[Epsom CQB Bunker - any good and advice on first CQB]

The dates shown for Wednesdays do align with Wednesdays in 2023

 

I’m going to make my standard statement of full face goggles. But a full seal goggle meets my criteria (as opposed to glasses type eye protection)

Whether or not balaclavas & mesh etc are good enough is personal preference 

 

Lens colour indoors and in the dark should be clear, or potentially amber.

Dark lenses filter out too much

 

Amber/yellow and some shades of orange can enhance your ability to pick things out in dull conditions 

 

[Low power ‘hit’ - bounce or direct hit?]

1 hour ago, Dan Robinson said:

 

 

Second one turned out (on reflection) to be a flag poking out from behind a tree.

 

 

A spare glow stick and a bush can be a fun combination at a night game 

[any decent eyepro]

12 hours ago, hunter511 said:

Fun fact......

 

On receipt of impact you should be changing eyepro. Especially after point blank testing with high FPS kit. They are designed to protect against a single impact and are then considered compromised. 

 

27 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Do you?  It must get pretty expensive binning lenses multiple times a day.

Strictly speaking Hunter is right …… but for the purpose that they are designed for

 

Military/shooting impact eye protection is designed to be the last chance saver from something as simple as dirt, dust, gases and the gravel/splinters etc flying from impact nearby

They are not for direct protection from what is being shot at you

Poor shooting glasses have been as simple as sunglasses - just for the dust etc (a reason for which I have traditionally directed people to look more than ‘shooting glasses’ but to check that there is an impact standard)

 

The advice in the video is in a shooting situation - once that safety equipment has protected you once then accept that it has done its job and replace it

(the same applies to motorcycle helmets - if it’s smashed and ground into the tarmac then you can see it’s had it’s day, but if it has impact but looks ok then the internal structure may have taken it all and should still have the helmet replaced)

 

For airsoft however the intent is to be shot and you can see all the ‘functioning parts’ - the lens

If the lens shows impact, has tiny little cracks etc then it needs to be replaced 

If the lens is to a compliant impact standard then I would not replace just due to a BB impact

 

 

The next consideration is lens age.  I used to religiously replace lenses annually, which continued until I had a vast collection each used occasionally by myself or on loan

I now replace based on condition and/or general age

 

If a lens is removable then extra consideration is to be given on how well fitted it may be - if regularly swapped for colour etc then that may affect how well they fit (or how clumsily the user fits them)

[Beginners need help]

I’d recommend editing your thread title to something like:

 

Newcastle - storage required 

That would help highlight for local players 

 

 

Southampton university society had problems with their new members in similar circumstances that those living in University accommodation were not allowed to hold RIFs.  They worked around it a few ways with society storage & members living off site.

 

An option that may be possible would be to speak to a local site and see if you can get some temporary storage - which depends on specifics as to whether they do have safe storage on site and you would want a lockable case etc  (many sites may be remote and don’t store valuables on site as they can be easy picking for burglaries)

 

If you haven’t done already then search ‘self storage newcastle’ and look for initial discounts and compact space for students etc 

[Hello & a Question!]

5 hours ago, Cannonfodder said:

There's also the grin factor. GBB pistols are way more fun to shoot.

 

Do you find yourself in situations where a pistol is needed often, eg tight spaces where moving with a rifle is difficult? If not then you might find it more beneficial to carry something which will be more useful like a pouch with an extra mag (plus it'll be easier on the wallet). Let's face it, the majority of airsofter's pistols spent 99% of the game sat in a holster.

Absolutely hit the target

 

 

A pistol carried as a sidearm is just another gun in the collection that you carry around for added weight

 

But a pistol in your hand makes you the biggest and baddest on the field - even (especially) if you’re constantly being out gunned - enjoy the disadvantages of a pistol vs everyone else - and seek out the advantages of a light, compact and mobile setup 

[Back again]

6 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

and "walk on" now means pre-book.  

 

1 hour ago, Impulse said:

 

I miss the days when you could turn up, pay your green fee and play BB wars without needing to pre-book in advance.

This is a much discussed topic in paintball over at the last year as well.

 

The origins of ‘walk on’ come from the sense of just turning up to play, and covered those with all their own equipment as opposed to a ‘rental’ player so had ‘few’ needs from the site.  Throughout my playing life ‘walk on’ meant a day or session dedicated to players with their own equipment 

These tended to be run by a keen player and would have a fairly regular crowd.

Marshalling as a matter of safety requires a reasonable ratio of player to marshall to keep an eye on unpredictable rental players - but in practice could turn out to be just one marshall per side - sites ought to be planning their staff for any particular day so would have needed pre bookings for rentals to judge the numbers 

Walkons could be expected to be better behaved and not need constant eyes on them for goggle removal etc so could run a walkon day for any numbers on minimum staff - a few extra players made no difference

 

 

That was in theory fine if the walkon was guaranteed to have someone playing, and if you were allowing bring your own paint - but a nuisance for a site to know what stock they needed and walkon paintballers don’t want to play with basic rental paint - a site would not want to stock up on a higher grade paint which would go ‘off’ if held over time and in uncontrolled conditions 

 

 

Now there are very few paintball sites catering for walkons, and those that do tend to post up every now and again about attendance levels

 

 

One site that we have been involved with must pay a fee to the landowner whenever people are on site - this included me turning up alone or a couple of us site walking or event preparing 

Fine if it was a day with rental bookings, but a prohibitive expense for one or two people to wander or to run a walk on based on the off chance that people might turn up

Then add staff costs - the site should be paying out at least minimum wage to someone for the duration of the day plus an hour or so either side for opening up and shutting down - I am aware that airsoft can often be relying on the voluntary side of player marshals (and that is also how the hey day of walkons happened due to ‘keen’ locals willing to put in the work to make them happen

 

To a player today it does mean that you should plan to play, sort your admin out to book and also turn up - if you’ve paid a deposit and don’t turn up because it’s wet then that is something to compensate the cost but demoralising for staff to open up for nobody or a handful 

………

 

 

Much of the recent conversations in paintball have been to try and rename ‘walkons’ into something more meaningful, but even the sites involved in the conversations still have ‘walkon’ on their websites / social media 

[BB weights...]

1 hour ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

 

I remember an explanation of barrel bores from YouTube that said the BB rattles down a standard bore, floats down a wide bore, and runs along the top of a tight bore barrel.

I have no idea if that's actually true but as in two cases the BB is supposedly contacting the walls of the barrel, I think it means energy loss would be negligible.

 

 

 

1 hour ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

 

The issue i have with that as an explanation is that whilst the bb is in the barrel, the airflow past it will be inverted so the magnus effect would be pulling it down against the bottom of the bore, and that additional airflow around the bb would magnify this effect, ie that it would rattle in a tightbore and run along the bottom of a widebore.

 

I did for a while contemplate the idea of an intentionally curved barrel, putting a slight radius along its length to force the bb to roll along the top surface which would help add a little more spin (although likely still need a hop for adjustability) but more importantly mean that the bb would consistently be riding along one surface.

 

Ultimately though in practical terms the trick is getting a pew consistent enough to even be able to notice these sorts of minutia, and that generally the main boost from a better quality barrel is not in its nominal diameter but in how consistent that diameter is along its length, how straight it is and how good the internal surface finish is.

My science knowledge is misty as it goes back many decades - and also my barrel / projectile experience is with paintballs, which have the added effect of distortion under pressure whilst inside the barrel

 

All the theories mentioned ring true with my recollection & experience, particularly the bent barrel which seems very wrong at first but effective when right (this was the Tippmann flatline) it does exactly as per the theory - drag in the curve causes backspin

 

 

Next we had the Apex tip which is pretty much the same thing as an airsoft hop

 

 

An adjustable rubber element gives backspin, but the tip can also be rotated to change the angle of the backspin

 

(spoiler in the following video but he rated it as ‘it sucks’ - it does give backspin and additional range, but can impact on consistency - I have a team mate who puts in all the practice, he was an apex ninja and as a result could place a ball where he wanted it to go - though this was courtesy of numerous factors with the Apex as just one of them to adjust the spin)

https://youtu.be/Vfgi_AwdTR8

 

Flatlines and Apexes have had their day, some will still use them, but most will go for bore matching a barrel / insert with the ball - and everyone has a different preference that they swear by of bore match, overbore or under bore 

 

Still to add are the consistency of the gun itself to reliably send the ball out of the chamber, and the length of the barrel which must be long enough to allow the ball to accelerate but not so long that any drag/bounce along the barrel is so much that it  loses the energy that was gained in acceleration

Consistency and practice are key - consistency gives you a reliable benchmark and practice let’s you first understand the combined effects  and fine tune each in turn

 

[MOLLE the start of the tacticool]

15 minutes ago, Dan Robinson said:

 

Not sure I get what you mean?

Just a throwaway spin on the name & weave, and perhaps an old joke a few years past it’s best before date 

 

 

(MOLLE needs to be weaved, but weavers not so much)

[MOLLE the start of the tacticool]

14 minutes ago, Dan Robinson said:

Actually learnt a few things in that video - I didn't realise you were supposed to weave the straps on the pouches for one.  Wonder if I will have time tonight before tomorrow to re run it all on my rigs.

This is the common mistake of MOLLE users.

When the first ‘consumer’ MOLLE pouches came out they would have ‘standard’ 25mm webbing straps and would very obviously flap around, if the user didn’t notice at first when fitting then they would soon realise something was wrong as their gear flapped around

 

Thicker multi layer straps from better quality consumer pouches or surplus pouches make it less obvious (and harder to weave) but still with flappy results 

59 minutes ago, Dan Robinson said:

Actually learnt a few things in that video - I didn't realise you were supposed to weave the straps on the pouches for one.  Wonder if I will have time tonight before tomorrow to re run it all on my rigs.

On another tack, have you ever managed to bend a weaver rail sight mounting system between weapon and sight?

[Is this safe to be used?]

Some extra general awareness on air cylinder safety:

 

The HPA1 air safety document was originally produced by the UKPSF (UK paintball representative body), and the version below is as distributed in 2010 by the UKSPC (a collective of event organisers), and has some additional comments of my own

[Is this safe to be used?]

 

Regulator internal maintenance:

Regulator removal:

 

Alternative types & elements:

 

 

Before you fill on site do please let the staff know that you’ve done some maintenance, for a little bit more care and awareness in case of potential issues 

[Is this safe to be used?]

4 hours ago, LazzurusMan said:

Bottle was leaking yesterday, let it empty itself as I could see an oring had shifted in the top of the bottle. Unscrewed it, reseated the oring and then screwed it back on, but only tight enough that I can still unscrew it (it won't go any tighter). As in the whole top part of the bottle came off (in picture).

 

Is this still safe to use? Should I just add some ptfe tape to help seal/tighten it?

I have another bottle, but it's only 26ci and this is 48. I'd prefer to know I have enough air for the whole day this Saturday whilst I try out hpa for the first time.

What o’ring needed reseating, and where was the leak?

 

If from your description the whole regulator has been unscrewed from the cylinder and replaced it should not require any sealant, PTFE etc 

 

Regulator threads are tapered and recessed in a manner that if you manage to unscrew whilst pressurised then the recess allows air to safely escape while the threads still grip. PTFE / sealant /  threadlock can interfere with the taper (and seal it) which keeps pressure as the regulator unthreads and can result in a flying regulator if it manages to unscrew enough without easing pressure

 

Provided there is no damage to threads in the regulator or cylinder and the taper is unblocked it would be safe

 

The regulator should be screwed on hand tight then tightened to a manufacturer specified torque, but without that torque is better hand tight then over tight 

(I’m going to post up a maintenance video but need to just rewatch for content before I commit)

[Special Forces Replica - What is and what is not realistic?]

17 hours ago, Super64 said:

Suppose it makes sense. If the MOD are spending money on giving the Rangers and Marines Gucci kit, it stands to reason the tier 1 assets will already have it.
 

 

 

You’re surely not saying that UKSF will want something because someone else has it and it’s Gucci, rather than based on suitability for a requirement ???

 

If it fits a role, then they would source it

17 hours ago, Super64 said:

. What decent resources are there for current UKSF kit?

Unless the government deems it beneficial the current equipment details for UKSF are not published.

 

General resources such as wiki, bloggers etc will publish what people believe to be held by UKSF, and they may or may not be identified from photos

at ‘incidents’.   But these may or may not be correctly identified such as CTSFO being misidentified as UKSF - unless of course UKSF blending in among CTFSO etc

 

 

[A flashbang with smoke and voice，the power by electricity(3.7v Button cell)]

2 hours ago, Miêu Anh-Nguyễn said:

My sincere apologies here.

 

In fact, your suspicion is quite right. I was wrong
…...
I'll send a video when the power system comes out in a while. I'm sorry

 

There will be factory standard procedures by the time it goes into production, which will be much safer.

No worries 

 

Either way you have captured the imagination of the members here

 

Pyro editions have the other safety standards to apply 

Powered ones also have safety standards - but an explosion isn’t one (unless of course there’s major battery damage etc) 

 

[Low power ‘hit’ - bounce or direct hit?]

@ParHunter

If you feel the hit then take the hit

 

The difference with bounces etc is that if you see it ricochet off the ground/wall/object then you know that it’s an indirect hit which can be disregarded 

[A flashbang with smoke and voice，the power by electricity(3.7v Button cell)]

………

 

Sparks etc are not necessarily a bad thing - filming any of the disposable pyrotechnics under slow motion would expect to reveal sparks 

Actually the ‘right’ way to use a striker smoke is to strike it, hold to one side for the sparking until the smoke kicks in, then throw.

The different chemical mixes of each colour can give variations in the level of sparking 

 

 

The concern comes from how much sparking and burning etc and how it is harnessed / directed 

 

A product used on site in the UK will need to comply with safety regulations 

 

Even compliant pyro can have issues

Those in the know or with a search around my posts will be able to identify my sponsors.

Their scientist contributed to the drafting of EU pyrotechnic standards and they have vigorous quality assurance processes, of which of participated in a few times with the batches as they arrive in the UK - every production batch number has a percentage of cases pulled at random as the container is unloaded. Then every item from those batches is set off (not at the pyro storage, but at a different location). These are tested against a checklist including timing of each stage of burn for each product design - any failure to comply with the Doctors specifications withdraws the full batch run

 

 

……….

 

We experienced a failure in game (and on camera) with a different manufacturer.

The photo sequence and burnt glove were put on display in the factory 

They had become complacent on the production line, and contaminated the  fuse with the main payload.  As soon as he struck the fuse a whole Mk9 exploded in his hand 

 

This was a ‘standards compliant’ factory production piece, let alone a custom DIY design 

[A flashbang with smoke and voice，the power by electricity(3.7v Button cell)]

On 06/08/2023 at 13:59, Tackle said:

All looks great,really good, but agree if those are real flames (they looked very real😳), then unlikely it would be welcome on many sites.

 

On 06/08/2023 at 16:06, Chev Chelios said:

Wow that Flash Bang is awesome.

 

Looks very real but am sure its just the vaper like with these things https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ac8MOmBb6mk&ab_channel=OSReviews 

 

 

10 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

I'm equally as sure that there must be some sort of pyrotechnics in there, I can't see how you'd get that sparking effect from vapour.

I’m still not convinced there isn’t something pyrotechnic in there @Miêu Anh-Nguyễn

 

The vapour effects as noted by @Chev Chelioswould show a flame like effect as the vapour cloud ‘flows’

 

But screen grabbing from the slow motion appears to show sparks and a smoke like grey cloud as well as flames 

It looks like their is a pyrotechnic element plus LED lights that still glow after the bang

 

 

 

 

 

 

[A flashbang with smoke and voice，the power by electricity(3.7v Button cell)]

Am I right from your description that the grenade is releasing fog which is lit up by LED?

 

The explosion videos do look like flames which was worrying to watch.

If they look the same in reality it would still have concerns for sites - if seen without knowing details not would be an immeadiate no, but could still be a worry to a receiving player 

If it’s just a very realistic effect based on lighting up fog then it would be fine

[(Interim) South East/London UKAPU Player Representative]

17 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

shop discounts when?

 

2 hours ago, 1st commando said:

It's nothing to do with shops though

Retailer and site discounts for UKAPU came out about a decade ago 

 

Whether or not they remain or there are others is up to the retailer.

Just ask

 

But do bear in mind that margins are narrow, and dare I say it - technical support / after care are an expense to the retailer without income (unless they have an add on tech support service)

If a retailer can give a strong discount then consider whether they can offer any decent technical support 

(Let alone certified technical support which costs money to obtain - unless they are a big enough customer to the manufacturer gaining free tech courses)

https://www.ukapu.org.uk/articles/membership-benefits/jd-airsoft-members-discount/

[Special Forces Replica - What is and what is not realistic?]

2 hours ago, Impulse said:

 

I went to a CQB site with an SR-25 with a 3-9x50mm scope still attached and was still the one clearing corners while others on my team stood back with their SMGs and short carbines too scared to push forwards.

 

 

At a woodland game, during the day I announced to the team that I was going to have some fun running around with my SLR for the next session.

Then a volunteer was requested & I found myself tasked with clearing and searching the cowboy & Indian western village doing almost CQB waving a full size SLR between all the tight angles 

[Special Forces Replica - What is and what is not realistic?]

Any Special Forces worth their salt will tailor to the role but also be able to use whatever they have.

Whether that’s compact weapons accompanied by flame retardant

suit or vest & jeans, rag tag bunch of cut throats, all the gear with some idea, or just baguette and beret

 

‘Special forces’ means many things. Paras, airborne, commandos were the SF of their day.  The SAS originals were named by intelligence to worry the Germans that the paras were around.  
 

My father was part of the UKs special forces in the Cold War (nuclear capable artillery) but not what would be regarded as UKSF - perfect if you are sat around the woods at a game

 

SF do have choice in how they equip, as a unit and as individuals.

Individuals need to know what they are doing to be able to self equip - passing selection and getting badged is only day 1 of their specialist training

(‘Normal’ soldiers also have a degree of personalisation available to them - depending on getting it past the

shouty man and / or where they are - MTP was adopted by the British Army as some infantry dyed their desert cam)

 

 

…………:

 

 

Eithet build your own concept themed around your choice of SF, or look for photos of specific operations / deployments (taking care to avoid posed recreation photos)

 

 

 

[Helikon-Tex History of Camouflage eBook]

5 minutes ago, Jamsandwich said:

To be fair they did very briefly mention the use of camouflage by hunters prior to WW1 but it was just a sentence.

 

 

I missed that, having skimmed.

 

One sentence each will need to cover most things with the size of it

[Helikon-Tex History of Camouflage eBook]

I’ve subscribed and obtained a copy which I’ll go through later in the week

 

But on first glance I was about to say how poor a history they have shown starting with the French (if we exclude nature) but the document itself doesn’t claim to be a history - just “camouflage in a nutshell”

 

The French have a valid claim to the term ‘camouflage’ as it’s their word.  But camouflaging combatants dates further back to pesky colonials, and far back to ancient times for ships etc long before dazzle patterns

 

No mention of ghillies, only one reference to snipers (without context on their camouflage needs and no reference to the origins of Snipe/sniper which would give a handy circle back to nature)

 

It still looks interesting though 

[Unspoken rules in airsoft?]

7 minutes ago, Cannonfodder said:

Re not having a hand up, I find giving a loud shout of dead man walking helps alot, especially if you're in an area where vegetation is thick or about to walk through a doorway etc 

“Marshall coming through” is a good phrase to call …… if you’re a Marshall 

 

I try to remember this as the first person I shot in game was a Marshall - his own fault for walking through bushes

 

[Unspoken rules in airsoft?]

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

There should be no ‘unwritten rules’

There are so called ‘unwritten rules’ among the regulars of a site.  But if you ask them what they are then they may be surprised about how each player thinks they vary

 

The rules ought to be the rules and the staff should provide them in the brief 

If in doubt then ask - particularly about sneaky knife kills etc and look around for the groups of players who think they do  and do not apply 

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

Like is it generally frowned upon if you get too close to enemy spawn because it is spawn camping?

This depends on the rules 

A player that can’t get out of respawn can tend to get grumpy and frown upon it

Its not spawn camping if you arrive at a spawn area then shoot everyone at it 

It would be spawn camping if you are camping upon the spawn.

If the site layout causes a situation where a player can dominate the spawn point then the site need a rule to allow it, disallow it or to have a point under which the spawners are being destroyed and a form of reset or temporary relocation are required

 

 

 

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

Should you call hits if your own team shot you?

If you’re hit then you’re hit - unless local rules say otherwise (and I would think such a rule is a bad rule unless justified for specific circumstances)

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

Does ricochet count as hits?

A ricochet is not a hit - unless local rules say otherwise (and I would think such a rule is a bad rule unless justified for specific circumstances)

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

How do you execute a knife kill,

 

 

Depends on local rules - either by contact or saying ‘tag’, ‘knife kill’ etc

It needs to be specified if the rule applies and how it applies

 

(eg the original barrel tag required contact with a barrel - so sneaky players carried a barrel in their hand, and a sensible barrel tag rule is to require that you are not stabbing with the tip of a barrel or conducting a negligent discharge with a barrel tip pressed into a player)

 

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

and does it only count if the enemy hasn't noticed you and if you do it ,

They need to notice that you have tagged / knived them. 
But if they notice you and let you walk right up to them then they deserve to be eliminated 

Local rules apply 

 

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

or can you engage a enemy around a corner and try to land a stab as

 

 

Sounds very much like blind firing - you need eyes on, such as stepping around the corner - but of course local rules apply 

 

22 hours ago, Pseudotectonic said:

 

they try to shoot you or is this not allowed?

This brings us back to my two versions

of surrender and tag - the local rules will apply

If I walk up to you but you shoot me first then that would be a legitimate kill

If I ask you to surrender but you shoot me then you have a legitimate kill - I should have made sure that I could enforce it (or i was bluffing) *

If I comply with tag/knife rules eliminating you and you then shoot me then unless it was in the same moment then you have cheated 

 

* at one game I was playing with my pistol, I spent too much time chatting and failed to change my co2. My pistol burped and I was ineffective 

Rather than just walk off I made myself a distraction target running directly at the castle - I made it to the castle alive

Sat for a moment deciding what to do, then stood up, leant over the wall, waved my pistol about and asked “Do you guys want to surrender?”

I captured the front wall of the castle

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

tis a tricky balance.

The balance is very important on the type of game 

 

A group of rentals aren’t going to have a good day out if the regulars appear to be ‘ cheating’ 

But an event is on the other side of the spectrum 

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

on the one hand a well executed sneaky play can be equal parts hilarious and effective, but on the other hand, if we can't trust someone is out when everything about their demeanour is saying so, then that's just gonna invite people to be sure, which whilst fair enough if their hands aren't up is regardless going to illicit salt from those who are genuinely out and just have their hand down.

 

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

yes you could argue that not having a hand up is fair game

 

 

‘Fair game’ is a good description - 

Not ‘fair game’ to rip into players ‘just to be sure’ 

But ‘fair game’ to challenge or shoot one

or a small burst

9 minutes ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

 

 

, but even outside of fatigue if you've got some tricky ground/obstacle to maneuver around/over you might need both hands to balance.

Tricky ground (plus ladders etc) should come with common sense - but clear rules should also apply 

Such as - do not shoot players climbing/descending ladders

I like the idea of ‘dead flags’ - they can keep you hands free for obstacles, long walks etc 

 

A dead flag does not need to be a fancy flag that pulls out of a pouch, but could be a piece of fabric 

Arm band rules can also apply where you remove your armband 

(this won’t work with taped arm bands)

Velcro arm bands can be removed (though a few players will drop them)

I played a couple of events which had paper armbands - part of the scoring system was the number of armbands issued - medics were given a counted number and could therefore heal a set number of players before obtaining more

 

A site that does not have clear surrender/tag/knife rules can be heading to grumpy disputes