Spray painting a two tone airsoft gun

[GunmanAirsoft]

Oh my God, between now and my previous post which quoted the exact law there have been several posts with massively incorrect information in them.

 

If you are under 18 you cannot buy an IF or a RIF. That is the only thing restricted by age.

 

Anyone of any age can own an IF or a RIF regardless of what they intend on doing with it.

 

To sell, import, manufacture a RIF, or to convert an IF to a RIF you need a valid defence.

 

A valid defence is using it at an organised, insured Airsoft event. The minimum attendance is one event.

 

If you want to spray your two tone gun in a realistic colour and you will be playing with it at an organised and insured event then you can do it. There is no age restriction on doing this apart from the fact that under 18s cannot buy cans of spray paint.

 

Sources are:

 

Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006 (Sections 36 & 37)

 

Violent Crime Reduction Act 2006 (Realistic Imitation Firearms) Regulations 2007

 

Firearms Act 1968 (Section 24a)

[Sacarathe]

At least two errors/inaccuracies there. That's a big trouble with large law related posts, the more words to you add the more errors duth appear. Third line is too absolute, fourth line has a syntax error for whom the defence belongs.

[Sitting Duck]

yawn to 3 pages.......

 

started typing an essay - but tbh I thought......

ahh bollox to it all in the end coz all the vcra/ukara stuff is just going over same ol' same ol' as last thread

 

apart from the fact that under 18s cannot buy cans of spray paint.

 

Can under 18's be "gifted" cans of spray paint ???

sorry - just couldn't resist that one

[Mos]

yep ^

 

I own a RIF, I don't have UKARA, nor am I over 18. Nor do I know the law aha.

 

but I do play airsoft. And pretty much if you play airsoft you're fine, you just need to prove it.

 

UKARA equal form or defence, I think.

I get a receipt from the airsoft site people. As my defence until my older brother can get th UKARA defence all sorted.

[Aengus]

Let's say you spilt some fairy power spray and tried to scrub it off but all of your two tone came off what would the punishment be if caught?

[Sitting Duck]

Let's say you spilt some fairy power spray and tried to scrub it off but all of your two tone came off what would the punishment be if caught?

 

30yrs min of hard labour cleaning ovens with Fairy Power Spray

that is if the trial gets to Old Bailey coz they can prove beyond all shadow of doubt that YOU was the one that did it

I bought it at car boot sale already like it - from Nobby in the pub blah blah blah

 

They are trying to bring back death penalty I think if anybody under 99yrs uses Fairy on anything other than ovens

plus if you do clean ovens you have to be registered as a professional oven cleaner and clean at least 3 ovens in 2 months

 

again - most ukara/vcra stuff is just going over same ol' same ol'.

skirmish = defense

above all don't be a dick and try to act/play responsibly with ya IF or RIF or peeew peeew toy gun what ever colour it is

[Aengus]

 

30yrs min of hard labour cleaning ovens with Fairy Power Spray

that is if the trial gets to Old Bailey coz they can prove beyond all shadow of doubt that YOU was the one that did it

I bought it at car boot sale already like it - from Nobby in the pub blah blah blah

 

They are trying to bring back death penalty I think if anybody under 99yrs uses Fairy on anything other than ovens

plus if you do clean ovens you have to be registered as a professional oven cleaner and clean at least 3 ovens in 2 months

 

again - most ukara/vcra stuff is just going over same ol' same ol'.

skirmish = defense

above all don't be a dick and try to act/play responsibly with ya IF or RIF or peeew peeew toy gun what ever colour it is

I'll be clearer if you breach the VCRA what would be the consequences (if a policeman arrested you)

[Sitting Duck]

I'll be clearer if you breach the VCRA what would be the consequences (if a policeman arrested you)

 

yes you may be in breach of the vcra section blah blah blah.....

but as to what the consequences are will totally vary on the arresting officer/station officer

 

if you have defense - a reason to have an airsoft gun then quite likely nothing will happen

at worst they "may" confiscate the gun and caution you if first offense etc....

All depends on circumstances on each case

 

BUT AND IT IS A BIG BUT - bigger than Kim Kardashian's ar$e....

 

WHAT THE F*CK are YOU doing to raise suspicion for a police officer to arrest you ffs ???

in rare circumstances you might be taking pot shots in ya secluded garden

you may have annoyed the neighbours and they might have been anal to call police......

 

BUT - if you was a c@nt and took your gun whatever f*cking colour it is out to show ya mates n stuff

Then yes you will attract attention and run the risk of a visit by local police or worse

which goes back to the "don't be a dick"

 

Airsoft gun - used for airsoft at a proper airsoft site - no real come backs

 

Airsoft gun - used by a dick - dick gets arrested is what I am saying

 

VCRA/UKARA is designed to stop/reduce the chances of "dick" getting hold of a RIF

though Dick can still get a RIF or a IF and repaint to change to appearance

but though it can be done - Dick will still be a Dick no matter what, unless they bring in a new DICK Act 2016

 

Do not get me wrong - even proper ukara responsible players can still be Dick

but Adult UKARA Dick should know better and may face more serious penalty if he has violated the DICK Act

 

An airsoft player - whatever their age or if they are/aren't UKARA'd registered....

If you act responsible you have nothing to worry about at the end of the day

if you act like Dick - then you are a f*cking Dick

 

NB - soz to any people called Richard etc... this was just a general term used to get point across to others

I'm not promoting or saying do this or that but you only gotta worry if you act like a dick really

[proffrink]

yep ^

 

I own a RIF, I don't have UKARA, nor am I over 18. Nor do I know the law aha.

 

but I do play airsoft. And pretty much if you play airsoft you're fine, you just need to prove it.

 

UKARA equal form or defence, I think.

I get a receipt from the airsoft site people. As my defence until my older brother can get th UKARA defence all sorted.

No, the under 18 thing is a no-no, so keep it to yourself. This boring thread is about converting IFs to RIFs and that's where the law is grey because of what a valid defence is. Owning Buying under 18? That's very clear-cut - you can't do it. To all intents and purposes your parents should be the actual owners buyers of the gun, but then they'd have to provide a defence.

 

Again, keep it to yourself

[Sitting Duck]

same ol' same ol'

 

keep it under wraps - don't be like Dick = no worries

 

we can't/won't be seen to promote or assist people who should not be owning a RIF or whatever

if u18 and you can't persuade your parents to buy you an IF - soz can't help ya

repainting IF - whatever your age is a grey area at best but probably ok for a skirmisher to own a repainted IF

NEVER SAID IT WAS LEGALLY OK TO PAINT IT !!! but if it was painted gifted blah blah blah is slightly different

 

If your parents are against you owning or going airsoft - tough $hit I'm afraid, yes life isn't fair

and sure they have their reasons - yes parents are out of touch you think

(when you hit 25+ you start to slowly realise they weren't so dumb and did know a thing or two)

 

you should all know that by now & use common sense discretion act mature & responsible

(yeah it is difficult sometimes but do try to where our sport is concerned)

 

play safe and non-dick like = job done

play bit means you actually do participate in airsoft rather just wanna own a gun coz it is cool

non-dick = uhm do you really need me to explain this anymore ???

 

peace x x x

[Sacarathe]

No, the under 18 thing is a no-no, so keep it to yourself. This boring thread is about converting IFs to RIFs and that's where the law is grey because of what a valid defence is. Owning under 18? That's very clear-cut - you can't do it. To all intents and purposes your parents should be the actual owners of the gun, but then they'd have to provide a defence.

 

Again, keep it to yourself

 

The manufacturing offence does not state you need to own the 'gun' when converting it from an IF to a RIF. Though I expect that's some kind of oversight.

[jcheeseright]

No, the under 18 thing is a no-no, so keep it to yourself. This boring thread is about converting IFs to RIFs and that's where the law is grey because of what a valid defence is. Owning under 18? That's very clear-cut - you can't do it. To all intents and purposes your parents should be the actual owners of the gun, but then they'd have to provide a defence.

 

Again, keep it to yourself

 

 

OWNERSHIP IS NOT LEGISLATED AGAINST AT ALL. THERE IS NO AGE RESTRICTION ON THE OWNERSHIP OF AN AIRSOFT GUN.

 

The VCRA ONLY legislates against SALE, MANUFACTURE and IMPORT. Ownership is not mentioned at any point, therefore it is not illegal for an under 18 to own an airsoft gun be it RIF or otherwise.

 

Please read this: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/38/section/36 & then this: http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/38/section/40

 

Sale of an IF/RIF and purchase of an IF/RIF are illegal when it comes to under 18's, OWNERSHIP is not mentioned and is therefore LEGAL.

[proffrink]

Yes, but he bought it - I know this because I've been following the forums. I shouldn't have said 'owning' and I'm not sure why I did, soz people and sorry jcheese's capslock key; you get too much abuse.

 

It's almost like I said this on page two of this thread:

VCRA only covers the point of sale (apart from the bit about manufacturing).

[jcheeseright]

This is one of those subjects where if you're not 100% clear all of the time people get confused and make all kinds of incorrect assumptions/assertions.

Whenever talking to someone new/ignorant of the VCRA I always make myself as clear as I possibly can in order to avoid that. It's an initially complicated subject that becomes really clear when you realise what people can/can't do.

[proffrink]

No, you're completely correct. That's why I go back and edit posts from time-to-time when I realise I've cocked something up because I vehemently in the camp that says you should search for your problem first before asking it in its own thread. What good is that if all the old posts are laced with subtle mistakes? None at all.

[Mos]

I'm unsure.

 

If the website has a design flaw where someone under 18 can buy a gun, and then the u18 now owns the gun via there flaw.

 

and bearing in mind the VCRA (I think please correct me) protects sellers. Whos at fault now?

 

When you place your bank details, is your age not on the card?

 

Now come someone tell me I'm silly/deluded/wrong.

 

Though I don't mind being wrong.

 

(Edit: corrected the word "flaw")

[proffrink]

Flaw*

 

No, they don't see your age through your bank details. If you lie then that's on you if it goes to court and they made a reasonable effort to confirm your age.

 

As we know though, it won't.

[jcheeseright]

I'm unsure.

 

If the website has a design floor where someone under 18 can buy a gun, and then the u18 now owns the gun via there floor.

 

and bearing in mind the VCRA (I think please correct me) protects sellers. Whos at fault now?

 

When you place your bank details, is your age not on the card?

 

Now come someone tell me I'm silly/deluded/wrong.

 

Though I don't mind being wrong.

 

It is an offence for an under 18 to buy a gun, doesn't matter if the website you buy it from has a flaw that allows you to do it.

[proffrink]

This thread just keeps getting more boring eh.

 

The bank holds it but they don't give that information out. Not at least with Visa or MasterCard. The cards themselves don't hold any personal data at all - they just serve as an identity in ways. Actual sensitive information is held on servers and simply checked against by the information you provide when you check out. You couldn't ever purely decipher the information on a credit/debit card to give you someone's address.

 

Again though, it's worth noting the liability is on the seller, not the buyer. I have no idea who'd be at fault if something like that ever went to court. They'd probably have to prove that they made a reasonable, good faith effort to obtain your age. An 'enter your age' box is almost certainly enough for this.

[Callsign_Tempest]

Hi, so I’m 15, 16 in June and my kit is impersonating the West Midlands CTSFO’s, I want to have RIF’s as I currently have red two tones, what can I do as I’m not allowed to obtain a ukara yet, (BTW my dad purchases my IF’s), I’ve been told I can be gifted them, but can I myself paint over the current two tone as it is also wearing off? 

[Tommikka]

18 minutes ago, Callsign_Tempest said:

Hi, so I’m 15, 16 in June and my kit is impersonating the West Midlands CTSFO’s, I want to have RIF’s as I currently have red two tones, what can I do as I’m not allowed to obtain a ukara yet, (BTW my dad purchases my IF’s), I’ve been told I can be gifted them, but can I myself paint over the current two tone as it is also wearing off? 

If your father had a Defence then he could gift you RIFs

 

You can paint your two tone that is wearing off - but should paint in the bright colours as specified in the VCRA to retain their IF status.

 

If you paint them black then you are modifying an IF into a RIF, and don’t have a Defence to back yourself up.

 

[Callsign_Tempest]

3 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

If your father had a Defence then he could gift you RIFs

 

You can paint your two tone that is wearing off - but should paint in the bright colours as specified in the VCRA to retain their IF status.

 

If you paint them black then you are modifying an IF into a RIF, and don’t have a Defence to back yourself up.

 

 So a defence is basically just a reason on why I did it or evidence that I could do it?

[Tommikka]

15 minutes ago, Callsign_Tempest said:

 So a defence is basically just a reason on why I did it or evidence that I could do it?

The VCRA governs Realistic Imitation Firearms.  A defence in this context is the valid reason for purchasing, importing, manufacturing (or modifying) a RIF

 

Defences in the core legislation are for museums, theatre, film and TV, reenactment etc 

Airsoft skirmishing was added by ‘statutory instrument’, the UKARA scheme was brought in to establish and document a players status as a skirmisher.  But you are underage and cannot obtain that defence yourself.

 

 

Arguably you could claim that your intent is only to paint your IFs into RIFs for the purpose of airsoft skirmishing at established insured sites, and you may be technically be within the law.  But you also could fail to do so in which case you would be committing an offence under the VCRA.

 

(Note that the original drafts of the bill had repainting an IF into a RIF as an explicit offence just by doing so. It isn’t as black and white now)

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Callsign_Tempest]

2 minutes ago, Tommikka said:

The VCRA governs Realistic Imitation Firearms.  A defence in this context is the valid reason for purchasing, importing, manufacturing (or modifying) a RIF

 

Defences in the core legislation are for museums, theatre, film and TV, reenactment etc 

Airsoft skirmishing was added by ‘statutory instrument’, the UKARA scheme was brought in to establish and document a players status as a skirmisher.  But you are underage and cannot obtain that defence yourself.

 

 

Arguably you could claim that your intent is only to paint your IFs into RIFs for the purpose of airsoft skirmishing at established insured sites, and you may be technically be within the law.  But you also could fail to do so in which case you would be committing an offence under the VCRA.

 

(Note that the original drafts of the bill had repainting an IF into a RIF as an explicit offence just by doing so. It isn’t as black and white now)

 

 

 

 

 

 

So if I wanted to take the risk I can say that my defence is only painting the IF to an RIF is for use on a skirmish field and to go with my kit, as I’m sixteen this year which means I’m legally obliged to speak for myself I may have more of a chance of getting away with that defence, but who would ask about my RIF, site manager?

[Tommikka]

‘Defence’ is not you defending from prosecution, eg in court.

 

If a player buys a RIF then that player does so under the skirmisher defence.

But it is the retailer who would be liable under legislation if the player does not have the defence 

 

That means a retailer might need to go to court one day and defend themselves from prosecution, establishing that their ‘Legal defence’ is that they reasonably ensured that the buyer had a VCRA ‘defence’ implying that they intended to use the RIF for skirmishing.

 

In modifying then you are the individual who could be liable for prosecution and could need to prove your legal defence of your skirmisher defence 

2 minutes ago, Callsign_Tempest said:

So if I wanted to take the risk I can say that my defence is only painting the IF to an RIF is for use on a skirmish field and to go with my kit, as I’m sixteen this year which means I’m legally obliged to speak for myself I may have more of a chance of getting away with that defence, but who would ask about my RIF, site manager?

The site manager won’t care.

The greater risk is to come to the attention of the police 

 

One way to start defending your position is to not tell people that you are painting it