Is the "Specna Arms SA-C25 - CORE PDW AEG" a good choice?

[ModernTimes]

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/specna-arms-sa-c25-pdw

 

I am looking to buy my first rifle and after reading countless articles I came to the conclusion that a lot of the good guns are currently out of stock. I want a CYMA gun as I have read that they pack a punch and are generally very good weapons out of the box but I have no idea when they will be back in stock.

 

That being said, is the gun I have chosen good? or is it not good and would you recommend something better or more powerful for the same price range? £100+ is fine I am just looking for a very good solid starter rifle that shoots very fast and long ranged.

[RostokMcSpoons]

Yeah that's a good choice.  I've just been through the same journey as you, ending up buying a Double Eagle M906c... you could search for my threads, if you're a masochist 😋

 

I'm actually keeping an eye out on the Black Friday sales as I would like to pick up a bargain backup gun. Your choice did catch my eye again yesterday, but it's still at full price.  Very nice gun though and was in the running when I was originally looking.

 

Now the interesting thing is Patrolbase actually have the M906 marked as a Black Friday deal at £120/130 which would be an absolute steal.  (and it would piss me off somewhat as I paid £40 more)

It's still at 'OOS' but why lower the price when it's been like that for a few weeks?

Are they going to reveal some stock on the day?  Worth keeping an eye out for that!

[Rogerborg]

It would be fine, although please be aware that it's plastic bodied.  A nice plastic, but that money gets you into the metal bodied EDGE range.  Oh... but they're out of stock.

 

Hmm, I see what you mean.  Out of stock, out of stock, out of stock, all the way down.

 

And I don't really rate the X-ASR mosftet in the CORE/EDGE range. It's there just for trigger contact protection, and is fine with the stock motors, but gets sketchy if you fit a higher draw aftermarket motor.  Given that, there's no particular reason to buy the higher priced CORE guns over the cheaper SA-C06 / SA-C08, as they're all plastic, and have the same decent rotary hop and QC spring system.  Or if you want compact and a mosfet, the SA-C12 will do the same job as the C25 for less.

 

The good news is that looking at what PatrolBase actually have in stock today in terms of M4 AEGs under £200, I would say that any of them will be fine, except I'd avoid the Nuprols like the plague, and Evolution Airsoft are still an unknown quantity.  Lancer Tacticals went through a ropey phase, but so did Specna, and they both seem OK at the moment.

 

I wouldn't over-think it, because at the moment if you snooze, you lose - the Double Eagles appear to be totally out of stock now.

[RostokMcSpoons]

Watch the Sweary Man (c)(tm) dissect each manufacturer here:
 

 

Skip the first 3 minutes.

It's long and there are lots of Naughty Words.  But as a tech he'll give you an idea of how good each company's products are.
(He likes Cyma and Double Eagle at the cheaper end, but there are some other manufacturers I know sod-all about that he rates too, and they might actually be in stock)
 

[EDcase]

If you have the strength of character it would be best to wait for new stock to come in.  It should be before the end of the year so 5 weeks max. 

[Rogerborg]

Is that an assumption, or do you know of any shipments on the way?

 

Anything coming in will have to get past the literal highway robbers on the M25 first, and given how fast everything is selling out, it'll still be a case of buying whatever's available before someone else does.

[ModernTimes]

On 24/11/2021 at 09:44, Rogerborg said:

It would be fine, although please be aware that it's plastic bodied.  A nice plastic, but that money gets you into the metal bodied EDGE range.  Oh... but they're out of stock.

 

Hmm, I see what you mean.  Out of stock, out of stock, out of stock, all the way down.

 

And I don't really rate the X-ASR mosftet in the CORE/EDGE range. It's there just for trigger contact protection, and is fine with the stock motors, but gets sketchy if you fit a higher draw aftermarket motor.  Given that, there's no particular reason to buy the higher priced CORE guns over the cheaper SA-C06 / SA-C08, as they're all plastic, and have the same decent rotary hop and QC spring system.  Or if you want compact and a mosfet, the SA-C12 will do the same job as the C25 for less.

 

The good news is that looking at what PatrolBase actually have in stock today in terms of M4 AEGs under £200, I would say that any of them will be fine, except I'd avoid the Nuprols like the plague, and Evolution Airsoft are still an unknown quantity.  Lancer Tacticals went through a ropey phase, but so did Specna, and they both seem OK at the moment.

 

I wouldn't over-think it, because at the moment if you snooze, you lose - the Double Eagles appear to be totally out of stock now.

 

I appreciate the heads up. Thanks for the tips! I'll be on the lookout for an EDGE one. I really wanted to pick up a CMYA rifle but literally can't find one anywhere. It's really annoying.

On 24/11/2021 at 13:16, EDcase said:

If you have the strength of character it would be best to wait for new stock to come in.  It should be before the end of the year so 5 weeks max. 

 

Yeah I will probably end up doing that. I'll see if I can find out when restocks happen exactly time and date and camp a CYMA or a Speca Arms EDGE series rifle. Thanks for the reply!

On 24/11/2021 at 10:14, RostokMcSpoons said:

Watch the Sweary Man (c)(tm) dissect each manufacturer here:
 

 

Skip the first 3 minutes.

It's long and there are lots of Naughty Words.  But as a tech he'll give you an idea of how good each company's products are.
(He likes Cyma and Double Eagle at the cheaper end, but there are some other manufacturers I know sod-all about that he rates too, and they might actually be in stock)
 

 

Thanks! Appreciate it! There's so many brands to choose from it gets a bit confusing. I'll definitely give it a watch.

[RostokMcSpoons]

Re the Negative Airsoft video... someone helpfully put the times in for each segment in the top pinned comment, so you can jump straight to each manufacturer

 

Edited November 27, 2021 by RostokMcSpoons

[Nunfa1]

What about this:

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/double-eagle-m916g-utr556?pv=17877

 

Lots of us have a Double Eagle from this range and early indications are that they are great value.

[Rogerborg]

9 hours ago, Nunfa1 said:

What about this:

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/double-eagle-m916g-utr556?pv=17877

 

At this point, if it's in stock, and not a Nuprol, you should probably buy it first, then mention it later.

[EDcase]

Yeah, don't tell anyone until after you bought it 😄

[Nunfa1]

I've already got one, it was a suggestion for the OP. 😃

[ModernTimes]

For anyone following the topic. I have decided to settle for either the gun I initially chose (Specna Arms SA-C25 CORE) but slightly leaning more towards the G&G Armament Combat Machine CM16

 

Both guns have really great reviews and seem like great starter rifles, only thing I slightly do not like about the CORE series rifle is that it's a PDW which would mean I'd need to buy more parts to make it into a standard carbine. Thank you to everyone who replied and helped!

 

I will still however be on active lookout for a CYMA M4 as that is the rifle I really want. It's just sold out everywhere for now.

 

On 27/11/2021 at 14:10, Nunfa1 said:

What about this:

https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/double-eagle-m916g-utr556?pv=17877

 

Lots of us have a Double Eagle from this range and early indications are that they are great value.

 

I appreciate the suggestion but I don't like the look of this gun too much. I think the stock is a weird shape and the barrel looks overly futuristic with it's mesh/netting type design. It does seem like a really good gun though.

Edited November 29, 2021 by ModernTimes

[Badgerlicious]

37 minutes ago, ModernTimes said:

only thing I slightly do not like about the CORE series rifle is that it's a PDW which would mean I'd need to buy more parts to make it into a standard carbine

Then why not the sa-c08? https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/specna-arms-sa-c08-core-tm-carbine-aeg?pv=17821

 

It has everything you'll need from a first gun.

[Rogerborg]

2 hours ago, Badgerlicious said:

Then why not the sa-c08? https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/specna-arms-sa-c08-core-tm-carbine-aeg?pv=17821

 

It has everything you'll need from a first gun.

 

Agreed, I don't see much reason to pay C25 prices.  They're both polymer, I'm unclear if the C25 is significantly better.  The only actual feature difference is the X-ASR mosfet, but that does nothing except trigger contact protection, and mine balks at aftermarket motors.  Both are fine for length, anything more than that is just willy-waggling for airsoft use.

 

And don't worry about the quoted FPS figures, those will be using Specna's stock M90 spring.  Fine for CQB, just about enough for woodland. Drop in an M100 through the quick-change system and you're good to go.

 

The G&G, hmm. It's a lot more than I'd want to pay for one, given how feature-poor it is.  The sight may be functional, or a gimmick.  That said, G&Gs do tend to shoot very nicely, and that's what actually matters, not the feature list.  You probably won't regret it.

[Badgerlicious]

And I believe the combat machines still use a geared hop up, compared to the specna's rotary hop up, which is just a better design. 

 

Its a small thing, but if you want to do something simple like change a hop rubber, you will be thankful for the rotary hop unit. 

[Nunfa1]

The C25 is available without the PDW stock.

 

https://mpa-airsoft.com/product/specna-arms-sa-c12-black/

 

 

[Rogerborg]

6 hours ago, Badgerlicious said:

And I believe the combat machines still use a geared hop up, compared to the specna's rotary hop up, which is just a better design. 

 

It is, the Specna is very similar to the ZCI hop and works well.  I'm amazed that anyone is still making geared hops at this point.

 

That said, every time I have a go with Ex-Workmate Eddy's basic G&G CM16, I'm reminded just how good it is, even totally stock and completely neglected.  I guess G&G keep making them that way because they work just fine.

[Skara]

Get the C-25!

 

You're getting more bang for buck than any G&G you'll ever come across and, let's be fair, it's much better to have a polymer body than a pot metal one!

[Skara]

I'll elaborate more:

 

Having a realistic feeling gun is great, but in terms of actual performance on the field, the body being polymer or metal doesn't make any difference.

Thing is, we are mostly lumping around our guns all day and slowly drain our energy.

The weight of the thing will determine at what point in time you'll start to hate your life

I'd rather have an all polymer gun that is light and manoeuvrable than something realistic looking but that will tire out my arms quickly.

 

with that being said, Specna (along with Evolution, Dboys and Saigo Defense) offers more than G&G despite having a lower price point:

proper steel bushings, decent brass barrel, QC gearbox and rotary hop unit, whereas G&G insists on brass bushings, pressed tinfoil barrels and those stupid geared hop units that a) are more expensive to make and b) they are flawed in design because they tend to unwind themselves. And they out screws on the wrong side of the gearbox -.-

 

you pay for the brand (and a fancy polymer body with the 2.0 series) but get outdated internals.

 

I know you can replace those parts on a G&G buy why pay more and replace parts when you can spend less and have them on board already?

[ModernTimes]

On 29/11/2021 at 12:36, Badgerlicious said:

Then why not the sa-c08? https://www.patrolbase.co.uk/specna-arms-sa-c08-core-tm-carbine-aeg?pv=17821

 

It has everything you'll need from a first gun.

 

On 29/11/2021 at 14:57, Rogerborg said:

 

Agreed, I don't see much reason to pay C25 prices.  They're both polymer, I'm unclear if the C25 is significantly better.  The only actual feature difference is the X-ASR mosfet, but that does nothing except trigger contact protection, and mine balks at aftermarket motors.  Both are fine for length, anything more than that is just willy-waggling for airsoft use.

 

And don't worry about the quoted FPS figures, those will be using Specna's stock M90 spring.  Fine for CQB, just about enough for woodland. Drop in an M100 through the quick-change system and you're good to go.

 

The G&G, hmm. It's a lot more than I'd want to pay for one, given how feature-poor it is.  The sight may be functional, or a gimmick.  That said, G&Gs do tend to shoot very nicely, and that's what actually matters, not the feature list.  You probably won't regret it.

 

Really fair points. Honestly I don't have much to go on and I think I'm slightly overthinking it but your really right in saying that there's no point me paying more for basically the exact same gun in terms of internals and how it handles so I will put the C08 as my backup instead of the one original C25 mentioned in the topic. It looks good and it's cheaper than the others I was considering and it is basically a middle ground between a PDW and a full longer barrel carbine so I do really like it.

 

Thanks for mentioning the spring Rogerborg. I didn't really know you could actually do that haha

17 hours ago, Skara said:

I'll elaborate more:

 

Having a realistic feeling gun is great, but in terms of actual performance on the field, the body being polymer or metal doesn't make any difference.

Thing is, we are mostly lumping around our guns all day and slowly drain our energy.

The weight of the thing will determine at what point in time you'll start to hate your life

I'd rather have an all polymer gun that is light and manoeuvrable than something realistic looking but that will tire out my arms quickly.

 

with that being said, Specna (along with Evolution, Dboys and Saigo Defense) offers more than G&G despite having a lower price point:

proper steel bushings, decent brass barrel, QC gearbox and rotary hop unit, whereas G&G insists on brass bushings, pressed tinfoil barrels and those stupid geared hop units that a) are more expensive to make and b) they are flawed in design because they tend to unwind themselves. And they out screws on the wrong side of the gearbox -.-

 

you pay for the brand (and a fancy polymer body with the 2.0 series) but get outdated internals.

 

I know you can replace those parts on a G&G buy why pay more and replace parts when you can spend less and have them on board already?

 

Yeah I did have a bit of a issue with the weight but I carried a similar weighted gun in a match and I didn't find it too bad so I assumed it was going to be fine but another good point. No point paying more for just extra weight. I know it might seem like I'm making a bit stupid decision but I really don't have much to go on other than other people's experiences and reviews and quite honestly this whole picking the gun thing is just confusing so I appreciate everyone who has commented and helped me out. Thank you!

On 29/11/2021 at 17:53, Nunfa1 said:

The C25 is available without the PDW stock.

 

https://mpa-airsoft.com/product/specna-arms-sa-c12-black/

 

 

 

Thanks for the recommendation but as another poster mentioned I think the C08 is just overall better. I just wanted the smaller form factor because I thought it would help it being lighter and whilst it does I believe it slightly lowers the range and now looking at it more and more after sifting through multiple guns over the past week I kind of prefer longer barrels. 😂

On 29/11/2021 at 15:17, Badgerlicious said:

And I believe the combat machines still use a geared hop up, compared to the specna's rotary hop up, which is just a better design. 

 

Its a small thing, but if you want to do something simple like change a hop rubber, you will be thankful for the rotary hop unit. 

 

No clue what this is but I'll have a look into it and see if I can learn how to do it. Thanks for the tip!

[Skara]

Btw I own a C-08, it's my tournament gun

Although there is nothing original left inside apart from the gearbox shell

[Rogerborg]

7 hours ago, ModernTimes said:

Thanks for mentioning the spring Rogerborg. I didn't really know you could actually do that haha

 

Yup, Specnas ship with an M120 and an M90 spring for different markets. The M120 isn't much use for the UK, being too hot for an auto-gun, but not quite enough to run it as a semi-auto DMR. The M90 should notionally give you about 295fps on a 0.2g BB, although you may see a bit more.  Like a lot of airsoft, "M" numbers aren't well defined but are generally interpreted as meaning metres-per-second with a 0.2g BB, all highly dependent on air seal, barrel and so on.  The M90 should be spot on for indoor CQB, but you might want a bit more for woodland.

 

If you do, all Specnas come with a quick change spring system which lets you change the spring... well, quickly.  You'll need a long screwdriver, a chonky hex key, and a bit of patience the first time, but it's easy enough to do, and an M95 or M100 spring will run you £6.50 delivered.

 

 

[ModernTimes]

On 01/12/2021 at 12:40, Rogerborg said:

 

Yup, Specnas ship with an M120 and an M90 spring for different markets. The M120 isn't much use for the UK, being too hot for an auto-gun, but not quite enough to run it as a semi-auto DMR. The M90 should notionally give you about 295fps on a 0.2g BB, although you may see a bit more.  Like a lot of airsoft, "M" numbers aren't well defined but are generally interpreted as meaning metres-per-second with a 0.2g BB, all highly dependent on air seal, barrel and so on.  The M90 should be spot on for indoor CQB, but you might want a bit more for woodland.

 

If you do, all Specnas come with a quick change spring system which lets you change the spring... well, quickly.  You'll need a long screwdriver, a chonky hex key, and a bit of patience the first time, but it's easy enough to do, and an M95 or M100 spring will run you £6.50 delivered.

 

Thanks. I'll pick that up but how does that help exactly? Doesn't the spring just make it more powerful? Can't I just adjust that gear thing inside the gun when you cock it back? I saw the marshalls doing that when they were chrono'ing the guns before the matches and I figured since you can adjust the power that way can't I just do that instead of getting a new spring?

[Skara]

5 minutes ago, ModernTimes said:

 

Thanks. I'll pick that up but how does that help exactly? Doesn't the spring just make it more powerful? Can't I just adjust that gear thing inside the gun when you cock it back? I saw the marshalls doing that when they were chrono'ing the guns before the matches and I figured since you can adjust the power that way can't I just do that instead of getting a new spring?

That's the hop up and has little to do with power.