Sitting Duck

Oi - do you two wanna flirt somewhere else or something jeeeez thought there was gonna be some new findings/results And I thought I was the main thread derailer or hijacker

in that case maybe get a cyma gearbox or just use stock gears - what !!! yes stock gears 18:1 with shs high speed all rewired with deans & a basic fet will greatly improve rof & response You need to crack open the box and check shims/regrease/ensure seals are good fit o-ring nozzle most of all you MUST check/do Angle Of Engagement unless you like piston's initial tooth snapped off Tiny slits near back or port quite far back for 455mm barrel I reckon Check box/seals work fine all fps looking good first... Then add shs hi speed - considerable increase on its own pop in fet on old stock wiring at trigger wires - new motor & battery wire on 16awg with deans Now test her on stock gears..... 7.4v lipo 25c = 19 to 20 rps 9.9v life battery 25 to 26 11.1v lipo battery 30 to 31rps Pretty impressive for old stock gears- however watch yourself on 11.1v lipo's & approaching 30+ If your piston is quite heavy/weighty on a stock m100 spring it won't return quite as quick as a light piston if this happens at higher speed PE or Pre Engagement can take place - on all metal gears on piston There will be no weak point to break and one hell of a BANG can happen if everything is all metal Reason of the PE warning is coz if you run with M100 spring or less it is more likely to happen People in US can use M110 - M120+ which will return heavier pistons faster & avoid PE When peeps build very high speed setups they get the weight right down to 10gms by swiss cheese oh high rof & DSG's All metal teeth, piston bearings etc.., add extra weight from 20gms to 31gms or you could get a complete piston with 1 metal tooth at about 16gms without swiss cheese Or you may need to run a higher spring - taking you over 350 but short stroke it to bring you back down But as long as you don't go mad and stick to 20 to 25rps then PE should not be a possible worry People think you gotta have high speed gears for higher rof - you don't You do need a higher torque motor to turn higher speed gears or a stronger spring -M130 on DMR's say But not all torque motors turn quickly - some are not much faster than stock but are much more powerful Some torque's are quite quick - but not all of them. SHS High Speed is a bloody quick impressive cheap motor especially when dean/fet/16awg is done Then you really unleash the potential of it and will turn as quickly as you can supply the juice to it People say torque is better - you are using a stock or lower than stock spring and stock 18:1 gears the motor is not having to do any extra strain except run quicker which it will You could just use deans but you should use thicker 16awg coz the stock motor wire will get very warm AND fit a basic mosfet to avoid contacts arcing/burning out You don't need an Active Braking mosfet - it won't double fire on stock gears and the stronger neodym high speed motor will come to rest very quickly anyway once power is cut - stock motor's (ferrite) will roll on a bit but neodym won't Get a half decent cheap box - say £40 check it works reasonable ok - probably too hot with a m120 spring in there Then buy a m100 or m95 spring, piston o-ring, o-ring nozzle, some cheapo self adhesive washers to do AOE PTFE tape to seal cylinder head, shims grease etc...... - £10 to say £15 Maybe better double o-ring cylinder head, steel/ali cylinder instead of brass type if you want it running best seals (imho - perhaps lose piston bearing it adds weight to piston and if not installed with loctite they often come undone use a lighter plastic spacer/bushing if buying a new piston head but stock might be ok but fit a bearing spring guide) Make sure all bits turn and slide real smooth and work all ok... Test it all out - job done........ (buy a load of various parts to build a box from scratch and they may not all fit/work correctly together straight away) Do the wiring & mosfet once the box is running nice and quiet with good seals etc.. like I said I am NOT an expert - far far from it I am still learning (and breaking stuff though not so much as I was at first) However I have read/researched a lot of stuff and one of the best guides on what you seek is here: http://www.airsoftsociety.com/forums/f10/legacys-guide-building-high-speed-aeg-87504/ It has saved me probably about 12 to 24 months in major headaches & busted boxes and mega mega kudos to the guy for putting together such a comprehensive guide all broken down in various stages of tuning and what you need to do to obtain an increased rate of fire Final thing - insane rof & DSG's etc... - just means in general ya box will crap out quicker it is like a car - faster you drive it at higher speeds in your box more heat/wear will occur the more miles or shots the quicker your car/box will need servicing With that "general" common sense bit out of way - do the stuff above without going too nutz keep the volts low and she will perform well for longer plus 7.4v lipo's should be cheaper/smaller and you will see a vast improvement over a stock gun without needing to spend out too much

if you buy the madbull hop the tracer bit is still extra - usually so read the small print on exactly what you are buying..... Also once the led's are wired in it usually is usually on all time unless you wire in a switch (could wire into trigger but you'd want it on for a little while to illuminate the tracer bb's I guess)

get box sorted - firing well good seals etc... (even standard parts if fitted and running well will bring good improvements) then when setup well you can just wire in a mosfet without needing to open box back up on a v3 and see the improved rof & response. Out of interest what rate are you seeking coz tbh a high rof is great but if you want it to last longer then run on sensible volts and still get great rof on a 7.4v

a member on the UKARA database simplifies sales - end of It means that they are OVER 18 - not some spotty schoolkid using daddies paypal They have skirmished at a reputable site for a few times - so have "briefly" demonstrated they once were mature & responsible with an airsoft weapon (I may be complete idiot now but I did demonstrate some of these properties) So it simplifies sales and shows that they were once at least a regular skirmisher for a little while AND 18+ It helps to prevent very easy unregulated sales in UK - does NOT eliminate it though but helps to reduce easy access by people not meeting the ukara requirements..... There are ways but I will not enter into any discussions on this matter But if a person really wanted there are a number of ways around this - and repainting an IF or obtaining a RIF is f*ck all compared to some other stuff I could mention Thankfully - even if it is a bit ott, sellers prefer a buyer to registered on the ukara database - not much to ask to be fair

dunno how good but don't think you can get them much cheaper: http://www.tinywind.com/dragon-fluorescent-full-auto-tracer-illuminator-unit-14mm-coyote-brown-p-13202.html http://www.tinywind.com/auto-tracer-silencer-round-type-14mm-p-11224.html

Dunno if you are putting any gears of what type in there but that length barrel 6.01 might be too hot & too tight - jamming if less that brill ammo used Could always just buy a cheap cyma 028 box and a few little tweaks + ya motor & fet etc.... (o-ring nozzle, check seal on piston/cylinder, AOE, time doing the shimming - be a cracking little box) then add fet + deans + motor to improve rof & response - 6.03 barrel probably best all round option

Sounds brilliantly thought out and defending the cows must have been "a mooooo sing" (soz I'll get me coat) Kudos to site chrono/stickers/number players/safety briefings shame I'm in Surrey but sounds very well done (been going a while coz I'm sure I stumbled across the name/site whilst browsing)

All bb's will deviate in wind - many use .25's .28' even .30's in their AEG loads to choose from at 0.20's not so many at other weights - Blasters are supposed to be good BAW but they don't do .28's .20's are cheap n cheerful for the more trigger happy player but as you found can go anywhere in slight wind Battery - you got a LIFE 9.9v battery which offers a great in between power balance of 7.4v & 11.1v LiPo's If you are happy get another battery like what you already have If you wish try an AK - still popular but a good airsoft weapon, just coz something is used by many doesn't make it bad

Battery - get 2 medium's say 1600mah & change at lunchtime (7.4v lipo's are perhaps best but I also use older nimah's now n then) The G&G you listed is great deal - has top but no side/ bottom rails as standard - battery up front other versions are rear wired.... Other option is a Raider - wtf they didn't do this a limited edition I'll never know as it has gotta be their #1 seller Short version = 233mm barrel Long version = 360mm barrel aprox only difference is barrel length - suppose you could say Long is better value as you get more gun/barrel for same price but if you play cqb then Short might be better suited perhaps CM18 - 275 barrel falls nicely in between short/long raider but is £150-£155 & comes with 120 mag instead of 300 hi-cap but looks sexy as hell and rails galore like Raider FireHawk - small noisy bad ass that turns heads all the time but not as good as they used to be - battery in stock tube is a pain The above models are all great guns - maybe a Raider is #1 selling starter gun as its cheap, light ABS/Polymer but sturdy rails for all ya bits n bobs - very very popular - common as hell if you like but it is bloody good gun for money If you want to be different and not follow the M4 herd then look at Cyma AK's but I like M4's as they are more ergonomic for me (AK's do have some stuff going for them - bigger mag/longer barrel - they can show up many M4's) Shame G&G never did a Raider with 275-300 barrel and they should of done a limited Raider with 280 barrel or a CM18 metal CM16 Carbine's are very good also - but I do not own one (yet) as I got other SRC & ICS models Battery up front on Carbine's abnd usually come in the long 363mm barrel but they do a lite version with 275/300 barrel but no rails as standard on carbine Phew there is the GC26 one but I think that is not as good as other models I listed - has a plastic flip sight that I think would break easily if dropped - yet the limited edition one is metal receiver but still plastic sight - jeez (front wired btw) If its your first gun and getting 2-toned then either your GC16 or a slightly cheaper Raider with its rails galore They are all built the same - very well inside.... No I don't work for G&G - I wish. But I'll put it this way..... I have bought/owned more G&G's than SRC or ICS M4's (and I bought some crap at first from " BB " sites and seriously regretted wasting my money) If you do buy cheaper crappier guns then that is fine - you will just be an easier target for others to shoot you Think that should cover most G&G models up to about £150, there a few other makes/models but that is my take on the common as muck Ford Transit van workhorses of Airsoft starter guns

Yeah I do get a bit of TOUT on mine from time to time can be a real fussy f*cker to be lined up and true to find a sweet spot (then she behaves very well it seems) not got a gas blowback only ebb R85 or gas non blowback pistols but can't say I've noticed any of them being ultra fussy

Just a week would be perfect to win last week's lottery = MY OWN AIRSOFT ARMY Seriously the maths on ratio does work BUT - for "general" chrono/airsoft setup's eg: this is the maths that in effect gives you the 1.5~1.6 ratio's for the "normal" 0.20's and maybe 0.25's All this bollox can really change when using heavier 0.30's and will be off for say DMR's using .36's The heavier bb's will need a great ratio of 1.8 to 2.0 perhaps to shift the heavier mass of bb correctly Airsoft Ed made a post about this over volume and there are many articles saying heavier bb's need higher volume ratio As it stands the basic quick check does work I reckon - for 0.20's at the chrono and how most stuff is shipped to run with However for those players seeking better performance with slightly heavier bb's the number 12 will not work for them These heavier bb's or higher volumes may need a larger number subtracted - eg: 16 instead of 12mm (42mm - 16 = 26 or 260 barrel with higher volume to push out heavier bb's - but I am guessing this bit atm coz I dunno) Heck I'm no expert mofo but just the numbers adding up or correlating on the 1.5/1.6 ratio and thought I'd inform you chaps and gear check thingy is coz I hate counting tiny gears and all that crap multiply this n that divide by wtf etc... I'm throwing this out there and if anybody looks into it and gives us some feedback we might all be able to arrive at a good all round quick ratio checker for normal bb's AND if we get some feedback adapt change the magic number 12 according to what bb's people use and we may be able to perfect it more for all weights of bb's (might be increase 12mm by 1.5 or 2mm for each .05g increment etc... but am open to any feedback like I said)

I was determined to see if I could post without my usual G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G G&G....... but I can't take it no more - G&G, budget (maybe long & short M4 types so you got spare) or G&G higher end Top Tech yup they may be like the Fords of airsoft but they do hold up well indeed

I'm all for doing stuff properly when it has to be but if there is an easier simpler method that works I'll deffo use that but sod doing an Open University Course just to figure out some stuff in my toy gun (I get bored at work sometimes and kept doing all these maths and wtf - that simple crap works as well)

I'm sure these easy ways to work stuff out is pretty damn accurate & no calculator or degree in mathematical engineering required I have checked them and the gears ratio saves a major headache indeed (unless you love counting up tiny teeth - 21 22 23 23 - no crap start again 1 2 3) Count amount of turns on bevel gear to rotate the sector gear 1 full revolution & multiply by 3 checked this against stock, high speed & high torque gears - works out very well and finally figured out wtf all them 100:200 & 100:300 gears bloody mean as well Then just recently noticed how the port on cylinder kind of works out right without all that Pi r ² crap working out volumes of cylinder & barrel and ratios etc.... So please have a look and if your own gun is running well see if the cylinder port bit makes sense eg: length to port minus 12mm aprox = say 30mm.... multiply that final figure by ten - yeah I think you shouldn't need calculator for that one = 300mm barrel for that port position yes there a few variables eg: Tight Bore & Bore up kits but in general these will only throw out figures on volume ratio by about 1% to 1.5% max on each variable.... I have checked this against a few cylinders that are for certain barrels and it works out very well indeed (it is that simple to me I dunno why peeps bother with old π r ² x cylinder/barrel length) plus some programs for calculating ratios are not easy to understand or don't seem to work out right to me (bit where you enter or measure cylinder length or port is a little unclear to me) plus people saying oh yeah a 3/4 cylinder is for 363 to 410 - wtf ? 3/4 is not exactly very pinpoint accurate and range of nearly 2 inches is also a little wide too ffs I think it is nigh on there with the 12mm figure subtraction is about correct - but the cylinder should have AOE done (Should really do AOE anyway is the general feeling) This adds aprox 4-5mm to say 6mm on cylinder head inside the cylinder itself - never mind go with 12mm for now ffs (O-ring sits aprox 2mm back from piston and is what creates the seal really so just go for 12mm - trust me) anyway here are the pics that should be speak for themselves give us any feedback if you can though chaps..... & cheers for any feedback even if I am talking out of my ar$e one more Just thought if anybody was putting together a gearbox these could come in handy to suss out what gear ratio you putting in there (in case you forgot or lost the packet they came in) and also if you got a cylinder knocking about but unsure what barrel it is supposed to be used with etc.... Yes they ain't 101% accurate but imho these 2 quick tests are bloomin' close without all the maths EDIT - make that figure aprox 15mm NOT 12mm - my very bad 12mm is piston but aprox 3mm further back from piston is center of O-ring which in effect is where the compression is created or rather not created until it passes the end of port - therefore it is the O-ring's start & finish or travel is what we are trying to work out So measure front of cylinder to port and subtract 15mm not 12mm - then multiply by 10 = ideal barrel range chaps EDIT - 2018, after reviewing my crap I revised this to 15mm for 0.20's and say 20mm subtraction for say heavier 0.30's

+1 likey for da motor - I need to get some more too & replace the ferrite ones on some of mine (great rof & improvement all round once deans & fet'd even on lower juice batteries)

Thanks for clearing that up about age & ukara Everybody on here is from all different ranges of Airsoft spectrum, and I am just not much more than a humble noob myself PatrolBase certainly know a LOT more about different guns than I will ever know (though always thought lopping coils off spring is a little tight & noobish as coils won't align correctly flat unless you do some work on the end you cut - ffs just fit a lower spring is the norm) I only have cheapo budget guns so can't comment on those 3 middle range guns - except the 416 you are paying a fair bit for trademarks (there is a WE version at LWA for £250 without tm's and if you get ukara you can get stuff even cheaper at gunfire.pl - BI-8001 is about £150 full metal) though the last gun tell them to downgrade spring as it is 390fps - but they do this for free - needs a few tweaks as hop is meeeh and standard mag is $hit but very cheap alternative - who is gonna know out on field if you got trademarks or not but that is just my cheapskate opinion (many on here have the higher end guns and perhaps one day I may treat myself to a Tokyo Mauri or something that performs great out of the box......) All I say is you probably will go with a couple of guns in the end - a cheap spare aeg and a pistol (gas blow back) plus an extensive loadout & bits n bobs - spare mags, batteries, BFG's - it all adds up if you go the whole mile To each their own but whatever aeg you get you will get taken out by the lower end guns from time to time you be out-ranged by bolt action snipers & they will be out-ranged by other upgraded snipers The gun you buy/use will depend on when you play woodland or cqb - or get a longer barrel M4 & spare shorter cqb one (add shotgun/pistol for some cqb sites - and at these sites range is not such an issue of course so you could get by very cheaply) All I would say its like passing ya driving test, you don't have to buy a BMW first car, many go for something a little less and work their way up But if you can afford it then by all means buy what you feel you want to as it is your money in the end Just letting you know it can really add up/get out of control - even if you stick to lower budget stuff let alone better mid range stuff Dunno what gun you been using/hiring but best advice - especially if purchasing a £200+ gun is see if you can pop along to local shopor at very least try and hold/fire a few shots from some other players guns at your local site first and ask them 20 questions about their guns do they think it was a good buy, reliable, easy/comfortable to use etc... Deffo try out a few guns first if buying higher end stuff to ensure you really do like that gun & can get on with it (amount of people that bought snipers thinking they could do that but found out it is not really for them) Don't rush out and buy any higher priced gun thinking it must be good coz its £xxx - yes often they are but not always

have you played yet ? - £300 for a starter gun are you 18 and aim to get ukara - or you gonna buy a £300 2-tone there are LOADS of guns/shops out there and you could easily get away with some decent starter gun for half that money there are new player guides - read Ian's airsoft on a budget and a few others £300 gun - add at least £100+ onto that for battery/charger basic loadout to gun with your higher mid end gun (probably way way more than £100 if you got such a good looking gun then you yourself wanna look the part too) Land Warrior Airsoft, Fire Support, Zero One, Airsoftworld.net - there's 4 very good places in top 10 airsoft shops in UK but I feel I would perhaps half my gun budget if I was a newcomer to the sport - £150 buys you a pretty decent starter gun but is up to you in the end

deans & mosfet - perhaps a programmable one like Gate BUT wait until it needs an overhaul ffs - it should just work sweet out of the box I got a TT FHawk that is still running fine and has seen lots of regular use if it ain't broke - don't try to fix (or tweak) it

this guy will issue you a ukara license

cheers for that - thought it was a aeg or something else - doh my bad inexperience according to these guys..... http://www.airsoftsniperparts.com/identifyyourrifle.htm ASG Steyr SSG 69 P2 Very much a starter rifle. No dedicated upgrades are available for this rifle. Most owners tend to undertake DIY modifications to get this rifle performing. AVOID! only thing I could find was a 500fps spring at JD Airsoft or something think best leave it as is and just use a cheap run of the mill AEG or other more upgrade/downgrade sniper then (suppose you could cut a few coils off but that is a bit of a bodge and ya lose ya 425 spring maybe an aeg spring might fit/stretch it but seems a bit of trial and error) if its all working out ok - keep it as is then & just use one of ya AEG's maybe Can't work out why a site would state a sniper would have to be same range as AEG's unless there ain't a MED like ya trying to use it in CQB in which case get a shotgun but site saying snipers have to be 350 & not 450 with MED is a little odd to me

m100 or m105 you probably got a m130 or 135 in there atm go with m100 just in case if your site is strict on chrono @ 350 max m100 outputs 328fps aprox - 100metres per second hence the m100 rating I say aprox coz springs vary and not uncommon for them to produce a touch over this plus a gun with great seals/ratio/good hop will be more efficient that one that is worn or crap

blimey no dimensions on that page which is weird for component shop... However a ROUGH guide going by stick 9.6v = 8 in a line "should" equate to an APROX 120mm x 37mm x 18mm size of nunchuck battery side by side HOWEVER it is only a ROUGH GUIDE - YOU need to check as you have battery already (digital calipers are brilliant tool for measuring up if crap will fit btw) It is YOUR responsibility to check if YOUR battery will fit I'm afraid grab a rule/tape measure and see for yourself - don't go by what I say or anybody else as your battery may be a little different and spec/sizes are only ever to be taken as a guide anyway failing all that if you really can't wait to use it - Duct tape is your new best friend yeah it's a bodge but loads of peeps just say wtf and fix all sorts of stuff to their guns actually electricians tape is slightly better as it leaves less sticky residue when removed forget sticking it on with just bit of tape - wrap a whole turn of tape on it and back again (tape to tape or overlapping tape sticks like $hit to a blanket - trust me it does stick well) don't need to go nutz - just tape 2 or 3 rings on there as long as they overlap - say 1.5/2 turns it will hold good

if ya got a great uncle "dude" kind of relative.... Maybe ya mum/dad has a brother that never really grew up & settled down and is up for a laugh he can get ukara & he can then purchase stuff Other than that - ergh no I'm afraid soz but they are the guidelines retailers have to abide by especially when it comes to selling RIF's (non 2-tone guns) 2 tone is fine btw, in fact there is a bit of fun shooting a pro with a cheaper 2 tone gun yup you might not blend in well in woodland sites but that orange could be "disguised" shall we say CQB sites it matters very little what colour ya gun is some places's 2-tone is a little more subtle than others..... some use less vivid blue or less bright green when they 2-tone plus you can - ahem disguise this if you chose to (this is against the VCRA so you/parents would be breaking the law especially with no defense - FACT !!!!!!) I'm pointing the above bit it to clarify that neither me or this forum are saying it will be fine & legal to proceed with it IT DOES STILL BREAK THE LAW if you are are u18 without a defense to paint a gun from Imitation Firearm to a Realistic IF (u18 still can't buy even a 2-tone gun so your parents have to agree to buy & "gift" it you but they can't buy a RIF without defense) Your parents can buy a 2-tone gun but not a RIF - that is just the way it is (think airsoft is still banned in Australia & US players are trying to fight a bill to change all AEG's to orange after recent shootings with airsoft guns) So it may not be ideal but it could be a LOT worse And finally don't think anybody will sell you one either as the seller/retailer would breaking the law and would have their own membership revoked on top of any legal proceedings against them Think that should answer your question

Yup agree with Gun B over volume can produce really weird results or joule creep if the cylinder to barrel volume ratio is out...... The whole ratio and getting correct cylinder/barrel can be a nightmare to work out from scratch and even some apps/programs that are supposed to help can be open to weird misunderstandings as it is the port that dictates the volume of air generated and some "3/4" cylinders are different to other "3/4" In reality to working out volume ratios there is not a great deal of difference in cylinder diameters and using a tbb barrel or std BEFORE anybody jumps in a tbb increases fps etc..... I never said that - I said a tbb hardly changes the maths in working out the ratio or air the tbb however makes the gun perform more efficiently and increase in fps & tighter groupings (but does not change the ratio by hardly anything - aprox 1.5% - which is FA compared to wrong cylinder port used for barrel) But yeah seen first hand the odd effects of say using a 363 cylinder on a 225 barrel - way over volume & low fps on .2's might need to run some tests on that with heavier bb's as it could be prone to joule creep like you said I dunno what the answer is to the chrono - there are numerous ways to cheat or bend the chrono stats (not saying what you said was cheating chrono at all) but think the old set in stone chrono method is perhaps the more basic simple method that most peeps go with but is perhaps not completely perfect or flawless - bit like ukara/vcra I suppose but can't see the sites willing to change or adapt their chrono tests as they just want to run a quick check & get on with it It can be tweaked/cheated by incorrect volume ratio but still look legit or lamer on .2's like you said but shoot higher on heavier bb's - same as hop on/off gives different results so yeah far from perfect but can't see sites wanting to change or deviate from the normal quick chrono Chrono's can be open for question or tweaking/bending the results but a rough chrono is better than a site not using a chrono I guess (even if that does mean some results are not true accurate reflections of muzzle velocity in game with different weight of ammo)