M4 Future Build Plan - Looking For A Review.

[J4ck]

Good Evening!

 

After researching online I think I have a plan of action to upgrade my airsoft gun, I'm still new to teching so I wanted an expert view on my build approach and any tips etc!

 

I have an Ares Amoeba 009 and I'm mainly looking for snappy trigger response as I mainly play in single fire however I'd still like to hit the low to mid 20's.

I was planning on gradually buying these parts rather than buying them all in one go, mainly so I don't get overwhelmed.

My fields FPS limit is 350.

 

Currently running:

-Stock Gearbox and Motor(Shimmed), -11.1v lipos, 15-25c, 1300mah, -M100 spring, Stock Electronic Trigger + Mosfet.

 

Planned Upgrades (In Order)

-16tpa Motor (Shs High Torque)

-All Air Seal Parts (Still stock so may aswell while I'm there)

-Gate Titan Mosfet

-16:1 or 13:1 Gear Ratio

 

My main questions are; 1) Will this build achieve my goals? 2) Will I have to modify any thing ? 3) Will My FPS change drastically?

 

I haven't bought anything yet so if you think there's a better build all together I'm all ears. 

 

Edited March 13, 2023 by J4ck
16:1 typo

[Speedbird_666]

9 hours ago, J4ck said:

 

-Gate Titan Mosfet

 

 

Nope - not happening on an Ares Amoeba unless you plan to replace the entire gearbox.

 

The stock Ares ECFS gearbox is not even close to 'TM spec' because of the electronic gubbins inside.

 

This guy stripped out the Ares gearbox and replaced it with a G&G unit.

 

 

But on the other hand - if you plan to essentially replace everything anyway - it might be better to build up a new gearbox from scratch. At least then you can keep the stock Ares Gearbox in the gun until you are happy with the new Gearbox build before swapping over.

 

There are (currently) some G&G gearbox shells in the classifieds at a very reasonable price.

 

 

[Dan Robinson]

Sorry for the hijack, but quick question... 

 

Would one of those ics boxes fit the boy's L85?  And would the g&g boxes other m4 brands? 

[HuttArmouries]

2 minutes ago, Dan Robinson said:

Sorry for the hijack, but quick question... 

 

Would one of those ics boxes fit the boy's L85?  And would the g&g boxes other m4 brands? T

The g&g gearboxes will fit other m4s but those ics gearboxes are ics m4 specific and the l85 uses a proprietary gearbox

Edited March 14, 2023 by HuttArmouries

[Rogerborg]

10 hours ago, J4ck said:

16tpa Motor (Shs High Torque)

 

That's for pulling a heavier spring.  At UK AEG power levels, you won't need that, so I'd go high speed instead. I haven't used SHS stuff, I chisel every penny and use Big Dragon M140s.

 

 

10 hours ago, J4ck said:

-Gate Titan Mosfet

 

Optical is great if you want to set up a short pull trigger, but you've got gearbox issues as above. A Perun AB++ living outside the gearbox will give you everything else including pre-cock, burst modes and ROF limiting if you overcook it.

[Davegolf]

Best new setup ive implemented a few times with great success is;

11.1v Warhead standard speed or other quality brushed 25k motor with stock gears (18:1) and helical bevel.

Just makes the sweetest sounding action with zero stress.

Will put out 19RPS on an M110 so is the goldilocks speed if you ask me

 

Obv this doesnt help the OP with his gearbox of choice currently, but hopefully good info for what guts to use.

And obv you will want a suitable mosfet at least or Perun Hybrid/Gate Titan etc to optimise.

 

[Speedbird_666]

2 hours ago, Rogerborg said:

 

That's for pulling a heavier spring.  At UK AEG power levels, you won't need that, so I'd go high speed instead. I haven't used SHS stuff, I chisel every penny and use Big Dragon M140s.

 

'Hi Torque' for SHS motors is a bit of a misnomer - I would rate it more of a balance between torque and speed at 16TPA. I used them in 7.4v setups with standard 18:1 ratio gears (which gives around 16rps) as a basic drop-in upgrade for 'out of the box' stock guns without mosfets. Worked well enough for quite some years for me.

 

1 hour ago, Davegolf said:

Will put out 19RPS on an M110 so is the goldilocks speed if you ask me

 

When I become ruler of the (airsoft) world - all guns will be capped at 20RPS.

 

[Krisz]

19 hours ago, J4ck said:

Good Evening!

 

After researching online I think I have a plan of action to upgrade my airsoft gun, I'm still new to teching so I wanted an expert view on my build approach and any tips etc!

 

I have an Ares Amoeba 009 and I'm mainly looking for snappy trigger response as I mainly play in single fire however I'd still like to hit the low to mid 20's.

I was planning on gradually buying these parts rather than buying them all in one go, mainly so I don't get overwhelmed.

My fields FPS limit is 350.

 

Currently running:

-Stock Gearbox and Motor(Shimmed), -11.1v lipos, 15-25c, 1300mah, -M100 spring, Stock Electronic Trigger + Mosfet.

 

Planned Upgrades (In Order)

-16tpa Motor (Shs High Torque)

-All Air Seal Parts (Still stock so may aswell while I'm there)

-Gate Titan Mosfet

-16:1 or 13:1 Gear Ratio

 

My main questions are; 1) Will this build achieve my goals? 2) Will I have to modify any thing ? 3) Will My FPS change drastically?

 

I haven't bought anything yet so if you think there's a better build all together I'm all ears. 

 

 

I don't call myself expert but my trigger response build is always 13:1 gears and a  22 tpa motor. And a mosfet which is capable of precocking. For indoor I don't think that you need anything else.

 

Your fps shouldn't change drastically but if you change compression parts your fps should be more consistent between shots. If you've got a good air seal already I wouldn't spend extra money on it.

 

You could change inner barrel and bucking + nub but again for that short distance stock internals do the same job.

 

If you're already in your GB you could correct AoE and grease and lube everything, too.

Edited March 14, 2023 by Krisz

[Davegolf]

Indeed, 7.4v 13:1 with 22TPA was my go to setup on 20+ builds, but the brushless motors allow the same response on a 18:1 setup when run on 11.1, run waaaay cooler, batteries last so much longer, and the gearbox on the whole is quieter owing to less stress - eg lower gear ratio / torque through gears.

 

@J4ck you could run any of the nice setups above, even a brushless motor without having to use an internal/smart fet, just use a decent external mosfet like Perun AB++.

If you do use the brushless motor make sure to disable or run the lowest active brake settings.

 

Also of note that if you intend to change the pinion on a brushless it can require some extra work that some might find scary to do considering the cost of the motor.

[Speedbird_666]

 

11 minutes ago, Davegolf said:

Indeed, 7.4v 13:1 with 22TPA was my go to setup on 20+ builds, but the brushless motors allow the same response on a 18:1 setup when run on 11.1, run waaaay cooler, batteries last so much longer, and the gearbox on the whole is quieter owing to less stress - eg lower gear ratio / torque through gears.

 

Interesting. I haven't jumped on the Brushless bandwagon yet but it's on my 'to-do' list.

 

[Davegolf]

Its definitely a bonus for guns with tiny battery space, but TBH its a lot of cash, you could run any quality 25k brushed motor for half, if not a third of the cost.

They are nice dont get me wrong, but a bit of ballache to fit, i think their ideal usage is in DMRs / 400+ guns.