Buying From Gunfire.Pl in the New Year? Might Want to See This

[Cannonfodder]

So I just received this email from Gunfire.pl. 

View attachment 66714

 

[MiK]

Yea I got the same and P&P is up about 9€ (6quid) - means one less place to buy something on a “whim” now

 

[EvilMonkee]

No great loss tbh, they used to be one of the cheaper retailers when they first started now frankly they take the piss with some of their prices

 

[Sitting Duck]

No great loss tbh, they used to be one of the cheaper retailers when they first started now frankly they take the piss with some of their prices

Agreed, both TWG (way back in 2014) & Gunfire did points to collect

could use your points for delivery or decent stuff (cheap gun, gearbox, bb's etc...)

now GF points in finishing on 31st December with fuck all available to exchange them for

postage has shot up, free postage used to be like 150 Euro's

then 230, now think it was about 300 last time I looked

edit: oh yeah them GF bastids added paypal fees to order a while back too

(TWG does charge you for paying via PayPal)

Mind you TWG does free delivery to all of Europe except UK since about 2017

Think exchange rates like with the dollar have had an impact on stuff though

GF does some good offers on spare parts at times, but not so much on guns

so gotta go some to make it worthwhile in 2020

and with 2021 around the corner, think the cheap as chips GF days are long gone now

(no more points, free shipping qualifying always increasing, PayPal fees etc...)

Another thing is that Gate & Perun stuff may be slightly impacted by UK/EU stuff

overall, think we may need to ensure we want to buy more shit

than casually buying stuff "coz it was on offer..." which may not be a bad thing tbf

we shall see, might help small retailers like Pete @ak2m4 so silver lining & all that

meantime we can try to make our old faithful shit run more efficiently to keep up

with the new fancy bollox - but still a peew peew toy gun sewing machine in the end

we shall see...

 

[Iceni]

I'd say that email was akin to marketing suicide.

Refusing to accept orders under £135? In an email sent to every UK customer on the database..... Slow clap.

I could understand an email saying there is going to be a change to the free postage system with a higher cap, and higher postage on all orders to the UK. That is an acceptable thing to do.

To just flat out add a min spend requirement.... Well that's something else.

Why would I even bother to look at that site to compare prices anymore. I'm going to go directly to another supplier. If the rest of the world can deal with international trade and the hurdles it creates, Then a single store loosing my business because they can't adapt and would rather loose a full market isn't something I'll be loosing sleep over.

Best bit is, there's a trade agreement... All they have to do is fill in a few forms and keep records of sales to the UK.... It should be part of any international companies basic infrastructure.

I get most of my bits from inside the UK anyway. AK2M4 has been a godsend, not that I actually buy a lot of parts. And Fire-support are generally the first website I visit when I want to gather my senses and not buy another gun.


There's also the elephant in the room so to speak. GF have been a pretty solid 20% cheaper on most gear through the years.... Could it be, and this is speculation at it's very best/worst, that GF fiddle the VAT books to keep prices down. Having to ship to the UK where the VAT would be scrutinised may upset the fiddle and cost them money, hence they can't actually offer those prices at all. And they need the £135 to be back into profit.... Food for thought there.

 

[Overlord7]

Also, to add to the list Taiwangun don't even display a shipping option to the UK now...

 

[Tactical Pith Helmet]

Sales over £135 from the EU to GB are liable for VAT payable by the importer post 1/1/21.  Under £135 the process looks more complicated with the possibility that some kind of registration on the part of the seller may be required.  

Have a gander at this from Question 6 onwards:   https://www.accountancyeurope.eu/publications/vat-customs-duty-and-brexit-prepare-now/

 

[Iceni]

Sales over £135 from the EU to GB are liable for VAT payable by the importer

And that's the issue.

Take a £100 purchase from GF. £20 is VAT in Poland.

Therefore the same purchase should be £80 from GF + import + VAT (UK).

GF simply can't sell with a margin that low. The profit on the sale should in theory be the same. In actuality the £80 price isn't possible, because as a business the quarterly VAT bill to the polish authorities was bogus.

The UK home prices have always been higher than GF/TWG for good reason... And it's not because the Chinese sell them the guns significantly cheaper.

Most web-store software has native VAT accounting. Even the receipt from GF/TWG has VAT listed, and that is done automatically. It's only a few selections in the software to show prices with and without VAT. The problem is this forces them to actually price correctly.

 

[Sitting Duck]

To be honest this £135 bollox condition...

I THINK - and I could be wrong....

from what it sounds like below that VAT is collected/forwarded by seller

(unsure if remains in Poland or goes to UK)

above £135, then goods are zero rated (I think), so no 23% Polish VAT applied

then you as buyer/importer pay 20% VAT & any duty/fees on arrival in UK

TWO THINGS...

1)

I personally thought if we got a trade deal then we'd buy/pay the VAT in country of origin

(not paying VAT on entry to UK like we did as EU member/transition etc...)

That is what I thought a "free trade deal" meant - trade freely no real hassle/paperwork no calculate VAT/Duty

What is with the £135 bollox and procedure differing for goods below/above this ceiling

2)

Not being funny, but how is this deal a free trade deal and why after this fucking about

why did we not just go WTO and be done with it ???

I thought getting a deal done meant just that - stuff carries on nigh on as it was

(we continue to pay the EU member's VAT in country of origin & UK gets little/nothing in public purse)

I'm well confused & think the £135 min order is so GF has less extra paperwork/liability when processing orders

(reckon EU sellers may have tried to place a min order say €50 anyway to fill out declaration/form for UK)

I'm confused if all goods now will be zero rated or not & what is declared/paid regarding UK VAT on arrival

This so called deal seems to be a confusing mish mash tbh

where one minute this side got the better deal & then the other side claims they got better deal

yet in reality nobody is truly happy & like this GF crap seems to show...

Everybody is a little confused what the fuck is happening soon

(think it is gonna take a while for dust to settle & some clarity appears on what is what)

regards

Confused Brit

 

[Shamal]

To be honest this £135 bollox condition...

I THINK - and I could be wrong....

from what it sounds like below that VAT is collected/forwarded by seller

(unsure if remains in Poland or goes to UK)

above £135, then goods are zero rated (I think), so no 23% Polish VAT applied

then you as buyer/importer pay 20% VAT & any duty/fees on arrival in UK

TWO THINGS...

1)

I personally thought if we got a trade deal then we'd buy/pay the VAT in country of origin

(not paying VAT on entry to UK like we did as EU member/transition etc...)

That is what I thought a "free trade deal" meant - trade freely no real hassle/paperwork no calculate VAT/Duty

What is with the £135 bollox and procedure differing for goods below/above this ceiling

2)

Not being funny, but how is this deal a free trade deal and why after this fucking about

why did we not just go WTO and be done with it ???

I thought getting a deal done meant just that - stuff carries on nigh on as it was

(we continue to pay the EU member's VAT in country of origin & UK gets little/nothing in public purse)

I'm well confused & think the £135 min order is so GF has less extra paperwork/liability when processing orders

(reckon EU sellers may have tried to place a min order say €50 anyway to fill out declaration/form for UK)

I'm confused if all goods now will be zero rated or not & what is declared/paid regarding UK VAT on arrival

This so called deal seems to be a confusing mish mash tbh

where one minute this side got the better deal & then the other side claims they got better deal

yet in reality nobody is truly happy & like this GF crap seems to show...

Everybody is a little confused what the fuck is happening soon

(think it is gonna take a while for dust to settle & some clarity appears on what is what)

regards

Confused Brit

I'm not confused mainly cause it doesn't bother me at all.is that wrong?

Life still goes on. We wake up go to work go to sleep. Repeat. 

If I need a pint of milk then I buy a pint of milk sure the price may be different and I'll moan but if i need it then I pay. I'm used to price increases cause they have been happening for years and years.i dont buy direct from abroad so I guess I'm not so pissed off by the changes.I  know I will feel effects but no different really to what has always happened.

All I know is that my life will continue to be the same as it was yesterday.

I thought it meant we were free to trade with whoever we wanted?

Politics are not my game but above are just my thoughts.

??

Regards 

 

[AlphaBear]

Let's face it, at the end of the day there are bigger things to worry about then extra VAT or customs duty on airsoft supplies! Whilst everyone has mentioned some valid points it's all comes down to what was agreed during the trade deal and how individual countries or even vendors will interpret it all...  these things will take some time to make sense of...  As @Shamalhas said life will still go on.... we will buy more British milk, British meat and British veg.... oh and let's hope our fish get's cheaper now! In theory domestic airsoft products should not increase in value, if that is the UK suppliers buy from the Far East.... of course if European 'middle men' are used then that may well be a different ball game entirely.... 

 

[Tommikka]

The £135 figure is a magic number under post Brexit importation regulations.

(Note that this link is pre deal, but it made the seller liable for direct declaration and payment of VAT to HMRC for goods under £135)

https://www.avalara.com/vatlive/en/vat-news/uk-to-leave-eu-vat-regime-31-dec-20200.html
Whether or not tariffs apply there is a greater requirement for paperwork. Gunfire (and other retailers) have opted for avoiding sales under £135

The free trade deal means there are no additional tariffs and no quotas.  However there are controls on goods.  If the original item or parts came from outside of the EU or UK, then tariffs and quotas may apply. If the ‘minimum standards’ are not met then free trade may not apply.  
 

Eg I would assume that the EU still requires the UK to send goods that meet EU safety standards, so if our UK manufacturer drops those standards then the transfer won’t be permitted. EU trading standards teams would be seen seizing sub standard deliveries.

But if we bin working conditions and bring back workhouses and child labour at 50p per week,  keeping the product and safety standards then the goods could be accepted but a tariff gets applied to compensate for undercutting EU manufacturers.  The seller cuts costs, the EU importer pays a tarrif and the local EU taxman gets some extra euros.

Airsoft guns & parts typically come from Asia so the item could be liable for tariffs under the trade agreement. (This may tie in to the existing 3.2% import duty that sometimes flags up on non EU importing bills already)

Currently under EU arrangements, if EU VAT has already been charged at the country of origin then there is no double tap, so no UK VAT to pay. That VAT goes to the local taxman

Free trade does not necessarily mean that still applies as VAT/sales tax differs from border tariffs.

I haven’t read enough detail on the agreement with regard to VAT.  It will depend on the specifics of the agreement whether the exporting country treats it in a similar manner to current EU cross border VAT (pay once), whether it is treated as VAT exempt export (and charged by the receiving taxman), whether there is a possible double tap of EU and UK VAT, etc 

 

[Speedbird_666]

Here is some additional information from another EU company that specialises in RC stuff. It adds some useful and concise context.

View attachment 66801View attachment 66802

So it's a rule that the UK has imposed on ANY import under £135 from anywhere in the world.

Google-fu found me this:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/changes-to-vat-treatment-of-overseas-goods-sold-to-customers-from-1-january-2021/changes-to-vat-treatment-of-overseas-goods-sold-to-customers-from-1-january-2021

 

[Cromulon1994]

It's the extra customs checks that are going to be a pain. Forget the 5-7 day delivery from europe.

I have a package that's been in customs 2 months, with receipts and they are questioning the value still.

 

[Asomodai]

Here is some additional information from another EU company that specialises in RC stuff. It adds some useful and concise context.

View attachment 66801View attachment 66802

So it's a rule that the UK has imposed on ANY import under £135 from anywhere in the world.

Google-fu found me this:

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/changes-to-vat-treatment-of-overseas-goods-sold-to-customers-from-1-january-2021/changes-to-vat-treatment-of-overseas-goods-sold-to-customers-from-1-january-2021

I suspect the UK's unreadiness is why we've implemented the “collect VAT at source” rules for foreign sellers. Entirely relieves Border Force of an admin burden on high volume low value parcels that honestly probably constitute the majority of any given sack of parcel post. So why should EU sellers go through the admin burden because of a choice we made? If EU businesses can turn their noses up at £135 or under orders, it doesnt look great for Brexiteers claiming the EU need us more the we need them.

Though we may not see much in the way of VAT charging in the short term, just because we don't have the infrastructure to cope, it's been intimated that the VAT collection importing from the EU will be quite "soft" initially. Though you bet exporting from the UK will be collected more effectively by EU countries who are more ready.

Re: Second hand sales and purchases. 

As well as that, we are bo longer in the single market so no longer in the EU Margin Scheme. Which means if you are buying a used item via FB, Facebook, etc etc etc and that item is in the EU, then you will be charged an additional 20% when it is delivered to you, in the UK - Makes no difference if you buy that used item from a private seller or a vat registered business - Ditto the EU buyer will be charged 20% on arrival of the goods at his front door - Hence the chances of any of us selling to a EU customer has somewhat diminished and few of us will be buying used gear from the EU.

So used gear has now just had a 20% price increase, once the goods go through a customs boundary.

And this is all entirely self inflicted. 

 

[kasaran]

yeah sovereignty ?

 

[Shamal]

And this is all entirely self inflicted. 

Because the majority of england voted to leave twice?

Regards 

 

[Druid799]

No great loss tbh, they used to be one of the cheaper retailers when they first started now frankly they take the piss with some of their prices

And don’t forget having F-all in stock as well as stupid prices ? ?‍

 

Hence the chances of any of us selling to a EU customer has somewhat diminished and few of us will be buying used gear from the EU

BUT to be fair my self (and I’m very confident I can say this)and all my airsoft amigos Could count on less than one finger how many times we’ve bought or sold 2nd hand goods outside the uk ? 

 

[Steveocee]

I've had 3 maybe 4 orders from X-Fire in Japan last year arrive no problems. No customs, no charges, 1 week turn around.

The most recent order, is 2 weeks and counting, got stopped at customs and I've paid £17 import fee (on an order total of £44).

How on earth did the government manage to fudge this up so very badly?

 

[DrAlexanderTobacco]

How on earth did the government manage to fudge this up so very badly?

Just like how they've been fucking up for the last 10 years ;D