Double Eagle M904g – Aka the Original Q Honey Badger

[Fatboy40]

5 hours ago, GoodeyAirsoft said:

So would it be better to go to a smaller inner barrel (200mm) or goto a bigger size (229mm) but I have never worked on a gun before so I wouldn't be to sure or happy to cut something down.

 

If you've got to stick to 350 FPS on 0.20g BBs be wary of going too long and too tight. If your M904G is behaving as expected and has a UK spec spring then out of the box it should be around 345 FPS so longer and tighter could take you consistently over 350 FPS and your gun being too hot ?

 

I've not bothered with the barrel on mine, but I've changed a few other parts, as it's more than accurate enough for an up to 350 FPS AEG.

[GoodeyAirsoft]

1 hour ago, Fatboy40 said:

 

If you've got to stick to 350 FPS on 0.20g BBs be wary of going too long and too tight. If your M904G is behaving as expected and has a UK spec spring then out of the box it should be around 345 FPS so longer and tighter could take you consistently over 350 FPS and your gun being too hot ?

 

I've not bothered with the barrel on mine, but I've changed a few other parts, as it's more than accurate enough for an up to 350 FPS AEG.

So i use 0.28g BBs in mine that runs me at around 280ish FPS/ 0.9 or 1.0 somthing joules.

 

So i might just go to a 200mm  inner barrel and make all the upgrade and see what happens, then make changes to keep it within UK limits.

[Fatboy40]

UK Double Eagle Stock Springs

 

I bought my son a DE M906C for Christmas, so far he's only fired it in the garden briefly, so before we play a game on 9/1/2022 I thought I'd swap in both a Maple Leaf 60 degree Macaron and Omega nub today (once my M908A arrives that'll be three DE M900's we have in the house).

 

The hop up units "arm" is the variant that has a hole for a "captive" nub... https://imgur.com/m9rWHXB ... which my M904E's arm does not, with this nub removed and the Omega nub installed this appeared (a visual check) to be adding quite a bit of hop to the Macaron without any hop actually being applied on the hop unit. A chrono gave me around 280 FPS on 0.20g, horribly under powered, so I thought it best to put all the original parts back in a chrono again (I forgot to do one beforehand). This still gave around 280 FPS, and started to get me worried.

 

I'm building up a nice supply of spare parts now, and have a few different springs to hand, so I thought I'd swap in a Gearparts M105 to see what the result would be. This lead to two negative discoveries, one the QC spring guide had its flat head screwdriver cut out mangled at some point... https://imgur.com/breI5D0 ... and secondly the spring was a hideously cheap and nasty one. So in goes the Gearparts M105, with DE M900's by default having both a piston head and spring guide bearing, and with no hop it shot hot at around 360 FPS and with a little hop it was consistently around 348 FPS so I was happy then and popped back in the ML Macaron (but the Omega nub will have to wait until I can buy a better hop unit).

 

That's two incidents I've had now with iffy springs in UK spec DE M900's, both of which were purchased from Patrol Base, who get them from Taiwan Gun as the European distributor. I personally don't think it's a coincidence, but who's installing these crap springs, is it DE themselves, the distributor or the reseller? (I'm going with either the distributor or reseller so they're country specific legal). This is a shot of three springs... https://imgur.com/PvoZtwF ... a Gearparts M120 at the top (170mm in length, with tighter coils at one end), my original DE M904E in the middle (160mm, no tighter coils) and at the bottom the M906C (200mm, no tighter coils). Both DE springs feel so cheap and flimsy compared to Gearparts and Guarder springs, especially the 200mm one. I'm very much looking forward to getting the spring out of my M90A when it arrives, as it's not from Patrol Base but I'm assuming the Taiwan Gun is the distributor (let's see if it has the usual green "Krakman" Polish label).

 

Luckily I've my own chrono, spare parts and tools, however the M906C could have gone to someone who'd not have known until a site chrono / a back garden plinker who'd never have known!

[RostokMcSpoons]

1 hour ago, Fatboy40 said:

UK Double Eagle Stock Springs

 

I bought my son a DE M906C for Christmas, so far he's only fired it in the garden briefly, so before we play a game on 9/1/2022 I thought I'd swap in both a Maple Leaf 60 degree Macaron and Omega nub today (once my M908A arrives that'll be three DE M900's we have in the house).

 

The hop up units "arm" is the variant that has a hole for a "captive" nub... https://imgur.com/m9rWHXB ... which my M904E's arm does not, with this nub removed and the Omega nub installed this appeared (a visual check) to be adding quite a bit of hop to the Macaron without any hop actually being applied on the hop unit. A chrono gave me around 280 FPS on 0.20g, horribly under powered, so I thought it best to put all the original parts back in a chrono again (I forgot to do one beforehand). This still gave around 280 FPS, and started to get me worried.

 

I'm building up a nice supply of spare parts now, and have a few different springs to hand, so I thought I'd swap in a Gearparts M105 to see what the result would be. This lead to two negative discoveries, one the QC spring guide had its flat head screwdriver cut out mangled at some point... https://imgur.com/breI5D0 ... and secondly the spring was a hideously cheap and nasty one. So in goes the Gearparts M105, with DE M900's by default having both a piston head and spring guide bearing, and with no hop it shot hot at around 360 FPS and with a little hop it was consistently around 348 FPS so I was happy then and popped back in the ML Macaron (but the Omega nub will have to wait until I can buy a better hop unit).

 

That's two incidents I've had now with iffy springs in UK spec DE M900's, both of which were purchased from Patrol Base, who get them from Taiwan Gun as the European distributor. I personally don't think it's a coincidence, but who's installing these crap springs, is it DE themselves, the distributor or the reseller? (I'm going with either the distributor or reseller so they're country specific legal). This is a shot of three springs... https://imgur.com/PvoZtwF ... a Gearparts M120 at the top (170mm in length, with tighter coils at one end), my original DE M904E in the middle (160mm, no tighter coils) and at the bottom the M906C (200mm, no tighter coils). Both DE springs feel so cheap and flimsy compared to Gearparts and Guarder springs, especially the 200mm one. I'm very much looking forward to getting the spring out of my M90A when it arrives, as it's not from Patrol Base but I'm assuming the Taiwan Gun is the distributor (let's see if it has the usual green "Krakman" Polish label).

 

Luckily I've my own chrono, spare parts and tools, however the M906C could have gone to someone who'd not have known until a site chrono / a back garden plinker who'd never have known!

 

I just dug around in my parts box, assuming I've got the correct old spring (it is in a box with a post-it saying 'DE orig spring', I try to keep track) then mine measures 200mm.

Obligatory pic: 

 

And it's a linear spring too.

Same results I had, going from < 300fps (no hop) to 345fps

Apart from that, it's still a lovely gun, my best purchase so far  
 

Edited January 7, 2022 by RostokMcSpoons

[JVacation]

On 07/01/2022 at 15:40, Fatboy40 said:

UK Double Eagle Stock Springs

 

I bought my son a DE M906C for Christmas, so far he's only fired it in the garden briefly, so before we play a game on 9/1/2022 I thought I'd swap in both a Maple Leaf 60 degree Macaron and Omega nub today (once my M908A arrives that'll be three DE M900's we have in the house).

 

The hop up units "arm" is the variant that has a hole for a "captive" nub... https://imgur.com/m9rWHXB ... which my M904E's arm does not, with this nub removed and the Omega nub installed this appeared (a visual check) to be adding quite a bit of hop to the Macaron without any hop actually being applied on the hop unit. A chrono gave me around 280 FPS on 0.20g, horribly under powered, so I thought it best to put all the original parts back in a chrono again (I forgot to do one beforehand). This still gave around 280 FPS, and started to get me worried.

 

I'm building up a nice supply of spare parts now, and have a few different springs to hand, so I thought I'd swap in a Gearparts M105 to see what the result would be. This lead to two negative discoveries, one the QC spring guide had its flat head screwdriver cut out mangled at some point... https://imgur.com/breI5D0 ... and secondly the spring was a hideously cheap and nasty one. So in goes the Gearparts M105, with DE M900's by default having both a piston head and spring guide bearing, and with no hop it shot hot at around 360 FPS and with a little hop it was consistently around 348 FPS so I was happy then and popped back in the ML Macaron (but the Omega nub will have to wait until I can buy a better hop unit).

 

That's two incidents I've had now with iffy springs in UK spec DE M900's, both of which were purchased from Patrol Base, who get them from Taiwan Gun as the European distributor. I personally don't think it's a coincidence, but who's installing these crap springs, is it DE themselves, the distributor or the reseller? (I'm going with either the distributor or reseller so they're country specific legal). This is a shot of three springs... https://imgur.com/PvoZtwF ... a Gearparts M120 at the top (170mm in length, with tighter coils at one end), my original DE M904E in the middle (160mm, no tighter coils) and at the bottom the M906C (200mm, no tighter coils). Both DE springs feel so cheap and flimsy compared to Gearparts and Guarder springs, especially the 200mm one. I'm very much looking forward to getting the spring out of my M90A when it arrives, as it's not from Patrol Base but I'm assuming the Taiwan Gun is the distributor (let's see if it has the usual green "Krakman" Polish label).

 

Luckily I've my own chrono, spare parts and tools, however the M906C could have gone to someone who'd not have known until a site chrono / a back garden plinker who'd never have known!

 

I've been doing a cyma ak build lately. I purchased it from PB. The springs are definitely coming from TG. Cyma aks always come really hot and Patrol Base use TG as a "supplier" I think what they are doing is ordering guns from TG and then getting them to downgrade them (which TG offer for free to normal customers). My Cyma ak came to me at 310 fps which is around the 310 downgrade that TG do. Also my spring looks exactly the same as the one you have.

[ak2m4]

@Fatboy40 The factory price for M906C is extremely low, they would never fit a spring with decent quality material sadly.  Try removing the thrust bearing from the piston head, you should see the fps come down 15fps

[doom9]

[ak2m4]

@doom9 love the SMG 45, not sure about that stock though, love the RS wire-frame stock, however it's only £115, pretty good value.

[RostokMcSpoons]

57 minutes ago, ak2m4 said:

@doom9 love the SMG 45, not sure about that stock though, love the RS wire-frame stock, however it's only £115, pretty good value.

 

I'm really liking the look of this (inc the stock)

What sort of price would that £115 become if it eventually found its way to my front door?

[ak2m4]

5 hours ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

What sort of price would that £115 become if it eventually found its way to my front door?

 

Should be roughly the same price if TW sold without the VAT or signed up for the vat prepayment. I imagine if they signed up for the prepayment scheme (I forget it's name) then they would skip handling charges?  

[RostokMcSpoons]

Perhaps I should 

a) Let someone else do the Taiwangun thang and report back

 

and more importantly 

 

b) Try the new guns I've just bought in a skirmish for the first time, before trying to buy another one (and risking my marriage)

 

 

[Fatboy40]

In the UK it would probably be the same as most other mid-ranged DE M4's, so I'd take a bet at £170 (although I've a horrible feeling that once the DE M900 range is back in stock everywhere in the UK prices are going to go up a little).

[RostokMcSpoons]

2 hours ago, Fatboy40 said:

In the UK it would probably be the same as most other mid-ranged DE M4's, so I'd take a bet at £170 (although I've a horrible feeling that once the DE M900 range is back in stock everywhere in the UK prices are going to go up a little).

 

Yeah I've seen some on sale at over £200 already, but strangely Patrolbase have twice put m900s on sale down at £130 - once for black Friday, and once for a 'Muzzle Flash sale' (props to the marketing dept for coming up with that)

However in both cases there wasn't any actual stock to sell !

 

 

[Gaziel]

Hey guys, I've had the M904G for a few months now and its FPS has dropped a tonne, so figured I'd do all my upgrades at once and get it to better performance. 

 

I was wondering if these upgrades were suitable and would lead to better grouping, FPS changes and improved rapidness of the burst fire. Please give me any suggestions and changes.

 

Spring:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/gearparts-aeg-spring-m105?search=Gearparts M105

 

Motor:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/zci-motor-high-torque-long?search=Zci motor

 

Rubber bucking:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/maple-leaf-macaron-60-aeg

 

Inner barrel:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/zci-inner-barrel-229mm

 

 

Hop-up chamber

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/zci-rotary-m4-hop-chamber-aluminium-red

 

[RostokMcSpoons]

I've taken the same journey, so you might want to catch up on my thread... 

I haven't changed the motor or barrel or hop unit... I'll be interested to see how you get on if you do change those, so please make before and after accuracy tests to prove what changes are really the most effective.. That would be very helpful to the community

 

I'm currently very happy with my gun after the change of spring, bucking and nub, but would always welcome more accuracy. 

The motor is fine (IMHO) , especially when driven by an 11.1v battery

 

Your shopping list looks the same as I'd make.  So good luck ?

Edited February 7, 2022 by RostokMcSpoons

[ak2m4]

@Gaziel make sure you all gearparts 70 omega nub for that Macaron: https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/omega-nub-soft-70-gear-parts

[Stevobeavo]

On 07/02/2022 at 20:06, Gaziel said:

 

Rubber bucking:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/maple-leaf-macaron-60-aeg

 

Inner barrel:

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/zci-inner-barrel-229mm

 

 

 

 

I have these upgrades plus the ML omega nub.

 

I can lob .3 bbs pretty accurately 60/65m. 

 

I've recently put in a ML MR bucking but haven't played a game with the new bucking yet so cant comment on performance. 

 

Edit - one thing I have noticed now we're in colder weather is that I have feeding issues first thing on the morning. Om 99% sure it's the longer bucking lips on the ML so I'll be sanding/cutting them down a bit.

Edited February 9, 2022 by Stevobeavo

[Zinvoy]

Hello there, I need some help about a problem that I'm having with my M904, I recently have taken it apart, and after checking the shims and greasing the gearbox, I have put every together, and while checking my fire selector it's not working, I don't have a semi mode anymore, every time that I shoot it just does a burst of 2 shoots, and it does do same sound when you connect the battery, everytime that I press the trigger!

[RostokMcSpoons]

Have you nipped any of the wiring when putting it all back together perhaps?  It might be worth pulling it apart to check.

I haven't opened my gearbox up... is the mosfet optical?  If it is - any chance you've got grease on a sensor?

 

Have you tried resetting the mosfet?    IIRC it's simply done by putting the gun in Safe and holding the trigger for 5 seconds.

Edited February 14, 2022 by RostokMcSpoons

[Fatboy40]

5 hours ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

is the mosfet optical?

 

It is, optical sensors for the trigger + selector + sector gear.

 

Maybe the selector plate is somehow in the wrong position, the sticker on the plate has come off / been damaged (a white sticker with black bars that the optical sensor detects), there's grease / gunge on the optical sensors or worst case the controller has become damaged 

[Stevobeavo]

You haven't accidentally put the gun in binary mode have you? 

[Zinvoy]

On 14/02/2022 at 11:55, RostokMcSpoons said:

Have you nipped any of the wiring when putting it all back together perhaps?  It might be worth pulling it apart to check.

I haven't opened my gearbox up... is the mosfet optical?  If it is - any chance you've got grease on a sensor?

 

Have you tried resetting the mosfet?    IIRC it's simply done by putting the gun in Safe and holding the trigger for 5 seconds.

I have tried to reset the trigger, but that didn't work, it's continues to shoot a 2 round burst

 

20 hours ago, Fatboy40 said:

 

It is, optical sensors for the trigger + selector + sector gear.

 

Maybe the selector plate is somehow in the wrong position, the sticker on the plate has come off / been damaged (a white sticker with black bars that the optical sensor detects), there's grease / gunge on the optical sensors or worst case the controller has become damaged 

By what I can see the sticker has some damage, I tried to straighten
that the best that I could, but it still has some marks in it.

 

19 hours ago, Stevobeavo said:

You haven't accidentally put the gun in binary mode have you? 

No, it's really a 2 round burst them I press the trigger, the strange part about that is the sound, every time that I press the trigger I can hear the same sound them you connect the battery or try to config some firing mode.

[RostokMcSpoons]

I would say the beeping is either a loose connection being shaken by the vibration of the motor, or the sensor doesn't like what it's seeing and is giving you an error code diagnostic beep 

 

Edit:  for a G&G mosfet, but maybe they're common...

 

So somewhat backs up the idea the sticker on your sector gear is the issue

Edited February 15, 2022 by RostokMcSpoons

[Zinvoy]

1 hour ago, RostokMcSpoons said:

I would say the beeping is either a loose connection being shaken by the vibration of the motor, or the sensor doesn't like what it's seeing and is giving you an error code diagnostic beep 

 

Edit:  for a G&G mosfet, but maybe they're common...

 

So somewhat backs up the idea the sticker on your sector gear is the issue

Yes that's what I'm thinking, I made the mistake of not seeing the sticker getting squished by the gearbox, now I have to see how I replace that.

[Fatboy40]

Luckily I've not yet had the need to take the selector plate off of any of the M900's I have / have access to, so I've not seen the sticker to confirm its patterning, but let's hope that they 100% mimicked GATE with their "Falcon" as you may be able to use this...

 

https://www.thecageairsoft.co.uk/gate-titan-v2-installation-kit/