Nickona Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 the more she see's you smiling and laughing like it dosen't bother you she'll want you more and so will other girl's around her! Couldn't agree more! After I got dumped I did the whole stiff upper lip thing and acted like nothing happened and the result was my Ex looked far more depressed then I did and was complaining to her friends how I didn't look sad about it Safe to say I won that bit Anyway here's some country to get you through the hardship and you can't not feel happy after this one...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 13, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 13, 2013 Ahhhh... never mind if some one could please close the thread please do. ...my heart genuinely goes out to you. Never mind all the stiff upper lip bollox, or trying to make her feel worse than you, or winning, etc. The truth is that nobody can win the human race, but letting people live in your head rent free is a weight that will definitely slow you down and for no profit. I advise you try your best to involve yourself in activities with your mates and if you do see her, allow whatever you feel to be visible. I fully realise that this is not the done thing, but I promise you that there are far reaching, always bad, and often terrible, consequences to pretending we're unaffected when really we're hurt. You know all that overaggressive macho-man wife beating arseholery? It all starts somewhere... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickona Posted March 13, 2013 Share Posted March 13, 2013 I fully realise that this is not the done thing, but I promise you that there are far reaching, always bad, and often terrible, consequences to pretending we're unaffected when really we're hurt. You know all that overaggressive macho-man wife beating arseholery? It all starts somewhere... Well that escalated quickly! First I was just making sure I acted as if it didn't get to me to try and save face and then I'm beating women :/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 13, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 13, 2013 Nobody goes to bed a perfectly happy, healthy, sane person and wakes up thinking, "Today, for no apparent reason, I'm going to behave like a total dick and beat my wife!" Everything has to start somewhere. Trust me on this, everything from wife beating and road rage to drug/alcohol addiction and eating disorders has its roots in repressing emotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam bussey Posted March 13, 2013 Author Share Posted March 13, 2013 Nobody goes to bed a perfectly happy, healthy, sane person and wakes up thinking, "Today, for no apparent reason, I'm going to behave like a total dick and beat my wife!" Everything has to start somewhere. Trust me on this, everything from wife beating and road rage to drug/alcohol addiction and eating disorders has its roots in repressing emotion. logic - this post has lots of it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters TPI Posted March 13, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 13, 2013 And their are Other External factor's not just Repressing Emotion's so you can't mention only that and Decree it to be all and Imperical I can see your Logic but it's also Mislead logic. Some other's are upbringing, social status, Money and a plethora of other thing's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters TPI Posted March 13, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 13, 2013 And no for the panzy's that think I'm arguing I'm not, just poking unclear misrepresented hole's so the Dim are not accidentally mis-lead! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam bussey Posted March 13, 2013 Author Share Posted March 13, 2013 ? if you are calling me dim would you kindly shove off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters TPI Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 No I wasn't actually but considering I was helping you previously in the thread I can't see why I would suddenly call you "Dim" but thank's for proving an unsuspected point & as requested "Kindly Shoving off" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Indeed there are many other factors involved in all the unhelpful behaviours I listed, however, common to them all is a mindset characterised by repressed emotion. I believe that the manner in which I express myself, when I choose to be deadly serious, ought in and of itself demonstrate that I am at least erudite and intelligent, though of course not by those qualifications correct (lol I am not committing the sin of actually departing from sound logic by arguing from assumed authority). However, taking vocabulary and grammar at face value, it really is somewhat amusing that the assumption was made that I was in fact claiming that something so complex as problematic human behaviour has but a single cause, whatever that may be, and to use the word "logic" sarcastically is absolutely hilarious! By all means ignore what I have to say. According to clinical research by a wide ranging variety of psych researchers, around 85% of adults in the USA (and John Bradshaw, an eminent practitioner, author and researcher, believes that more like 90% in Europe) are dysfunctional emotionally to a degree which negatively impacts on their lives and those around them. Thus it is 'normal' to be a bit nuts, in layman's terms - but not "a bit nuts" as in "I like to party and go off the deep end a bit", more like "a bit nuts" as in "even though I hate bullies, when I'm pissed off I treat anyone who cannot complain, or loved ones whom I subconsciously know will not complain much, harshly." The problem then is that to suggest that someone do something sane is abnormal and therefore viewed as 'insane'. The irony is delicious... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters TPI Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Ian I wasn't being derogatory to you sorry if it cam across like that I just wanted you to acknoledge their are other thing's that contribute to Beating Spouse's. I wasn't arguing from assumed Authority either it's not my fault if I've read and learned what I've learned. Once again. I wasn't arguing you are wrong just that a sweeping statement whether or not it is intended to be so is apparently frowned on but only in secret it would so seem.. I also take it that I'm this "Bully"? In which case everyone on this forum had far too much of a sheltered Life compared to mine as I would define bullying as something vastly stronger than what I do (although I do agree I did get to meet some of the Spec's when Tac declared Airsoft to hurt more and be more badass than All of paintball) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 No no Craig, I didn't say or mean that you are a bully. I just used that as an example of behaviour which none of us like, very few of us can admit to, but which is nevertheless quite common. If we take, for the sake of this point only, a reasonable definition of insanity to be doing something over and over expecting different outcomes, even though every time the consequences are bad, then this very common 'jobsworth', or 'taking it out on', or even 'never give a sucker an even break' type, small scale bullying, which never produces more than short term (but in themselves unwell and, by our running definition, insane) benefits and always generates antagonism which renders the bully outside the usual circle of mutual help which people tend to adopt and thus will, without question, always result in negative consequences, is insane. Actually it's quite funny, because, as I said, very few people can examine their own behaviour and admit to being a small time bully, even privately to themselves, and the very reason they cannot, which thus precludes doing something about it, is down to repressing emotions. The reason is because it becomes habitual - who would choose to feel feelings which are painful or difficult to manage, like jealousy, anger, and, case in point, that combination of stomach hollowing, blood draining, loss, fear of a future alone, self-doubt, anger, jealousy, betrayal even... that comes from being dumped? And yet emotions do not have an off switch in reality. The only ways to avoid feeling them fully are through coping mechanisms and/or mood altering substances. The trouble is that since our upbringing, for 85-90% of us, contains nothing but examples of coping strategies which are to some degree emotionally dysfunctional, those are what we turn to... ...and the circle completes... and yet again when we have children... and again when... ad (literally) nauseam... I know that you were not arguing from assumed authority, you merely pointed out that there are other factors involved. My point was that, when talking about human behaviour, complexity is a given. I get the feeling that I touched a nerve, but I may well be guilty of another all too common behaviour which often works negatively: projection, because I grew up witnessing spousal abuse and on the receiving end of a degree of violence which went far beyond 'chastisement', even though that was how it was characterised usually. The very reason why I know so much about this subject is because I have had cause to deal with the consequences of a dysfunctional upbringing, one characterised by emotional repression... Hmmm... I'm editing to add clarification: the reason emotional repression prevents a bully changing their behaviour is because it feels bad to examine our behaviour and find fault with it, thus the coping strategy is usually to lie to oneself: "so-and-so deserved it", "never give a sucker an even break", etc. Thus the bad feelings are pushed down - but only held in abeyance - they will spill out sooner or later, often onto the next victim of our bullying... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters TPI Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Oh no harm done Ian. I only thought you were pinging me as "Assumed Authority" («those are qoutation mark's right? I'm not home and using my blackberry so I'm unsure) because I believe it was Ed who said to me that I was projectionally bullying. Well something along those Line's (I could explain how much I hate it when people look up to me and respect me enough to mimic me but that's too long to do on my blackberry if you remind me I can PM it to you when i'm home) which at the time I didn't mean to be doing either (I was defending something at the time). I was sore about the bully bit because of my own experience's with bully's although I'd prefer to wait until I'm at a PC before I even think about writing about the beating's and all the shit I received although I gave back thrice what they gave me and friend's to prevent them from doing it again! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Yeah, all good Craig. Let's take it to the supporters forum before we get way far and gone OT here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Airsoft-Ed Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Just wanna say, I think Nick got the wrong end of the stick at the start of all this. When I read what Ian said I didn't assume he was directing it at anyone that's ever tried to save face in front of their ex after a break up, simply stating that emotional repression could end badly, he didn't say what amount of it, but I got the impression the amount was a lot, not just one night - wife beater. I'm not sure how anyone could've read it that way in fact. It's all a bit too serious to direct at anyone in my opinion. But yah, well said all. Additionally, I didn't mean to put you down or cause offence back when we were commenting on Tac's status, Craig, I think you just got a bit carried away. It's best to take a step back in situations like that. If there's a chance someone can be misunderstood or something wrongly represented, I always think it's more important to explain why you're angry, to what degree and in what context, than to simply express anger. I don't think Tac was actually saying Paintball hurt less or whatever it was, I forget the specifics, I saw it more as him just having a laugh, not aiming for it to be at anyone else's expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lethaldave Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 my wifes happy i have a hobby as it keeps me out her way lol! but on a serious note take her, its good fun and its proactive, not all women will find it nerdy.. mine just takes the piss when i ask for her opinion on whether my kit looks good :L good times Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam bussey Posted March 14, 2013 Author Share Posted March 14, 2013 my wifes happy i have a hobby as it keeps me out her way lol! but on a serious note take her, its good fun and its proactive, not all women will find it nerdy.. mine just takes the piss when i ask for her opinion on whether my kit looks good :L good times i got dumped yesterday not helping! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nickona Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Ian I should probably clear what I said up a little. I wasn't saying to repress every emotion but rather don't go around moping and looking all sad for yourself and complaining as people are far less likely to be sympathetic whereas if it seems like you're doing well people tend to be far more sympathetic to you and willing to offer you advise and help. Of course don't repress stuff just find the correct outlet, like talking to a close friend usually helps or any siblings (depending on who they are) normally help a lot. I'm not saying don't be sad, just try to look on the bright side of life.. if you spend time wallowing on whats gone wrong you'll miss it when things go right! A little quite from Butters may also help.. "Well yeah I love life, and I'm sad, but at the same time I'm really happy that something could make me feel that sad. It's like, it makes me feel alive, you know? It makes me feel human. And the only way I could feel this sad now is if I felt somethin' really good before. So I have to take the bad with the good, so I guess what I'm feelin' is like a, beautiful sadness. I guess that sounds stupid." Also as Craig said earlier, if you're still dating you can't be dumped as you weren't really going out if you know what I mean, no disrespect intended. And some more country therapy this time from Mr. Toby Keith... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 Right, this thread has become a microcosm of exactly what I was talking about, and, to me at least, not surprising really since it just goes to confirm what Bradshaw et al. say about the bulk of us. I am not going to pick holes in anyone else's behaviour for 2 reasons: this time I genuinely CBA and it's an opportunity for everyone to examine their own behaviour in a very mild situation, which thus ought not to generate any significantly scary emotions, and, perhaps at a later date, extrapolate from the mild truths they discover to the potential for more serious issues... lol, one can only hope! I say "this time" I CBA because it is one of my go-to self deceptive coping strategies to tell myself that I can't be arsed with things which experience subconsciously warns me are likely to generate difficult emotions - in this case stemming from the potential for a proper nob-yelling argument. So rather than address specific statements with tailored responses, I addressed the topic in a more generalised fashion. In case you're wondering, the emotion I repressed was that nigh on impossible for men to admit to, except in very specific circumstances, for fear of losing social status (which is a very real consequence which has uber serious ramifications including our potential as attractive males), which is fear itself. The fear of ugly circumstances which have started as a simple argument and ended with... here I was about to quote some personal horrors, which are pretty bad in the general scheme of things, in order to justify the fear I just admitted to - lol! don't feel you have to stop smiling if you see her (but don't look at her and start smiling after you've seen her it's just confusing and I CBA explaining how to turn it in your favour) the more she see's you smiling and laughing like it dosen't bother you she'll want you more and so will other girl's around her! As a point of absolute fact it is impossible to control feelings to a degree at which you can usefully instruct yourself to feel or not feel a certain way without the use of mood altering substances. You can, and most people do, try and many believe that they or others have succeeded, but it is simply a fallacy, as any psychiatrist will be happy to tell you. Indeed we can deceive others about our emotional state and the more we try it, the more successful our attempts become, until the point at which our target audience does actually believe the charade, at which point we have become accomplished liars. This training typically begins as we begin to imitate our parents, older siblings, and playmates, from about age 3, assuming our primary carer is not 1 of the emotionally functional minority. It is true that being able to deceive others about our emotional state is a very powerful tool when deployed consciously for specific outcomes with predetermined consequences, however there are 2 major hiccoughs: 1) it is a very rare person who is sufficiently conscious of themselves in the moment to both understand their real emotional state, so they can hide it, and project a convincing false one on top, while also judging how their performance is being received and adjusting it on the fly to stay focussed on their goals - this is why it takes actors a good deal of training to get good at it; 2) whether it be through education or subconscious experience, we all know that, unless somebody is very weird (psychopath etc.), we all have more in common emotionally and psychologically than we have differences, so if someone knows that, in our situation, they would be hurting, but we appear not to be, then there are only 2 options - either we are a psycho or we are lying. Remembering what I said earlier about self deceit being a very common emotional coping strategy, what usually happens is that far from lying consciously for specific reasons, it is an habitual reaction to difficult emotions: we feel hurt thus we are vulnerable, so we fear being hurt even more, so we pretend we are not bothered and tell ourselves that the pretence is actually aimed at getting a response from an/other/s, when really it is a shell to protect our squishy inner selves. This becomes more complex because there is a natural instinct to get back at somebody who has hurt us, but just like deliberate lies, the best self-deception is that which contains a good bit of truth. It has to be noted that there are also very few people who are either trained to both take part in social interaction and observe it with something approaching objectivity simultaneously, or are so jaded that regardless of any outcomes they genuinely couldn't care less, so their own emotional reactions do not distract them. It is also true that the younger we are, generally the less trust we place in our 'gut feelings'. So it is very possible to derive 'benefits' from only partially successful deceit, but... Without writing an actual textbook, the fruit of the poison tree may fill a hole but it fcuks you up eventually. Being thought of as a 'playa' might get us short term benefits, but at the cost of trust - not just amongst the opposite sex, but amongst our same sex friends who cannot but wonder, "If he can do that, what else could he do? Who else could he do? Sh!t, he's not here, where is my girlfriend?" Of course if we act like something long enough and don't behave in any other way, we actually become it, 'playas', and we do cross lines which we would previously have considered taboo, because it is the nature of young people to test the boundaries, to find what is and is not ok. The trouble is that when we are deceiving ourselves we are robbed of our most important tool in this growing up process, our very own moral compass, and instead we must rely on the reactions of others to gauge sick from actually sick behaviour. Here it comes: but if we are deceiving them as well, how the fcuk can we derive any useful guidance from them? Plus, all of this takes a great deal of effort. This is what I meant by "someone living in your head rent free". Our behaviour is being partially dictated by our perception of how someone who has decided they don't want to share any of the benefits of doing things for someone else's sake with us anymore... Couldn't agree more! After I got dumped I did the whole stiff upper lip thing and acted like nothing happened and the result was my Ex looked far more depressed then I did and was complaining to her friends how I didn't look sad about it Safe to say I won that bit Let's examine what was won. Certainly our atavistic urge for revenge is satisfied by visiting consequences upon the perpetrator of our woes in equal measure, plus a smidge more for, we tell ourselves, a lesson not to do it again, but which actually constitutes a threat of dire consequences should the perp decide to make a feud out of it (the self deception here is because these days it is generally felt to be unacceptable to make threats in social situations). However, taking a broader view, what are we left with? A group of women who believe varying amounts of a few things, amongst which are: we were not particularly emotionally invested in the relationship so we were lying just to get into her pants, or we are lying now, or we are so mercurial that we can go from attraction, and perhaps something like love, to indifference very quickly, which marks us out as either somebody to be shagged but not boyfriend material and/or a psycho. As young men this is not necessarily such a bad thing, because, admit it or not Adam, we are genetically programmed to seek sex with pretty much as many females as we find attractive and can get access to without dire consequences resulting... What is a major problem though is, as I've already said, it becomes habitual. Years later when we find ourselves with an undefinable emptiness, an urge to do something but we don't know what, we eventually cannot but venture into our own scrupulously avoided inner selves, looking for the answer to the question, "I'm doing what I want so why do I not enjoy it so much and why, during moments when I am not distracted by these dwindling pleasures, do I feel uncomfortable in my own skin?" And the problem is that after years of habitual self deception, there actually isn't anything real inside us at all. We can do nothing but imitate others in the hope that 'doing what people do' will lead to a fulfilling life... but it won't. We cannot be fulfilled until we know what it is that we want and we cannot know what we want until we know who we are and we cannot know who we are until we are someone real... Well that escalated quickly! First I was just making sure I acted as if it didn't get to me to try and save face and then I'm beating women :/ Yeah, I jumped from the beginnings of a problem to some severe eventual consequences which can, and often do, result and I've elaborated in exactly the same way above. But hey, like I also said, the reason I have studied this is because I first lived it. I had problems which I didn't know had a rational basis, but once I did know I wanted what I thought of as "a cure" (lol!). Anyway, the first lesson, which I am trying to define for, and introduce to, you (plural, not anyone in particular - 'the reader'), is that our psyches are such complex spaces/frameworks/matrices/souls/whatever-the-fcuk-you-believe-in-s that even small, seemingly innocuous, meddling with what we perceive as the truth of any given situation has consequences which, given that we are also living within them, cannot be understood very well when it matters, ie at the point of action. Thus our actions become less and less firmly under our conscious control, as each deception adds still more unfathomable complexity of thought, and more distance between such thought and repressed, unacknowledged feelings. We react, controlled by the need to immediately quash emotion, not respond in a considered way, ie feeling as we do, understanding that, taking it into account and, depending also upon our attitude, proceed with whatever we come up with as a plan... unable to respond properly, we are not fully response-able... and yet we have adult bodies and can amass sufficient resources to cause a great deal of trouble! But hey, as I said, I lived it... so I remember what I was like as a young man. "It won't happen to me...!" the mantra and indeed the battlecry lol! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
two_zero Posted March 14, 2013 Share Posted March 14, 2013 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 14, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 14, 2013 ...because it is serious. As you can see, close to deadly serious... Edit: & that was after I came out of hospital! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters jcheeseright Posted March 15, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 15, 2013 This thread is LOL. Also, Adam, move on... snakes with tits! Just find another one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted March 15, 2013 Supporters Share Posted March 15, 2013 Your woman leave you then, James? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
breakdown Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 O. M. F. G. all this from wanting to take some girl to airsoft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adamasrc Posted March 17, 2013 Share Posted March 17, 2013 breakdown - name is so relevant as for emotions, deal with it how you see fit. you can't really take advice from anyone else as you know how to deal with yourself best.. UNLESS you're suicidal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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