Post Brexit Imports

[Valentine]

Does anybody know the exact rules surrounding importing/ buying from the eu after december? I gather that new fees will be added but what would happen if i were to order on say the 30th of December?  Am i likely to get stung on this end even tho the transaction was done before the time limit?

[Stahl]

5 minutes ago, Valentine said:

Does anybody know the exact rules surrounding importing/ buying from the eu after december? I gather that new fees will be added but what would happen if i were to order on say the 30th of December?  Am i likely to get stung on this end even tho the transaction was done before the time limit?

No because it's something that's part of the Brexit talks in terms of imports and exports, txes etc and considering how they are going at the moment, no one knows.
If anyone says otherwise, or you read about it, it's bollocks.

We won't know until a trade deal has been made with the EU.

Here is the advice by the Government on the Gov.UK website https://www.gov.uk/prepare-to-import-to-great-britain-from-january-2021

[Valentine]

Well thats gonna be an interesting discovery either way then i guess lol, it sucks wanting so much stuff while on a tight budget

[Stahl]

6 minutes ago, Valentine said:

Well thats gonna be an interesting discovery either way then i guess lol, it sucks wanting so much stuff while on a tight budget

As it stands, it is almost guaranteed that imports will become how they are with importing from non-EU nations.
20% of the value added for VAT, along with the 5% Import and Duty fees (because it was Duty Free), then the £10 for customs.

So for argument sake, if you pay £300 for a RIF and you import into the UK, your total bill would be £385, so you will have to pay £85 for it to clear customs, before your package will be delivered to you.

[Asomodai]

46 minutes ago, Valentine said:

Does anybody know the exact rules surrounding importing/ buying from the eu after december? I gather that new fees will be added but what would happen if i were to order on say the 30th of December?  Am i likely to get stung on this end even tho the transaction was done before the time limit?

 

Nothings been agreed on, but unless we stay within the single market which is very unlikely, we will have to pay 20% on import duty. 

 

You will likely have to get any package through customs fully before the 30th of December. If you order it on the 30th then it will very likely be charged at 20% VAT plus import fees. It's why I have been stockpiling on RIFS and BB's for the past year. 

[Sitting Duck]

Remember though if WTO & UK is a third country..

 

Then EU exports to a third country are zero VAT rated

 

So if you buy from Poland you should no longer pay Poland's 23% VAT

Then on entry you pay UK's 20% VAT plus any import fees

 

It is a question of WHERE the actual VAT revenue sits

 

That is how it is supposed to work

Buying from Gunfire "should" be zero rated VAT to a third country outside EU, then pay UK VAT & fees on arrival in UK with the revenue staying in UK public purse

 

If you listen to project fear everything will rise 50% or even double

But WTO to third country means exports are zero rated

[ak2m4]

6 hours ago, Sitting Duck said:

So if you buy from Poland you should no longer pay Poland's 23% VAT

Then on entry you pay UK's 20% VAT plus any import fees

 

Correct, this is how it should be - unless I've missed something.  I'm seeing quite a few posts of people you have to add on 20%VAT without explaining that VAT on the sellers end will be removed.  VAT in Poland is 23%.  Let's see how EU retailers handle it, they may use a service which they pay the VAT up front.

 

Duty should be 3.2% I believe, which is general sporting goods...Can't exactly remember now.

[Tommikka]

Note that with post Brexit Euro exports the European price could drop because the sale is an export and their local VAT is no longer due.

The retailer may drop the listed price once UK is selected, or the price may remain the same and they get to keep more of the sale.

 

Say their VAT is the same rate as ours:

Currently for a €100 item the sales price including local VAT would be €120, and let’s call it €10 post making €130

On arrival in the UK currently we have paid a European VAT so it comes through with no charges

 

If you order on 30 December you pay €130 but it takes a few days and comes to the UK after Brexit.

€130 paid becomes £116.34 for valuation purposes.

Then it is dependant on what the trading terms are - if it’s deemed to be an import then add on 20% UK import VAT (£23.27) and possibly import duty and we will guess it’s 5% (£5.82) and a carrier handling fee, say £20

Thats £39.09 extra and you pay £155.43 overall 

 

If you order in January then the local VAT could possibly not apply (the retailer treats it as an export)

So you pay €100 + €10 = €110 / £98.44

Plus 20%=£19.69 5%=£4.92 and £10 fee (£34.61 charges)

£133.05 total

 

If the retailer doesn’t deduct local VAT as an export at the point of sale they may either charge local VAT and then reclaim it among their accounts

(Local VAT shows on the invoice) or they could stick to the listed website price reverse engineering the invoice to show 0 VAT but the same total

 

If you are charged foreign VAT on an invoice then there is the potential for you to claim back from that countries treasury but rules are complex and you can’t always claim

 

If a trade agreement is put into place then the terms of that agreement will apply.  But there is little time, so it would need to be a blanket trade agreement covering all goods, if there are agreements on specific areas of trade then it depends on where the goods sit

 

 

If a UK retailer steps in and gets enough viable business then they may do more commercial importing and the  additional charges will be evened out

[GenuineGerman]

With shipping I know UPS are adding a 3-5% additional charge on shipping and i imagine over carries will do the same. I can only imagine the end user will pick up this additional cost  

[Valentine]

Hmmm, seems it still might be cheaper than ordering here even with the worst case scenario just with a slightly smaller difference, rif I'm looking at at the mo is 107 over there but at least 140 here and spare mags are half the price as usual, will be interesting seeing how it all pans out thats for sure 

[kasaran]

Im possibly wrong.  But i had the impression gunfire and taiwan gun were so cheap because airsoft counts as toys and are not taxed in poland?  So any with change in where tax goes is purely going to go up with import?

[Tommikka]

30 minutes ago, kasaran said:

Im possibly wrong.  But i had the impression gunfire and taiwan gun were so cheap because airsoft counts as toys and are not taxed in poland?  So any with change in where tax goes is purely going to go up with import?

No, they are VAT inclusive and will show the VAT breakdown in the invoice 

The same goods in different countries can vary widely in price, but that’s generally a different mix in overheads and variations in the market changing the balance of viability.

 

[ak2m4]

I think VAT in Poland is 23% right?

[Sitting Duck]

2 hours ago, kasaran said:

Im possibly wrong.  But i had the impression gunfire and taiwan gun were so cheap because airsoft counts as toys and are not taxed in poland?  So any with change in where tax goes is purely going to go up with import?

 

Sigh - is why you shouldn't believe EVERYTHING project fear says....

 

Feel free to check online your own GF orders etc...

 

 

An old GF order of mine where 23% VAT is paid in country of origin prior to shipping

& on arrival in UK fuck all is paid = dosh for Poland, nowt for Blighty

(This arrangement benefits countries who export more - especially Germany

UK is Germany's 4th biggest export market & I think France's 6th market is UK)

 

There WAS 28 EU members before UK departed

19 of those members has a slightly higher rate above UK's 20%

Hungary is highest at 27% VAT

Denmark I think was 25% and is applied to EVERYTHING - hardly any exemptions

 

UK has one of the lowest "overall" rates of VAT imho

UK has the largest list of zero rated items = 0% on food (ingredients), kids clothes, baby seats, books & other crap

There is a lower 5% rate on VAT applied to domestic gas/electricity & tampons

 

Ahhh but Ireland has zero rated tampons - great if you are on ya blob

but pay more VAT on gas/electricity & other stuff - yeah I think UK is not that bad overall

(plus I think Ireland you pay income tax straight away where as UK you are allowed £12.5k before you pay income tax)

 

UK imports 2:1 what it exports to EU on average

but a lot of UK exports are services & finance, much of that is reclaimed on finance almost immediately

so even less remains in the UK's public purse due to what we export

 

The whole tax issue is quite complex & varies from each country

There is a lot more to all of this & I don't fully understand it all

But I have done a bit of research since 2016 & it is not all doom & gloom like BBC, Sky, LBC etc... would have you believe

 

[Valentine]

5 hours ago, Sitting Duck said:

 

Sigh - is why you shouldn't believe EVERYTHING project fear says....

 

 

 

 

So with our 20% vat + 3.5% import fees it won't much difference unless handling fees from the courier get involved?

If i understand correctly thats not too bad an certainly still cheaper than the uk market where everything already seems to have a 30% mark up to cover thier overheads

[Sitting Duck]

1 hour ago, Valentine said:

So with our 20% vat + 3.5% import fees it won't much difference unless handling fees from the courier get involved?

If i understand correctly thats not too bad an certainly still cheaper than the uk market where everything already seems to have a 30% mark up to cover thier overheads

 

THAT is how it is "supposed" to work exporting to a third country outside the EU

 

It is gonna involve more paperwork/fees & a ballache (at first)

plus civil servants/taxman etc... even buyers/sellers hate change

 

Me personally I think they will come to an "arangement" if they don't reach an official AGREEMENT

They (EU & EU states) stand to lose revenue from VAT if zero rated to 3rd country/WTO

So I reckon even if no deal they will "allow" some flow of goods still if VAT is paid

 

BUT though UK Government had said fuck all tariffs will apply to most cases

I think HMRC was looking forward to the shift in revenue just on VAT alone

 

Now throw COVID into the mix - everyone is fucking skint on all sides

No Deal = no £39bn - there is a LOT of needed revenue at stake

so who really knows ?????

 

Of course if UK goes full WTO, no deal, no £39bn on 01/01/2021

then that is it - EU gets little - no settlement, no VAT on exports to UK

But sellers will likely slap on some admin fees to clear ports but still way down

 

I do NOT have the answers - I'm only taking a WILD guess at to what "could" be in the event of WTO

I'm merely pointing out what happens & where the VAT is applied/where it resides in whose public purse

(VAT is an EU/EEC invention as prior to '73 UK had a sales tax, so this VAT term could be phased out in time)

 

UK can not deviate from 31/12/2020 due to EU's 7 year budget ending then

if we go past that point - UK is likely for a massive EU COVID budget for next 7 year term

(Hungary/Poland have veto'd it just recently on some issues of law)

 

WTO - UK membership in 2015 cost 7,579,535 CHF (Swiss Francs)

or less than 6.3m pa (very little compare to EU membership)

The EU's membership in its own name - FUCK ALL

(coz it makes nothing, yet creams off from the 27/28 members

who are WTO members in their own right - clever little number)

 

If UK goes to WTO then revenue will start residing in UK's public purse

I feel EU may consider some loose "arangement" though than end up losing the large VAT revenue they enjoy

(though EU doesn't get this VAT directly - it generates growth which is used to calculate members fee)

But some of this finds it way to Brussels in some form indirectly etc...

 

If it goes hard Brexit, no deal, WTO then fine, at least the revenue will stay in the UK's purse

(yes our own UK's exports suffer but financial services VAT is reclaimed anyway)

 

Yes as I see it it won't make a massive difference imho

there might be a day or two delay in shipping/clearance of red tape for a while maybe

& the VAT/Revenue should end up staying in UK

& if prices rise more than expected (moderately at most), then that in turn favours UK busineesses maybe

 

Yes if you are really concerned on something large you absolutely must have

then get your order in by early December is best advice if you can afford it

(I do NOT know for certain - NOBODY DOES, just pointing out what WTO to 3rd country "should" mean)

 

but try not to panic like project fear tells you

(unless you are the person who stockpiled all the fucking toilet paper in March/April this year)