Sub 1k Polarstar Build 🤔

[Bob Ross]

Hi, I'm fairly new to Airsoft however i've played enough to know that i'd like to invest more in it. I'm looking to build a setup that will last and can be modified and tweaked as required. I'm currently leaning towards a Polarstar Fusion rig with a budget of ~ £1k. Although building airsoft guns is completely new to me, I'm pretty handy when it comes to technical stuff and enjoy a challenge, so I remain optimistic (...or perhaps naive 😆).

 

I'd really like some recommendations on donor guns. I'd like something thats highly configurable, durable, and looks/feels solid that can be matched with the fusion engine, preferably metal bodied (although i'm open to having my mind changed). I'm also leaning towards a DMR setup or at least I'd like to move in this direction!

 

Would a used rig be recommend for this? ...and is there anything to look out for apart from the cosmetic condition (considering im ripping the internals out)? ...any particular brands to go for, or steer clear of?

 

Quick costing, please tell me if i'm way off the ballpark here.

 

Fusion Engine ~£400

Tank & regulator ~£200

Donor gun ~£400

Scope (whats the sweet spot price wise?)

 

Best,

 

Bob

[Shamal]

26 minutes ago, Bob Ross said:

Hi, I'm fairly new to Airsoft however i've played enough to know that i'd like to invest more in it. I'm looking to build a setup that will last and can be modified and tweaked as required. I'm currently leaning towards a Polarstar Fusion rig with a budget of ~ £1k. Although building airsoft guns is completely new to me, I'm pretty handy when it comes to technical stuff and enjoy a challenge, so I remain optimistic (...or perhaps naive 😆).

 

I'd really like some recommendations on donor guns. I'd like something thats highly configurable, durable, and looks/feels solid that can be matched with the fusion engine, preferably metal bodied (although i'm open to having my mind changed). I'm also leaning towards a DMR setup or at least I'd like to move in this direction!

 

Would a used rig be recommend for this? ...and is there anything to look out for apart from the cosmetic condition (considering im ripping the internals out)? ...any particular brands to go for, or steer clear of?

 

Quick costing, please tell me if i'm way off the ballpark here.

 

Fusion Engine ~£400

Tank & regulator ~£200

Donor gun ~£400

Scope (whats the sweet spot price wise?)

 

Best,

 

Bob

Hi Bob and welcome to the airsoft sweet shoppe.👋

Seems like you know what you are aiming for and its good to have a plan.I'm sure you will be guided by the gun gurus that loiter in these hallowed pages and can siphon all the knowledge contained in their collective minds. Lol

 

I'm just meet and greet so don't ask me! Lol

 

My airsoft know how is tip round balls into black box thing,push into hole under gnu,pull on hangy down lever type thing and if balls come out of long tube thing up front then happy days,all is well with the world.👍😄

Good luck.

Regards 

P.s are you Bob Ross the joy of painting chap? 🤔

[Bob Ross]

Yes, it is I Bob Ross! .... I’ll have to update my profile pic (one second!) ... and thanks for the intro Shamal.

 

 

[Shamal]

25 minutes ago, Bob Ross said:

Yes, it is I Bob Ross! .... I’ll have to update my profile pic (one second!) ... and thanks for the intro Shamal.

 

 

Do us a quick mountain scene with log cabin,river and trees lol

Welcome 👍

Regards 

[Adolf Hamster]

why not go with the F2? cheaper, much easier to setup, and something you can swap to a much wider range of platforms than a fusion.

 

when it comes to setting up hpa it's both easy and hard, whilst dropping in a kit and getting the gun to fire is much easier than working on a conventional gearbox setup, tuning it to perfection is quite the mountain.

 

i suggest you have a read through here- familiarise yourself with what to expect:

 

donor gun wise, pretty much pick your poison, whilst a lot of hpa's tend to be built on pretty recievers there's nothing that says you can't drop a polarstar into a plastic raider body.

 

only internals to worry about are the hop/barrel setup, and if you're really chasing perfection things like reciever wobble, but those generally aren't the worst things to replace anyway.

[Bob Ross]

Awesome thanks for the link! I’ll have a read now

[Bob Ross]

16 hours ago, Adolf Hamster said:

why not go with the F2? cheaper, much easier to setup, and something you can swap to a much wider range of platforms than a fusion.

 

when it comes to setting up hpa it's both easy and hard, whilst dropping in a kit and getting the gun to fire is much easier than working on a conventional gearbox setup, tuning it to perfection is quite the mountain.

 

i suggest you have a read through here- familiarise yourself with what to expect:

 

donor gun wise, pretty much pick your poison, whilst a lot of hpa's tend to be built on pretty recievers there's nothing that says you can't drop a polarstar into a plastic raider body.

 

only internals to worry about are the hop/barrel setup, and if you're really chasing perfection things like reciever wobble, but those generally aren't the worst things to replace anyway.

That was a good read thanks!

 

Have you had any experience with the new semi-auto Kythera? How does it compare the the F2?

[Adolf Hamster]

6 hours ago, Bob Ross said:

That was a good read thanks!

 

Have you had any experience with the new semi-auto Kythera? How does it compare the the F2?

 

sadly not used the kythera, although heard good reports on it.

 

needless to say you're trading a chunk of tunability and auto for batteryless operation.

 

tbh, unless i was specifically aiming for a semi only build (eg dmr or for a gun that's semi only by nature) i'd probably still go with the f2 for the cross compatibility.

[leadly]

Hello,

 

Is part of your desire to actually build something yourself or is it just a HPA powered gun your after?

 

I've got a Wolverine MTW Forged edition with the Inferno gen 2 engine in it.

It ticks a lot of your boxes. It's full metal, using some real steel parts, can be locked to semi if you want to DMR it as well.

 

I love it and it's worth a gander if your not familiar with it.

Edited May 9, 2021 by leadly

[Bob Ross]

That Wolverine looks very nice tbf. 
 

.... I’ve been busy and managed to pick up an unused, open box VFC Avalon Saber Carbine v2 as my donor gun. My dilemma now is that I’m without a battery or charger and if I continue with the polarstar build I’ll never have anything to compare it too 🤔. I suppose I could pick a battery set up but I’ll likely never use them again, so a bit of a waste of cash.

 

I’m still leaning towards the Fusion so will have an unused VFC Avalon motor and gearbox available. How much do these typically go for?

 

 

[Tactical Pith Helmet]

Not much in the scheme of things mate.   Probs best for keeping for an AEG project.   I guess that when you start playing seriously you'll want a trick aeg at some point, and those bits will be v useful.  

[Bob Ross]

I’m with you on that. I just need to finish my man cave in the basement first, so that I have somewhere to hide my toys from the wife 😆 

 

Sadly the stock for the fusion engine seems to be none existent here in the uk atm and  I sure don’t fancy paying brexit/customs prices 😳 ... if the fusion (v2) engine is spotted for sale anywhere in the uk please pm me.

[Adolf Hamster]

still reckon the f2 is the better shout here.

 

less money for a platform where for our limits the only real downside is slightly less rof potential (note than the 20rps considered decent for an aeg is the starting settings on both, so don't worry you can still run it fast enough to piss people off), and a slightly less positive trigger switch (with an aftermarket trigger though both are excellent) in exchange for something you can swap to a pretty wide array of platforms.

 

it's not that the fusion is bad, just that the improvements are very much the product of being at the leading edge of the diminishing returns curve.

[Bob Ross]

On 11/05/2021 at 14:03, Adolf Hamster said:

still reckon the f2 is the better shout here.

 

less money for a platform where for our limits the only real downside is slightly less rof potential (note than the 20rps considered decent for an aeg is the starting settings on both, so don't worry you can still run it fast enough to piss people off), and a slightly less positive trigger switch (with an aftermarket trigger though both are excellent) in exchange for something you can swap to a pretty wide array of platforms.

 

it's not that the fusion is bad, just that the improvements are very much the product of being at the leading edge of the diminishing returns curve.

tbh whilst browsing I managed to find somewhere that imported from the eu and I couldn’t stop myself 🤦‍♂️
 

I’m now waiting for the fusion to arrive in the post. Talking of limits, what bb weight would you recommend for outdoor range, considering it’s for use in a dmr fusion build? I’ll be using a vfc avalon saber rid, my local limits for a semi-auto dmr are 450fps or 1.9j. If I’ve done the calcs correctly that’s about 450fps on .2g about 360fps on .3 🤔 

 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

Ammo weight wise, as heavy as you're prepared to pay for.

 

Geoffs .48's out of a well dialled in fusion build is basically easy mode once you drown out the "ker ching" noise your inner accountant makes every time you pull the trigger.

[Bob Ross]

3 hours ago, Adolf Hamster said:

Ammo weight wise, as heavy as you're prepared to pay for.

 

Geoffs .48's out of a well dialled in fusion build is basically easy mode once you drown out the "ker ching" noise your inner accountant makes every time you pull the trigger.

hmm, so do they do .05s 😂

 

I best get my aim down then

 

 

[Encore]

Bit late to the thread but my primary is a fusion engine'd G&G PDW15. I'll give my two cents on the body itself (PDW15) and the fusion engine, though Hamster's guide gives you all the info you'd need. I've added some more detailed info about alignment because I feel this is an often overlooked aspect of tuning HPA guns.

 

Donor Body: G&G PDW15 AR

 

 

Compatibility: The fusion engine dropped right in and sits perfectly in the body. I was expecting to have to do some work for have the engine sit and also line up with the hop unit properly but was pleasantly surprised when it was perfectly inline and level with the upper and hop unit.  This is something you want to keep in mind with all HPA systems but can be a particular challenge with the fusion engine because unlike other drop in units that fit into the gearbox that comes with the gun (and hopefully lines up correctly with the hop unit) the fusion engine is a complete replacement of the gearbox. I've illustrated the issue below.

 

 

This can be a oft overlooked part of getting any HPA setup tuned correctly. If you shine a light down the barrel, you want to see your nozzle sat directly in the centre with an even spacing around it to the barrel inner wall. Off centre will give you consistency issues and potential feeding issues. Off angle will give you feeding issues, limit rate of fire and wear your nozzle and barrel where they rub. Both issues can be corrected with correct shimming but it does take some work and effort to get perfect. You can also get clips that clip your hop unit to the front of the engine to ensure they line up, its just a matter of finding what works for you.

 

Features: My body is fully ambidextrous with selector switches on both sides and mag release buttons on both sides. I really like this because it lets me switch hands and shoulders and still retain full functionality. I can reload left handed or right if I go dry, can switch to safe or full auto etc. This depends on your shooting style buts getting comfortable with firing from either shoulder/hand is something I highly recommend learning. Its a huge advantage when you come up against cover that would otherwise force you to expose more of yourself to shoot past.

 

Build quality: My gun is CNC machined, though I'm not sure of the alloy used. However, whatever alloy they have used is solid. My gun has no wobble or flex at all and has taken the heavy use it see's well. Admittedly, I don't go punishing my gun and throwing it around but I'm not afraid to crawl with it; butt it up against cover to get steadier aim etc. The biggest thing for me, however, is there is zero and I mean zero wobble/flex between the upper and lower. Most AEG's because of the design rely on the front pin and the top/cylinder portion of the gearbox sitting inside the upper to keep it snug against the lower, there just no room for tabs at the rear of the upper to interface with the rear locking pin. Most gearboxes are cast and designed to work in a wide product family, so they don't have a snug enough fit in the upper to prevent wobble/flex. G&G got around this issue by creating a extended shelf that sits up against the buffer tube portion of the lower receiver (see image below). This extension ensures that the upper is properly held down against the lower. Again, this helps keep the alignment between the hop unit and nozzle/engine consistent while I run and gun.  

 

Fusion Engine

 

My fusion engine is setup with the standard poppet valve and a green nozzle (primarily used for CSB at my local site). I get around 280(+/- 2-3) fps using 0.3g (1.09J). I was using Geoff's 0.3g bb's and it would shoot like lasers. I found 0.3g to be a nice compromise between weight and cost for CQB. Now I'll be the first to admit that 0.3g is a overkill for CQB but having my hop set to 0.3 meant I could go to a outdoor sight and be ready to roll without any fucking about with my hop or where my sights where zero'd at. It also meant that even if the guy I was shooting was wearing a think hoodie/PMC jacket with plater carrier, they'd feel my shots hit them even at the longest ranges I would be engaging at my local site (RIP The Stan).

 

I'll be changing my setup to a red poppet and amped purple nozzle for increased shot efficiency and a higher FPS (aiming for around 310fps with 0.28g, 1.24J ) since I only have outdoor sights available to me now. I'm also switching to Valkyrie BB's on a trail basis since I've heard good things and a few friends who've tried them say they get better consistency with them. I'm going with 0.28g because they don't do 0.3's and their 0.32g are a bit too expensive for me right now. 

 

Regulator: Wolverine Storm - 40 - 140 PSI range. Nothing to say other than works perfectly with my fusion engine. 

 

If you've got any specific questions, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer but from what I've read so far you're on track for a good polarstar setup. The fusion engine was designed around VFC M4 bodies when it was being designed so should be as close to, if not, just drop in and go as you can get for a fusion engine though the Avalon is a newer model but I doubt much has changed in terms of internal dimensions.

 

Finally, thank you for give me an opportunity to talk and gush about my hpa setup! 😁 I don't get to do it often but I really do love to do it when I can (I suspect we all just want someone to listen to us talk about airsoft endless, its why we're all on this forum after all!)

Edited May 14, 2021 by Encore
Spelling, grammer and typo's

[Bob Ross]

4 hours ago, Encore said:

Bit late to the thread but my primary is a fusion engine'd G&G PDW15. I'll give my two cents on the body itself (PDW15) and the fusion engine, though Hamster's guide gives you all the info you'd need. I've added some more detailed info about alignment because I feel this is an often overlooked aspect of tuning HPA guns.

 

Donor Body: G&G PDW15 AR

 

 

Compatibility: The fusion engine dropped right in and sits perfectly in the body. I was expecting to have to do some work for have the engine sit and also line up with the hop unit properly but was pleasantly surprised when it was perfectly inline and level with the upper and hop unit.  This is something you want to keep in mind with all HPA systems but can be a particular challenge with the fusion engine because unlike other drop in units that fit into the gearbox that comes with the gun (and hopefully lines up correctly with the hop unit) the fusion engine is a complete replacement of the gearbox. I've illustrated the issue below.

 

 

This can be a oft overlooked part of getting any HPA setup tuned correctly. If you shine a light down the barrel, you want to see your nozzle sat directly in the centre with an even spacing around it to the barrel inner wall. Off centre will give you consistency issues and potential feeding issues. Off angle will give you feeding issues, limit rate of fire and wear your nozzle and barrel where they rub. Both issues can be corrected with correct shimming but it does take some work and effort to get perfect. You can also get clips that clip your hop unit to the front of the engine to ensure they line up, its just a matter of finding what works for you.

 

Features: My body is fully ambidextrous with selector switches on both sides and mag release buttons on both sides. I really like this because it lets me switch hands and shoulders and still retain full functionality. I can reload left handed or right if I go dry, can switch to safe or full auto etc. This depends on your shooting style buts getting comfortable with firing from either shoulder/hand is something I highly recommend learning. Its a huge advantage when you come up against cover that would otherwise force you to expose more of yourself to shoot past.

 

Build quality: My gun is CNC machined, though I'm not sure of the alloy used. However, whatever alloy they have used is solid. My gun has no wobble or flex at all and has taken the heavy use it see's well. Admittedly, I don't go punishing my gun and throwing it around but I'm not afraid to crawl with it; butt it up against cover to get steadier aim etc. The biggest thing for me, however, is there is zero and I mean zero wobble/flex between the upper and lower. Most AEG's because of the design rely on the front pin and the top/cylinder portion of the gearbox sitting inside the upper to keep it snug against the lower, there just no room for tabs at the rear of the upper to interface with the rear locking pin. Most gearboxes are cast and designed to work in a wide product family, so they don't have a snug enough fit in the upper to prevent wobble/flex. G&G got around this issue by creating a extended shelf that sits up against the buffer tube portion of the lower receiver (see image below). This extension ensures that the upper is properly held down against the lower. Again, this helps keep the alignment between the hop unit and nozzle/engine consistent while I run and gun.  

 

Fusion Engine

 

My fusion engine is setup with the standard poppet valve and a green nozzle (primarily used for CSB at my local site). I get around 280(+/- 2-3) fps using 0.3g (1.09J). I was using Geoff's 0.3g bb's and it would shoot like lasers. I found 0.3g to be a nice compromise between weight and cost for CQB. Now I'll be the first to admit that 0.3g is a overkill for CQB but having my hop set to 0.3 meant I could go to a outdoor sight and be ready to roll without any fucking about with my hop or where my sights where zero'd at. It also meant that even if the guy I was shooting was wearing a think hoodie/PMC jacket with plater carrier, they'd feel my shots hit them even at the longest ranges I would be engaging at my local site (RIP The Stan).

 

I'll be changing my setup to a red poppet and amped purple nozzle for increased shot efficiency and a higher FPS (aiming for around 310fps with 0.28g, 1.24J ) since I only have outdoor sights available to me now. I'm also switching to Valkyrie BB's on a trail basis since I've heard good things and a few friends who've tried them say they get better consistency with them. I'm going with 0.28g because they don't do 0.3's and their 0.32g are a bit too expensive for me right now. 

 

Regulator: Wolverine Storm - 40 - 140 PSI range. Nothing to say other than works perfectly with my fusion engine. 

 

If you've got any specific questions, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer but from what I've read so far you're on track for a good polarstar setup. The fusion engine was designed around VFC M4 bodies when it was being designed so should be as close to, if not, just drop in and go as you can get for a fusion engine though the Avalon is a newer model but I doubt much has changed in terms of internal dimensions.

 

Finally, thank you for give me an opportunity to talk and gush about my hpa setup! 😁 I don't get to do it often but I really do love to do it when I can (I suspect we all just want someone to listen to us talk about airsoft endless, its why we're all on this forum after all!)

Thanks for this post, it’s very informative

 

So are you still trialing the Valkyrie BBs then? How do they compare?

 

Im confused about BB weights tbh. I read from multiple sources that increasing the BB weight holds the speed better, which seems logical. However because we are keeping under 1.9 jules, we must run less fps and according to a few online range calculators the best range is running at 450fps 0.2g - unless I’ve used the calculator wrong which is possible!

 

So my question is, price aside, are we always better running heavier bbs with less fps for max range?

 

Also, did your ambidextrous selector switch require any modifications when running with the fusion?

 

Thanks,

[Adolf Hamster]

 

23 minutes ago, Bob Ross said:

Im confused about BB weights tbh. I read from multiple sources that increasing the BB weight holds the speed better, which seems logical. However because we are keeping under 1.9 jules, we must run less fps and according to a few online range calculators the best range is running at 450fps 0.2g - unless I’ve used the calculator wrong which is possible!

 

So my question is, price aside, are we always better running heavier bbs with less fps for max range?

 

don't worry, it's pretty counter-intuiitive.

 

i had the same confusion so like the complete nerd i am sat down and did the maths on it:

basically if you're firing at the same muzzle energy, and your hop unit can spin it, then heavier is always better for range.

 

travelling slower does mean you gotta learn to lead properly, but then that's just part of what passes in airsoft for marksmanship. it's really satisfying when you get it right and the target literally walks into the round.

[Shamal]

1 hour ago, Adolf Hamster said:

 

 

don't worry, it's pretty counter-intuiitive.

 

i had the same confusion so like the complete nerd i am sat down and did the maths on it:

basically if you're firing at the same muzzle energy, and your hop unit can spin it, then heavier is always better for range.

 

travelling slower does mean you gotta learn to lead properly, but then that's just part of what passes in airsoft for marksmanship. it's really satisfying when you get it right and the target literally walks into the round.

Bit like clay pigeon shooting.

[Adolf Hamster]

22 minutes ago, Shamal said:

Bit like clay pigeon shooting.

 

.48's in the makarov was a fun one, sure it'd reach out but at a mere 0.75j you had to fire in the morning game and hope after lunch someone would pick the wrong spot to stand in

 

gave up with that malarkey after realising i was changing bulged nozzles nearly as often as i was changing magazines and the thing was shooting further than i can actually aim a pistol anyway.....

[Encore]

5 hours ago, Bob Ross said:

Thanks for this post, it’s very informative

 

So are you still trialing the Valkyrie BBs then? How do they compare?

 

Im confused about BB weights tbh. I read from multiple sources that increasing the BB weight holds the speed better, which seems logical. However because we are keeping under 1.9 jules, we must run less fps and according to a few online range calculators the best range is running at 450fps 0.2g - unless I’ve used the calculator wrong which is possible!

 

So my question is, price aside, are we always better running heavier bbs with less fps for max range?

 

Also, did your ambidextrous selector switch require any modifications when running with the fusion?

 

Thanks,

 

Happy to share any knowledge I can!

 

My first game with them will be on the 22nd so I'll let you know after then.

 

Hamster's post once again does a perfect job explaining bb weight vs fps. 

 

Heavier bb's generally tend to be better if you can hop it and they're still moving quick enough to hit some faster than they can dodge it. The only exception being if you're at a matrix themed event where everyone wants to dodge bullets like neo 😂.

 

Nope, just took the system that game with the G&G originally and fitted it to the fusion engine. Works a charm. Only thing that required work was filling down the G&G selector plate along its edges to fit inside the channels for the selection plate on the fusion engine. 

[Bob Ross]

Thanks for all the advice, I appreciate it
 

First and foremost I’d like this to be a DMR build, however I do like the idea of having a RIF that’s versatile too, allowing me to run and gun (potentially on full auto); or even CQB with a little pre-game setup of course!

 

I’m currently trying to decide between tuning the RIF to fire .36g BB’s, which may fall short in the DMR territory (+ proving expensive when in full auto); and running .40g+ BB’s for DMR and ~.25g BB’s full auto and adjusting the hop-up to compensate. Is this a terrible idea? 😬 ... perhaps I could save a little and get another RIF for shorter play styles - but then it would be a shame to waste the potential of the Fusion engine, huge air tank and super fast regulator.

 

 

The kit I have so far ...

 

- VFC Avalon sabre

- Polarstar Fusion v2

- 1-4x primary arms classic variable scope

- Polarstar Mr gen 2 regulator

- Shark composite 68cl 4500psi tank

- Amped HPA leads

 

The kit I’m considering, includes:

 

- PRS height adjustable stock

- Longer barrel (internal and external)

- Xcortech X3300W chrono suppressor 

- Mid cap mags

 

Anything else I’m missing? 

 

 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

i used to run .32's mainly in mine with .48's saved for special occasions (but i would still run them on auto like a madman)

 

the only real difference is gonna be in your dwell settings, however if you get it dialed in on one ammo weight then just note down the settings before dialing it in for another.

 

hop wise, well it depends how you set it up, but i have had guns that needed shimming to lift the super heavies and as a result would space anything too light. this is probably more relevant if you're jumping massively in power level between battle rifle and dmr.

 

bearing in mind, whilst semi-locking on an hpa can easily be done electronically, some sites might require mechanical locking too/wont be happy with the notion of being able to switch to auto even on a mechanically locked system by spending 30 seconds in the fcu menu.

 

wouldn't bother with a longer barrel- stick a big foam can on the end and enjoy the quietness instead.