Single Sector Wanker Gun

[Fatboy40]

Some other discussions online are leading me down a dark path, in that I quite fancy building (for the fun of it) a "Wanker Gun". So far all of my airsoft toys have been focussed on a snappy semi-auto, overall range, DMR or bolt-action but I fancy building an AEG that's got a stupidly fast full auto (even though I probably won't be able to actually skirmish with it).

 

The weirdness in me though wants it to be an AEG and also be single sector, not a DSG, and a brushed motor (no HPA on this journey baby). A strong springed mid-cap magazine would also be used, I've a few PTS EPM1's, to feed it.

 

Has anyone else gone down this route and do you have any advice? (other than don't f**king do it). If you've dabbled what sort of RPS did you achieve? (as an aside I want to do this with a Double Eagle M900 AEG, so hopefully I can find a cheap used one).

[Skara]

Doable, but I found that past a certain threshold (say 30 rps) it's much more convenient to build a DSG instead.

 

I managed, by mistake, 36/37 RPS on a single sector gear running off 12:1s and 36k warhead but I had to shortstroke the sector by 4 teeth to achieve proper timing.. You will need a very good tappet plate and spring because the poor thing will be the most stressed component as it has to reciprocate at ludicrous speeds almost 40 times a second.

[agors]

are you strict to brushed? 

if not a 50k brushless 11.1 and 18.1 will bring you straight to 40rps.

 

my opt.1 high speed (53k) did 42rps on 18:1 ss-4. no timing issue or any other headache. 

a 40k brushless will give you 33rps with 18.1 

 

obviously it's easier to get high rps with a dsg but with brushless motors anything is possible today

[Rogerborg]

Mags are key. None of mine will feed fast enough to satisfy stock JG G36 gears and ~1.1J spring, stone-age brushed Big Dragon M140, 11.1V 1.4Ah 30C, and slightly chonkier wiring with Perun AB++.  I don't even know what rps it's running at because... well, the mags won't keep up.  5 round burst tends to get off 3 or 4 BBs.  Once you start down the path of wankergunnery, you're going to keep running into one limit after another, so just dive in and solve the problems as you find them.

[John_W]

I knew a guy whose upgraded Thompson had a legendary rate of fire, but was problematical because the magazine springs couldn't feed fast enough to keep up.

The days when you just put a 9.6v and a 1j spring in a marui and ran it till the gearbox exploded...

[Cannonfodder]

2 hours ago, John_W said:

I knew a guy whose upgraded Thompson had a legendary rate of fire, but was problematical because the magazine springs couldn't feed fast enough to keep up.

The days when you just put a 9.6v and a 1j spring in a marui and ran it till the gearbox exploded...

*Insert captain America I get that reference meme here*

 

The Thompson of doom

Edited April 16 by Cannonfodder

[mirinjawbro]

3 hours ago, John_W said:

I knew a guy whose upgraded Thompson had a legendary rate of fire, but was problematical because the magazine springs couldn't feed fast enough to keep up.

The days when you just put a 9.6v and a 1j spring in a marui and ran it till the gearbox exploded...

i miss those days. none of this mosfet. 50+ m4 variants and other stuff

[Cannonfodder]

4 minutes ago, mirinjawbro said:

i miss those days. none of this mosfet. 50+ m4 variants and other stuff

And everyone was wearing either DPM,l⁰ US M81 woodland camo or flecktarn if you wanted something a little fancy

Edited April 16 by Cannonfodder

[Chev Chelios]

27 minutes ago, Cannonfodder said:

And everyone was wearing either DPM,l⁰ US M81 woodland camo or flecktarn if you wanted something a little fancy

 

CRYE Gen 1s with the massive shit flap zip. Used to play a game of how many you could unzip with out being noticed in the briefing. :). Could go through 20k BBs running a STAR plastic M249 and only spend £20

[Leo Greer]

I have done it.

 

Here in the land of cowboys and Indians, we have no rules, and no limits to our wankery

 

Here’s Leo’s simple recipe for making the refs come over and stare whenever you test fire on the range…

 

Traditional wisdom is that fast motors and fast gears are not friends. TRADITION LIED: Tienly makes the best brushed motors on the market, if not the cheapest, followed by Star Wei. Quality build and hand-wound armatures become increasingly important if you want your build to be functional in game without the motor grip turning into one of Gusteau’s Microwaveable Plasma Ultrabirritos.

 

Oh yeah, and shredding your brushes while it’s at it.

 

If built well, a 40K brushed motor can get you to 40RPS when paired with 13:1 gears and an 11.1v.

 

Gears: any solid gear set will work for a while, as long as the bevel meshes well with your pinion of choice. To actually get high speed out of this thing without brute forcing it like some sort of wanker ape, we need to push up the efficiency numbers. To hit 40, you need 80% efficiency. 85% gets you to 43. And so on. SHS/rocket work alright. Siegetek are the best (but seemingly nonexistent in the UK). Solink have a good rep with folks that I trust, and are readily available, so I would go with those.

 

Bearings. You can go bushings if you like with no issue, but real speed demons shell out for J-caged bearings, which can handle the increased stress of what we’re about to do to them. Be wary though, as many of these suckers are tall, and can interfere with selector activities. The “shortest” on the market are 2.5mm thick.

 

Spring. To avoid PME, we need to punch that piston fast and forcefully. PDI makes the best, but Guarder comes in a close second. I would suggest buying at least equivalent of an M130 and M140.

 

And to bleed off that extra spring power we…

 

Shortstroke?

 

No. Not before we have to. Short stroking damages both our tappet timing and our pressure spike, which I’ll discuss in a second, so we avoid it if we can.

 

Instead we shorten our barrel. As any tech knows, all the spring strength in the world means nothing if it all blows out your o-rings and packing seal. This is the same for BB acceleration time. If there is no time to accelerate, it matters not what the ultimate velocity could have been. I would aim for 100-150mm and increase if you can. Cheap stock barrels from various manufacturers can be used to great effect in testing before any expensive parts are purchased.

 

Did you know that most G&G ARP9s come with the equivalent of an M130 installed? Short barrel, fast cycle speed, strong spring.

 

To make sure we can feed the frenzy we need a good stiff tappet and strong spring. This isn’t too complicated. Any stock or upgrade tappet that accomplishes the mechanical demand will do just fine. Guarder makes a good one. King arms does as well. Lube the rails and make sure it slides easily.

 

O-ring drag is real. Double o-rings were invented to solve a design/manufacturing tolerance issue, not a design/airseal issue. Nothing wrong with it if it works for you… but Arcturus, Krytac, and I believe Guarder and Lonex make great single o-ring nozzles that may very well provide better fitment with your nozzle tube and less drag while you’re at it.

 

Pick a strong, light piston with a POM head and ditch those bearings on the PH itself. They’re worthless. You need a total weight of about 15gs to be successful here. The easiest way is to use an SHS blue with the big holes and any decent POM head. Lonex, Gate, etc, etc.

 

You can also remove material from any good quality one. Lonex Red FMRs and Arcturus poly pistons are prime for this.

 

As long as the cylinder and cylinder head seal and don’t have any serious tolerance issues with your other parts, they’ll do just fine. You can easily polish stock brass cylinders to near mirrors of glassy perfection.

 

But if you need to buy one… the Guarder Chromes are nice.

 

As long as you have at least half the cylinder the porting doesn’t matter in the slightest for this. Don’t listen to Negative Airsoft, he does not understand the physics of ported cylinders; the port is not to let air into the cylinder, it’s to allow piston preacceleration.

 

Which brings me back to why we don’t short stroke. When the piston accelerates before sealing with the cylinder, it creates a beautiful little pressure spike that effectively gives you a lot more oomph for less. Ask any HPA user if raising the pressure on their reg changes anything and you’ll understand. Less useful knowledge in this specific case, but great for general teching.

 

Your shimming must be the shimming of Gilgamech and BBkidnu, the great shimmers of yore. We Americans look to George Shimmington.

 

And to power this all, you need a good battery pack. Let’s face it, the vast majority of battery makers and sellers are liars. The packs aren’t IR matched, the capacity and discharge rating are blatant untruths, and the assembly quality is poor.
 

Running your packs at above capacity KILLS YOUR PACKS. If you plug in a beefier battery and your gun gets faster, you’re doing this.

 

You have two ways to combat this.

 

#1

Overcompensate. Recognize the lies, and go so far above and beyond that even the lies place you easily in the green. Turnigy NanoTechs are good candidates.

 

#2

Buy an actually good pack. Kypom are the best I know of. Gens Ace comes second. On the American Airsoft forums we happen to have a guy with a lot of mechanical engineering experience who can actually test cell IR ratings, true capacity, and discharge rates. He’s tested quite a few, and Kypom are consistently closest to advertised.

 

 

Hopefully some of this is helpful to you!

 

tech on

-Leo

[Fatboy40]

So, progress is being made.

 

I bought a used DE M904E, which was in a worse state than I'd assumed, but it had its stock gears replaced with 13:1 SHS ones (short stroked by two teeth, I'd rather they had been as is) so there's one less thing to buy. I'd spent far more than I wanted to, but the inside of the gearbox was a bit of a shit show, and remaining parts will arrive soon for me to crack on and hopefully get it running ready for the Red Alert Battlesim Lite next weekend.

 

My attempts with painting / rattle cans continues...

 

[Colin Allen]

On 16/04/2025 at 13:45, Cannonfodder said:

And everyone was wearing either DPM,l⁰ US M81 woodland camo or flecktarn if you wanted something a little fancy

Some of us still wear flecktarn and DPM.

[Rogerborg]

17 hours ago, Colin Allen said:

Some of us still wear flecktarn and DPM.

 

Flecktarn and DPM? 🤔

 

[Colin Allen]

4 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Flecktarn and DPM? 🤔

 

Yep!  A Harlequin, just like my Finnish kit.

[Rogerborg]

17 minutes ago, Colin Allen said:

just like my Finnish kit.

 

Mine always seem to be a work in progress.

[Fatboy40]

5 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

 

One to add to the book of challenging wanks 🍆