Canada Threatening to Ban Airsoft

[Shamal]

Consistently voting in Authoritarian governments whether its left or right of the political spectrum will make bans a common place. 

If you vote green then they will want to stamp on it for sure

 

[Asomodai]

If you vote green then they will want to stamp on it for sure

That is their policy. I avoided stating a particular party but if you want to go down that rabbit hole then..

It was a Right Wing Authoritarian Tory Government that effectively banned handguns in the UK, leaving only .22 pistols which were banned a year after. It was also a right wing Tory government that banned full automatic full bore rifles and similar. 

It's been Right Wing Authoritarian Tory governments that have tried to introduce legislation that could affect Airsoft rifles and UKAPU has had to deal with. 

Now that China, a Right Wing Authoritarian Government effectively rule Hong Kong, they are now trying to ban Airsoft. Australia has not allowed Airsoft to be played and have recently banned Gel Blasters unless you have a license. The government in charge at the time? The Liberal Party, which is a Centre Right party.

Some Scandinavian countries and NZ have healthy Airsoft scenes despite being run by Left Wing/Centrist/Somewhat Socialist governments, because they are not Authoritarian. 

As I said. It is "mostly" AUTHORITARIAN governments that try to ban stuff like this, regardless of right and left. 

 

[GenuineGerman]

Now that China, a Right Wing Authoritarian Government effectively rule Hong Kong

I’m sure China is run by the Communist Party 

 

[Asomodai]

I’m sure China is run by the Communist Party 

Australia is run by the Liberal party, but are Right Wing. The name means nothing. It's the actions they take that means something. 

Also Communism like Authoritative is neither Left or Right. It exists in either wing.

Socialism can be left wing, but can also be Right Wing and Authoritarian at the same time.. Look at the Nazi party as a good example. 

 

[GenuineGerman]

I get what your saying and I don’t disagree. I think like you have said it’s about the control the government want. I’m Germany we have the CDU/CSU which are the conservatives effectively and the SPD which are labour although most of this is true for the past. I think most parties now sell you the same policies but in a different guise 

 

[Asomodai]

I get what your saying and I don’t disagree. I think like you have said it’s about the control the government want. I’m Germany we have the CDU/CSU which are the conservatives effectively and the SPD which are labour although most of this is true for the past. I think most parties now sell you the same policies but in a different guise 

I think one thing we can agree on is that Political Parties are no longer different enough to matter. But when a party or person does become popular that is specifically left or right, they get run out eventually as to not break the status Quo. Re: Corbyn and Trump. 

I find peoples opinions on imitation firearms to be very similar to NIMBYS (Not in my Backyard) People who prevent any sort of new developments near their property. The complaints can come from both the Right and Left wing as it's something no one really wants near them. The same can be said for Firearms or Imitation rifles.

Personally I think the only way to survive as a sport in the UK is to introduce a government sanctioned, full blown legal Airsoft License. It would both legitimise us as a hobby/sport and make it harder for the your average guy on the street to pickup a RIF and go hog wild in a public place with it. Some people disagree with me saying it's a step closer to outright banning the sport. But any UK government can take it away now immediately with very little consultation as we have a very tenuous defence that allows us to purchase rifles. I would rather risk going legit now on our terms and insistence, then the whole lot being taken away without warning.

How would one go about getting such a license... I haven't a clue! That's for someone smarter then me to come up with! 

 

[GenuineGerman]

A lot of politics now play into popularism and playing one faction off against another. It the old of your not with me your against syndrome, the reality is we all probably have more in common than we don’t but everything seems so polarised at the moment people can’t see what’s directly in front of them. Back in the good old day’s there used to be moderate voices that would speak sense and balance but this doesn’t seem to exist anymore. 
 

As for NIMBYS, completely agree. Always complaining that young people cause problems but when they want to develop something that will create jobs but might affect the value of the homes they are up in arms. 
 

As for licensing proper I would have to politely disagree with this. If some muppet is going to run around there local high street with a RIF and get shoot by the cops then give them a Darwin Award. I know I’m sensible and I think the majority of people are, we aren’t talking about live firearms. for me it’s just another way of making us more compliant by having to License what is effectively an expensive toy for what gain, to prove I play a sport. It’s starts with airsoft where does it stop when we live under a talebanesque regime where you can’t fly a kite. 

 

[Asomodai]

A lot of politics now play into popularism and playing one faction off against another. It the old of your not with me your against syndrome, the reality is we all probably have more in common than we don’t but everything seems so polarised at the moment people can’t see what’s directly in front of them. Back in the good old day’s there used to be moderate voices that would speak sense and balance but this doesn’t seem to exist anymore. 
 

As for NIMBYS, completely agree. Always complaining that young people cause problems but when they want to develop something that will create jobs but might affect the value of the homes they are up in arms. 
 

As for licensing proper I would have to politely disagree with this. If some muppet is going to run around there local high street with a RIF and get shoot by the cops then give them a Darwin Award. I know I’m sensible and I think the majority of people are, we aren’t talking about live firearms. for me it’s just another way of making us more compliant by having to License what is effectively an expensive toy for what gain, to prove I play a sport. It’s starts with airsoft where does it stop when we live under a talebanesque regime where you can’t fly a kite. 

I understand what you mean. Partisan politics can be poisonous. Especially when people tend to vote a certain party because they either dont like the people who vote for the other party, or they vote based on a single policy. Despite the other party having a whole raft of policies that would benefit them. I find Left or Right is like supporting a football team, you rag on the other team for no reason apart from they arent on your perceived side. 

Case in point I "might" vote for a party in the next election that may well ban Airsoft because I believe in the majority of their policies and enacting those policies are more important then playing airsoft once a fortnight. 

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My opinion is that we have to base the reasoning of a license on what the average joe public sees. Sure, they are not live firearms, but to a "normal" person it's a firearm, which incites panic and for good reason. Hence why a license in my opinion will legitimise things more in the eye of the public and authorities.

The current defenses in the UK are not fit for purpose as it's still too easy to get a RIF without the most recognised one (UKARA.

IFs should be banned as bright colours can be painted on real firearms anyway.

The majority of problems we face in Airsoft is bad press because of unscrupulous and/or stupid people going nuts with a RIF in public. We need to stop them from getting access to them so easily. A license wont stop it outright as anyone determined enough can get hold of one, but a verified license will stem the incidences somewhat to a lesser level. It will also separate us legitimate airsofters, from the stupid rabble who use them for purposes other then airsoft.

You can yell at people until you are blue in the face, but they see RIF, they see firearms and I cant blame them. 

 

[Adolf Hamster]

Personally I think the only way to survive as a sport in the UK is to introduce a government sanctioned, full blown legal Airsoft License. It would both legitimise us as a hobby/sport and make it harder for the your average guy on the street to pickup a RIF and go hog wild in a public place with it. Some people disagree with me saying it's a step closer to outright banning the sport. But any UK government can take it away now immediately with very little consultation as we have a very tenuous defence that allows us to purchase rifles. I would rather risk going legit now on our terms and insistence, then the whole lot being taken away without warning.

there are arguments both ways for that.

i certainly agree that a cemented legitimacy would be a good thing for the hobby, but at the same time that's pushing airsoft into a scheme of regulation that would make destroying it via law much easier.

the question is, if it's licenced then will that make us safe from future reprisals.

the worry is if they do decide to ban (licence or no), many of us have a not insignificant amount of money tied up in hardware, and if they're taken away you can bet there won't be any compensation scheme worth a damn and if stuff gets "grandfathered" such as in canada's case you then can't sell it, which sucks for anyone who would occasionally sell kit to raise funds for other parts of their lives.

My opinion is that we have to base the reasoning of a license on what the average joe public sees. Sure, they are not live firearms, but to a "normal" person it's a firearm, which incites panic and for good reason. Hence why a license in my opinion will legitimise things more in the eye of the public and authorities.

it's tricky though, because you introduce a licence that only cements the image that airsoft pews are anything other than over-engineered spud guns for grown ups.

the problem is awareness, i've never had any panic or problem with regards to airsoft from anyone who i've had the time to explain it to first

 

[GenuineGerman]

the problem is awareness, i've never had any panic or problem with regards to airsoft from anyone who i've had the time to explain it to first

This is it, I’ve had a polite chat with my neighbours to let them know that I play airsoft and if they see me with military kit and what looks like real firearms they aren’t and they have been very understanding

 

[Druid799]

It was a Right Wing Authoritarian Tory Government that effectively banned handguns in the UK, leaving only .22 pistols which were banned a year after. It was also a right wing Tory government that banned full automatic full bore rifles and similar. 

Right mate I really do need to pull you up on this , it wasn’t simply a case of a ‘Right Wing Authoritarian Tory Government’ banning firearms in the U.K. It was as a result of two mass shootings FFS ! 

Were you even born when Hungerford and Dunblane happened ? I remember both events very well and at the time of the Dunblane massacre I was very much in to shooting and I lost several very expensive pistols my self due to the ban , did I agree with the ban ? no I didn’t BUT do I understand why ? Yes 100% I do . It was an example of the few being sacrificed for the many , simple as that .

The public needed to see the Government acting so it could never happen again and they did , this action needed to be taken immaterial of who was in power at the time wether Tory , Labour or the Liberal party had been .

You've completely ignored the history of these actions and politicised them to use as a ‘bash the Tories’ comment which quite frankly is acting in no better a manner than the very culture we’re discussing !

 

[Asomodai]

Right mate I really do need to pull you up on this , it wasn’t simply a case of a ‘Right Wing Authoritarian Tory Government’ banning firearms in the U.K. It was as a result of two mass shootings FFS ! 

Were you even born when Hungerford and Dunblane happened ? I remember both events very well and at the time of the Dunblane massacre I was very much in to shooting and I lost several very expensive pistols my self due to the ban , did I agree with the ban ? no I didn’t BUT do I understand why ? Yes 100% I do . It was an example of the few being sacrificed for the many , simple as that .

The public needed to see the Government acting so it could never happen again and they did , this action needed to be taken immaterial of who was in power at the time wether Tory , Labour or the Liberal party had been .

You've completely ignored the history of these actions and politicised them to use as a ‘bash the Tories’ comment which quite frankly is acting in no better a manner than the very culture we’re discussing !

It's in response to the posts and general feeling that it's just the left that are more likely to ban firearms (which seems to not be challenged when stated here, I am playing counterpoint), Just clearing that up.

NZ had a mass shooting and they have cleaned up their gun laws as well being a leftist/centrist government. 

The Conservatives were absoloutely right to ban those firearms, it was very close to banning Airsofts use of RIFs as well. 

The issue is already politicised by people "bashing the left" on the forum, I just want to make sure that people are aware it is not necessarily a "Left or Right" issue. Changes happen in reaction to an event or authoritarian methods of control. 

Edit: I am old enough to remember the mass shootings. 

Further edit: I hadnt brought up the idea that "governments will do it in reaction to an event" because I assumed that everyone knew that was obvious and a given. I am sorry I didn't specifically mention it before. 

I also agree that I did labour the Authortitive part of that statement when I shouldn't have as even a non authoritative government would have acted the same. (The government happened to be authoritative, but it has no real bearing on what resulted from the shooting, it was the right thing to do)

 

[Shamal]

The government is the government.Its not about who is in power at a particular time it is about who has the power all the time.

Parties are just fronts,someone to pledge alliance to,and moan about,but we all must know that they are manipulated by invisible 'advisors',the ones that really pull the strings,the ones that are controlling the whole show.

Regards 

 

[Tackle]

 Sadly I too remember hungerford & dunblane, the latter was very poignant for me as my niece was the same age as many of the victims at the time, & a ban wasn't a knee jerk reaction, but was a somewhat heavy handed but simple response against a system that desperately needed an overhaul.

As for the politics, total bs, much of the changes in legislation we now experience come down to the opinions of those in charge, sometimes the motivation is personal, or financial, often both.

There are people that don't like guns, or what they represent, in much the same way there are people that don't like motorcycles, usually with no valid reason, but it's much easier for the anti gun lobby to garner support, which is why as Rif owners we've got to be at the top of our game, to appear almost Saint-like in the eyes of the media & authorities.

For this reason I'm glad that FB keeps cracking down on Airsoft pages, 90% of social media users are thick as shit, so when it comes to our hobby most do more harm than good, at least with the forums there's a more proactive attitude to do (& say) the right thing, as well as vigilant admin to monitor it.

 

[colinjallen]

I’m sure China is run by the Communist Party 

The Communist Party is Communist in name only; the Chinese are natural Capitalists and the Party has  given up trying to turn them into Communists.

If anything, China is almost pure political Fascism.

 

[Dacks_18]

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but at the end of the first paragraph in the bill it says something like "It does not include replicas intending to resemble antique firearms"

So.... Does that mean they can Airsoft with RIF antiques?

I'd love to wear a fast helmet, assault vest and webbing with multicam and armed with a flintlock/musket! ?

 

[hitmanNo2]

I wonder how they define antique.  Often "older than 100 years" is banded about.  There's a whole lot of viable RIFs that are based on guns older than 100 years.

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I wonder how they define antique.  Often "older than 100 years" is banded about.  There's a whole lot of viable RIFs that are based on guns older than 100 years.

iirc isn't the uk definition based on a design that came out before 1875? theirs might be something similar.

tbh i can still see it killing canadian airsoft, reckon a lot of them would rather have nerferised pews than lever guns.

 

[Tommikka]

I wonder how they define antique.  Often "older than 100 years" is banded about.  There's a whole lot of viable RIFs that are based on guns older than 100 years.

iirc isn't the uk definition based on a design that came out before 1875? theirs might be something similar.

tbh i can still see it killing canadian airsoft, reckon a lot of them would rather have nerferised pews than lever guns.

In general English, antique goes for 100 years, but can vary.

In legislation these terms get a definition, and should be referred to within the legislation.

For Canada an antique firearm is a rifle, shotgun or handgun manufactured before 1898, and also meeting specific criteria on the ammunition within each type:

https://laws-lois.justice.gc.ca/eng/regulations/SOR-98-464/FullText.html

In the UK under the VCRA it is pre 1870 design

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-violent-crime-reduction-act-2006-commencement-no-3-order-2007-firearms-measures

 

[Dacks_18]

So what the law is basically saying, is;

Airsoft = bad, 

Re-enactment = fine