finally finished my scar what u think

[MrCheesman94]

its shooting at 340-360fps video doesnt do it justice

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O3syIjAzkec&feature=youtu.be

 

 

[M_P]

Meh.

High rofs don't interest me.

[DEDSEC]

Quite true. To me,

 

High fire rate = waste of ammo & extra stress on internals so they won't last as long.

 

Plus if you prefer the less dickish style of gameplay you'd use semi only (I do). High rate of fire builds seem like a waste of money and like I said, ammo. You squeeze the trigger and 30 bb's bombard your target when really, you only need 1-10 depending on range, and atmospheric conditions.

 

Only time I'd ever go full auto is if there is a large group of targets (excess of five people within a five metre radius of each other) or some pleb isn't taking his hits.

 

Does sound nice though.

[n1ckh]

Mines a high ROF as its a support weapon but a 2 second pull of the trigger and it spits out about 7 or 8 rounds, that's enough to keep anyone's head down

 

I went mad on 2 people yesterday cause they wouldn't take there hits so a fair few of us complained through out the day about both of them and they got followed by the marshalls

[Chock]

It's an impressive ROF, but it's not really true to the real weapon you are attempting to emulate; more like a 9mm SMG's ROF, such as an UZI or a Skorpion maybe. Both the light and the heavy SCARs do have quite high rates of fire, but yours looks around twice the ROF of the 5.56 SCAR to me. The heavy calibre SCAR is noted for its compensator and stock etc making it seem like a much lower calibre in terms of the recoil and barrel climb that it transmits, but even so, I think if it was pumping 7.62x51 rounds out at the rate yours is, you'd have a hard time keeping it on target (not to mention probably melting the barrel), as in spite of the SCAR heavy controlling recoil better than older weapons and dissipating heat quite well - thanks to its more modern design - the fact is, 7.62 weapons do still take some controlling and fire discipline when on full auto.

 

Of course it's your weapon, you can have it fire how you like, but personally, I prefer it when my airsoft guns have some parity with their real firearm counterparts, i.e. I would want an AK to be doing somewhere around 600 rounds per minute rather than 6,000 lol. I'm also more inclined to fire on semi, usually relying on a three round triple tap, which I find is just as effective at keeping people's heads down or hitting them as letting half my mag go would have been. It's why even though my GBB MP5K has a ridiculously high rate of fire on full auto, which is admittedly fun to demonstrate (It can empty the standard 20 round mag in less than a second on full auto, so even the longer 50 round mags I have would hardly be that practical either). Thus I would find it totally impractical as a weapon for CQB skirmishing (which is what the MP5K is supposed to be for) if I did not prefer to shoot on semi-auto as most SWAT and SF teams would also do.

 

So I think that high ROFs are more use for a p*ssing contest in the test area where your gun is being chrono'd than for practical purposes, since in a skirmish you're either on target when shooting or you're not, and if you're on target and people are taking their hits, then one round is as good as twenty. But, above all, airsoft is about having fun and doing what you enjoy, so if having a Minigun's ROF on your assault rifle is what floats your boat, then so be it.

[M_P]

Mines a high ROF as its a support weapon but a 2 second pull of the trigger and it spits out about 7 or 8 rounds, that's enough to keep anyone's head down

I went mad on 2 people yesterday cause they wouldn't take there hits so a fair few of us complained through out the day about both of them and they got followed by the marshalls

You do realise that 4rps is considered pretty slow?

[n1ckh]

I wasn't going for true realism Chock, its fun for me to keep peoples heads down while others move in, as I'm always on a budget its improvise, adapt & overcome

 

As alot of people know, I'm ex infantry so was always in the mix, I love doing airsoft for the social side of it, being with like minded people but I'm really enjoying the support side of it

 

It doesn't spit out 4rps M_P, its more like 20 or 25, i wanted suppressive fire not spray and pray like a lot of people do, so many people I've witnessed have no clue about tactics so they pour money into a weapon

[M_P]

If you do a 2 second trigger pull and it fires 7 or 8 rounds then it can't be 20 or 25 rps.

[n1ckh]

I see what your getting at but it was a guesstimate of how long I hold the trigger for, I fire in bursts but not just spray everything, I have trigger discipline and as its not real life, we can use as much ammo as we want

 

I can 100% garuntee its not that low of a figure

[Guest PT247]

Personally I think high rof guns are more of a danger than high fps when skirmishing. Only reason I can think of for their existence is to intentionally hurt people. Saying that it does take some skill to get them working properly and reliably so appreciate the work that goes into building them. I concentrate my mods on accuracy, range and consistency. Only ever fire in semi even on hpa rigged to a hi-cap except when up against non hit taking.

[Chock]

I wasn't going for true realism Chock, its fun for me to keep peoples heads down while others move in, as I'm always on a budget its improvise, adapt & overcome

 

so many people I've witnessed have no clue about tactics so they pour money into a weapon

 

Oh I know that, and as I say, whatever floats your boat. But your topic did ask us what we thought, so I put what I thought.

 

You are correct of course when you say that a lot of people have no clue about tactics, especially when it comes to fire and move tactics with assault rifles and/or a squad support weapon, even though there is even quite often a clue as to what you should actually be doing in the name of the very weapon you are holding lol, i.e. 'squad support weapon', 'assault rifle', etc. It's obvious that all the many 'one man army' computer games, coupled with lazy AI in them which forces people to play them like that, and possibly stuff like action movies too, is where we can lay a lot of the blame.

 

Lots of people simply don't get that the way to win is invariably to be found in being a team player.

[n1ckh]

It makes me laugh so hard when "Rambo" runs around trying to kill everyone and gets tagged the second he pops his head up

 

It wasn't me that started the thread and I always take criticism on board as I can come up with good ideas from it and learn so much, we all have our ways of playing and what roles we play it was originally my son who wanted me to turn it into a support type rifle and I believe it does just that, its not the best (compared to an M249) but it certainly keeps peoples heads down when I open up

[M_P]

Trust me it's as good as if not better than a 249. In airsoft they all shoot pretty much the same, being lighter and smaller is an advantage, an m249 is only better in that it looks the part

[MrCheesman94]

this is just my toy i have a polarstar dmr thats going to be my baby when its fully finished

[Guest PT247]

Is always good to have a toy you can do crazy stuff to, my G5 is making me quite inventive and getting me trying out different set ups etc to see what works best! :-)

[Sitting Duck]

Jeez - out of interest what is that 40+ ???

 

SSG - 12 or 13:1 hi speed gears & beefy motor

or did ya go nutz on DSG build...

 

I got to 30+ on stock 18:1 & hi speed motor using 11.1v

but most likely will perhaps stick with either:

 

20 on 7.4v lipo

or

25 on 9.6v nimah or 9.9v life

 

That is more than fast enough in my book, to try & make her last a bit

may just stay around that & use speed or slightly lower rate if using hi torque motor

 

just made me own fet - bit rough on the layout/routing wires but don't matter as its first

attempt & still room in stubby stock for the fet & lipo

 

Congrats on ya build sir, hope she lasts a while

sounds amazing to me - congrats once again

[MrCheesman94]

its got 13:1 gears, SHS super high torque motor, 11.1 lipo, m110 spring and a aluminum swiss cheese piston. its fun but when i finish the polarstar i will post a pic of it anyone meets me on the field i'll be happy to let u try it

[Sitting Duck]

nice build and even just using 7.4v will ensure you can still give them hell if you so wish

note to me: avoid worthing/sussex as I may get owned (well more than usual)

[n1ckh]

What difference does using a lower gear ratio ?? other than making them a little faster to turn

 

What effects do they have on the piston etc ??

[dex]

What difference does using a lower gear ratio ?? other than making them a little faster to turn

 

What effects do they have on the piston etc ??

More cycles basically. Ultimately means more stress on the moving parts.

[Sitting Duck]

Everything comes at a price generally speaking......

 

Your box has a life of X shots before it needs service/rebuild

Low ratio or high speed gears that mean higher rof - in a nut shell you will hit that fig X quicker

In true terms your box will quite likely crap out a little before it hits X as running faster would imply more heat/wear

 

You can't just shove hi speed gears in and expect cheap stock motor to pull it easily - or at very least at bit more strain

even with higher volts (more heat generated in stock wiring), a stock motor probably won't easily shift high speed 13 or 12:1

(if it does then I'd say the stock ferrite motor's balls will just drop off real soon/burn out/refuse to budge)

 

Like a car when you start upgrading things you find you need to also upgrade quite a few bits in the end....

 

Luckily - G&G do build their $hit well - they radius the front of cylinder area on box which is supposed to help absorb the shock of piston

BUT - like most low/med end stuff it is just quickly assembled & not even running at full stock potential:

AOE isn't done (2nd tooth is removed but I snapped a piston just by throwing in hi speed motor & no AOE)

Nozzle has no O ring and piston seal along with cylinder head wasn't great either.

 

So if your gun starts to show signs of losing power say under 300fps then those few stock improvements can really help

As well as all springs lose power over time so new m100 or m105 can be fitted, check shims grease etc....

If the owner feels confident or thinks wtf I'll have a go like me

 

On most guns it will pay dividends - but just recently discovered the lame CM FH made matters worse

How come - yup box is running sweet on a "normal" barrel but on a 120mm barrel the cyl/barrel ratio is out

never mattered before coz is was pi$$ poor seals etc but now it is way out or rather way over 1.8 ratio

I get 340fps on M4 but same box on 120mm barrel I get 270pfs

yup need to put in a MP5K cylinder with ports halfway or bore it myself (will try n hack a full type 0 cylinder first)

 

The above is an extreme rare example - the blue cylinder port is fine for short raider 233 to 275 on cm18 btw

so by just checking seals, new spring and perhaps AOE will help box run much more efficiently.

That will give you more fps and help with range if hop/barrel is all good

Won't give you more rof but will help it loads and greased up will last longer running stock setup

 

If you chuck in a more powerful motor to increase torque speed rof etc.... then if you stay in single figures

you may get away without a fet but then using fet will save contacts & help response and a tiny bit more efficiently

Most higher speed/torque motors are neodym magnets as opposed to ferrite

(spin motor - stock motor can turn easy - ferrite but high torque won't budge much coz stronger neodym magnets)

 

You should not really need a braking fet for a neo motor - ferrite yes at higher volts neo not really

Reason being the stronger neo magnets will slow motor very quickly once voltage stops

ferrite will roll onwards and can double fire on higher volts so people use braking to stop motor

but reverse polarity generates a fair amount of heat itself

so don't use it and just use normal single fet on a neodym motor as long as you don't too mental

though on higher speed gears the chance of double feed increases coz of ratio bevel to sector gear

Hence reason for me sticking to stock 18:1 gears on hi speed motor

(6 turns of bevel = 1 sector turn compared to just 4 bevel gear turns - 1 sector rotation on 12:1)

 

Torque motors "usually" turn a little bit slower rof but not much say 30 vs 26 on a SHS high torque

but some others are just that torque with not so great increase in rof over stock say 20ish over stock 15 rps

 

Before people get too carried away with all this - the real M4 only fires at 15/16rps I think

 

Whoa soz - waffling again and I have still $hitloads to learn but just keep breaking stuff and learning is giving me a buzz atm

If when ya gun starts to lose its oomphy mojo then check a few things and get it running sweet on stock is my lame nooby advice to most

Then if you got it running nice you can go nutz gradually like motor and/or fet etc......

trying to chuck in higher gears/motor and loads of volts without a bit of care & basic tweaks will just mean it goes bang very quickly

(3 broke pistons, 2 sheared crappy gear sets so far)

 

In the end it is nice to get a gun running bloody quick but then you don't have to push silly volts through it if you don't want to

and can just go easy on the juice and still have a better setup gun than stock when you are done

 

Hop/barrel sorted & I am ready to own the field - ergh nah I am still $hit at this airsoft stuff

but at least my gun is performing better - even if I am still $hit

[n1ckh]

Cheers dex

 

@ duck

 

I'm thinking of changing out the piston and head plus maybe a nozzle as I think both M4's are down on FPS, I can't remember if G&G gearboxes have and o-ring the head but I know the nozzle doesn't where as my G36C does on the piston

[Sitting Duck]

cylinder head is fine - bit of plumbers tape wrapped round it to ensure good seal

 

nozzle get a shs red m4 nozzle - there 2 types:1 has 1 o-ring nozzle other has 2 o-rings either will do:

 

1152195485 = single o-ring

1152200427 = 2 o-ring nozzles

 

piston & head are ok but get a couple of piston o-rings coz green G&G one on piston is $hit seal

 

sorbo pad - maybe 2 on cylinder head if you wanna do AOE

self adhesive rubber washers M4 20mm ebay# 250981193606 will do the trick

 

2nd tooth on stock piston is already removed - cheers G&G

may need to shave a bit off 3rd tooth - this will lose a little fps coz piston isn't travel so far but a must

if you go further at some stage with motor gears fet etc.......

 

Good seals will cancel out any slight loss from doing AOE btw

 

and if not then new spring will more than boost it way back up to what it should be

 

shs m100 spring or Element M105 if your site is 350 limit (about £4)

 

about £15 if source it on fleabay + some grease & common sense & take ya time

that should put some kick back in her and if greased & gears/shim are good

then you can go further at a later stage - but will be running much more efficient even from new

 

One final thing is a possible bearing spring guide like SHS-037

the G&G piston doesn't have bearing on it and when tweaking/modding it is wise to fit something

to reduce spring twisting - if fitted to piston then it adds weight when most want a lighter piston

for hi rof setup - mostpeople I think go for spring guide bearing than piston - though some do both

admit I haven't done this yet but will be ordering some SHS-037's in new year myself

(piston bearings can crumble/disintegrate/undo if not fitted correctly and thread seal glue)

yeah I'll just use a bearing spring guide for now & see how it goes

 

Oh and mega mega thanks to Samurai:

Stick a little round earth magnet under the AR latch when opening & refitting box back together

bloody amazing trick to get that f*cking AR bastid to stay put

cheers sir at least I only need 3 hands now to close a gearbox

[n1ckh]

Cheers duck, I'll write all this down and get it in the new year with a few other bits

[Sitting Duck]

spring guide is perhaps if you are taking to the next level as it didn't come with one

I will fit one when I open another up to do fet n motor malarky next time

 

gonna order stuff early in new year - get xmas over with

but before you know it it will be Chinese New Year and nowt happens for over a week in far east

so I best remember to order up sooner rather than later and forget again

 

see how ya go - silent pistons & heads I'm still unsure about - they deffo don't add extra punch imho

and stock stuff is ok just needs a little tweak here n there really

blimey you go too mad and you will blow over £50 on each gun - ffs its just a toy mrs duck says

No - its MY toy gun I say - you go & buy yet ANOTHER pair of shoes/bag/stuff for crying out loud

 

soz to OP - gatecrashing his gun thread - still nice gun though