pottage7 Posted July 22, 2013 Share Posted July 22, 2013 Hey guys, I'm looking for some advice on a decent radio and headset/earpiece for an upcoming milsim. I'm not very clued in on radios at all, so I'm pretty desperate for some advice/suggestions. I don't really want to be running around with a massive headset on my head, and it's going to be awkward with boonie strap, glasses, eye protection straps, and then more straps from a full size headset like the Bowman Evo III. Sorry if you guys get asked this a lot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted July 22, 2013 Supporters Share Posted July 22, 2013 What's your budget? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottage7 Posted July 22, 2013 Author Share Posted July 22, 2013 What's your budget? I'd say around 60 for the radio, headset not included in price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters jcheeseright Posted July 22, 2013 Supporters Share Posted July 22, 2013 decent radio and headset for £60... gonna be tough! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottage7 Posted July 22, 2013 Author Share Posted July 22, 2013 60 for the radio, headset not really included in that price. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted July 23, 2013 Supporters Share Posted July 23, 2013 You should be able to get a used Motorola XTNID (8 Channels) Two Way Radio for under £60, if you have patience. You will definitely be able to get a XTNi which has no screen - they are PC programmable via mini or micro usb cable (i forget which). The XTN's are the product replacement for the XTR446, of which i have one and can recommend them as pretty good. The trouble with buying walkie talkies is that new they usually come in pairs. For under £60 new you can get a pair of Motorola TLKR T6's. I'd steer clear of Cobra and Binatone if I were you, but there is also the Midland G5 XT - but be aware that Midland and Kenwood use 2 pin connectors for headsets, which are not as easy to find as the Motorola single TRS jack plug type. Another option is to buy a single seller refurbished handset. You'll usually get a short warranty and sometimes you can find very expensive radios for around £30 + P&P. Just as a guide on what kind of deal is out there for a solution to your needs, last Sept-Oct-ish i bought a used Motorola XTR446 for £14 including shipping from Portugal. All that was wrong with it was that the decals have worn off the rubber buttons - it is still going strong. Here is a spanker of a deal... in fact it's so good that i considered not telling you, buying them myself and selling them on for a profit but, as with so much in life, i just cba! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sam_G Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 It can be done. I got a pair of Motorola TLKR-15 radios with base charger, Z-tactical PTT and Z-tactical Comtac2 head set for just over £60! Ebay is your best bet. I would steer clear of Binatone as you cant get a direct fit PTT to use a military type headset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz JJ Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 How far do you want to talk/who do you want to talk to ? Ive just bought some Motorola T8 sets. My review is on the forum. http://www.airsoft-forums.co.uk/index.php/topic/16797-tactical-radios/?p=112134 £79 for a pair. Easily matchable Motorola single pin connector. If you only want one, buy a pair and sell the unwanted one on here or Ebay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted July 23, 2013 Supporters Share Posted July 23, 2013 If you only want one, buy a pair and sell the unwanted one on here or Ebay. Yeah, or better still, find someone to go 1/2's with from the start. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottage7 Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 Buying a set of 2 is no problem at all, and I can easily go 50/50 with someone. As for range, it doesn't really have to be far at all, what I'm looking for the most is audio quality. I want to be able to understand people when adrenaline is pumping and they might not be too clear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz JJ Posted July 23, 2013 Share Posted July 23, 2013 These PMR446 sets are fine if youre speaking to other fireteam members on the net. Not enough range if you are roaming over a large milsim area and want to takk back to command. The makers talk about 6 - 8 clicks but thats crap unless one of you is standing on the rock of Gibraltar and its purely line of sight. The T8's have a good audio and you can't turn them right down. At the end of the day, the audio quality will come from the headset and mic you choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted July 23, 2013 Supporters Share Posted July 23, 2013 Yeah, that's a good point about the audio quality. It's not all the headset but, so long as you stay away from Binatone, most handsets which do accept external audio accessories will have good enough amplifiers for everything except sibilance and plosives., but that is also a function of the auto-squelch which cuts off what it is programmed to recognise as noise. I can heartily recommend the Z-Tactical Bowman headsets for audio quality, and I am a sound engineer. It's somewhat mind boggling that you can get such good quality at the price and so small, compared to only a few years ago - it's all a product of raging research for mobile phones; you've got microphone capsules designed to mechanically reduce extraneous sounds by subtracting out of phase input from the signal these days, in a carbon condenser mic no bigger than a little fingernail ffs! Even 15yrs ago that was only available on professional performance mics... I wouldn't be surprised if good quality handsets are using realtime bandwidth analysis to dynamically move 2 or 3 band pass filters so that the frequency ranges which are amplified most, for each syllable spoken, are selected for maximum intelligibility, discarding unnecessary frequencies which may contain extraneous noise as well as the voice. Anyhoo, it's not difficult to organise the various straps of your headgear so that you can wear an EVO III - it's the same shape as the EVO II which I use and that's with an eyepro strap and 2 straps on a mesh 1/2 face. I like the way the 4 straps combine over my right ear - it's a bit of protection from BB's in the ear'ole! The can / earpiece doesn't work too well with a respirator, but it can be worn differently to fit better and the EVO III has a removable boom so you can switch to either a throat mic or dedicated respirator mic. It's a sad fact that those acoustic tube type earpieces are shite unless you spend a fortune on them and D earpieces fall off at just about any provocation, unless you tape the lead to your shoulder. They're not good for intelligibility though because they do almost nothing to prevent sound around you from getting into the same ear and also, because it is basically a tiny speaker cabinet suspended in front of your ear, it's effectively a brass band in a biscuit tin. If you don't want to wear external can/s, your best bet is an earbud type, like on a phone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pottage7 Posted July 23, 2013 Author Share Posted July 23, 2013 Some great info, thanks very much guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris555 Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 get a midlands g7 great radios you can also up grade them to three watts very easily altho im not sure how legal this is also you can buy them singular for around 40 pounds i use one abd am just waiting my evo to comethrough for it so all is good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted August 4, 2013 Supporters Share Posted August 4, 2013 It's totally illegal to transmit @ 3 Watts on the Private Mobile Radio PMR446 licence free bandwidth. Depending on where you do it, in practice it could be damn near impossible to prove. Do be aware that the airwaves are monitored in every large population centre though, primarily to prevent pirate radio stations, but it's a computerised scanner set up so it's no additional effort to monitor 446MHz. You're not going to know where any monitoring is done from, but the knowable parameters which you need to consider are: terrain - ground completely blocks radio signals so a hilly area can severely limit range ; buildings and trees - these do not necessarily block signals completely, but they do reduce the power that can be received through them, so enough of them will eventually reduce signal strength to below the reception threshold; other users - if some person with an insufficiently fulfilled life hears you and knows that, from where they are, you could not be coming through so loud unless you were transmitting more than 0.5W, they may report you, but, conversely, if there are many users nearby, it would take a large expensive police operation to discover which of them is the culprit; range - over water, or flat featureless terrain, or if the transmitter is high enough that a straight line to the receiver bypasses terrain obstacles, depending on the quality of your handset, 0.5W will be enough power to transmit an intelligible signal 6-10Km, and obviously 3W will go much, much further... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chris555 Posted August 4, 2013 Share Posted August 4, 2013 So increasing power will do the job in thick woodlands without increasing areal size this is good to know where we play is thick woodland in a non built up area near a motorway the good thing is the upgrade is easily undone as all you do is snip one very small piece of wiring would i be blocking any emergency chanels tho with the upgrade Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted August 4, 2013 Supporters Share Posted August 4, 2013 No, emergency channels use dedicated bandwidth and complex digital codecs, so even if someone does accidentally, or deliberately, transmit on those frequencies, the receiver will still be able to recreate intelligible audio from transmissions by emergency personnel. The only thing which would defeat these types of systems is a transmission of white noise at ridiculous power relatively close to the receiver. Unfortunately electric motors generate broad spectrum radio waves and, what kind of signal is it? You've guessed it, white noise. This is a huge part of the reason for CE mark testing and compliance, but you may be aware of it if somebody ever used an older drill nearby while you were watching analogue TV... You're right about power increase without changing the antenna. Unless you know what you're doing, you shouldn't mess with the aerial because doing so can affect the frequency at which any transmitter connected to it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters jcheeseright Posted September 3, 2013 Supporters Share Posted September 3, 2013 no, too powerful, 0,5w output power is the legal limit without licensing in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted September 3, 2013 Supporters Share Posted September 3, 2013 http://www.446shop.com/446shop.com20130320/views.asp?hw_id=26 what about this? is this fine to use or what? Im slightly confused lol As James says, no. But it's also using the wrong set channels to communicate with people using the free band. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz JJ Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 I use my radio every week, but just for receiving. Very useful for tuning into the marshalls. The other week, a young lad was stung by a wasp, had a reaction and ended up back at the safe zone. They were trying to trace his father who was advancing through the undergrowth with me and some others. I also find it valuable to find out when they are planning to call a halt to the current game, what we are doing next and so on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose87 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 Just to clarify a few thing after reading this subject. Changing the power will boost a radio wave that is transmitted. Changing the ANTENNA!!!! (radios do not use aerials) can increase the size of the radio wave transmitted and has no bearing on the freq used. A larger antenna will produce a larger radio wave and will allow it to travel further before being absorbed by its surroundings. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baz JJ Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 The increase in power will allow it to penetrate further and lengthening the aerial or antenna to specific lengths will increase the gain and therefore the useable range. This is why it is illegal to transmit more power or modify aerials in PMR446. Another common misconception is that the sub-channels on PMR446 provide you with more than 8 channels. Its just an encoded squelch which means you cant hear unwanted traffic. They can still hear you. I scan all eight channels and I hear everything in range. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose87 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 If your using a vertical radiating antenna on UHF then a roughly accurate size it good. the ones on a hand held radio are gonna be a 1/4 wave length so biggest its ever gonna need to be in 4 times. Yer sub channels is more to do with fine tuning. fairly unnecessary for short wave comms Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supporters Ian_Gere Posted September 3, 2013 Supporters Share Posted September 3, 2013 Wavelength and frequency are two ways of describing the same thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moose87 Posted September 3, 2013 Share Posted September 3, 2013 well yes and no. you can adjust a wavelength without changing the freq, the freq dictates the type of wave length. a HF radio transmitting on 5Mhz will have a long wave length and a UHF radio transmitting on 400Mhz will have a very small wavelength. there are specific calculations to work out the length of an antenna depending on the freq and those calculations work in 1/4 wavelengths. the most optimal antenna size is one that transmits 3/4s of the full wave length. the antenna will also change in size depending on the material that you are using as an Antenna. Trust me guys in know my stuff i came top of my class as an Communications Operator in the army. thats not being condescending to anyone and people may know more then me im just reassuring people of my credentials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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