Pseudotectonic

Just brainstorming but are there other airsoft bodies in other countries that are somewhat similar to a regulation body in that country? How are they shaped in relation to the triangle of retailers, site owners, and players? Because let's say in the far future airsoft develops an international federation of its own, which is required for olympics (https://olympics.com/ioc/international-federations), it might be helpful to learn from other countries and their associations and it's never too early to start I suppose Back to the UK, I think UKARA at least has a clear purpose and is functional. It seems UKAPU is at least poised to sit in the players corner. At the moment the site owners corner is vacant, because ATB/UKAF does not inspire a whole lot of confidence let alone looking competent enough. I guess in order to research and develop some version of a federation airsoft we will at least need the player's corner and site owner's corner to co-lead the process (probably as a consortium), while having UKARA on the side as support because the growth of the sport also means growth of their profit. Because it needs to be a project that benefits everyone. And if UKAF is non-functioning, it is all down to UKAPU to step up. But they don't seem to have the resources. But I don't think the final result should be a governing body (at least not in the beginning), to even to start, we really just need the rules and definitions of the sport written on a piece of paper. It is largely just a white paper. And the only thing to do afterwards is to wait for fields to adopt and players to adopt and for the hobby to catch up, and hopefully the benefits will be clear enough to become a de-facto adopted format of airsoft, then we can talk about regulating and governing. -- I think we need AI to do the work

Best you can do is do surveys of the rules of every field and publish a white paper on the findings, then you can think about how to draw similarities and think about pros and cons of unifying which rules at what costs and what impact Then you can try to come up with one version of a regularised version of airsoft, publish it, and hope the fields will adopt it the UKARA list of registered fields is a good starting point You can set up a dedicated forum (somewhere outside facebook) and then use it as a base of operation, do a program and recruit volunteers to complete chunks of surveys for you and then have people write the stuff and publish it But surely that is not part of the UKAPU's mission, they have got enough on their plate You need a consortium for airsoft regularisation research (come up with a better name), for the sole mission of coming up with one version of a semi-improved airsoft ruleset, or some sort of standard framework for fields to adopt Later on you can convince some fields for testing and also publish the experiment results and go from there

I mean, their claim of "Preservation of UK airsoft" is obviously a lie, because if it is true, they would have at least some evidence to show for it, but there is zero evidence of this. And UK airsoft is not under any threat that needs any entity to work "tirelessly" to preserve. If they work tirelessly, what exactly are they doing tirelessly?

lol so it's true they do absolutely nothing and then lie about it on their page to lure people to donate? that is fraud, you know

I was referencing the membership "donation" and to their claimed purpose of "Preservation of UK airsoft" and "worked tirelessly to protect UK airsoft form various attempts to ban or overly restrict airsoft by the government and police" which frankly is pure horseshit, excuse my language If I say I "work all day and night keeping bad juju at bay so the world is safe for everybody to live in" and ask people to setup standing orders to give me £3 a year they'd put me away

What specifically is the legal help? It says it only deals with border force seized goods and issues with police, so what exactly do you do to help? Do you submit notice of claim for the person and follow up? And what do you do with the police exactly?

I didn't know I can be disappointed in someone larping as a professional body, but I am thoroughly disappointed

Interesting find (Note UKAF is not UKAPU) The codes looks a bit pointless because they are all pretty normal things any business is already expected to do, and with extra restrictions you only find in professional bodies like disciplinary and complaints, lol, what are they gonna do, expel them from their excel file?

steel wire with crimp on ferrules, probably something like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJEXgWAq1vo

I think another possible reason for the twang is if the spring is too short idk why some springs are different lengths

@Asomodai how does it work? do they give expert witness or something? or do they help finding lawyers etc and how does it work in terms of liability, since UKAPU is not a legal entity, would it be down to the assigned (?) volunteer (?) for each case?

@DanBow I think in the UK we already have a rather robust set of laws around airsoft already, which is not really in any danger that I am aware of, so there is no such shit that can hit the fan, so to speak, and even if it might, the UK legislation process is long enough and we will have opportunities to fight it, but until then, we cannot predict what it is about, and we cannot prepare for something we have no idea about that might not even exist. Not too long ago Canada had the Bill C-21 which threatened the airsoft community, as far as I know there was not one single "association" to save the day, but it did bought the whole community together and they all lobbied together (obviously there is someone organising some campaigns) but I don't think it was pre-planned. Similarly not too long ago the CPSC-2023-0021 in the US was just a matter of people coming together and put in some signatures (not sure how that turned out) but as far as I know, it didn't end up impacting airsoft in the US. As far as I know, again there was no single organisation responsible. So if such a mythical shit were to manifest and float towards the British fan, I don't think it will be any facebook group that can beat it alone but the entire industry and community will come together, and UKARA being our airsoft illuninati who is about to lose a lot of business is surely going to champion any campaign against such mythical shit. I think the last thread had someone had mentioned the behind the scenes of how UKARA came about or something like that. Just to say, I don't think there is any lobbying to do for anyone at the moment, nor there is any foreseeable existential threat, and even if there is, we won't need a facebook group to "save the day", therefore if you want to join one, you probably want to join it for the other reasons e.g. finding a a community, which is totally valid. But then again, nothing will bring the community together better like another VCRA or something. And if you are just talking about individual cases, I think UKAPU has a few blog posts explaining the law, but that's it, I don't think they provide direct support to any actual case.

-- Allow me to look at this critically, "voluntary non-profit" so logically it survives on donations (or selling patches) "purely to uphold and enhance the reputation of its members" so it's just a marketing consortium "demonstrating exemplary standards in their professional conduct" so it's not for players "within the bounds of legislation" so it's not for criminals (of course) I mean, it sounds like fiction Also, your patch says "I'm a supporter", not "a member", so it means you are basically just a fan, but you're not part of the club On the whole it doesn't seem to have any purpose, other than someone making patches as a hobby

The more I think about it the more I think we probably don't need such an organisation in the UK unless there is some clear specific purpose that calls for it (such as case of UKARA being a framework for providing actual legal defence) Going back to drawing board, these functions are more or less fulfilled without any centralised body. 1. Represent and Promote - already tons of airsoft content on social media and youtube 2. Regulate and Enhance - sort of perpetuated by field owners (game rules and so on) and perhaps insurance 3. Organise and Facilitate - anyone can organise any event Is the airsoft hobby fragmented? Maybe, but is there any benefit of changing that? I don't know -- I think making a patch about a fictional organisation (and writing backstories about it) can be a cool and creative exercise, but I think it needs to be honest in its execution and not mislead people into thinking it is something real. And until they can demonstrate something other than making a patch (anybody can do that) I remain sceptical. Happy to be proven wrong tho. But I don't feel there is an actual vision there, other than buzzwords.

Who runs it?

No names, no source of funding, collecting personal data... hmm...

My opinion has not changed about UKAPU, functionally they are a facebook group that does nothing other than holding AGMs and charging people monthly fee in preparation for a mythical prophecy that one day some legal apocalypse might happen that is when they will save the day. -- If one were to go back to the drawing board, and think of what an actually useful organisation would do, their mission would include fundamentally three things: 1. Represent and Promote 2. Regulate and Enhance 3. Organise and Facilitate 1. Represent and Promote: is basically PR activities (and lobbying, if necessary) for the hobby 2. Regulate and Enhance: is R&D into the nature and rules of the hobby, and developing best practices and codes and so on, to improve safety and fun 3. Organise and Facilitate: is basically running forums, or running events, that can benefit the hobby as a whole -- If we judge UKAPU by these measurements, I don't think they are too effective in any of these

Only 3 shims? Sounds suspicious... Solid bushings actually not a problem But 3 shims sounds too few to have

Perun ROF reduction settings? If not, could be shimming related Bearing bushings or solid bushings?

Speaking of Perun, I had a strange issue with the sticker with the Specna Edge selector plate, I've ruined all the three stickers and eventually on my last ICS sticker trying to troubleshoot and it turns out the blue selector plate itself is reflecting too much IR (?) light for the safe mode to be properly selected (in test mode) so I actually had to paint the side edges of the plate around the whole area near the sensors to fix it, which once I did that it works. Emailed Perun, they say sometimes it does that, but usually once the whole receiver is assembled it should just work and select safe mode no problem. The thing is if it didn't work properly in test mode I wouldn't want to assemble the whole thing. But it's fixed anyway with some paint.

out of curiosity I just tried to reverse engineer the sticker pattern, according to the manual it is just a matter of giving various optical brightness % for the sensor calibration to work, so the stripe pattern is really just meant to be 50% grey these dimensions should be "close enough":

Just noticed the Novatech GP-350 didn't have a delay in that video and it turns out there is indeed some sort of built-in controller with a blue signal wire coming out of the motor... and an included trigger unit? Seems there is also a Reapers video on this, I will watch it later today First glance the motor looks oversized, not sure how it works

@Leo Greer Is your 38 TPA this one? https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005001389831124.html Yeah saw a video that tested it, it sounds surprisingly slow indeed Curiously it only has a stall torque for about ~230 mN.m for ~33 A which is substantially lower than the 28 TPA, looks like while it is technically more efficient (more torque per current) but it seems it simply cannot make full use of the amount of currents we can afford in airsoft Interesting use case for a 14.8 @Sewdhull I take Reaper's "cycle time" with a grain of salt because they don't explain their methodology (maybe they did but I don't speak German) and judging from other trigger response videos floating around, and the 10 ms delay measured above, I suspect their cycle time is taken from a string of full auto divided by the number of shots, because in my head Warhead would be behind a few other brushless (and not at the top of the chart) if it is only measuring the very first shot, which is more important for trigger response Similarly their current chart looks about right, but it doesn't show whether it is semi or full auto (and for how many rounds), and whether their 11.1 is fully charged (i.e. more than 11.1) or at exactly 11.1 measured with a meter, and if they were not through in making sure the battery is at exactly the same voltage before the tests, it can affect the numbers Also different capacity of 11.1 batts will have dramatic differences of Vdrop under load, which can affect trigger response and cycle time So while their charts are good references I have some doubts about their cycle times and I am not sure Warheads have better trigger response than the other brushless as the chart implies

Curiously the Warhead motors have about 10 ms starting delay, could be software related, because they also seem to have some sort of throttle control for those soft ramping amp draw (source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QZozpvzYNQI ) This could be their "secret sauce" for making it as efficient as possible, by sacrificing a little bit of performance at the spin-up. That and the fact that I have to buy a bottle of high strength retaining fluid just to install the pinion gear (and wait 24 hours for it to cure) makes it a no-go for me. If I were to spend money on a brushless I would get any other brushless but not a Warhead. Also, in terms of torque, my observation from watching countless video is I think brushless are no better than a 28 TPA motor for trigger response. Curiously I just dug out the actual numbers and it confirms my suspicion: Chaoli's brushless gives 401.8 mN.m at a cost of 156 A https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006432563689.html Chihai's candidate gives 416 mN.m at a cost of 162.5 A https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006352513842.html a 28 TPA gives 395.65 mN.m with merely 66.875 A https://www.aliexpress.com/item/4000757781793.html And look at this 18 TPA cutie they just came out which gives a whopping 5123.3 mN.m for 167.3 A (I am sure it is a wrong label and should be g.cm rather than mN.m so if it is around 500 mN.m maybe it could compete with brushless if one were to force feed it current) but this does have upgraded magnets https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005006433968020.html I know brushless are more efficient generally speaking, but I still think the higher torque brushed motors are still better (for trigger response), because they have no software issues (e.g. with ETUs) to worry about and and there is no 10 ms boot time delay or other nonsense, you feed it current and it just works. But of course they have higher RPM ceilings and compared to brushed motors with similar RPM they do have better torque. I am just saying, I guess they don't have extra torque more than the highest torque brushed motors.

I'd give them benefit of the doubt and think he might just be an American