Rarity over Need/Practicality.

[Asomodai]

Hello all. 

 

I have sort of trapped myself in a 1st world dilemma and felt the need to come to you guys to help me get around the process going in my head!

In the past I have always bought things that are rare over things that are more practical or that I needed more. This is because I do like the weird and wonderful, which are either not going to be made anymore or on very limited production cycles.

 

After realising that a gas rifle is not for me, I sold my Umarex Tavor GBB and am now contemplating my next choices of which I have many! It is rare that I get a lump sum of money such as this to spend on a rifle, I generally buy cheap and upgrade later. 

 

• Silverback SRS Sniper Rifle. 
• <S>A&K M60 MK43 (LMG)</S>
• Real Sword Type 97/97b
• <S>S&T Tavor Pro</S>
• <S>Magpul PDR-C</S>
• G&G F2000 hunter scope with ETU
• AA12 Electric Shotty
• <S>Upgrade parts for current in-upgraded rifles.</S> 
• Clothes, Tactical gear, Camera setup.

 

Recently I have gotten into bolt action rifles, I have an almost fully upgraded Well MB09 which I am having a lot of fun with, I haven't been able to use it much but I do intend to use the play style intended more often. 

 

So I have felt that an SRS would be a great rifle to go for, even though my Well will probably out perform it initially. The 16" is small and effective. I would consider this a practical choice as I only have one bolty which some of the proprietary parts are of dubious quality. However, the SRS is a current production rifle, and unlikely to be discontinued anytime soon. So there is no urgency to purchase it, though whether I will have the ability at a later date is questionable!

 

The A&K M60, is a practical/need choice as I do not have a true LMG (The MG36 does not count). Yes its one of the worst rated LMGs, but I can get them for 230 euros brand new, which would leave me plenty left over for upgrades or even buying the F2000. 

 

The Real Sword Type 97 is the bees knees in bullpups. You guys know me and bullpups, this would be the ultimate for someone like myself, though I have no great like for the design. These are no longer really made, or rather there are pretty much no sellers worldwide anymore, only two places in Europe sell them and at a somewhat inflated price. But externally and internally, the most solid bullpup. However I have loads of AEGS already! So this is the rarity option, which I may not find again. 

 

S&T Tavor Pro. Hilariously I sold one that I never used so I could buy the GBBr variant. There is no decent Tavor, but this one can be upgraded with difficulty and I really DO like the platform and looks. I haven't much more to say about this, its a cheap option as well so I could get another choice on top of buying this. Its not rare but the production cycles are very unpredictable. 

 

Magpul PDR-C. Hard to get hold of and due to licensing will never really be made again. I have found two new ones still for sale in the UK. I already have the small bullpup platform covered twice over, but there is something about this that I cant shake out of my head. Not keen on the dual stage trigger and no semi fire selector though. Definitely an indulgent purchase, though if I purchased this I will have money left over. 

 

The G&G F2000 with ETU has only recently been released, but has not sold well and not many produced in the first place, this is likely going to be a Rarity choice. When I first started airsoft, THIS was the rifle I wanted, but I couldn't find one with the hunter scope, since then I picked up the CYMA one which does not have the scope. It is cheap enough though, that I would have money left over for upgrades. 

 

AA12 Shotty. This would be more of an indulgent choice. I have no true need for an electric shotgun, but it looks bloody hilarious to use. But I do fear it will make my KSG a bit redundant. For me this is the "Fun" choice, and isn't airsoft all about that?

 

Upgrade parts for current unupgraded rifles. I have a G36 that needs an overhaul, along with three other rifles that needs the gearboxes opening up to replace compression parts, include the labour cost and this could turn quite expensive, but at least I will get the most of what I have already. This is the sensible practical choice. 

 

Clothes Tactical gear, Camera setup. I still have just one set of clothes that I use, French surplus stuff, it would be practical to get something else, maybe tan for Milsim and dark for night and indoors. I have also been fiddling with an idea of using a camera for my site reviews. So definitely a practical/need choice. 

 

So would you guys go for Rarity or something more practical/needed? Would you regret not going for the rare item?

 

[Rogerborg]

7 minutes ago, Asomodai said:

For me this is the "Fun" choice, and isn't airsoft all about that?

 

We could have stopped reading there if you'd put that first.

 

AA12 would be my choice out of that lot, purely for the lulz.

[Asomodai]

3 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

We could have stopped reading there if you'd put that first.

 

AA12 would be my choice out of that lot, purely for the lulz.

 

It was a rhetorical question as we ALL know its 90% fashion and 10% fun. To be honest I should probably include the ICS MGL in this list as that looks hella-fun! 

[ImTriggerHappy]

2 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

We could have stopped reading there if you'd put that first.

 

AA12 would be my choice out of that lot, purely for the lulz.

Disagree because once you get past the hype you realise the AA12 is just an aeg that fires 3 bbs at once and not in any way that is great.

 

It is not particularly nice in the hand, low powered, low end of average on the accuracy and the trigger response is meh. 

 

Real world AA12s are fun looking bits of kit but an airsoft one is just what is the point.  Severe rose tinted glasses from users and people who think it will in some way recreate the happy times of a real one. The subjective opinion is it's just meh.

[Asomodai]

Have added PDR-C option as that's always in the back of my mind. 

 

2 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Disagree because once you get past the hype you realise the AA12 is just an aeg that fires 3 bbs at once and not in any way that is great.

 

It is not particularly nice in the hand, low powered, low end of average on the accuracy and the trigger response is meh. 

 

Real world AA12s are fun looking bits of kit but an airsoft one is just what is the point.  Severe rose tinted glasses from users and people who think it will in some way recreate the happy times of a real one. The subjective opinion is it's just meh.

 

Luckily for me I have never seen a real one in a movie or anything else, just going by what I have seen airsoft wise. The simple pleasures of firing three BB's at a time on full auto is certainly something. My only problem is the reported reliability issues. 

 

What do you think about the rarity vs needs? 

[ImTriggerHappy]

3 minutes ago, Asomodai said:

Have added PDR-C option as that's always in the back of my mind. 

 

 

Luckily for me I have never seen a real one in a movie or anything else, just going by what I have seen airsoft wise. The simple pleasures of firing three BB's at a time on full auto is certainly something. My only problem is the reported reliability issues. 

 

What do you think about the rarity vs needs? 

Rarity wins as better to be different.

[Musica]

2 minutes ago, Asomodai said:

What do you think about the rarity vs needs? 

 

I think a lot of people prefer to be a snowflake than buy something tested and proven in the hope they get in "early" on the next gold standard before it's well know. I like to know what I'm getting and just because bbs leave the barrel doesn't satisfy my criteria for acceptable performance. 

 

I don't have a problem with people wanting niche kit and guns but too many beginners want stuff for the way it looks instead of the way it performs. If you have a few reliable weapons then go nuts and enjoy the random ones knowing if doesn't perform equal to other peoples or breaks down you have something to fall back on that will compete and not leave you at a disadvantage. I think it's negative for the hobby as if people are getting out gunned as new players they might lose interest and quit. 

 

I can actually see the advantage of a 3 shot shotgun as often people double and mostly triple tap to make sure the guy "feels" the hit.  The SRS is a pretty popular choice as well and if you like that play style I would be torn between that and the AA12.

[Guest DrAlexanderTobacco]

18 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Disagree because once you get past the hype you realise the AA12 is just an aeg that fires 3 bbs at once and not in any way that is great.

 

It is not particularly nice in the hand, low powered, low end of average on the accuracy and the trigger response is meh. 

 

Real world AA12s are fun looking bits of kit but an airsoft one is just what is the point.  Severe rose tinted glasses from users and people who think it will in some way recreate the happy times of a real one. The subjective opinion is it's just meh.

Having played with someone who owns two and brought them out for every game in the last 12 months, I strongly disagree with this - They can be upgraded fairly nicely, tapped for HPA etc if you want to get over the standard TM design decisions like low FPS, weird hop orientation and so on. Drum mag makes suppression fairly effective considering the stock hop spray. The only thing I'd say I really don't like about it is the weight - weight + the odd shape means it's awkward to carry around.

[Resistor170]

Rarity. I would go for the type 97 without much thought needed. But that is just my opinion, I like bulpups and really like this one, both in looks and origin. Its not something you'll see about much either. 

 

But you say you don't particularly like the look of it, so maybe it's best you don't get it...? 

[Asomodai]

10 minutes ago, Musica said:

 

I think a lot of people prefer to be a snowflake than buy something tested and proven in the hope they get in "early" on the next gold standard before it's well know. I like to know what I'm getting and just because bbs leave the barrel doesn't satisfy my criteria for acceptable performance. 

 

I don't have a problem with people wanting niche kit and guns but too many beginners want stuff for the way it looks instead of the way it performs. If you have a few reliable weapons then go nuts and enjoy the random ones knowing if doesn't perform equal to other peoples or breaks down you have something to fall back on that will compete and not leave you at a disadvantage. I think it's negative for the hobby as if people are getting out gunned as new players they might lose interest and quit. 

 

I can actually see the advantage of a 3 shot shotgun as often people double and mostly triple tap to make sure the guy "feels" the hit.  The SRS is a pretty popular choice as well and if you like that play style I would be torn between that and the AA12.

 

I agree to a point. M4's are ubiquitous because at a goldilocks period of Airsoft, it was the popular RS rifle of the time, so it became the defacto airsoft rifle. I would encourage people to buy decent oddball rifles on the chance more upgrade parts or other odd rifles to be designed and produced. 

 

In my personal dilemma I have so many oddball rifles that one failing doesn't matter as I have plenty of others, so do I really need something reliable anyway? 

7 minutes ago, Resistor170 said:

Rarity. I would go for the type 97 without much thought needed. But that is just my opinion, I like bulpups and really like this one, both in looks and origin. Its not something you'll see about much either. 

 

But you say you don't particularly like the look of it, so maybe it's best you don't get it...? 

 

What sells the Type 97 for me is the external and internal quality from stock. I can hand on heart say that none of my rifles bar the ICS L85 are particularly robust on the externals front. I have held a 97B and thought it was the bees knees. It's not that I hate the externals, its more that I already have something that looks like a bugle (FAMAS). 

 

 

Have added S&T Tavor Pro to the list. 

[Resistor170]

1 minute ago, Asomodai said:

 

I agree to a point. M4's are ubiquitous because at a goldilocks period of Airsoft, it was the popular RS rifle of the time, so many people bought them at the time that it became the defacto rifle. I would encourage people to buy decent oddball rifles on the chance more upgrade parts or other odd rifles to be designed and produced. 

 

In my personal dilemma I have so many oddball rifles that one failing doesn't matter as I have plenty of others, so do I really need something reliable anyway? 

Agree here. If it was my first gun I made sure it was a solid choice for use. I have a couple now so if I like a gun then I would by an airsoft variant... Unless it really is useless

[Wo1f]

Buy an MWS, return here to thank me 😂. 

 

Realsword’s are nice. I’ve got an SVD from them and the thing is a tank. From my understanding they use RS bodies and cram gearbox’s into them. 

[Asomodai]

2 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

Buy an MWS, return here to thank me 😂. 

 

Realsword’s are nice. I’ve got an SVD from them and the thing is a tank. From my understanding they use RS bodies and cram gearbox’s into them. 

 

Come back to me when they make a bullpup MWS

 

That is true, same factory etc. The only weaknesses are the gearbox casing and motor cage, though I believe that only happens on higher FPS countries then ours. 

[Resistor170]

6 minutes ago, Asomodai said:

What sells the Type 97 for me is the external and internal quality from stock. I can hand on heart say that none of my rifles bar the ICS L85 are particularly robust on the externals front. I have held a 97B and thought it was the bees knees. It's not that I hate the externals, its more that I already have something that looks like a bugle (FAMAS). 

Now that has just buried my choice under 100m of concrete never to change again. I think the gun is different enough to the famas, for me anyway. Especially the B. If it's a top quality build too then....shame I wont have the money for a good while

[Asomodai]

1 minute ago, Resistor170 said:

Now that has just buried my choice under 100m of concrete never to change again. I think the gun is different enough to the famas, for me anyway. Especially the B. If it's a top quality build too then....shame I wont have the money for a good while

No way would I want to skirmish it all day though, bloody heavy! At least it's a bullpup so its distributed reasonably well. 

[ImTriggerHappy]

32 minutes ago, DrAlexanderTobacco said:

Having played with someone who owns two and brought them out for every game in the last 12 months, I strongly disagree with this - They can be upgraded fairly nicely, tapped for HPA etc if you want to get over the standard TM design decisions like low FPS, weird hop orientation and so on. Drum mag makes suppression fairly effective considering the stock hop spray. The only thing I'd say I really don't like about it is the weight - weight + the odd shape means it's awkward to carry around.

Hpa tap an electric shotgun?

[Guest DrAlexanderTobacco]

Just now, ImTriggerHappy said:

Hpa tap an electric shotgun?

HPA Tap is the wrong term to use I suppose, I meant to convert it to HPA - can definitely be done:

 

 

 

[ImTriggerHappy]

1 minute ago, DrAlexanderTobacco said:

HPA Tap is the wrong term to use I suppose, I meant to convert it to HPA - can definitely be done:

 

 

 

I suppose you could with some serious tech work shoe horn a  gas tri shot inside the aa12 case but that begs the question why would you?

 

The AA12 is a dick to work on and any mods are bespoke so will stand by the fact it is a shit gun, as any gun can be made good so your point is moot. Still horrible to hold and use no matter what you do to it.

 

For a gun to be fun it still has to be nice to use as well as different so type 97b wins all the way.

[Adolf Hamster]

it's a balance, tbh this is a hobby and it should be about what you want, if you want to have rare kit and be different on the field then more power to you.

 

i like a bit of both, i like my oddball guns but at the same time i have a minimum standard for performance. only gun i've sold was a WE luger because despite being odd and cool it's performance was so horrificially bad i couldn't use it. luckily their makarov doesn't suffer such issues.

 

at the end of the day there's a certain amount of impracticality you're prepared to accept for doing it differently, and that's your decision to make.

[Guest DrAlexanderTobacco]

14 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

 

The AA12 is a dick to work on and any mods are bespoke so will stand by the fact it is a shit gun, as any gun can be made good so your point is moot. Still horrible to hold and use no matter what you do to it.

 

Horrible to hold? Yes

 

Horrible to use? No, as I've stated and you've admitted - any gun can be made good!

 

E: But for real I second the Type 97b - such a headturner and considering you're predisposed to bullpups, makes sense. @Asomodai

[ImTriggerHappy]

9 minutes ago, DrAlexanderTobacco said:

Horrible to hold? Yes

 

Horrible to use? No, as I've stated and you've admitted - any gun can be made good!

Horrible to hold is horrible to use.

 

Performing good is not enough to make a good gun, ergonomics and comfort are hugely important. 

[Guest DrAlexanderTobacco]

1 minute ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Horrible to hold is horrible to use.

 

Performing good is not enough to make a good gun, ergonimcs and comfort are hugely important. 

I think it's bearable depending on what you're doing in the skirmish - the big thing I struggle with is just doing stuff like getting over a wall with one, passing it through a window to a mate etc owing to how funky the CoG is. Running around with it is kinda fine, weight notwithstanding.

 

Circling back to Asomodai's requirements I think he wouldn't get on with it purely down to the weight/form factor - far removed from a bullpup!

[Guest]

Personally, I hate bullpups with a passion (ha ha ooops), the AA12, fun or not, is massively heavy for an AEG, even more so when you consider you need three times as much ammo as a normal AEG.

 

I cut the pilon sights off mine, added a long rail, then got bored and sold it (as usual).

 

I would recommend it, if you must have similar, buy an SGR-12, at least it’s nice to hold

[Musica]

1 hour ago, Asomodai said:

 

I agree to a point. M4's are ubiquitous because at a goldilocks period of Airsoft, it was the popular RS rifle of the time, so it became the defacto airsoft rifle. I would encourage people to buy decent oddball rifles on the chance more upgrade parts or other odd rifles to be designed and produced. 

 

In my personal dilemma I have so many oddball rifles that one failing doesn't matter as I have plenty of others, so do I really need something reliable anyway? 

 

 

M4s aren't the only decent offering but at the entry level price point for beginners since they have had so many designs and so many of them built the price point of them has come down so price for performance is pretty good. Where as say the Krytac Vector and Umarex MP7 AEG are both new designs which took more R&D the cost shows (also the license cost for the real trades). 

 

The problem with oddball rifles that are made well people consider them to be "propitiatory" because they don't use a standard components in their m4s.  The evo for example has a propitiatory spring guide and hopup. 

 

I get you are not a beginner and I envy your situation of getting to decide what random selection you want. Interestingly enough the first gun on my list for a random because I want it gun is a bullpup GBB P90.

 

If you pick up one of the lesser known options a good review on its OOB performance does wonders for encouraging sales. 

[ImTriggerHappy]

14 minutes ago, Musica said:

 

M4s aren't the only decent offering but at the entry level price point for beginners since they have had so many designs and so many of them built the price point of them has come down so price for performance is pretty good. Where as say the Krytac Vector and Umarex MP7 AEG are both new designs which took more R&D the cost shows (also the license cost for the real trades). 

 

The problem with oddball rifles that are made well people consider them to be "propitiatory" because they don't use a standard components in their m4s.  The evo for example has a propitiatory spring guide and hopup. 

 

I get you are not a beginner and I envy your situation of getting to decide what random selection you want. Interestingly enough the first gun on my list for a random because I want it gun is a bullpup GBB P90.

 

If you pick up one of the lesser known options a good review on its OOB performance does wonders for encouraging sales. 

How many guns have you owned and worked on?