UKARA license enquiry

[Drdarkjokes]

I am an avid gun enthusiast, specifically realistic ones that use cartridges, a bit like realistic revolvers with their casings, like an M4A1 as an example, and you don’t get them in the U.K. for cheep, so I bought one online from the US that was imitation only, no shoot, no electronic or gas functions, just a prop that could cycle shells. Now, so I can get this, I need to sign up for a UKARA license however I don’t intend to play airsoft (yet) and for a license I need to have a registered arena and attend games there, but I just want it for the ability to own Rifs. The other way is by getting a gun license but I don’t want something that governmental. I was hoping to reach out to the UKARA but I can’t find a contact. 
thanks for reading, 

DrDarkJokes

[Jez_Armstrong]

You may wish to have a read of this 

 

https://airsoft-forums.uk/topic/1254-popular-ukara-questions/

[hitmanNo2]

First of all, UKARA is not a license.  It's a defence for an exemption. 

 

Secondly even if you had a FAC, you would still be unable to buy RIFs.

 

I assume as you're asking here, your purchase has been pulled by customs and they've asked you for your UKARA? If so, sorry but that's getting confiscated and destroyed. I hope it didn't cost too much.

 

I suggest if you want to own RIFs, just go and play Airsoft. It's really not a big ask.

Edited November 8 by hitmanNo2

[Colin Allen]

36 minutes ago, Drdarkjokes said:

I am an avid gun enthusiast, specifically realistic ones that use cartridges, a bit like realistic revolvers with their casings, like an M4A1 as an example, and you don’t get them in the U.K. for cheep, so I bought one online from the US that was imitation only, no shoot, no electronic or gas functions, just a prop that could cycle shells. Now, so I can get this, I need to sign up for a UKARA license however I don’t intend to play airsoft (yet) and for a license I need to have a registered arena and attend games there, but I just want it for the ability to own Rifs. The other way is by getting a gun license but I don’t want something that governmental. I was hoping to reach out to the UKARA but I can’t find a contact. 
thanks for reading, 

DrDarkJokes

If you want to obtain a UKARA registration, which is actually just a site membership number, you have to play 3 games at that site over a minimum of two months, e.g. the third game being 56 days or more after the first.

There is no other way of doing it.

UKARA registration only provides a defence relating to airsoft toys, not to any other form of imitation firearms.

You probably should have checked the rules on importing imitation firearms before you ordered one from overseas.

[Galvatron]

As kindly as I can say this, your enthusiasm for guns isn't a defence. The whole point of UKARA is that regular players get an exemption for retailers to sell them an airsoft RIF for the purpose of their gameplay having realism. The UKARA defence is ultimately a compromise from a time when new legislation threatened to ban the sale of airsoft RIFs in the UK.

 

If you manage to get in touch with UKARA, don't be surprised if they decline your request to side step the rules with short shrift. If you can't prove you've played to satisfy the requirements, particularly as you've openly expressed no intention to play, you shouldn't hold you breath for an exception or a fast track UKARA number because you didn't familiarise yourself with  import laws & restrictions. They're unlikely to risk undermining their own position for the sake of one person who doesn't want "something that governmental" to show some credbility on his part as a responsible owner.

 

I reckon you should treat this as an expensive learning experience because I would be surprised if Customs is willing to hold on whatever airsoft gun/replica firearm/prop it was that you ordered for more than 56 days before destroying it.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tommikka]

@Drdarkjokes

 

The VCRA made the sale, import and manufacture of Realistic Imitation Firearms 

 

Defences under the legislation are for museums, re-enactments theatrical and airsoft skirmishing 

 

The UKARA is the main recognised skirmishers defence - a non shooting RIF is unsuitable for airsoft skirmishing therefore does not apply to your purchase.

(Note that on import your package is looked at on a case by case basis - you could end up with your import being destroyed due to attempting to use a skirmishers defence for a non shooting RIF)

 

Your stated purpose of collecting does not fall under any VCRA defence - you may have made an expensive mistake

 

Adding in a comment that you don’t want something ‘governmental’ sounds alarm bells as to why you want to import something that looks like a firearm, the import of which is an offence, and don’t want the government to know about it.  

Its hard to justify importing what would be an unlawful item against the legally defined purposes to a government department such as Border Force by stating that you don’t want the government to know what you are doing

Edited November 9 by Tommikka
Corrected purchase to sale

[Jez_Armstrong]

1 hour ago, Tommikka said:

@Drdarkjokes

 

 

Adding in a comment that you don’t want something ‘governmental’ sounds alarm bells as to why you want to import something that looks like a firearm, 

 

 

The second I read that made me think someone wants to rob a bank 

[TrooperX]

2 hours ago, Tommikka said:

 

The VCRA made the purchase, import and manufacture of Realistic Imitation Firearms 

 

I might be wrong but I always understood it was selling, import or manufacture that was an offence without a specific defence.

 

So in a sale of a RIF to someone without eg. a UKARA registration, it is the seller that is committing the offence, not the buyer.  The buyer would only be committing an offence if they attempt to import a RIF into the UK without a defence.

Edited November 9 by TrooperX

[Colin Allen]

3 minutes ago, TrooperX said:

I might be wrong but I always understood it was selling, import or manufacture that was an offence without a specific defence.

 

So in a sale of a RIF to someone without eg. a UKARA registration, it is the seller that is committing the offence, not the buyer.

Correct.

[TrooperX]

On the subject of Firearms Certificates and RIFs… there was a story going round not long after the VCRA came in to play about a couple of Police Firearms Officers who visited an airsoft shop.  They wanted to buy a pistol to mount on a plaque as a gift for someone who was retiring.  They were apparently very shocked to be told the shop couldn’t sell them a RIF, despite them standing there with their real Glocks holstered, because they didn’t have a valid defence.

 

Not sure how true it was and of course they could have been doing some ‘mystery shopping’ in a bid to catch the shop out over the new law.

[Jez_Armstrong]

25 minutes ago, TrooperX said:

On the subject of Firearms Certificates and RIFs… there was a story going round not long after the VCRA came in to play about a couple of Police Firearms Officers who visited an airsoft shop.  They wanted to buy a pistol to mount on a plaque as a gift for someone who was retiring.  They were apparently very shocked to be told the shop couldn’t sell them a RIF, despite them standing there with their real Glocks holstered, because they didn’t have a valid defence.

 

Not sure how true it was and of course they could have been doing some ‘mystery shopping’ in a bid to catch the shop out over the new law.

Faily sure that was us at Pro Airsoft Supplies in North London, we had quite a few visits from AFO's and were shocked when we told them we can't sell them a BB gun, despite them having a big red BMW outside with a boot full of G36's 😂

[Anonymoose]

59 minutes ago, TrooperX said:

On the subject of Firearms Certificates and RIFs… there was a story going round not long after the VCRA came in to play about a couple of Police Firearms Officers who visited an airsoft shop.  They wanted to buy a pistol to mount on a plaque as a gift for someone who was retiring.  They were apparently very shocked to be told the shop couldn’t sell them a RIF, despite them standing there with their real Glocks holstered, because they didn’t have a valid defence.

 

It's bizarre that you can't buy a BB gun without a valid defence, but you can buy an identical and more powerful 4.5mm air gun as long as you're over 18 and have ID.

[JinxDuh]

Hey guys how can I break, uh, I mean, circumvent the legal requirements? I’m totally legit and definitely don’t want to commit crime haha, you believe me, right guys? 

[TrooperX]

27 minutes ago, Anonymoose said:

 

It's bizarre that you can't buy a BB gun without a valid defence, but you can buy an identical and more powerful 4.5mm air gun as long as you're over 18 and have ID.

If you’re over 18 you can buy a .22 air rifle, (which is roughly the same calibre as a 6mm bb) of up to 12ft/lbs, which is roughly 16 joules (vs ~1.1 joules for your average airsoft RIF or ~2.3 joules for your average bolt action).

 

The law is very muddled at times!

 

Edited November 9 by TrooperX

[Enid_Puceflange]

Would some sort of Reenactment club not be a better suggestion for the OP 🤷🏻‍♂️

Edited November 9 by Enid_Puceflange

[JinxDuh]

1 hour ago, Enid_Puceflange said:

Would some sort of Reenactment club not be a better suggestion for the OP 🤷🏻‍♂️

To be honest, yes. I used to purchase RIF’s with my AFRA ID (Yearly paid subscription which provides personal insurance as well as proof of belonging to a reenactment society/group) and never had an issue. 

[Enid_Puceflange]

11 minutes ago, JinxDuh said:

To be honest, yes. I used to purchase RIF’s with my AFRA ID (Yearly paid subscription which provides personal insurance as well as proof of belonging to a reenactment society/group) and never had an issue. 

 

Well, if the OP ever comes back, maybe they/them will notice our suggestion 😄

[Cannonfodder]

I get the feeling that if the OP doesn't want to play airsoft they're probably not going to be interested in reenactment either, especially if they have to pay an annual subscription 

[JinxDuh]

55 minutes ago, Cannonfodder said:

especially if they have to pay an annual subscription

It was a preference thing as most reenactment groups have their own insurance, and the annual fee was £10. (At the time I had it, which was about 10 years ago 😂)

[ButcherBill]

TBH I haven't commented before because I think the OP is baiting... possibly someone who's recently been kicked from the site?

[Cannonfodder]

12 minutes ago, JinxDuh said:

It was a preference thing as most reenactment groups have their own insurance, and the annual fee was £10. (At the time I had it, which was about 10 years ago 😂)

Fair enough, but my point was that if the OP can't be arsed to attend 3 airsoft games they probably won't want to join a reenactment group either

[BigAl]

5 hours ago, Anonymoose said:

 

It's bizarre that you can't buy a BB gun without a valid defence, but you can buy an identical and more powerful 4.5mm air gun as long as you're over 18 and have ID.

 

This is because airguns where already covered under existing firearms law when the VCRB was written.  UK firearms law is a disjointed mess and needs totally overhauling.   However if they ever get round to it it will be bad news for some shooting sports.  Every Airsofter, Paintballer, Air Gunner Shotgunner, Rifle Shooter and Pistol Shooter should get together and join organizations and fight every proposed law, not just the ones that affect them.  Otherwise one day al we'll have left is Fortnight!

[Tommikka]

12 hours ago, Colin Allen said:

Correct.

 

12 hours ago, TrooperX said:

I might be wrong but I always understood it was selling, import or manufacture that was an offence without a specific defence.

 

So in a sale of a RIF to someone without eg. a UKARA registration, it is the seller that is committing the offence, not the buyer.  The buyer would only be committing an offence if they attempt to import a RIF into the UK without a defence.

Correct and edited to fix

 

 

….. to be fair to me, I had spent 4 hours moving tables to set up a comicon the evening before then got up at 5am to drive back there then posted  ….. I’m impressed that the rest made sense

11 hours ago, Anonymoose said:

 

It's bizarre that you can't buy a BB gun without a valid defence, but you can buy an identical and more powerful 4.5mm air gun as long as you're over 18 and have ID.

You can buy a BB gun without a defence ….. but it would be >50% brightly coloured or one of the other criteria of an IF

[Colin Allen]

1 minute ago, Tommikka said:

 

Correct and edited to fix

 

 

….. to be fair to me, I had spent 4 hours moving tables to set up a comicon the evening before then got up at 5am to drive back there then posted  ….. I’m impressed that the rest made sense

Ouch!  That is a tough shift; been there, done that.

[Tommikka]

On 09/11/2024 at 09:12, TrooperX said:

On the subject of Firearms Certificates and RIFs… there was a story going round not long after the VCRA came in to play about a couple of Police Firearms Officers who visited an airsoft shop.  They wanted to buy a pistol to mount on a plaque as a gift for someone who was retiring.  They were apparently very shocked to be told the shop couldn’t sell them a RIF, despite them standing there with their real Glocks holstered, because they didn’t have a valid defence.

 

Not sure how true it was and of course they could have been doing some ‘mystery shopping’ in a bid to catch the shop out over the new law.

 

….. actually ….. though being qualified firearms officers doesn’t give a defence, they did / do have one potential route to a defence:

 

section 37.2(f):

the purposes of functions that a person has in his capacity as a person in the service of Her Majesty

But, giving a leaving present isn’t a purpose in service of Her (or his) majesty

There are potential concepts for the use of airsoft type guns by firearms officers, such as a familiariasion copy - but they are better off using the real thing in a safe manner

Even if an airsoft gun is of use (or a non functioning replica) it would not need to be realistically coloured as a RIF but can happily be a coloured IF ….. and any non real steel use they make of something would be better off with a coloured IF 

 

 

The perfect solution for a display item is a deactivated firearm - but you need the right paperwork

 

You could however make a trip to my local auction

 

They have had two mounted sets (or the same one that was sold a few months ago returned for sale again last week)

 

These have been moulded pieces though, with only half of the body

So as a RIF is something that would be indistinguishable from reality - if you have half shells stuck to a piece of wood are they RIFs?