Good day, but totally crap as well..... I need a new gun, or two.

[sonofsammo]

Went to play at Camp Sparta today and have ended up feeling more frustrated than anything else.
For anyone that doesn't know, Sparta is a 31acre ex RAF site, with 14 buildings and about 500 or so rooms.
It's a grand day out!

The rifs I took:
S24 Sniper

MWS
ARP9

TM MK23

The only rif that didn't annoy me at all was the MK23 - flawless as ever. At one point I came round a corner and took out 3 out of 5 members of the opposition before I got mullered.
The S24 shot at 480 on .2's. The range was shite. About 50M tops.
The MWS shot at 310 on .2's . The range wasn't great either -  again, around 50M.

The MK23 outranged both and the ARP9 was close behind.
Maybe my rif based future is electric?
Running round in this heat with the MWS and a belt full of gas mags knackered me totally.
I found myself with fewer and fewer reasons to play with it over the ARP9.

All I want is a gun that I can shoot the enemy with, preferably before they shoot me. If not before, I'd like a gun that actually makes me competitive and gives me at least the same range as the enemy.
I don't seem to have one and it's driving me bonkers. 

Any and all relevant suggestions welcome.
 

 

[Careless]

you cannot have it all my friend but the above should tick all the box's once setup right  ,  you are deffinatly using the wrong weight bb's in all of the above though ,  use .40's in your sniper and atleast .36's in your mws and mk23   .... that should help get further range and accuracy out of them all , not all guns are good out of the box , some will require hop and barrel work , dont be affriad to try it yourself , plenty of how to guides on youtube/internet and removing the barrel and hop up is pretty easy on most guns  , as your only be disapointed when you buy your next gun  to find out its a piece of shh1tt3 out the box  and with a few replacement parts and a bit of lovin you have a well sorted rif thats shooting how it should be  , all guns can be upgraded and worked on ,  even if i buy a new gun it gets worked on straight away,  but your bb weights are well off and get yourself a hadron designs tdc hop cover for the mk23 , its a must have!  

 

edit , use quality bb's !!  bb quality will also effect accuracy , dont cheap out if you want accuracy and consistency

[sonofsammo]

2 minutes ago, Careless said:

you cannot have it all my friend but the above should tick all the box's once setup right  ,  you are deffinatly using the wrong weight bb's in all of the above though ,  use .40's in your sniper and atleast .36's in your mws and mk23   .... that should help get further range and accuracy out of them all , not all guns are good out of the box , some will require hop and barrel work , dont be affriad to try it yourself , plenty of how to guides on youtube/internet and removing the barrel and hop up is pretty easy on most guns  , as your only be disapointed when you buy your next gun  to find out its a piece of shh1tt3 out the box  and with a few replacement parts and a bit of lovin you have a well sorted rif thats shooting how it should be  , all guns can be upgraded and worked on ,  even if i buy a new gun it gets worked on straight away,  but your bb weights are well off and get yourself a hadron designs tdc hop cover for the mk23 , its a must have!

I had to use .2's to get past chrono.
Was running .4 longbows in the sniper and .36 longbows in the MK23 and MWS.
The MK23 already has the TDC mod, with a crazyjet barrel and MF autobot bucking waiting for it.
The Sniper has a CJ barrel, autobot bucking and maple leaf concave hope arm.
The MWS has an Orga barrel and brass nub - and when I get round to it a modify tan bucking....
That's why I'm so hacked off - they're not standard and have received much love........ 😞 

[Careless]

ahhh i see , sorry i thought you meant you were using .2's lol ,   are you able to over hop the bb's with those weights at all?  

[sonofsammo]

4 minutes ago, Careless said:

ahhh i see , sorry i thought you meant you were using .2's lol ,   are you able to over hop the bb's with those weights at all?  

Can definitely with the MWS - but not with the sniper....
I think the sniper needs the TDC mod. Certainly couldn't make it worse.
I put 6 mags through the MWS playing with the hop and couldn't get it any further 😞

[Careless]

yea atleast make the sniper so you can over hop it then when its adjusted properly you know for a fact its too its full potential , dont know what to make of the mws then , if your able to over hop it and its consistent then  you could try using .4's?

[sonofsammo]

Just now, Careless said:

dont know what to make of the mws then , if your able to over hop it and its consistent then  you could try using .4's?

Bugger - wish I'd thought of that today!!

[Rogerborg]

1 hour ago, sonofsammo said:

The S24 shot at 480 on .2's. The range was shite. About 50M tops

 

More energy + sufficient hop = more range.

 

Diagnosis: insufficient hop.

[Wo1f]

Mws should be outranging an ARP by quite a distance. I sold my first TM recoil because it couldn’t hold its own against the mws. If you look on the mws thread, I’ve just posted a video hitting my brother at 75m almost every time with one of mine and that’s at 385fps on a .2 (my DMR limit is 400). With my 350fps one 65m is about the max effective range. 

[Prisce]

Sammo, do us a favour, try a batch of Geoff’s BBs, and see if you get any better luck, I had issues with longbows not giving me the same consistency as Geoff’s.

 

As for the S24, you really shouldn’t need a TDC mod in that, my mates has similar mods to yours and easily makes 80M. What’s your FPS deviation? Are they accurate to 50m?

[sonofsammo]

11 hours ago, Prisce said:

Sammo, do us a favour, try a batch of Geoff’s BBs, and see if you get any better luck, I had issues with longbows not giving me the same consistency as Geoff’s.

 

As for the S24, you really shouldn’t need a TDC mod in that, my mates has similar mods to yours and easily makes 80M. What’s your FPS deviation? Are they accurate to 50m?

Interesting you should say that about Geoff's, as I normally use them but had run out of the .36s.
I've got some .4's I can try in the sniper.
I'll get hold of some .36's for the MWS.
For the sniper, the deviation is 1-2fps. I could probably hit a man size target at 40M, but beyond that I wouldn't want to bet my life on it.
 

[djben9]

13 hours ago, sonofsammo said:

I had to use .2's to get past chrono.
 

Is that because, like me, the site doesn't like to use a table to work it out and prefers to see a .02 result!

recently one of the sites i go to has started to use the table to help them so you dont have to use .2s

 

Most ive gone on my DMR was 0.3s when i played in woodland, and from memory they were ok, i just stick with 0.25s all round due to the site limits / obstructions so find its not used to its full potential .....yet.... 

 

[Prisce]

4 hours ago, sonofsammo said:

Interesting you should say that about Geoff's, as I normally use them but had run out of the .36s.
I've got some .4's I can try in the sniper.
I'll get hold of some .36's for the MWS.
For the sniper, the deviation is 1-2fps. I could probably hit a man size target at 40M, but beyond that I wouldn't want to bet my life on it.
 

 

That sniper is woefully short on range, And accuracy. 

 

Just a thought, but I seem to remember that the m24 isn’t VSR compatible.. possible issue with hop unit/rubber/barrel may be the cause? Will have to do a little digging when i get in from work.

[sonofsammo]

1 minute ago, Prisce said:

 

That sniper is woefully short on range, And accuracy. 

 

Just a thought, but I seem to remember that the m24 isn’t VSR compatible.. possible issue with hop unit/rubber/barrel may be the cause? Will have to do a little digging when i get in from work.

Yup - very - the only thing I can think of is that the hop rubber has a nub for the hop window that's slightly too long - I'll try trimming it and see if that helps.
The s24 is supposed to be VSR compatible in the main - accepts barrels / buckings etc - but the actual hop unit itself is slightly different size to the VSR, afaik.
 

[Wo1f]

The nub or the mound inside the hop rubber? Can’t you file the nub window on the chamber to accept the nub? An omega nub isn’t long by any means..

[sonofsammo]

3 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

The nub or the mound inside the hop rubber? Can’t you file the nub window on the chamber to accept the nub? An omega nub isn’t long by any means..

My fault for not using the right words. The bit circled in red is what I meant:
 

[Wo1f]

Ahh okay, the mws is a little like that where you have to cut that tab a little shorter

[Prisce]

https://www.snipermechanics.com/single-post/2017/04/30/AK-M24-the-SSG24-contender-Initial-Thoughts-and-Mods

 

Have a read and look at some of the photos, you’ll notice it takes VSR buckings, but the tabs don’t line up, so it might need modding.  Have a good look and read, look at what you have done to yours, and what he has done to his.

 

You should then be able to identify your issue. And see how to fix it.

 

If you still can’t work it out, give us a Shout. 

 

 

[sonofsammo]

3 minutes ago, Prisce said:

https://www.snipermechanics.com/single-post/2017/04/30/AK-M24-the-SSG24-contender-Initial-Thoughts-and-Mods

 

Have a read and look at some of the photos, you’ll notice it takes VSR buckings, but the tabs don’t line up, so it might need modding.  Have a good look and read, look at what you have done to yours, and what he has done to his.

 

You should then be able to identify your issue. And see how to fix it.

 

If you still can’t work it out, give us a Shout. 

 

 

Cheers, but read it already - before I started doing anything! In fact that post was the reason I went for one in the first place...
What effect do you think the bump on the tab on the bucking may have?
I had great fun (NOT) dremelling the hop chamber so it was smooth and would accept the CJ barrel..
The only thing I can think is it's something to do with that tab on the hop rubber.
Or possibly insufficient pressure on the hop - which means I could do the TDC mod - but I'm wary of the drilling required.
 

[sonofsammo]

Latest chrono for the s24-, using Geoff's .40s...

No other changes made yet...

[Wo1f]

You removed the locking lugs from the hop chamber?! 😱 I thought it took vsr barrels? 

[sonofsammo]

8 minutes ago, Wo1f said:

You removed the locking lugs from the hop chamber?! 😱 I thought it took vsr barrels? 

With that modification, yes...

[Wo1f]

[Prisce]

Well I presume that the issue must lie in the barrel/hop rubber/hop change compatibility.

 

Hadn't heard of the CJ barrel until you mentioned it. Perhaps it’s worth looking at the original barrel, or looking very carefully at the barrel and rubber unity. (Can’t think of the right word) 

 

You may even just have a nick on the rubber causing these issues. Your FPS isn’t too much of a worry, so defiantly a hop issue.

[sonofsammo]

24 minutes ago, Prisce said:

Well I presume that the issue must lie in the barrel/hop rubber/hop change compatibility.

 

Hadn't heard of the CJ barrel until you mentioned it. Perhaps it’s worth looking at the original barrel, or looking very carefully at the barrel and rubber unity. (Can’t think of the right word) 

 

You may even just have a nick on the rubber causing these issues. Your FPS isn’t too much of a worry, so defiantly a hop issue.

Could it be something to do with the hop adjustment arm? I cracked it by over tightening the screws.... Although I can't see what negative impact that would have.
The barrel and nub were both new. If there was a nick, wouldn't that adversely affect the fps?
I'm going to take it to bits and start again tomorrow.
Although I'm tempted to ditch it and either a) buy a SRS or  b) buy a Bar10 and put the same mods in it
The spirit of the perverse, however, is begging me to persevere with this one.