlighted if the normal economic impact assessment had not been bypassed in the case of this proposal). Inevitably, many replicas would remain uncontrolled out of ignorance to the drastic changes, turning the owners into criminals.

The vast majority of replicas are in no way convertible to fire real ammunition. They have the appearance of a firearm on the outside but the type of replicas we use for airsoft do not have any components which would be useable in a firearm. No justification has been presented in the text of the proposal for the inclusion of replicas in the scope of the directive. Member states have not expressed any major problems relating to public order caused by the use of replicas nor have replicas been implicated in terrorist acts.

In fact, after an extensive study in 2010 (COM(2010)404) the European commission itself recommended that “replicas, with their various characteristics and purposes, should not be included in the field of application of Directive 91/477/EC (Firearms Directive), especially as those which can be converted to a firearm and therefore treated as one are now covered by Directive 2008/51/EC.”

I also believe that the category change will be impossible to implement. Most replicas do not have a serial number, and some are children’s toys. Replicas can be produced from almost any material by any person, for example by carving wood into the shape of a gun. I don’t think it would be possible to register and control such a broad category of items. The cost of serialising and registering all replicas would be enormous, as would be the compensation costs for confiscation of the many replicas which would become prohibited. By EU estimates there are hundreds of millions of replicas in Europe. The governments of Germany, Czech Republic and Austria have specifically objected to the reclassification of replicas, and I do not believe that the Police force will find the measure sensible, achievable, enforceable or a good use of resources.

I support sensible controls, such as ensuring that readily convertible replicas, alarm and signal weapons are classed as firearms. I support robust mandates to ensure standardised irreversible deactivation of firearms across the EU. What I don’t support is heavy handed curtailing of law abiding citizens pastimes under the guise of preventing terrorism.

Please seek the amendment of the proposal COM(2015)750/F1 so that replicas will not be classified as firearms by being added to Category C (Firearms subject to declaration) of directive 91/477/EEC.

Yours Sincerely,

YOUR NAME HERE

Like us on Facebook for more information as it comes in https://www.facebook.com/europeanairsoft/.

Matt Furey-King

President

European Airsoft Association

Sent to my local MP, wonder how long he'll take to reply(if ever)

[proffrink]

He'll probably reply with: 'I'm your MP not your MEP', heh.

[K@rl]

Whilst I apriciate that having a black rif is tacticool I wouldn't go as far as to say it's the end of Airsoft. I find it very unlikely that there will b a blanket ban on Airsoft weapons but I can see them forcing two tone. I understand that for some this would be the end of the world but I play for fun, as do meny. And I wouldn't care if my gun was bright pink with yellow spots and int the shape of a cock. As long as wen I aim an shoot the bb goes where I want it to.

Very few paintball players use rif style markers and there sport has mass appeal.

It would be much easier to defend ourselves with one unified body that we all were a member of that we all funded to fight for our interested but like so meny things I have been involved with, ie fishing, paragliding, etc, it is very disjointed. There are so meny layers to the sport and one group Always looks down on another as a joke.

For me I hope we are able to maintain rifs. I am sure the rules with change and maybe for the better. But if they don't and we have to two tone or alter the aperience of our guns it won't bother me. I hope that we use that as a chance to take it to the mass market. Let milsim plays go there own way and get licence etc so they can play out there army fantasy and the rest of use will enjoy hurting each other.

For anyone reading this who owns/runs a site please don't assume that if this is enforced that it's all over because it's not. It's just another opertunity to increase your customer base. And if ur stuck for ideas as to how am sure I can help.

[Hef Legend]

I wonder how much airsoft sales have dropped since the EU sparked all of this, I'm sure lots of people have held of on purchases in case they get told that everything they own is illegal or some such nonsense.

 

I personally have held of on buying a new RIF, pending any news on this.

[proffrink]

Well chaps, if the new law covers the point of sale then under most circumstances they won't be able to make those old sales illegal and ask for our stuff back. Cleverly avoiding Ex post facto law is a pillar of modern legal systems but is also the reason why you can still buy 'pre-ban' automatic firearms in the US (if you have the money). Having said that, they could easily make gun ownership illegal in some other way by simply banning their transportation or use etc.

If this comes into action and it covers the ownership (again, not the sale) then the UK (and the rest of Europe) would be looking at a huge amnesty that's bigger than anything that's ever been done before. We're talking far, far bigger than Australia or Britain's voluntary gun surrenders and that's going to cost an absolute sh*tload of money and oversight. They are going to need to be super committed to do this on such a scale.

It's far more likely that - if this were to pass at all - that it would cover the sale of goods and not ownership.

I guess what I'm saying is use all of your Christmas money to horde guns like an American hordes ammunition whenever someone shoots up a school.

[djben9]

no harm in sending an email....

 

copy / paste job though ...

 

if all goes tits up and interest dwindles slightly, i can use the newly purchased chest rig for day trips with the kids....tactical food storage!

[TheFull9]

Well chaps, if the new law covers the point of sale then under most circumstances they won't be able to make those old sales illegal and ask for our stuff back. Cleverly avoiding Ex post facto law is a pillar of modern legal systems but is also the reason why you can still buy 'pre-ban' automatic firearms in the US (if you have the money). Having said that, they could easily make gun ownership illegal in some other way by simply banning their transportation or use etc.

 

If this comes into action and it covers the ownership (again, not the sale) then the UK (and the rest of Europe) would be looking at a huge amnesty that's bigger than anything that's ever been done before. We're talking far, far bigger than Australia or Britain's voluntary gun surrenders and that's going to cost an absolute sh*tload of money and oversight. They are going to need to be super committed to do this on such a scale.

 

It's far more likely that - if this were to pass at all - that it would cover the sale of goods and not ownership.

 

I guess what I'm saying is use all of your Christmas money to horde guns like an American hordes ammunition whenever someone shoots up a school.

 

I've been wondering a lot about this since the Paris attacks and following introduction of this pointless proposed legislation.

 

As you say, in the states when they change gun laws it's almost always a 'no more sales' rather than 'no more ownership' policy and every time they hint at banning anything it causes a monumental spike in sales of whatever they hint at banning. However people are generally, from my small amount of experience, far more politically active in the US and massively so when it comes to guns; combining this with the amount of pro-2A people there are it means their government is simply too afraid of even trying to implement amnesties or compulsory handing-in of certain weapons/accessories in most cases. Firearms and replicas thereof in the UK though... the pro are massively out-weighed by the anti, we've simply not the people-power to stop the powers that be doing whatever they like to our toys in the name of 'safety'.

 

I 100% agree that the administering of an amnesty on all IFs would be a seriously costly venture and one the police force can quite evidently not afford to be wasting their already stretched time on doing. But I'm just not 100% that that would stop the government implementing a ban on ownership (as opposed to sales) anyway. You could well be right and there's no way to say for certain either way, but if this law came in from Europe and if we implemented it here, personally I'm really not sure which way it would swing.

[Sacarathe]

On amnesties; Neither IFs or RIFs are required for the sport. It could be hugely damaging to airsoft to run around with airsoft internals in externals akin to a supersoaker or nerf gun, the sport could survive... Though the implementation costs would destroy the sport.

 

Incidentally, any idea how this legislation could affect toy guns which are actually produced for children? What i mean to say is, if it was worst case, could toy guns, such as water guns and nerf get sucked up by these amnesties.

 

At first you might think, "why would they", but it would not take long for nerf clones to pop up with factory installed airsoft parts - if nerf guns were exempt (example), basically, it has to be all (unlicensed) guns or nothing?

 

Im sure we've all seen that vid of the guy shooting police in london with a nerf gun - cant be certain its not real ammo. We all know that all you need for a real gun is the ammunition, anyone with appropriate skills can create a firing device (a gun). Going after imitation firearms is a cheap shot that serves no useful purpose, imo, and as most others have said.