Can I Be UKARA Registered Without Being a Skirmisher

[Steve82lamb]

Hi could anyone help me please,

Why do i need to run around in the woods skirmishing shooting a pistol no more than 350fps 3 times over the course of 2 months so i can then buy the RIF of my choice that infact the particular ones i am looking to buy will be too powerful for me to use whilst i skirmish so there's no point in taking up skirmishing on a regular basis when for me I've grown up with air rifles/pistols shooting on private land and away from the public i would like to buy some more realistic looking weapons is there another way to become ukara registered without having to play army games or can i have a valid defence without being a film making museum curator who rein acts battle scenes? 

Kind regards Steve   

P. S no offence intended to anyone who likes to skirmish its just not for me 

Thank you 

[Asomodai]

10 minutes ago, Steve82lamb said:

Hi could anyone help me please,

Why do i need to run around in the woods skirmishing shooting a pistol no more than 350fps 3 times over the course of 2 months so i can then buy the RIF of my choice that infact the particular ones i am looking to buy will be too powerful for me to use whilst i skirmish so there's no point in taking up skirmishing on a regular basis when for me I've grown up with air rifles/pistols shooting on private land and away from the public i would like to buy some more realistic looking weapons is there another way to become ukara registered without having to play army games or can i have a valid defence without being a film making museum curator who rein acts battle scenes? 

Kind regards Steve   

P. S no offence intended to anyone who likes to skirmish its just not for me 

Thank you 

 

UKARA is specifically to prove you are an Airsoft Skirmisher. As you are not one, then UKARA is not for you. Apart from being a re-enactor there isn't a reason for you to buy an airsoft rifle. 

[Steve82lamb]

Yes but then is there another way to purchase say a glock 17 gen 4 dual ammo pistol without ukara, and not a silly two tone like i say im not a skirmisher but i love all air weapons use them properly and not outside waving it around causing harm or threat is there another way to certify my intentions without the need to take up skirmishing or are all airsoft dealer's just going to say no sorry you're not ukara registered 

[Asomodai]

4 minutes ago, Steve82lamb said:

Yes but then is there another way to purchase say a glock 17 gen 4 dual ammo pistol without ukara, and not a silly two tone like i say im not a skirmisher but i love all air weapons use them properly and not outside waving it around causing harm or threat is there another way to certify my intentions without the need to take up skirmishing or are all airsoft dealer's just going to say no sorry you're not ukara registered 

 

See the below.
 

• * The purchaser has a UKARA Defense.

• * The purchaser is part of a Reenactment Society.

• * The purchaser is a Museum Curator.

• * The purchaser is a member of a TV / Film Production Team.

[Diemaco]

The dual ammo version is .177 pellet or BB, and not airsoft, so you don't need UKARA.

[Steve82lamb]

Ok so ukara needed to buy a pistol that is too powerful to use doing what i need to do to be registered makes sense thanks

[Tommikka]

10 minutes ago, Steve82lamb said:

Hi could anyone help me please,

Why do i need to run around in the woods skirmishing shooting a pistol no more than 350fps 3 times over the course of 2 months so i can then buy the RIF of my choice that infact the particular ones i am looking to buy will be too powerful for me to use whilst i skirmish so there's no point in taking up skirmishing on a regular basis when for me I've grown up with air rifles/pistols shooting on private land and away from the public i would like to buy some more realistic looking weapons is there another way to become ukara registered without having to play army games or can i have a valid defence without being a film making museum curator who rein acts battle scenes? 

Kind regards Steve   

P. S no offence intended to anyone who likes to skirmish its just not for me 

Thank you 

You can buy air rifles & air pistols that ‘look’ like real guns.  In the eyes of the law they are not RIFs as under firearms legislation an air rifle/air pistol is a low powered air weapon.  It’s a firearm that doesn’t require a FAC, therefore the VCRA does not apply.

 

If it is over revised legal requirements of an airsoft gun then technically it is a firearm / low powered air weapon.

 

If buying in the UK its up to the seller if they are willing to sell on the basis of it being a firearm / low power air weapon or that they may be at risk of falling under the VCRA as a RIF which would make them liable to a £1000-£2000 fine for selling to a buyer without a defence.

If importing then it’s up to you to convince customs

 

The VCRA is an anti chav law to reduce lookalike RIFs in the hands of those who don’t meet the criteria selected for defences 

[Steve82lamb]

Hi diemaco can i buy 177 gas blowback without ukara? 

[Diemaco]

1 minute ago, Steve82lamb said:

Hi diemaco can i buy 177 gas blowback without ukara? 

 

Yes, it's covered by the same legislation as other air pistols..

[Steve82lamb]

Diemaco, Tommikka thanks very much exactly what i was looking for I've been confused by this for couple of weeks and was just getting the same info no matter what i searched so thanks guys 

Kind regards Steve 

[Guest]

@Steve82lamb

 

You can legitimately hold UKARA without skirmishing. You need to be a member of a site that is UKARA registered, and take part in other airsoft activities that aren’t skirmishing.

 

Like, for instance, Practical Pistol competitions, or target shooting competitions.

[Steve82lamb]

25 minutes ago, rocketdogbert said:

@Steve82lamb

 

You can legitimately hold UKARA without skirmishing. You need to be a member of a site that is UKARA registered, and take part in other airsoft activities that aren’t skirmishing.

 

Like, for instance, Practical Pistol competitions, or target shooting competitions.

Thanks ill look into this i actually have a shooting club /range near so ill try and find out.

thank you 

[Guest]

Just now, Steve82lamb said:

Thanks ill look into this i actually have a shooting club /range near so ill try and find out.

thank you 

My local Airsoft sight does, MPA in Hockley, Essex

[AirsoftNate]

On 01/05/2020 at 21:24, rocketdogbert said:

@Steve82lamb

 

You can legitimately hold UKARA without skirmishing. You need to be a member of a site that is UKARA registered, and take part in other airsoft activities that aren’t skirmishing.

 

Like, for instance, Practical Pistol competitions, or target shooting competitions.

thanks! literally made an account just to reply to this. ive been in the same boat where I have no interest going around shooting people just to get a licence to purchase and be a collector.

 

With that said, ive looked a bit into being a member of a film / tv production team, does anyone here have any experience with this or know how would you even prove that?  i've seen some requirements of needing public liability insurance and the correct permits to film on scene but at most I would probably be making video reviews at home where the guns will most probably never leave lol.

[Guest]

3 hours ago, AirsoftNate said:

thanks! literally made an account just to reply to this. ive been in the same boat where I have no interest going around shooting people just to get a licence to purchase and be a collector.

 

With that said, ive looked a bit into being a member of a film / tv production team, does anyone here have any experience with this or know how would you even prove that?  i've seen some requirements of needing public liability insurance and the correct permits to film on scene but at most I would probably be making video reviews at home where the guns will most probably never leave lol.

No idea

[38super]

I've been looking at this for a while now and these are my conclusions. Feel free to correct me if I've got something wrong.

Target shooting is definitely not a valid defence for someone to sell you a RIF. You can do target shooting with a IF. The VCRA is very specific about the 'military or law enforcement scenario' aspect that allows Airsofter's to have a valid defence.

IPSC practical shooting could be argued as a defence as it has it's roots in defensive shooting but is now in reality 'racing' style shooting and again there is no reason to be using a RIF when an IF is perfectly fine. I have yet to find a retailer who will accept IPSC/UKPSA membership as a valid defence although I have seen people argue quite strongly that it should be. 

For the re-enactment defence you would need to be an active member of a registered club which could be checked and confirmed by a retailer. Similarly the film/acting defence needs to be a current provable activity. 

The Home Office guidance on the VCRA also states that an activity must have appropriate public liability insurance in place as part of the defence.

Full membership of the Sportsman's Association covers insurance for re-enactment but I was still asked to prove established relevant activity.

I have heard of people using Cosplay membership as a defence but since most Cosplay events ban RIF's completely that seems a bit thin and would probably still need proof of relevant activity.

The bottom line is that the VCRA made it illegal for someone to sell you a RIF unless you could prove you had to have a realistic firearm for one of the few purposes set out in the Act as a valid defence. Otherwise you are welcome to have whatever you like as a two tone gun as long as you stay below the muzzle energy criteria for a firearm. 

The UKARA has become the generally accepted method of proving a valid defence under the VCRA and although many people claim that other defences are available none to my knowledge have been tested in court and you will be hard pressed to find a retailer willing to stake their business on it without some fairly firm evidence.

[Tommikka]

5 hours ago, AirsoftNate said:

thanks! literally made an account just to reply to this. ive been in the same boat where I have no interest going around shooting people just to get a licence to purchase and be a collector.

 

With that said, ive looked a bit into being a member of a film / tv production team, does anyone here have any experience with this or know how would you even prove that?  i've seen some requirements of needing public liability insurance and the correct permits to film on scene but at most I would probably be making video reviews at home where the guns will most probably never leave lol.

 

 

Collecting is not a valid defence to have a RIF

(You can collect deactivated firearms)

 

Being a member of a production team is not enough to be a defence.  You would need to be the props buyer.

(for example just getting a job, or volunteering for free to work on a film production such as the camera, sound, runner etc don’t justify you buying a RIF)

 

Gun review videos will not suffice.

Just making a film will not suffice.

A retailer selling to someone claiming the film/tv defence will want some proof of ‘proper’ film work.

 

(((Note that a guns supplier to the film industry was also a criminal gun supplier and used the secrecy of 007 films as an excuse to get specific weapons which he would reactivate for the criminal community - the industry are still dealing with the issues that came out of that.  Trying to manufacture a film/tv defence may be affected by that and be harder than you expect)))

 

For example student film makers won’t be able to justify, but their college/university could if they wished to.

 

 

13 minutes ago, 38super said:

 

I have heard of people using Cosplay membership as a defence but since most Cosplay events ban RIF's completely that seems a bit thin and would probably still need proof of relevant activity.

 

There’s a certain Cosplay scheme which does require a form of ‘proof’ to sign up

But as you’ve noted, Cosplay & Comicon ticket rules ban RIFs, with the only exception that many allow orange tips - which being below 50% are still RIFs under the VCRA

(Including comicons that the scheme links to)

That cosplay scheme is clearly an excuse at ‘bending’ rules, and their reference on the website to what they think their PLI insurance covers will be dropped by any insurer 

 

The only valid Cosplay defence for a RIF would be for the ‘professional’ cosplay performers at comicons - as they fall within the theatrical element and have PLI that actually means something as a performer 

 

 

 

[DRay]

Another covert ‘how can I avoid UKARA’ thread. 
 

You can’t, you shouldn’t, you won’t find a single UKAF regular poster who will endorse the sentiment. 
 

All of this looks really bad for a sport/hobby that is more or less entirely self regulating, posts are open forum and can be dragged up by anyone who wants to make an argument to legislate against owning grown up toy guns and kill the sport stone dead. 
 

TLTR: put £70 into a small business over the course of 56 days and then go mad ordering stuff on Patrol Base for the subsequent 365 days and turn your back bedroom into an armoury. That’s your option. End of story.