Return to Airsoft

[MiK]

38 minutes ago, AlphaBear said:

Personally I’m gonna wait till the vaccine is offered. I’ve been thinking about this long and hard and figured one may as well wait a little longer as we’ve waited and suffered so much already. Yes I’m eager to go back to running around the woods and what not but the mitigation of risk is what I think is more important in my humble opinion. 

I’m lucky enough to have my first jab but even if they say “hey MiK you can go pew pew next month” I’m still gonna wait till my second jab is done and dusted on the 1st of May, I am then gonna wait maybe at least another month (possibly more) for my vaccine to be in full effect and hopefully think about June being the first time I’m gonna think about going out to play.

I would be interested to see if any sites would be brave enough to add into their Terms that unless you come with your vacation card you won’t be allowed in to play, in fact if any site had that rule and actually enforced it I would gladly hand over a few pounds more to play there.

[GenuineGerman]

Im in the Lowest risk group which would mean i might not be completely vaccinated until August/October. I understand the need to wait however if they start rolling out vaccine certificates most of the population still wouldn't be allowed out. Seems a little unfair to me.

[AlphaBear]

It’s not a question of being in a lowest risk group. It’s a question of transmissibility. The virus sadly doesn’t do fair. Even those in a low risk group can carry it and pass it on. We just all have to be a little bit more  patient..  The light at the end of the tunnel is there. The good news is that the vaccines are working and the cases are dropping. The trigger it seems is to get less than a 1000 cases a day. Of course that’s still a 1000 too many but it’s going the right way. Finally we will all be able to breathe again. 

[MiK]

30 minutes ago, AlphaBear said:

It’s not a question of being in a lowest risk group. It’s a question of transmissibility. The virus sadly doesn’t do fair. Even those in a low risk group can carry it and pass it on. We just all have to be a little bit more  patient..  The light at the end of the tunnel is there. The good news is that the vaccines are working and the cases are dropping. The trigger it seems is to get less than a 1000 cases a day. Of course that’s still a 1000 too many but it’s going the right way. Finally we will all be able to breathe again. 

 

Correct -  The problem is just because you get vaccinated doesn’t mean you still won’t get Covid-19 (like Aso’s Gran & my Brother-in-law) likewise just because your vaccinated doesn’t mean your not gonna transmit to someone else who isn’t as you can still carry the virus through contact of surfaces but of course we still have to deal with the eeeejit anti-vaxxers and club/party ponces.

 

 

1 hour ago, GenuineGerman said:

Im in the Lowest risk group which would mean i might not be completely vaccinated until August/October. I understand the need to wait however if they start rolling out vaccine certificates most of the population still wouldn't be allowed out. Seems a little unfair to me.

maybe the Jonhnson & Johnson single jab vaccine comes out soon which should bring the numbers/waiting times down 

[Speedbird_666]

10 minutes ago, MiK said:

 

Correct -  The problem is just because you get vaccinated doesn’t mean you still won’t get Covid-19 (like Aso’s Gran & my Brother-in-law) likewise just because your vaccinated doesn’t mean your not gonna transmit to someone else who isn’t as you can still carry the virus through contact of surfaces but of course we still have to deal with the eeeejit anti-vaxxers and club/party ponces.

 

It seems like data coming from Israel indicates that the Pfizer vaccine does reduce the virus' transmission rate.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-vaccine-pfizer-israel-transmission-latest-b1805313.html

 

[Shamal]

I'm not an anti vaxer but I don't want it. 

I'm also in high risk group but I still don't want it.

Thats my choice because I'm free to choose and that is my considered choice.

Am I bad?

 

1 at a time please...lol

Regards 

[Speedbird_666]

4 minutes ago, Shamal said:

I'm not an anti vaxer but I don't want it. 

I'm also in high risk group but I still don't want it.

Thats my choice because I'm free to choose and that is my considered choice.

Am I bad?

 

1 at a time please...lol

Regards 

 

No. I know many people who don't want it. It's not for me to judge - your body, your choice. But whether your employer will think the same is another matter.

 

I will probably have to have it - I fully expect my employer to make it a requirement to return to the office.

 

[AlphaBear]

Roadmap has been unveiled. So it’s either 29th March or 12th April for Airsoft. Again it will depend upon how the sites interpret the new guidance.  And best of all normality to resume by the 21st of June. No earlier. OMG the light is there!!!

[Speedbird_666]

 

I would guess 12th April.

[AlphaBear]

That’s an awesome graphic. But yeah I think 12th April too. 

[Speedbird_666]

Just now, AlphaBear said:

That’s an awesome graphic.

 

Stolen from the Daily Mail. No, I'm not a typical DM reader - but I do find some of the guff on there funny.

[GenuineGerman]

1 hour ago, AlphaBear said:

It’s not a question of being in a lowest risk group. It’s a question of transmissibility. The virus sadly doesn’t do fair. Even those in a low risk group can carry it and pass it on. We just all have to be a little bit more  patient..  The light at the end of the tunnel is there. The good news is that the vaccines are working and the cases are dropping. The trigger it seems is to get less than a 1000 cases a day. Of course that’s still a 1000 too many but it’s going the right way. Finally we will all be able to breathe again. 

As you said every one can catch and pass it on however if you are at a higher risk group you have higher change of it causing more damage and it killing you. The vaccine is supposed to stop it being as serious but still doesn't prevent it if i have understood that correctly so by that reasoning if higher and lower risk groups mingle you should have a balance of symptoms where everyone roughly has it that same on average. If you start having certificates to allow people in events for example football, airsoft, music events and thus effectively prevent a large part of the population going out is just seems a bit unfair to me. I've have probably just over thought it and thinking worst case. 

[Shamal]

34 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

 

No. I know many people who don't want it. It's not for me to judge - your body, your choice. But whether your employer will think the same is another matter.

 

I will probably have to have it - I fully expect my employer to make it a requirement to return to the office.

 

I'm self employed. But would that be constructive dismissal if your employer came up with " well you can't come to work if you don't do it and if you don't come to work you will loose your job"

Its like them saying we want all our staff to have tatoos cause we got them and if you don't then your down the road muttering!

🤔

Regards 

 

[Asomodai]

3 minutes ago, Shamal said:

I'm self employed. But would that be constructive dismissal if your employer came up with " well you can't come to work if you don't do it and if you don't come to work you will loose your job"

Its like them saying we want all our staff to have tatoos cause we got them and if you don't then your down the road muttering!

🤔

Regards 

 

 

I think it's more "If you are customer facing or work with others, we don't want them to have their potential risk of exposure increased". Also jobs involving International travel. 

 

Random Exerpt:

 

"

Can employers indirectly compel employees to vaccinate?

Businesses could decide to take indirect measures to pressurise vaccination of their employees, such as refusing staff entry to certain parts of the workplace or certain roles, if they cannot demonstrate that they have been vaccinated. Similarly, employers may be tempted to issue disciplinary action if an employee repeatedly refuses to be vaccinated. Any such measures should be considered very carefully before being implemented. 

If an employee’s refusal to be vaccinated is down to a disability/protected religious/philosophical belief, and results in disciplinary action from their employer, they may be able to issue a direct or indirect discrimination claim, and claim constructive unfair dismissal if they resign in protest. A better course of action for organisations would be to help employees to make informed decisions regarding their vaccination by sharing impartial, factual information."

[Speedbird_666]

3 minutes ago, Shamal said:

I'm self employed. But would that be constructive dismissal if your employer came up with " well you can't come to work if you don't do it and if you don't come to work you will loose your job"

Its like them saying we want all our staff to have tatoos cause we got them and if you don't then your down the road muttering!

🤔

Regards 

 

 

I work on a campus with 4200 other people. If my employer wants to implement a 'no vaccine, no office' rule, they will find a way to do it. It sounds like the Government are mulling over 'Covid Certificates' anyway, so I would not be surprised if a law change gets rammed through Parliament with little opposition. Individual Liberty be damned.

[GenuineGerman]

 

59 minutes ago, Shamal said:

I'm not an anti vaxer but I don't want it. 

I'm also in high risk group but I still don't want it.

Thats my choice because I'm free to choose and that is my considered choice.

Am I bad?

 

1 at a time please...lol

Regards 

Vaccination should be everyone's choice and you should also not be discriminated against if you choose not too.  However you know it will be used against you.

[MiK]

1 hour ago, Speedbird_666 said:

 

It seems like data coming from Israel indicates that the Pfizer vaccine does reduce the virus' transmission rate.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/health/covid-vaccine-pfizer-israel-transmission-latest-b1805313.html

 

unfortunately no vaccine will ever stop transmission by contact

 

[Shamal]

5 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

 

I work on a campus with 4200 other people. If my employer wants to implement a 'no vaccine, no office' rule, they will find a way to do it. It sounds like the Government are mulling over 'Covid Certificates' anyway, so I would not be surprised if a law change gets rammed through Parliament with little opposition. Individual Liberty be damned.

That's exactly the jist of what I was saying yesterday.but until it is law we have a choice.😉

[GenuineGerman]

14 minutes ago, Asomodai said:

sharing impartial, factual information

Said no government or public institution in the history of mankind ever

[Speedbird_666]

3 minutes ago, MiK said:

unfortunately no vaccine will ever stop transmission by contact

 

 

Yes, I'm aware of that, but anything that reduces the possibility of transmission, even in single-digit percentages, will still help in the long-run.

[AlphaBear]

16 minutes ago, GenuineGerman said:

 

Vaccination should be everyone's choice and you should also not be discriminated against if you choose not too.  However you know it will be used against you.

If we find out @Shamalis a closet speed softer we’ll definitely will use that against him 😂😂

[MiK]

https://www.pinsentmasons.com/out-law/guides/coronavirus-can-uk-employers-require-staff-vaccinated
 

looks like employers could enforce staff to get vaccinated if they word it correctly, I am self employed so I’m my own boss and set my own rules but if I was a employee and another co-worker was refusing to be vaccinated I would expect the employer and the H&S of its works to either make a safe area for those who are and segregate those who aren’t or continue to use the furlow scheme or enforce them to work from home.

It may seem selfish of me to want this but why should I be put at risk from those who choose not to help to keep safe those around them.

Those who can’t have a jab due to medical reasons should be separated as a default setting.

[Shamal]

3 minutes ago, Speedbird_666 said:

 

Yes, I'm aware of that, but anything that reduces the possibility of transmission, even in single-digit percentages, will still help in the long-run.

Has it been proved that the jab reduces transmission? If it has then surely it's a cure.

We are starting an extension next week. All the plans are done and people lined up.basically we have a contract.

If we get to job Monday and customers enquire as to our jabbiness and say they don't want us there until we have all been jabbed with the juice of life then I,personally, 

will tell them to stick up their own arses and get someone else because that wasn't part of job description.

I would also sharpish start a claim for breach of contract!🤨

Regards 

[Speedbird_666]

3 minutes ago, Shamal said:

but until it is law we have a choice.😉

 

Not really. I understand your argument about Constructive Dismissal, but taking such an issue to tribunal is a long (and potentially expensive) process.

 

Many employees will be scared into having the vaccine by employers who will either tacitly or explicit state that it is a requirement. They will use leverage (bonuses, promotions etc. where applicable) to enforce their will.

 

Disclaimer: To be clear - I have not been told anything by my employer anything along these lines and is purely conjecture on my part. I am in no way implying that my employer will use these measures in now or in the future.

[MiK]

@Shamal playing devil’s advocate here.....

Will you be doing the extension with more than 6 people or more than two different households ? Then currently they could possibly ask you to reschedule when the rules allow more mixing and I think they could possibly win any breach of contract agreement, but being honest here they want the extension so they will probably not worry about it