Compressor or hand pump

[eddie-biggs]

Been hand pumping and my god I think am going to die lol was thinking of a compressor to save time, what would people recommend?? 

[Tommikka]

41 minutes ago, eddie-biggs said:

Been hand pumping and my god I think am going to die lol was thinking of a compressor to save time, what would people recommend?? 

I would recommend against a compressor unless you have a serious level of use out of it, or plenty time to leave one running and allowing for cooling.

 

You cannot use domestic or workshop types of compressors.  (Actually there is a way, but I’ll get to that)

You need something capable of compressing to 3000psi, and providing clean breathable quality air.  That will cost a number of thousands, and needs to be maintained.

 

You can get cheaper ones now that are capable of that level of pressure, but I’m unconvinced and you need to know what you are buying to ensure the quality is up to the job.

 

There are booster compressors such as the discontinued Shoebox compressor by Tom Kaye.

This type needs a workshop style compressor as a primary source to feed the shoebox at 100s of PSI which then boosts to 1000s of PSI

The source air from domestic or workshop compressors is at high risk of oil or other contamination.  Best case scenario is dirty air which clogs the bottle side of the regulator and gives an early burst disk failure.  The worst case scenario is when you get any heat from air pressure you end up with a flash fill explosion.  I’ve seen the effects and you don’t want that.  The photos below are from a flash fill explosion near Southampton a number of years back.  It was due to oil contamination remaining from an earlier unidentified player and the player concerned had their regulator explode during filling, their bottle became a rocket, their clothes melted onto them and you can see the state of his hand.  He luckily lived to tell the tale.

 

 

My recommendations are:

1) get a fill from the site you play at.

This might not be possible at all airsoft sites

2) occasionally use the stirrup and build up your muscles 

3) get a fill at a friendly dive shop - you will probably need to bring your own fill adaptor rig, and it will get expensive per fill for a playing size cylinder

4) buy spare aluminum cylinders and fill as many as you can in one go from a site compressor 

5) buy a scuba cylinder, fill it at a dive shop, then use your own fill rig to cascade fill to your playing cylinder

Fill by as little as possible and as often as possible, just topping up to minimise the pressure difference between cylinders to make your scuba source last the longest 

 

 

 

[sjhirst]

Ive been considering one myself. This one seems to get favourable reviews:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08DQN98PD/?coliid=IF1QIZ3JZY2QR&colid=1JKPUEDKCX43G&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it&th=1

 

[Lozart]

11 hours ago, sjhirst said:

Ive been considering one myself. This one seems to get favourable reviews:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B08DQN98PD/?coliid=IF1QIZ3JZY2QR&colid=1JKPUEDKCX43G&ref_=lv_ov_lig_dp_it&th=1

 

 

A few things to consider: compressed air at that pressure is dangerous, there's no getting around that so a good quality unit is essential. A good quality compressor is expensive, this isn't which rings alarm bells for me (trust me, it really isn't expensive - my airbrush compressor only went to the hundreds of PSI and it cost three times as much as that). Needing to change cooling water every 30 minutes would be an issue for me, lack of any moisture trap concerns me too.

I'd go with something more like this: https://www.uttings.co.uk/p130854-air-venturi-nomad-ii-4500-psi-portable-pcp-compressor-av-mcomp4500-2/#.YTHnp45KiHs

[eddie-biggs]

1 hour ago, Lozart said:

 

A few things to consider: compressed air at that pressure is dangerous, there's no getting around that so a good quality unit is essential. A good quality compressor is expensive, this isn't which rings alarm bells for me (trust me, it really isn't expensive - my airbrush compressor only went to the hundreds of PSI and it cost three times as much as that). Needing to change cooling water every 30 minutes would be an issue for me, lack of any moisture trap concerns me too.

I'd go with something more like this: https://www.uttings.co.uk/p130854-air-venturi-nomad-ii-4500-psi-portable-pcp-compressor-av-mcomp4500-2/#.YTHnp45KiHs

Wow 600 notes? that's a lot wouldn't be so bad if I could go half's with someone lol

[Tommikka]

29 minutes ago, eddie-biggs said:

Wow 600 notes? that's a lot wouldn't be so bad if I could go half's with someone lol

That’s part of the problem - a site or dive shop compressor is priced in £thousands. These also need to be regularly serviced and monitored. 
A site won’t run their compressor for fills, they will normaly have a series of large cylinders which get pre-filled by the compressor then regularly topped up in short sessions.  (Typically a 4500 psi compressor & cylinder system providing 3000psi fills to bottles (or less at 2500psi etc to reduce the need to top up the compressor) 

If there’s a particular event on then sites will most likely bring in contracted air providers such as HPAC with a compressor lorry.

 

The Amazon link above has one for £200, but that only one of those two has a ‘safety’ cut off at 4500psi, the other will just keep on going until something fails.  They both have a basic water ‘filter’ which still leaves water passing through at first. You would start with £200 and need upgrades immediately to render it fit for purpose

 

The ‘better’ £400 link is more sensible, but is still a fairy low use compressor 

Note that they get advertised for PCP and typically get used for low capacity bottle fills or rare fills to a ‘standard’ bottle which will cascade to a smaller bottle for PCP airguns.  Airsoft won’t need as much air as paintball. So it is doable

But it’s doable with your eyes open - it comes with responsibility, and as in my pictures above when someone makes mistakes they aren’t necessarily the one who will suffer

 

Contamination and a flash fill explosion is not to be taken lightly. I’m not aware of one for many years, which is because the slack standards that had slipped causing various minor things being forgotten to add up together and cause the injuries shown:

People not knowing what they were doing

Complacency

Contamination 

Fast fills

Heat

Flash failure explosion 

Major industry shake up

Then years later, complacency comes back

 

The question is - why do you need to self fill away from a site fill station ?

There are a lot of dive shops around the UK.  It’s not like parts of the US where a few people are genuinely in the back of beyond 

The best compromise of your site doesn’t have compressed air is a scuba and a local dive shop

[Tackle]

15 hours ago, Tommikka said:

I would recommend against a compressor unless you have a serious level of use out of it, or plenty time to leave one running and allowing for cooling.

 

You cannot use domestic or workshop types of compressors.  (Actually there is a way, but I’ll get to that)

You need something capable of compressing to 3000psi, and providing clean breathable quality air.  That will cost a number of thousands, and needs to be maintained.

 

You can get cheaper ones now that are capable of that level of pressure, but I’m unconvinced and you need to know what you are buying to ensure the quality is up to the job.

 

There are booster compressors such as the discontinued Shoebox compressor by Tom Kaye.

This type needs a workshop style compressor as a primary source to feed the shoebox at 100s of PSI which then boosts to 1000s of PSI

The source air from domestic or workshop compressors is at high risk of oil or other contamination.  Best case scenario is dirty air which clogs the bottle side of the regulator and gives an early burst disk failure.  The worst case scenario is when you get any heat from air pressure you end up with a flash fill explosion.  I’ve seen the effects and you don’t want that.  The photos below are from a flash fill explosion near Southampton a number of years back.  It was due to oil contamination remaining from an earlier unidentified player and the player concerned had their regulator explode during filling, their bottle became a rocket, their clothes melted onto them and you can see the state of his hand.  He luckily lived to tell the tale.

 

 

My recommendations are:

1) get a fill from the site you play at.

This might not be possible at all airsoft sites

2) occasionally use the stirrup and build up your muscles 

3) get a fill at a friendly dive shop - you will probably need to bring your own fill adaptor rig, and it will get expensive per fill for a playing size cylinder

4) buy spare aluminum cylinders and fill as many as you can in one go from a site compressor 

5) buy a scuba cylinder, fill it at a dive shop, then use your own fill rig to cascade fill to your playing cylinder

Fill by as little as possible and as often as possible, just topping up to minimise the pressure difference between cylinders to make your scuba source last the longest 

 

 

 

Thanks, you just gave me another reason to not bother with hpa?

Never realised it can get that "technical" just to get a good set-up

[Steveocee]

The question I'd ask is, can you take a compressor to and run it at site? Probably not. A 48Ci steely like most of us buy needs to be topped up several times throughout the day.

You would be far better off spending the same money on a decent air rifle type cylinder and then paying £5 every 3-4 games to get it filled by someone with a multi thousand pounds compressor than trying to jerry rig a noisy and dangerous unit at site.

[Monkman]

I was thinking of getting my own compressor, but there are so many things that could go wrong with it and where do I get it serviced?  In the end I just bought a dive tank and get it filled for £5 at a dive shop when I need to top it up.  Some sites will fill you tank as well for a price or even free....

[Tommikka]

8 minutes ago, Monkman said:

I was thinking of getting my own compressor, but there are so many things that could go wrong with it and where do I get it serviced?  In the end I just bought a dive tank and get it filled for £5 at a dive shop when I need to top it up.  Some sites will fill you tank as well for a price or even free....

Rhetorical question of course  - “where do I get it serviced?”

You get it serviced through the specialist supplier that you bought it from, possibly as part of the maintenance contract along with the initial purchase …… unless you bought it from a generic Asian exporter.

 

In the olden days most goods were sold with the expectation of support, nowadays in retail most goods are throwaway - you might get sold the extended warranty but often the fashion or technology changes and you replace it before the warranty runs out.

If you do buy a warranty then you replace it the day after the warranty runs out when it breaks

 

This wears away at all the tech support there used to be in every town.  Now businesses rely on specialist businesses giving the support they will need when they need it.  There might be only one company - even one person, who can do the support in that area of the country 

[Monkman]

39 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

Rhetorical question of course  - “where do I get it serviced?”

You get it serviced through the specialist supplier that you bought it from, possibly as part of the maintenance contract along with the initial purchase …… unless you bought it from a generic Asian exporter.

 

In the olden days most goods were sold with the expectation of support, nowadays in retail most goods are throwaway - you might get sold the extended warranty but often the fashion or technology changes and you replace it before the warranty runs out.

If you do buy a warranty then you replace it the day after the warranty runs out when it breaks

 

This wears away at all the tech support there used to be in every town.  Now businesses rely on specialist businesses giving the support they will need when they need it.  There might be only one company - even one person, who can do the support in that area of the country 

Well most compressors that I have seen are of the "generic" Asian ones...(Some airsoft/paintball retailers or Amazon)  I elected instead to get a tank and buy refills from a Dive shop and they will also test my tanks & dive tanks as well when they need doing..so supporting local business as well..granted not a lot of money were talking about here..but putting a few quid into business I guess.   Oh next year..i'm going to try scuba diving as they do a real good starter package/tryout.

 

[enzo47]

This is come great stuff. i brought a hpa setup. was hoping use with my compressor at home. 

[Tommikka]

16 hours ago, enzo47 said:

This is come great stuff. i brought a hpa setup. was hoping use with my compressor at home. 

I’m going to guess that the compressor produces around 150psi

Not enough to generate decent pressure for a bottle, and would need additional filtering to avoid contamination 

[enzo47]

ive should done more research and not took this matter so lightly . i guess i will have use my local dive shop. 

 

Thanks guys stopped me from doing something stuipid  lol