Navy seals look

[James1989]

In my opinion, I think a lot of military gear is relevant for airsoft, afterall the job of military gear is to optimise an individuals ability to run around and shoot people. I think there are some common themes.

 

Of course you will always get people that are captan overkill and I got pissed of with a guy in ghillie that couldn't feel his hit. Then he took off the hood and was about 12 and I felt bad but I digress.

 

It doesnt matter if its airsoft or monopoly some c*nt (normally my brother) is cheating. We can just try and embrace the majority of the community.

 

In answer to the OP for inspiration I found a great site called google images. Or go to military first to find the name of the camo you like then find it on ebay

[Sako]

3 hours ago, LightningCh said:

Solar has definitely come across more obnoxious in this thread at least. Some of his older posts are actually good (he wouldn't have 8 likes for nothing after all lol)

It really does have that Readman97 vibe to it in this thread though. Although Solar's account was made in October 2017 so unless Readman made an alt account early on ready for when he quit. I doubt its the same person, just that sort of mindset.

They should maybe meet up and be the bestest of friends.

[ImTriggerHappy]

32 minutes ago, James1989 said:

In my opinion, I think a lot of military gear is relevant for airsoft, afterall the job of military gear is to optimise an individuals ability to run around and shoot people. I think there are some common themes.

I can see what you are thinking but for a normal skirmish military gear is no better than a pair of jeans and a hoodie with a belt to hook a few pouches on.

The best set up for airsoft is actually the speedsofter style but I am a little too old to pull that off.

 

Military gear is designed for a battlefield and to help keep you in peak condition and carry all the stuff you might need for several days on patrol or on a battlefield.

 

Airsoft is generally short games where all you need is a few mags and maybe pyro. The camouflage aspect is all but pointless at airsoft ranges.

 

Wearing military style gear is just a case of choice and I have already said thats cool by me as long as its still suitable for airsoft and that the person wearing it remembers it is airsoft which is not actually being a soldier. It's not about the clothes it is about the part of the community that forgets the game and the fun is still the main thing.

[James1989]

2 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Military gear is designed for a battlefield and to help keep you in peak condition and carry all the stuff you might need for several days on patrol or on a battlefield.

 

Airsoft is generally short games where all you need is a few mags and maybe pyro. The camouflage aspect is all but pointless at airsoft ranges.

 

Oh yeah f*ck carrying the kitchen sink but I prefer the uniforms on purely wht I find practical as they tend to have good size pockets, with molle pouches dont slide about, etc. Anyway not expecting you to change your mind and turn up head to toe in mtp

 

Personally at Red1 I hae found it easier to spot the people in hoodies as appose to darker camo like flektarn ad dpm but that could just be my eyes. 

 

Anyway all's fair in love and airsoft

[LightningCh]

I wear my camo for woodland purely to just look the part lol. For how cheap it is to get surplus items (£30 gets you a smock and trousers in basic camo)
But I wear a Condor MCR5 for both indoor and outdoor so I'm just lightweight and the camo is purely for the "aesthetics". I would never claim it stops them from seeing me, (that is because im just good at hide and seek lol). I keep my "soldier stuff" to a minimum, its about the game and enjoying myself.

But for indoor I definitely have a more "speedsofter" kit. As posted in the loadouts thread, a hoodie and some cargo pants lol.

So all in all, the difference between my indoor kit and outdoor kit is...
Pistol holster is on chest for woodland, on belt for indoor.
and camo for outdoor while i wear black for indoor.

I will not personally be the guy carrying an extra set of weights purely for the realism while skirmishing. It's a skirmish and it's definitely orientated more towards the fun of playing in my eyes.
But that's my opinion, and to the guys who rock up at indoors in MTP and the full loadout. You can wear whatever you want, just don't let it get in the way of the honour side to this sport. Eh. "I didn't feel it through my 6 inches of mags and rig"

[Guest scalawag]

14 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

I can see what you are thinking but for a normal skirmish military gear is no better than a pair of jeans and a hoodie with a belt to hook a few pouches on.

The best set up for airsoft is actually the speedsofter style but I am a little too old to pull that off.

Yes I can see this but then surely military gear is by your own admission no worse than jeans and a hoody either.  I imagine the speedster style is the best if your objective for the day is to win every game you take part in, but that may not be the only reason other people enjoy airsoft.

14 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Military gear is designed for a battlefield and to help keep you in peak condition and carry all the stuff you might need for several days on patrol or on a battlefield.

Some of it is, but the military do more than battlefield stuff and long patrols,  some military set ups are designed for quick sharp shock engagements(remember the machine gun nest scene in saving private Ryan, a swift change of set up to take on the assault), or even no engagement at all if possible.  To paint military gear as only having the purpose you describe is selling it short and is not the whole picture.  I am sure this was not your intention, and that you meant specifically heavy military load outs, but I at least took from what you wrote "all military load outs"

14 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Airsoft is generally short games where all you need is a few mags and maybe pyro. The camouflage aspect is all but pointless at airsoft ranges.

I could not agree more.  But I still like to wear camo, I don't necessarily wear it for the concealment aspect, I even wear it around the house because I find it comfortable and well made for the most part. I am wearing it as I type this because I am comfortable wearing it.  Assuming that people do things for only one reason can lead to missunderstanding.

14 hours ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Wearing military style gear is just a case of choice and I have already said thats cool by me as long as its still suitable for airsoft and that the person wearing it remembers it is airsoft which is not actually being a soldier. It's not about the clothes it is about the part of the community that forgets the game and the fun is still the main thing.

I agree with most of what you are saying here, but suitability of gear for airsoft is in my opinion a very subjective thing.  Yes it is clear that some things are more suitable than others, and some set ups are more likely to help you win the game, but there are companies out there producing exactly the sort of gear your are describing not to mil specs for military use, but specifically for airsofters, so there would seem to be a part of the wider airsoft community for whom the look of gear is a part of things and who would see it as suitable to turn up in that gear.

 

I don't want to labour the point but, I think some of this has to do with the diversity of styles in airsoft in the UK now, and the lack of places to exclusively play those specific styles of game.  The "Sunday Skirmish" for better or worse is an airsoft game for all, and for the most part what we are stuck with, and that being the case we all need to find a way to get on.  No matter how much we complain about a certain type of player they are not going to go away, sites won't turn away their money anymore than they will yours or mine.  So we have to find a way to tolerate it, or if not then perhaps there is a need for sites where it is clear that the airsoft played is not a military game in any sense and it is about the competition and trying to win.  

As I have said before my enjoyment of airsoft does not come from winning the game, or making sure that everyone is playing "properly" it comes from other things like the dress up aspect and great mates to chat with for the day. So for me at least, you can see "the game" is not one of the main things, fun is though.

[Duff]

tl;dr

 

If we all liked the same old sh*t then life would be boring, variety is the spice of life and if someone else's choice makes you chuckle, don't make them feel bad for it.

 

And remember, if you're offended by anything someone else says, that is your choice, not theirs. Baggage is something you have to carry with you.

 

 

Now, who's up for forming a onesie squad?

[Guest scalawag]

28 minutes ago, Duff said:

If we all liked the same old sh*t then life would be boring, variety is the spice of life and if someone else's choice makes you chuckle, don't make them feel bad for it.

Spot on mate.

28 minutes ago, Duff said:

And remember, if you're offended by anything someone else says, that is your choice, not theirs. Baggage is something you have to carry with you.

This I am not so sure about.  Some people can some times (maybe because of their baggage) be genuinely offensive, and taking offence is not always due to the baggage of the offended.  In these instances where offence would be the appropriate response it would be disingenuous to blame the offended person, and entirely inappropriate to let the offender go unchallenged.  So sorry I cannot fully agree with you on this statement. Apportion responsibility accurately and appropriately and challenge those who are genuinely offensive, some will even tell you that is what they set out to be.

Again this form of communication sucks in this area because meaning is not always conveyed in the way that the writer wishes.  

Write down a couple of moderately long sentences that convey some form of meaning, read them in your head, and then get someone else to read them back to you aloud, and I bet what you hear is not the same as you reading the words in your head which conveys your original sense of meaning.  Its an interesting experiment.

[Duff]

Stephen Fry said it best "So you're offended, so f*cking what?"

 

 

Try this, every time you hear or read something that upsets you, read it as if you wrote it. Still upset by it, then it probably isn't you.

[Guest scalawag]

8 minutes ago, Duff said:

Stephen Fry said it best "So you're offended, so f*cking what?"

 

 

Try this, every time you hear or read something that upsets you, read it as if you wrote it. Still upset by it, then it probably isn't you.

Yes I agree but this is a little different from your first comment, as it does not always pass balme to the offended party and allows for offence to be a legitimate response after consideration.  Sometimes it is appropriate to be offended, and sometimes other people are genuinely offensive.

[Duff]

3 minutes ago, scalawag said:

Yes I agree but this is a little different from your first comment, as it does not always pass balme to the offended party and allows for offence to be a legitimate response after consideration.

 

There's no real set formulae for this... you're either able to not take sh*t personally or you're triggered by any opinion that differs from your own. 

 

I feel like it's a sign of intellect being able to not instantly take offence to stuff even if it's directed at you. More often than not those that bite immediately aren't the sharpest of tools.

[ImTriggerHappy]

@scalawag I think you are still missing the point. I have no issue with military style gear even though it is not something I choose to wear myself. The problem is with those players who go so far down the route they are wearing clothing that effects their ability to play properly. Plate carriers with plates in, pads on every possible surface, pouches filled with useless none essential items, bloody backpacks, clothing that is too thick and loose all these things will effect a players ability to feel and hear hits.  Those players who claim they still know are wrong because even the lightest loadouts have dead points.

Even worse was your earlier claim that a few missed hits do not matter because yes they do. The main purpose of an airsoft game is to shoot each other and the number one rule is when you are hit stick your hand up and call it. There is no part of the rules that says that if you don't know it is ok as long as you are happy with your roleplay outfit that is all that matters.

 

If the dress up is more important than the actual game then re-enactment is the logical choice and not being on an airsoft field pissing people off. 

 

If people want a good mix of both then play milsim but don't turn up at a normal skirmish dressed like a juggernaut as that defeats the object. I have very few issues with people not calling hits as I can usually adjust my aim for a better spot but not everyone manages that and they end getting frustrated because some airsoft larpist thinks their enjoyment is more important than everyone elses.

 

Lots of players still do great military loadouts but still stay within the realms of sensible. It is only a minority that are the issue but their numbers are growing and it only takes a few to ruin a day.

 

As for upsetting people understand I honestly do not care as anyone who takes it personal is one of those that I am aiming at.

 

[Guest scalawag]

1 minute ago, Duff said:

 

There's no real set formulae for this... you're either able to not take sh*t personally or you're triggered by any opinion that differs from your own. 

 

I feel like it's a sign of intellect being able to not instantly take offence to stuff even if it's directed at you. More often than not those that bite immediately aren't the sharpest of tools.

No there is not a set formulae as we are all individuals.  

I agree with you, but there are some individuals who will offend a significant proportion of the population with their words or actions and see no wrong in that.  I suppose what I don't like are those individuals who seem to think it is their task in life to trample all over the feelings, opinions and/or beliefs of others and then tell them it is their fault "because they can't take it".  My dislike may be because I have worked with the results of that sort of attitude towards others far too often in the last 25 years.  

We will all have things that will set us off, some have fewer than others but we all have them.  Having less of them is not strength, or more of them weakness, its just good fortune or misfortune, and you can't help the baggage you have, as you put it, because you cannot change the things that have happened to you. You can learn to live with it differently, or manage it differently but you will always be prone to the triggers you have.

Personally I don't think this is connected to intellect directly.  I think it is about what we experience in life, regardless of how intelligent we are, and what those experiences teach us about the world, other people and ourselves.  Those born with lower intellect, as you put it, may be more prone to the type of life experiences, and interpretations of them, which prevent the development of resilience as on the whole they tend to be looked down on and taken advantage of by those who consider they have a higher degree of intellect, leading to more negative experiences in life than others may have, and a tendency toward sensitivity.

[Duff]

Honestly I don't give a sh*t who I offend but over the years I've noticed that kind of attitude can lose friends fast or give you a reputation that isn't necessarily accurate.

 

Interpretation is key and a lot of the written word is lost in the reading, for numerous reasons.

 

I try to be decent to most but sometimes I default to "Oh go f*ck yourself."

[Guest scalawag]

19 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

@scalawag I think you are still missing the point. I have no issue with military style gear even though it is not something I choose to wear myself. The problem is with those players who go so far down the route they are wearing clothing that effects their ability to play properly. Plate carriers with plates in, pads on every possible surface, pouches filled with useless none essential items, bloody backpacks, clothing that is too thick and loose all these things will effect a players ability to feel and hear hits.  Those players who claim they still know are wrong because even the lightest loadouts have dead points.

Even worse was your earlier claim that a few missed hits do not matter because yes they do. The main purpose of an airsoft game is to shoot each other and the number one rule is when you are hit stick your hand up and call it. There is no part of the rules that says that if you don't know it is ok as long as you are happy with your roleplay outfit that is all that matters.

 

If the dress up is more important than the actual game then re-enactment is the logical choice and not being on an airsoft field pissing people off. 

 

If people want a good mix of both then play milsim but don't turn up at a normal skirmish dressed like a juggernaut as that defeats the object. I have very few issues with people not calling hits as I can usually adjust my aim for a better spot but not everyone manages that and they end getting frustrated because some airsoft larpist thinks their enjoyment is more important than everyone elses.

 

Lots of players still do great military loadouts but still stay within the realms of sensible. It is only a minority that are the issue but their numbers are growing and it only takes a few to ruin a day.

 

As for upsetting people understand I honestly do not care as anyone who takes it personal is one of those that I am aiming at.

 

I don't think I have misunderstood you or that I am missing your point or that you are missing mine, I think we will just not ever agree with each others point of view, and I do hear your concerns about some military kit, but I do think we will never agree as we seem to have very different ideas about what the "fun" in airsoft is derived from.  I don't think we will ever see it the same way. I will just leave things at that now as I have really said enough already.

[ImTriggerHappy]

12 minutes ago, scalawag said:

I don't think I have misunderstood you or that I am missing your point, and I do hear your concerns about some military kit, but I do think we will never agree as we seem to have very different ideas about where the "fun" in airsoft lies.  I will just leave things at that now as I have really said enough already.

Then to be honest you are one of the people I have issue with.

There is no point playing the game unless you play appropriately and the reason every plays is shoot people and get shot and dressing up is just a side effect. If you choose to wear something that will prevent you playing the game fairly but have the attitude that it is ok because you are happy then that attitude sucks. Every time I play I am hyper conscientious about playing in a way that is fair to everyone around me so they enjoy the GAME and that nothing I do adversely effects their GAME.  If any part of my gear causes too many issues with hit taking then I change it as no one should have to have me not calling because I put my dress sense before their game.

 

I am done as this brick wall is giving me brain damage.

[Duff]

My leather cut stops any pain from a bb hit butIl I always feel it. I even got shot in the back from about 40ms and even though I barely felt it as in "no pain" I still felt the impact. 

[Guest scalawag]

18 minutes ago, ImTriggerHappy said:

Then to be honest you are one of the people I have issue with.

There is no point playing the game unless you play appropriately and the reason every plays is shoot people and get shot and dressing up is just a side effect. If you choose to wear something that will prevent you playing the game fairly but have the attitude that it is ok because you are happy then that attitude sucks. Every time I play I am hyper conscientious about playing in a way that is fair to everyone around me so they enjoy the GAME and that nothing I do adversely effects their GAME.  If any part of my gear causes too many issues with hit taking then I change it as no one should have to have me not calling because I put my dress sense before their game.

 

I am done as this brick wall is giving me brain damage.

Yes I think I probably am because for me the "game" really isn't that important, I can't keep up with the youngsters anyway now and be competitive, so I care a lot less about the game itself and more about the overall day out.  Doesn't mean I cheat or am not diligent about taking hits.  I just enjoy other aspects more. It also means that I am less bothered by how other people are playing.

You see we do just have different takes on the game/airsoft.  And thats ok with me.

[Guest scalawag]

24 minutes ago, Duff said:

My leather cut stops any pain from a bb hit butIl I always feel it. I even got shot in the back from about 40ms and even though I barely felt it as in "no pain" I still felt the impact. 

I don't think you can ever feel or hear every hit.  Even in the most appropriate of clothes players miss hits. And as ITH has already said you know when you have been hit, but how do you know when you have been hit but missed it?   What I think is far more important is how you respond when someone says they hit you but you did not feel or hear it.  I always err on the side of my having been in error and accept that I was hit.

[Duff]

8 minutes ago, scalawag said:

I don't think you can ever feel or hear every hit.  Even in the most appropriate of clothes players miss hits.  What is far more important is how you respond when someone says they hit you but you did not feel or hear it.  I always err on the side of my having been in error and accept that I was hit.

 

Until you've tried out what I wear you cannot say difinivitely that is true or not. Trust me, I was super surprised at how good proctection it is yet I can feel all my hits. I've decided now that I need something similar for my legs because my thighs looked like I'd ran out of veins to jack into on my arms after last session.

 

But I can bet that a plate carrier full of sh*t will stop you feeling anything at all. Same goes for those hats, though even I can hear hits on those when other people are wearing them.

As for someone not taking their hits, I assume they just enjoy being shot and want to be shot again. Happy to oblige.

[ImTriggerHappy]

29 minutes ago, scalawag said:

Yes I think I probably am because for me the "game" really isn't that important, I can't keep up with the youngsters anyway now and be competitive, so I care a lot less about the game itself and more about the overall day out.  Doesn't mean I cheat or am not diligent about taking hits.  I just enjoy other aspects more. It also means that I am less bothered by how other people are playing.

You see we do just have different takes on the game/airsoft.  And thats ok with me.

I don't think many people actually cheat and 99% of none hit taking is just plain not noticing but as it seems to be the thing people moan about most we all need to do our part to limit it.

[Guest scalawag]

18 minutes ago, Duff said:

 

Until you've tried out what I wear you cannot say difinivitely that is true or not. Trust me, I was super surprised at how good proctection it is yet I can feel all my hits. I've decided now that I need something similar for my legs because my thighs looked like I'd ran out of veins to jack into on my arms after last session.

 

But I can bet that a plate carrier full of sh*t will stop you feeling anything at all. Same goes for those hats, though even I can hear hits on those when other people are wearing them.

As for someone not taking their hits, I assume they just enjoy being shot and want to be shot again. Happy to oblige.

Sorry but I honestly don't believe that anyone, you included, will feel or hear 100% of hits 100% of the time.  There are all sorts of reasons why you may not feel it, and as others have already said even speedsofters in their very lightweight gear occasionally miss hits. It's inevitable i'm afraid.

 

Just a thought here, but are others shooting you in the leg because that is where they have realised you are most likely to recognise the hit?  as I said just a thought as ITH did say that he adjusts his aim for different parts of the body if a hit does not register.

 

As for repeatedly shooting someone who you think is not taking hits - then I hope you enjoy it as much when someone does it to you. I think that sort of attitude sucks, but its probably there because you believe it is possible to feel every hit.  

 

On reflexion perhaps this is not what you meant and I apologies if I have the wrong end of the stick here, but it is what I read into the tone of your reply.

 

[Duff]

Well that's your opinion. I've never been told by another player or a marshall "You were hit" when I thought I wasn't.

 

It's clear you're a snowflake of a man, too sensitive for this world.

 

Also, please stop adding "tone" to everything you read, this is how we got here in the first place.

 

Edit: Also, I see you posting about adding sand to weights in your rig set up, no wonder you can't feel hits and this is exactly what @ImTriggerHappy is getting at.

[Druid799]

Guys having dragged my self through the whole thread from start , think it’s time someone said it’s time to call it quits last three pages been the same point of view going around and around and around , we can all safely say we all have our own take on what a game day should entail , let’s just all be  happy happy joy joy together , and breath ! 

[Guest scalawag]

8 hours ago, Duff said:

Well that's your opinion. I've never been told by another player or a marshall "You were hit" when I thought I wasn't.

 

It's clear you're a snowflake of a man, too sensitive for this world.

 

Also, please stop adding "tone" to everything you read, this is how we got here in the first place.

 

Edit: Also, I see you posting about adding sand to weights in your rig set up, no wonder you can't feel hits and this is exactly what @ImTriggerHappy is getting at.

Well thanks for that but I haven't actually been affected by anything  said here.  If you see discussing my point of view which is different to yours as sensitive and if in your eyes that makes me a snowflake then so be it.

 

Perhaps, again hypothetical, people are not telling you you missed hits because they are following your lead and just shooting you again, again just a possibility.

 

I will I am afraid use what ever language I see fit in my posts as I am sure you also feel entitled to do, but thank you for your input anyway.

 

As to your last assertion, no I was not posting about adding sand to add weight to my set up in another thread.  Thats not something I would want to do as I already have enough weight to carry around with just me these days.  I was trying to be helpful to another forum member who had asked about making more realistically weighted vest plates.  I don't recall that there was any mention in any of the posts in that thread about the weighted plates being used at general airsoft events so there is no indication that this might relate to the discussion ITH has been having.  Maybe, just maybe they are for use in milsim?

 

Breaking News

It transpires that we were both wrong, the OP in the quoted thread wants heavier plates for his fitness training regime.  Nothing to do with skirmishing after all.