Bringing in RIFs in from the USA

[MH. B]

Hi all I'm new to these forums, but wanting some advice/opinion on an issue.

 

So... I'm a member of the UK military and I've been living and working in the USA for the last year and a half, in this time I've got into airsoft (believe me most of the time I drive a desk....)!

 

However, I'm going to be heading back to the UK later this year and I'll be bringing my RIFs with me, now I've read around the UK law and understand the defences against the VCRA....

 

....but it seems the easiest defence when I pass through UK customs is a UKARA one. Now whilst I've signed up to the British Airsoft Club, I won't be able to complete the requirement (3 games, greater than 2 months) by the time I'll be finishing in the USA, to get a registration number. The Crown servant defence is unlikely to wash either.

 

I also understand that UKARA is not required for ownership, but I'm unsure how I prove I'm a skirmisher otherwise.

 

Has anyone been in this situation? Or have any thoughts or advice?

 

Thanks.

[SeniorSpaz87]

Do you have a mate you could leave your guns with, come here, get your UKARA number, and then have him ship them here? Just a thought, more experienced people than me will come along soon and be able to give you better answers than that.

[MH. B]

Thanks mate, appreciate the thought, but I'm probably not going to be able to get that organised...

[SeniorSpaz87]

Just wait for one of the addicts or mods to come along, they know all the ins and outs of UKARA, of which there are plenty.

[TheGrover]

Ukara wont be able to help you if you cant get the two months in. There are other defences that you could look into, but otherwise you could paint the gun(s) two-tone so that you can import an IF instead of an RIF, or sell them over in the US and use the cash to buy new ones over here once youve done the compulsory hire gun rituals

[MH. B]

Just submitted this email query to HMRC, we'll see if they respond!

 

"I'm a member of the UK military and I'm currently living and working in the USA on an authorised deployment. During my deployment I have taken up the hobby of 'airsoft'.

 

My query relates to bringing (importing) my Realistic Immitation Firearms (RIFs) that I use for this hobby back into the UK at the end of my deployment. I am likely to return to the UK via Heathrow airport.

 

I've read around the UK law and understand the defences against the Violent Crime Reduction Act (VCRA), specifically section 36(1)(d), and the offence of importing a RIF into the UK.

 

Given, this my defence would be under:

 

"the organisation and holding of permitted activities for which public

liability insurance is held in relation to liabilities to third parties arising

from or in connection with the organisation and holding of those

activities".

 

I am aware of the UKARA scheme, that allows airsoft retailers to sell airsoft RIFs to UKARA members in the UK, but to my understanding this is not necessarily a VCRA defence. Rather, membership of UKARA provides evidence of participation in the hobby, which can be used to support the defence stated above.

 

I will be unable to complete my UKARA membership prior to returning to the UK (play 3 airsoft games over a period greater than 2 months at a registered site).

 

Given this, I'm unsure how I prove that I'm a 'skirmisher' participating in this hobby, as so far I have only participated in airsoft events in the USA."

 

I didn't realise the law would be so unclear!

[SeniorSpaz87]

Just submitted this email query to HMRC, we'll see if they respond!

 

"I'm a member of the UK military and I'm currently living and working in the USA on an authorised deployment. During my deployment I have taken up the hobby of 'airsoft'.

 

My query relates to bringing (importing) my Realistic Immitation Firearms (RIFs) that I use for this hobby back into the UK at the end of my deployment. I am likely to return to the UK via Heathrow airport.

 

I've read around the UK law and understand the defences against the Violent Crime Reduction Act (VCRA), specifically section 36(1)(d), and the offence of importing a RIF into the UK.

 

Given, this my defence would be under:

 

"the organisation and holding of permitted activities for which public

liability insurance is held in relation to liabilities to third parties arising

from or in connection with the organisation and holding of those

activities".

 

I am aware of the UKARA scheme, that allows airsoft retailers to sell airsoft RIFs to UKARA members in the UK, but to my understanding this is not necessarily a VCRA defence. Rather, membership of UKARA provides evidence of participation in the hobby, which can be used to support the defence stated above.

 

I will be unable to complete my UKARA membership prior to returning to the UK (play 3 airsoft games over a period greater than 2 months at a registered site).

 

Given this, I'm unsure how I prove that I'm a 'skirmisher' participating in this hobby, as so far I have only participated in airsoft events in the USA."

 

I didn't realise the law would be so unclear!

 

That was actually very well written, and if they feel the need to respond, they may be able to help sort you out.

[MH. B]

Thanks mate, I've got the standard automatic email response, with a ref. number(!). They get 15 working days to respond, I'll post any response I get on this thread. I'm hopeful that by being straight up and open then I can get to the bottom of it...

 

.... Rather this than getting arrested at Heathrow ;-)

[Sitting Duck]

Technically a UK ukara'd m8 could import them for you - NO I AIN'T OFFERING !!!!

 

But if you could find a trusted local UK airsoft member they "could" import if push really comes to shove

But it is a little risky so there would have to be 201% trust on both sides then they "gift" your guns back

 

But it is a major bollock ache for anybody but a fellow airsofter/army m8 you really know & trust tbh

Soz - not trying to deliberately avoid or bypass the vcra but is an option to perhaps look into

Maybe some of your old m8's might be into it if you look them up ???

 

To be fair though, look into amount of duty to be paid if keeping it all above board

Times we have imported from stateside we have been clobbered by Royal Mail & customs crap

but feel if you declare in effect s/hand aeg's with receipts ( much cheaper in US btw )

then a couple of s/hand guns wouldn't be a massive amount of value - heck get somebody to

write out a receipt for one or two broken guns even and pay even less

 

Suppose you could be the courier delivering them to a registered ukara member but dunno if that would wash

 

But at least you are trying to explore legal requests and attempting to do it above board or being open about it

 

And no - don't ask me - soz

 

If you can provide proof of you skirmishing stateside and you being honest & open I feel you got half a chance

[Russe11]

Do you have records of attendance at airsoft events or membership of an airsoft site? All UKARA does is provide a quick and easy way for someone to check that you have been airsofting a few times. If you can provide records that do that then you should be okay.

A big issue is airport and airline security, even if you can bring them into the country, you may not be allowed to take them on the plane. You will need to look into this also.

 

Look into local airsoft sites you will be going to when back in the UK. Maybe they will allow you to have your RIF's couriered to them for you to pick up when you skirmish there?

[BigAl]

If you can prove you have ben skirmishing in the USA then you are a skirmisher and have a defence. It doesn't say anywhere in the act about having to prove you have skirmished in the UK. The fact you have skirmished in the USA while living there proves you are a skirmisher there, thus it is reasonable to believe you intend to skirmish here upon your return.

 

I would contact UKBA again and give then whatever proof you can as your status as an active Skirmisher in the US. See where that gets you.

 

Failing that you could probably ship them to a UK dealer for a small fee. ( if you need to go down this route pm me, I know someone who may be able to help )

[MH. B]

Thanks for the replies guys, really appreciate the help!

 

Russe11, strangely the problem is not airline security, you can check in real steel over here no problems! As long as they're in hold, declared and secured it shouldn't be an issue!

 

Big Al, appreciate the offer of help, I'll pm you.

 

Thanks,.

[straffham]

Interesting, please share any reply you get! As you own them then technically you wouldn't be committing any offence as VCRA doesn't cover ownership, its how they define importing that counts in this case I guess? Good luck mate!

[MH. B]

So.... HMRC actually got back to me pretty rapidly, however, they have suggested that I speak to the Home Office Violent Crime Unit to get an answer to the question I posed above...

 

... I'll post any response I get!

 

Although starting to feel like a criminal, just by seeking clarification of some pretty shonky legislation ;-)

[Jambo88]

Dismantle them and send them over in bits.

[TheGrover]

Dismantle them and send them over in bits.

One of the various legal guidelines surrounding RIFs mentions this, and whilst the sending of RIF parts is legal, putting them together isnt, so the practice is frowned upon.

 

And youre also likely to raise suspicion when two packages addressed to you have matching gun parts, i havent got any experience in the matter but i personally would expect a visit from some police shortly after i unpacked

[Jambo88]

One of the various legal guidelines surrounding RIFs mentions this, and whilst the sending of RIF parts is legal, putting them together isnt, so the practice is frowned upon.

 

And youre also likely to raise suspicion when two packages addressed to you have matching gun parts, i havent got any experience in the matter but i personally would expect a visit from some police shortly after i unpacked

Send the internals in 1 package wait until it arrives and then post the externals. If your going to be sensible and use the guns how they are intended no one cares if you have a UKARA. It's only when someone acts a fanny with a RIF that there is a problem but I'm sure your sensible so it won't be a problem

[TheGrover]

Send the internals in 1 package wait until it arrives and then post the externals. If your going to be sensible and use the guns how they are intended no one cares if you have a UKARA. It's only when someone acts a fanny with a RIF that there is a problem but I'm sure your sensible so it won't be a problem

Youre right, but when customs see gun parts go through in a parcel (and they most likely will) they are going to start asking questions, and their job is to assume that everyone will act like a fanny

[Jambo88]

Youre right, but when customs see gun parts go through in a parcel (and they most likely will) they are going to start asking questions, and their job is to assume that everyone will act like a fanny

But it's not against the law to own them or send them and until you do something wrong no one can stop you. It's the easiest way. Contact evike and ask them about any problems they had sending parts.

[TheGrover]

It IS illegal to import them however, which is where the UKBA come in

[Jambo88]

But it isn't illegal to send parts. A shop in HK does this when you buy a RIF without ukara and really what's the chances of him getting into trouble for manufacturing a RIF.

[TheGrover]

But it isn't illegal to send parts. A shop in HK does this when you buy a RIF without ukara and really what's the chances of him getting into trouble for manufacturing a RIF.

 

i know its doable, and i know people do it, but the Border agency know that we do it and they dont like it, as people are doing it simply to circumvent a law.

[Leonard2124]

Hi all,

 

I have a similar query, I want to get a polarstar'd Magpul PDRC in from the US into the UK. It would either be my own, I would send it out to Bingo airsoft to get it done or buy a pre-built one. My issue would be when the Rif is coming into the UK, I don't have a valid UKARA at the moment (it ran out in January and has saved me a lot of money by doing so!!!!!) but I still skirmish regularly so getting a new/renewing wouldn't/shouldn't be a problem. I have seen the "importation of/causes one to be brought into the UK" part of the legislation and was wondering if it would affect me less/more if the RIF was already mine (getting mine sent to be done) or just straight importing a new one? Would I have to ask that the parts be shipped separately, or would the fact that there is no physical way that the gun could ever be fired, until the HPA rig is attached, be enough for the customs to allow it through. Bringing it back into the UK and it being seized/destroyed because it is a RIF is the only reason I am holding off from doing so, so any help with this would be much appreciated

 

Thanks all,

 

Matt

[TheGrover]

Hi all,

 

I have a similar query, I want to get a polarstar'd Magpul PDRC in from the US into the UK. It would either be my own, I would send it out to Bingo airsoft to get it done or buy a pre-built one. My issue would be when the Rif is coming into the UK, I don't have a valid UKARA at the moment (it ran out in January and has saved me a lot of money by doing so!!!!!) but I still skirmish regularly so getting a new/renewing wouldn't/shouldn't be a problem. I have seen the "importation of/causes one to be brought into the UK" part of the legislation and was wondering if it would affect me less/more if the RIF was already mine (getting mine sent to be done) or just straight importing a new one? Would I have to ask that the parts be shipped separately, or would the fact that there is no physical way that the gun could ever be fired, until the HPA rig is attached, be enough for the customs to allow it through. Bringing it back into the UK and it being seized/destroyed because it is a RIF is the only reason I am holding off from doing so, so any help with this would be much appreciated

 

Thanks all,

 

Matt

Its illegal to import it, period. Think about it, anything you buy from abroad is your property when it lands in customs.

 

Just renew your ukara, if youve been skirmishing regularly it just needs you to drop a form off at your next skirmish, then its problem solved

[Leonard2124]

No, I was always going to renew my ukara before I did anything, it was about the importing that was my query. Thanks for the reply