Raytd Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Hi I know someone who is possibly going to sell his rig to a friend of his who isn’t a .... reassuring person I want to put him off from a legal point can anyone find me a link to where I can find the legal penalties of selling an rig to someone without ukra please Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiercel Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 UKARA only applies to retailers, hence United Kingdom Airsoft Retailers Association. There is no penalty for a private seller selling to someone without it. The act you're looking for is the VCRA. Feel free to Google it for all the Incredibly dull long winded legal mumbo jumbo that in reality is totally unenforceable because there's about 3 police officers left in the whole country, and 2 of them are busy dealing with someone who said something mean on Facebook. I'm sure @Rogerborg will be in here shortly to blow his legal load all over you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raytd Posted July 30, 2019 Author Share Posted July 30, 2019 Really ok I just saw a thing on this website saying how it was illegal but didn’t say what the issues are t thought they had to provide reason for purchasing I can promise the dude buying it isn’t planning on playing airsoft Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiercel Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Im pretty sure nobody has ever been prosecuted under the VCRA for selling a toy gun. You don't have to be an Airsofter to buy Airsoft guns. There's multiple other legal defenses for buying them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callum Hornsby Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 The best way to do it especially if you know the person is ask yourself do you trust them? If not and from your post it seems not then don't sell it too them. If this bloke buys the RIF then does something horrendous with it the police could well prosecute your mate for selling it too him. If he isn't planning to play airsoft with the gun or any of the other protected defences and can't provide proof of this your mate is committing a crime by selling it too him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke85 Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 Im prying, bit what makes you think this potential buyer wont be playing airsoft? What do you believe his real intentions are? Are they potentially criminal? If yes, then I'd have a serious chat to your mate about your concerns. And also remind him that any use of his sold items in anything criminal could perhaps come back on him as well as having a potentially negative impact on airsoft as a whole. If this guy just wants an airsoft gun to plink with though, no harm, so long as hes not an idiot with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommikka Posted July 30, 2019 Share Posted July 30, 2019 31 minutes ago, Raytd said: Hi I know someone who is possibly going to sell his rig to a friend of his who isn’t a .... reassuring person I want to put him off from a legal point can anyone find me a link to where I can find the legal penalties of selling an rig to someone without ukra please A fine of between £2500 and £5000 Ive quoted the relevant areas of the act elsewhere in the forum if you need more evidence of sources Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Rogerborg Posted July 31, 2019 Supporters Share Posted July 31, 2019 17 hours ago, Tiercel said: There is no penalty for a private seller selling to someone without it. Er, it's always an offence to sell a RIF to anyone. https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/38/section/36 You need a defence to that offence, regardless of whether you're a business or private seller. https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/38/section/37 Consequences if you don't have a defence? (9) An offence under this section shall be punishable, on summary conviction— (a) in England and Wales, with imprisonment for a term not exceeding 51 weeks or with a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale, or with both; and (b) in Scotland, with imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or with a fine not exceeding level 5 on the standard scale, or with both. Level 5 fines have been unlimited since 2015. (http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2012/10/section/85 commenced in 2015 http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2015/504/pdfs/uksi_20150504_en.pdf) [Light's cigarette, enters refractory period] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommikka Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 18 hours ago, Tiercel said: UKARA only applies to retailers, hence United Kingdom Airsoft Retailers Association. There is no penalty for a private seller selling to someone without it. The act you're looking for is the VCRA. Feel free to Google it for all the Incredibly dull long winded legal mumbo jumbo that in reality is totally unenforceable because there's about 3 police officers left in the whole country, and 2 of them are busy dealing with someone who said something mean on Facebook. I'm sure @Rogerborg will be in here shortly to blow his legal load all over you. The VCRA is the legislation - correct The UKARA is a retailers association - correct But you are wrong in stating that the UKARA does not relate to private sales The UKARA run a players register to their benefit as retailers, they also allow individuals to verify details on behalf of a potential buyer A private seller (and also a retailer) are not bound by the UKARA scheme. They can accept any method that they are happy to accept Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StayOnTarget Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 Tell your mate to sell his RIF on one of the many forums online failing that what about putting up a sign at the site where he Airsofts that way at least he'll know its going to(hopefully) a legit player Its simply not worth the risk and ask your friend if he could live with the consequences if someone came to harm just over a quick easy sale? Remember its our sport that gets put in the spotlight every time some cunt fucks around with a RIF and thats on him too 🖖 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Rogerborg Posted July 31, 2019 Supporters Share Posted July 31, 2019 37 minutes ago, Tommikka said: The UKARA run a players register to their benefit as retailers, they also allow individuals to verify details on behalf of a potential buyer They shouldn't do, since their GDPR disclosure only says that they'll give details to retailer members and "UK Boarder [sic] Agency to allow player imports of RiFs & 24/7 Intelligence department, Hampshire Police." "Any other third-party access to data would only be permitted when the terms of the Data-Protection act have been for-filled [sic] for legal access requirements." Mind you, not that I can see anyone ever complaining that UKARA have provided a private seller with a defence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators Tackle Posted July 31, 2019 Moderators Share Posted July 31, 2019 42 minutes ago, StayOnTarget said: Tell your mate to sell his RIF on one of the many forums online failing that what about putting up a sign at the site where he Airsofts that way at least he'll know its going to(hopefully) a legit player Its simply not worth the risk and ask your friend if he could live with the consequences if someone came to harm just over a quick easy sale? Remember its our sport that gets put in the spotlight every time some cunt fucks around with a RIF and thats on him too 🖖 agree, @Raytd, why not sell it on here on your friends behalf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommikka Posted July 31, 2019 Share Posted July 31, 2019 5 hours ago, Rogerborg said: They shouldn't do, since their GDPR disclosure only says that they'll give details to retailer members and "UK Boarder [sic] Agency to allow player imports of RiFs & 24/7 Intelligence department, Hampshire Police." "Any other third-party access to data would only be permitted when the terms of the Data-Protection act have been for-filled [sic] for legal access requirements." Mind you, not that I can see anyone ever complaining that UKARA have provided a private seller with a defence. With that they can’t release data, but on a technicality it may not be ‘giving access’ if Joe Bloggs asks if details given a buyer match their records That probably also accounts for the closure of the online data check Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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