Playing With a Pacemaker?

[Clanktank]

Is there any restriction at UK sites with having a pacemaker fitted and playing? Just want to try it out, but don't want to book and waste time & money if they won't let me play, and details of individual sites health requirements seem very light on the ground.
Do they ask you to sign a medical form or anything similar?

The only thing I can find online is this one German site which restricts access, but nothing in the UK.
https://airsoftpark.tirol/en/rules/safety
I plan to wear some kind of protective vest if I do play, but want to know if they'll let me in even without vest.
Thanks

[MiK]

Best advice I can offer - give the site you wish to play a call direct and ask, that way you won’t lose any money - hitting them up on social media is worth a punt too.

Most sites waivers are basically “you play at your own risk as long as you meet our minimum requirements” they may ask for a doctors clearance but more than likely go on “are you fit enough?”

addition - try a CQB site if there’s on near you, you’ll get a taste and it’s no yomping over miles but it’s fast enough to get the heart pumping

[Shamal]

4 minutes ago, MiK said:

Best advice I can offer - give the site you wish to play a call direct and ask, that way you won’t lose any money - hitting them up on social media is worth a punt too.

Most sites waivers are basically “you play at your own risk as long as you meet our minimum requirements” they may ask for a doctors clearance but more than likely go on “are you fit enough?”

addition - try a CQB site if there’s on near you, you’ll get a taste and it’s no yomping over miles but it’s fast enough to get the heart pumping

I think that's the job of the pacemaker Mik. Lol

I have never been asked about my health nor have I had to sign any declaration that I am fit enough to play. 

Been questioned few times about my mental state though! But let's face it we's all a bit crackers to be doing this!🤪😉

I think you will be fine to play clanktank with or without vest although more protection the better lol

Regards 

[Rogerborg]

AEGs use an electric motor in the grip, which is tucked close to your chest.

 

You can go for gas guns, but gas rifles take more maintaining and cost more to run, and rentals are electric.

 

I'd run that one past a doctor first.

 

As regards asking the site, doing so puts them in an awkward position.  If they say yes, they've created liability for themselves where none existed (and they can't disclaim away liability for personal injury or death, despite those silly waiver forms that we all have to sign)

 

If they say no, they've... created liability where none existed, as they should then proactively prohibit pacemakers for all players, and once they or their insurers start thinking about medical conditions which preclude play, that list could get quite long, quite fast.

 

It's best for them if you don't ask and they don't tell.  And any opinion they give is likely to be informed more by insurers/lawyers than medical advice, so again: I'd check with your own sawbones.

[Tackle]

Ultimately, we should all know our own limitations within reason, that said once the adrenaline kicks in its easy to forget the aches & pains, & other issues.

I would definitely get some advice on what can & can't have a detrimental effect on a pacemaker, magnetic fields etc, but also apply some common sense (not saying you don't have any😜), pick a site that isn't going put you under undue physical stress, so a nice flat site that's not too big, maybe cqb ?, play in a sneaky mofo style, maybe a dmr setup, & get a "battle buddy", get a mate to go with you who knows your "issues" & will watch your back, he/she will probably love it too.

And most of all, have fun👍, don't feel that because some of the players (& staff ?) are a bit gung-ho & encouraging everyone to "CHARGE" etc, don't feel pressured,  it's your money & your day, just play within the rules & ease yourself in to the sport.

Good luck 😁

[Nick G]

Where abouts in the South West are you ? To echo what others have said , run it past your Doc first to see what their thought and recomendations are and if that's OK then try a playing style to suit. Beauty of the sport is that you can play as fast or as slow as you want. Enjoy !

[Clanktank]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I have a younger brother who used to play so will ask him to buddy up the first time.
I have the pacemaker on the left side, and am left handed, but luckily fire right sided so shouldn't be an issue.
I'm in Swindon.
I kind of feel like I will be the a**hole guy at the back, walking around and sneaking kills. 😉
It seems the best route is don't ask don't tell, then any issues are my own.

[Shamal]

1 hour ago, Clanktank said:

Thanks for all the replies guys. I have a younger brother who used to play so will ask him to buddy up the first time.
I have the pacemaker on the left side, and am left handed, but luckily fire right sided so shouldn't be an issue.
I'm in Swindon.
I kind of feel like I will be the a**hole guy at the back, walking around and sneaking kills. 😉
It seems the best route is don't ask don't tell, then any issues are my own.

Well you can buddy up with me then cause I'm usually bringing up the rear cleaning up the left over pickings from the young bravehearts who have courageously forged ahead. Full steam ahead and no hand signals. That's the motto of the able. Lol 

Regards 

[Tackle]

To be fair, if you tell them it's more likely to illicit a knee jerk response of "no way, sorry", without them actually doing research on what's feasible, whereas your doc will probably say any exercise "in moderation" is acceptable, unless your condition leading up to the fitment of the pacemaker was a lot worse than you've let on.

But there are many of us on here with various health conditions that have forced us to modify our playing styles & still have some great days, & sneaky is definitely a winning strategy.

Other thing is, while it might be advisable to wear something on your chest to reduce the chance of an impact in the heart area, I don't recommend getting a full on plate carrier, if your not in tip top fitness then wrapping your self in layers of tactical nylon will just put you under more physical load & heat, better to consider a chest rig of some sort, such as a warrior 901 which has an extendable "bib" piece that covers much of the upper chest, but leaves your back open to allow heat to escape etc.

Plus many chest rigs have an accessible double layer, allowing you to put a thin layer of something in the middle to further stiffen/harden the front area, I'd recommend something like correx, a light corrugated plastic.

[Rogerborg]

2 hours ago, Clanktank said:

I have the pacemaker on the left side, and am left handed, but luckily fire right sided so shouldn't be an issue.

 

It's still something that I'd run by a professional. Sadly, hard numbers for airsoft motors, like tesla field strength, are hard to come by.  This might be a case of less being more - there's a startling difference in the magnetism of a wimpy stock airsoft motor versus an aftermarket one.

 

Worse case though, spring and gas are viable options.

[Minimi124246]

Honestly Probably, the magnetic field from an AEG motor will should not interfere with a pacemaker. As I'm sure you've seen the big ring magnets we use to disable and reset them it takes quite a bit of strength from the magnetic field. The main issue would be the reason for the pacemaker; HOCM, 2nd/3rd block, AF, etc. If you are fit enough to partake in moderate exercise normally, Airsoft really shouldn't be a problem with a pacemaker - just take it steady and do what you are comfortable with. Any chest pain or breathlessness that's unusual then cool it down and take appropriate steps for you if it doesn't subside with rest. 

[Rogerborg]

3 minutes ago, Minimi124246 said:

Honestly, the magnetic field from an AEG motor will not interfere with a pacemaker

 

Honestly, this is exactly the sort of statement that I wouldn't make unless I was prepared to put my real name, contact details and professional qualifications on record.

[Minimi124246]

19 minutes ago, Rogerborg said:

 

Honestly, this is exactly the sort of statement that I wouldn't make unless I was prepared to put my real name, contact details and professional qualifications on record.

Fixed it for you, hope that's better.

 

A guide can be found at Medtronic's (make probably 99% of ICD's and pacemakers in use) website of what is considered no and low risk. It could be presumed and care must be taken by the individual concerned to weigh up the following; that the motor from a golf cart is considered low risk if kept at least 6 inches away from the patients implantable device, that perhaps on careful consideration the small magnet used in an AEG motor may probably but not definitely be ok. Of course this would totally be after you have weighed up all the possible risk and made your own informed opinion and after consultation with a cardiologist. 

 

Just a bit of further information for Clanktank to guide him. Hope this also complies with your litigious requirements Rodgerborg. And no, I shall not be posting my personal and professional details on an open forum - for obvious reasons).

[Rogerborg]

30 minutes ago, Minimi124246 said:

And no, I shall not be posting my personal and professional details on an open forum - for obvious reasons

 

You could let Clanktank know via the message system.

[Clanktank]

4 hours ago, Minimi124246 said:

Honestly Probably, the magnetic field from an AEG motor will should not interfere with a pacemaker. As I'm sure you've seen the big ring magnets we use to disable and reset them it takes quite a bit of strength from the magnetic field. The main issue would be the reason for the pacemaker; HOCM, 2nd/3rd block, AF, etc. If you are fit enough to partake in moderate exercise normally, Airsoft really shouldn't be a problem with a pacemaker - just take it steady and do what you are comfortable with. Any chest pain or breathlessness that's unusual then cool it down and take appropriate steps for you if it doesn't subside with rest. 

It's an intermittent right sided AV block. I also have a stent 🙂.  I have some professional experience of cardiology, but the EP / Tachycardia side rather than the devices / angiography stuff, so your advice is appreciated.
I'll take it easy for sure, just want to be out and about doing something enjoyable.

 

 

5 hours ago, Tackle said:

Other thing is, while it might be advisable to wear something on your chest to reduce the chance of an impact in the heart area, I don't recommend getting a full on plate carrier, if your not in tip top fitness then wrapping your self in layers of tactical nylon will just put you under more physical load & heat, better to consider a chest rig of some sort, such as a warrior 901 which has an extendable "bib" piece that covers much of the upper chest, but leaves your back open to allow heat to escape etc.

Plus many chest rigs have an accessible double layer, allowing you to put a thin layer of something in the middle to further stiffen/harden the front area, I'd recommend something like correx, a light corrugated plastic.

Thanks for that. I've been looking round and found some dedicated sports orientated stuff to protect that area (Paceguard and Vital Beat), which are just really shirts with a pocket for removable padding, but it's all expensive and is designed to fit only over the specific area. I can see it moving around with activity, and not covering the odd angles that impacts may come from when being shot, so something more general like the chest rig may be better to cover the surrounding area and the routes into the pacemaker, as well as the pacemaker itself. The pacemaker is located a few inches below the left shoulder blade, so chest protection would need to cover that area which is tricky, as the ones I've seen are tend to be centred on the main mass but leave the upper corners of the chest area exposed.
I also looked at padded shooting shirts, but with the padding on the left for lefty shooters, but it may have the same problem of not covering the full area.

[Shamal]

6 hours ago, Clanktank said:

It's an intermittent right sided AV block. I also have a stent 🙂.  I have some professional experience of cardiology, but the EP / Tachycardia side rather than the devices / angiography stuff, so your advice is appreciated.
I'll take it easy for sure, just want to be out and about doing something enjoyable.

 

 

Thanks for that. I've been looking round and found some dedicated sports orientated stuff to protect that area (Paceguard and Vital Beat), which are just really shirts with a pocket for removable padding, but it's all expensive and is designed to fit only over the specific area. I can see it moving around with activity, and not covering the odd angles that impacts may come from when being shot, so something more general like the chest rig may be better to cover the surrounding area and the routes into the pacemaker, as well as the pacemaker itself. The pacemaker is located a few inches below the left shoulder blade, so chest protection would need to cover that area which is tricky, as the ones I've seen are tend to be centred on the main mass but leave the upper corners of the chest area exposed.
I also looked at padded shooting shirts, but with the padding on the left for lefty shooters, but it may have the same problem of not covering the full area.

Bloody cheek!! How dare they use my photo without asking! Lol

I wish. 👀😉

Regards 

[Minimi124246]

In terms of protecting the pace box, you could just get a tightish T-shirt and your local seamstress to sew a pocket on in the correct place, pop a small D30 (cardinal hip protectors are pretty flat) or other flexible armour pad of your choice in, or even cut a little camping mat to size and bam! £90 saved on protection vest and armour?

 

Again though, this is just my musings and you should do all due diligence and pay no real attention to this 🤷🏼‍♂️
 

edit: cardiac EP? Braver man than me 😂

[clumpyedge]

Speaking as someone that works on a site, I would want to know straight off the bat if you have a pacemaker fitted as IF the worst did happen and you didn't have a buddy with you that knows you have one and an ambulance does need to be called for whatever reason then its information that can be passed to the attending crew. You don't have to disclose that to anyone but the site owner/marshals.

 

We had someone on site who chose not to disclose medical issues and it was lucky a friend knew all of them as when the crews arrived to help when she had an episode they could treat the player as required had they not had the information the potential for things to go awry turned out to be fairly high.

[Rogerborg]

Something I'd let your medical professional know when discussing it is that no matter how slow you're taking play, being hit with a BB can give you quite the jolt and a rush of adrenaline depending on where you get hit.

[Tackle]

Bout £35, + instant muscles = win win😁 

Serious though, shirt like this & a small grab bag for mags/water/chocky & your ready to go, lightweight, cheap & non sweat inducing, definitely make your first few games easier while you find your "role/playing style".

[Clanktank]

7 hours ago, clumpyedge said:

Speaking as someone that works on a site, I would want to know straight off the bat if you have a pacemaker fitted as IF the worst did happen and you didn't have a buddy with you that knows you have one and an ambulance does need to be called for whatever reason then its information that can be passed to the attending crew. You don't have to disclose that to anyone but the site owner/marshals.

 

We had someone on site who chose not to disclose medical issues and it was lucky a friend knew all of them as when the crews arrived to help when she had an episode they could treat the player as required had they not had the information the potential for things to go awry turned out to be fairly high.

Good point. I'll buddy up with my brother as he knows the score.
To be fair, even if it does fail it's probably not going to effect me immediately and cause a medical emergency.

 

 

6 hours ago, Tackle said:

Bout £35, + instant muscles = win win😁 

Serious though, shirt like this & a small grab bag for mags/water/chocky & your ready to go, lightweight, cheap & non sweat inducing, definitely make your first few games easier while you find your "role/playing style".

 

I was thinking something more discrete. 😄

[Tackle]

35 minutes ago, Clanktank said:

Good point. I'll buddy up with my brother as he knows the score.
To be fair, even if it does fail it's probably not going to effect me immediately and cause a medical emergency.

 

 

I was thinking something more discrete. 😄

Nah, get the padded shirt & stick a blue led ring in the middle of the chest, you too can be Tony Stark😂

[Clanktank]

So this is the solution I went with if anyone is interested. £12.95 from Amazon, and seems pretty okay with a nice layer of firm padding.
I'm pointing to where the pacemaker is located in the second picture.