Steyr Aug A1 build questions and advice

[FreeFrag.UK]

Hi all,

I've just completed one of my builds and as such I'm now contemplating my next possible venture. I did have a look for this but have come up dry, I suspect due to what I'm looking for being quite specific.

I'm looking at the possibility of assembling a Steyr Aug A1 to match that used in everyone's favourite Christmas film... Die Hard. I realise that there are numerous quality issues with the various Aug's on the market but I'm looking at picking up the JG Aug A1 in Olive Drab.

My big questions surrounding this particular model fall down to;

1.  Is the overall length the same as that in the film? I ask this as I'm aware of at least three different barrel lengths for the Aug ranging from 14" to 20". I know that it's almost impossible to tell scale from a film and photo's so I'm hoping someone can clear this up for me as the length of the A1 in the film looks ideal for my needs.
   
2. How terrible is the 1.5x optic? Is it serviceable?
   
3. Is the JG a reasonable platform out of the box or is it advisable to gut it rebuild immediately? Is there a better option?
   

I was going to place this in the technical area as I suspect some of this ventures into that realm but I'm hoping that the knowledge of the community can assist with this pursuit.

Many thanks,

Frag

 

[Druid799]

I had one for years and it was a cracking good gun !

as to wether it looked like the Diehard one ? Just had a quick look on IMDB guns in movies and yea there the same .

scope is ok and as to how reliable mine ran for 6yrs till my son fell on it at a skirmish ! ?‍ 

 

[Iceni]

AUG's.


The full-length A1 is the correct length for the DH model.


Optics are basic, but they have a nice circle reticle and work. You can even zero them.


Out of the box, JG/APS are about equal. TM is the best but they don't make the model you want. 

JG has the closest externals to the DH gun. APS have slightly raised pistol grip and stock areas.

JG has the better piston head, APS uses a side injection point design on the sealing edge.

The wires, gears, shells are all the same from both manufacturers.

JG has a slightly nice trigger, With a ball bearing detent. APS uses a spungbar.

JG has a slightly faster stock motor.

So overall the JG is the winner, but it's not a massive lead. And if you plan upgrades the APS guns tend to be the cheapest variants.

You should be able to find the JG Aug A1 with a QC spring gearbox. But only on the newer models with the extra rails.

ASG do a fully traded A1. Finding it can be difficult, and in addition, it might be either a JG or APS body, ASG  use both.

There is also the issue of the extra rails. You want a gun without them, and that isn't in fashion atm. Most you will see for sale will have them. They can be removed but they screw into the plastic and leave holes when removed.

This is the traded, ASG, JG, A1 in olive, without extra rails.

https://actionsportgames.com/en-gb/productcatalog/steyr-aug-a1-od-green

It is model, 16531. Findiing that model might be difficult.

The untraded JG is easier to find.

https://gunfire.com/en/products/jg0449a-replica-1152190026.html


For mag's DH use the amber waffle mag. I would attempt to source 1 of these for pictures, but for the bulk of the shooting either mag 170rnd mid-caps, or king arms 110rnd mid caps are ideal. Most of the manufacturers make the amber high caps, ASG might include an amber or black high cap with the gun.

The king arms ones are easier to get. Running at about £7.50 each.
https://www.fire-support.co.uk/product/king-arms-steyr-aug-plastic-mid-cap-magazines-box-of-5110-rnd

As far as I know, there are no poor feeding aug mags. I use a mixture on my guns. TM, APS, JG, MAG, King arms, Battleaxe. None have issues.


For the battery, you want a 7.4v  2200mAh block type. You may have to remove the lug on the gearbox dividing plate, depending on the model of dividing plate.
https://www.componentshop.co.uk/7-4v-2200mah-30c-continuous-discharge-airsoft-lipo-battery.html

All wires are external, a MOSFET can be fitted without opening the gearbox. You are limited on space, but a basic fet like an xcoretech xet304u will fit on the gearbox side of the dividing plate with some good wire management.

Hop units are good, Do not be tempted to shim the inner barrel, it has to move to lock the gun together.  Prommy purple is a decent upgrade. CNC hop units don't offer anything over the plastic ones.

Airseal nozzles are a pain on all models. All manufacturers seem to make different length and width aftermarket nozzles. Buy on length alone 24.8mm Sometimes you will see g36/aug nozzles... these are 24.3mm and will give you all sorts of interesting problems!

Any problems you can just tag me in your thread and I'll help.


Since you want the platform you will have to live with its quirks.

BB's get lost in the body, and you have to split the gun to shake them out. It's easy and takes a few seconds to perform.

The butt pads can fall off if you don't put them on right. If you lose it you can buy spares.

Augs are noisy. And benefit from silent piston and cylinder head upgrades. The plastic element heads are the best. The body cavity also benefits from some noise damping on the inside.

M4 double pouches will only hold 1 mag. Aug mags are wide. So you may need new mag pouches.

 

[Druid799]

@Iceni I REALLY fecking hate you now ! after reading you excellent little AUG blurb i now want another one ! AAAAHHHHHHHH ! ??‍

 

[Iceni]

@Druid799 You know you want a TM HC.

Seriously tho, The Aug platform is superb if you can live with the quirks. You will not find a more comfortable gun. It was designed from the ground up with the shooter in mind.

 

[CrackCommandoUnit1972]

Got myself an ASG A1 commando version over xmas but I have yet to use it in anger. The box says it shoots 390fps so will need to down grade it, however, its got a quick change spring so should be really easy (no idea what strength spring is in there).

The scope is ok, fuzzy a short range but fine at longer ranges. It has iron sights on top of the scope but will need to add some white dots to it as its hard to see. The other issue I have is looking through the scope when I am wearing my Dye I4 mask, the mask gets in the way.

I was worried about the two stage trigger but found it super easy to single fire the weapon every time.

All in all, it's a nice gun. Need a few extra mags and I will be good to go. (The mags fit fine in my g36 pouches I have).

 

[Druid799]

@Druid799 You know you want a TM HC.

God no ! I hate high cycle guns ! ? but an ordinary one ? Oh yes ! 

The scope is ok, fuzzy a short range but fine at longer ranges. 

I do believe longer range is the actual use of a scope ? ? ?????

 

[Iceni]

Got myself an ASG A1 commando version over xmas but I have yet to use it in anger. The box says it shoots 390fps so will need to down grade it, however, its got a quick change spring so should be really easy (no idea what strength spring is in there).

Split the gun in the middle, To remove the pressure on the gearbox front.

Then remove the butt plate and the 2 screws that hold in the dividing plate....You should be able to see the back of the gearbox and the QC bolt. Insert a big Allen key, turn, Push in and turn it 45 degrees in either direction.. The bolt should just push out followed by the spring. 

The spring you want to put in will be an M100 (330fps). £5 from AK2M4.

https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/internal-parts/springs/shs-ra-m100-aeg-black-spring

As for the model, it's can't be a commando. The commando has a top rail. It'll be an A1 para.

Para above, Commando below.

As for the scope been fuzzy at less than about 2 meters it will be fuzzy, but it should be fine at anything longer than that. Most scopes with some magnification have a minimum range for clear focus. The front element is adjustable so yours might need screwing in a little.

 

[CrackCommandoUnit1972]

You are right, it's the Para version.

I really need to get a chrono so i can test these things at home. 

 

[Iceni]

I would pick up a spring.

Even if it is a UK spec gun it'll have a cut spring rather than a complete one. JG and APS are both responsible for cutting springs rather than using the correct one.

The new spring will take 10 minutes to fit, and if you are worried about it get one of the techs at your local sites to do it. It's a very simple job with the QC system.

 

[FreeFrag.UK]

@Iceni Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and wisdom relating to the Aug, it's very insightful to say the least. Out of curiosity I've noticed some Classic Army Proline Aug A1's still available, do you know if the extra money worth it?

I've done some further research and found that the one wielded by Karl uses the 16" barrel, I had a brief look around but couldn't see a 16" outer barrel for the AUG, do you know where I might be able to find one or a way of achieving this barrel length? As a final question, do you know if all airsoft versions of the AUG are slightly longer than their real steel counterparts?

Once again, thank you for sharing your knowledge and I definitely plan on getting one. I have an L85A2 at present which I love but it has a couple of quirks (like all bullpups) and despite my love of bullpups I only own the one so the AUG leapt out at me as my next bullpup.

Edit: I've also seen another manufacturer referred to as "army", I don't know if this means anything to anyone?

 

[Iceni]

You'll see a few makes.

Classic army I know nothing about, I've never been into one to know what the internals are like or held one to know what the externals are like.

Army is probably Army armament. They use the APS bodies so I would assume they are the same internals. There is some interesting wire cutter A3's from them.

APS might not be the OEM brand for that body style, ASG, APS, Army armament, Snow wolf and probably a few others use that body. I call them APS since that is the most common brand with that body you will see outside of ASG (and we all know ASG as rebranders so there is no issue there). Saying that there is no hard and fast rule for who is selling what. I've seen the JG style bodies branded as snow wolf as well, and GFC (gunfire) using both body types. I would avoid these bodies as they don't look right for what you want.

Barrel length the DH one is a 20 inch. These images should clear that up for you.

View attachment 41338

 

 

[Dentonboy]

Had a Classic Army A1. It was, to my eye, the exact same length as Karl's.

Optic is very useable. Gun is a good quality replica. Regret selling mine and have been eyeing up another A1 AUG...

I remember AI awarded the CA AUG 5/5 - the first 5/5 AEG award given iirc - back in the day. Solid performer and I don't recall it ever letting me down.

Not sure how available they are to buy now though apart from Zero One...

 

[FreeFrag.UK]

@Iceni Just to quickly pick your brains, would you recommend avoiding or going for any particular silent cylinder heads?

 

[Iceni]

I'd go for the POM plastic type. I've had good success with element V3 kits.

https://www.bullseyecountrysport.co.uk/element-airsoft-silent-piston-head--cylinder-set-for-v23-gear-mech-boxes-17109-p.asp

 

A good brass spring guide also helps transfer the spring noise into the gearbox shell.  You will never fully get rid of spring twang.

I have used the SHS bore up kits as well. Whilst they have a superb finish, and a great airseal (if you add an oversized o-ring), The extra head weight means the gun will still be loud.

My best gearbox has this setup internally.

JG shells
Bushes
JG 18:1 gears and stock delayer
JG piston
Element cylinder head and piston head
Deepfire brass spring guide V3 (Solid type)
ASG ultimate tappet plate
ASG ultimate CNC 35K motor
Guarder air nozzle (POM) Oring
M95 spring

Gate nanohard (these are a pig to fit, and need divider plate modification).

ZCI 363mm, Stock hop, Prommy purple.

I run that in my A3, It has some internal sound damping as well, and uses a suppressor. Stood in the house you can not hear it downstairs with the doors open (2 bed terrace). On the playing field you can't tell where the gun is shooting from, and it's silent at about 10 meters. To the shooter it still sounds loud. RPS is about 22 on 7.4v


My aps a1 has a different gearbox setup

Shs bore up kit (P-head, C-head, Cylinder, Airseal nozzle)
20x2.5mm o ring
APS 18:1 gears and shs delayer
APS stock motor
ASG ultimate tappet plate
M110 spring cut to 348fps
Stock QC spring guide
Bearings

Xcoretech xet304u mosfet, (easy to fit with some careful wire management)

ZCI 363mm, Plastic hop unit, Prommy purple.

It's a slower gun at about 17rps on 7.4v, but it is so much louder. It sounds like a regular gun on the field, to the shooter it is deafening. I leave this one like this for those days where you want the noise. It has no advantages over the Element setup. Other than the fact it's a bit better on ammo, and has more FPS.



You'll notice I use shorter inner barrels.  509mm is standard for an Aug. It's too long. 363 is better, I've got a few other barrels that I drop in as well all are shorter than the 363mm ones. Both of the ZCI barrels are internally polished to 1 micron (YMMV) A full-length Aug needs no modification to run a shorter barrel.

Both guns have exceptional range and accuracy. And I get accused of been hot quite a bit for it.

 

 

[FreeFrag.UK]

@Iceni Thank you for the brilliant response, once again you've covered just about everything I could hope for.

I've got a few more questions if you'll indulge me?

First of all, do you run a sling on your Aug A1? If so do you have any advice? I quite like three-point slings (not the most popular I know) and I was considering getting one to go with the Aug but I can't tell if this could present really handling issues?

Secondly, I keep going back to the Classic Army as my port of call but I honestly can't figure out if the extra cash is worth it. I realise this is something you may not be able to weigh in on but I'm of the mind that Classic Army tend to produce pretty solid guns with good internals. As far as I can tell the ASG version of the A1 which comes with the trades and is the "military" version doesn't actually come with the QC Spring System so it would seem logical to go with what is probably higher build quality?

Finally, how do you find the scope on the APS A1? I'm assuming this is comparable to the JG? It's a feature which I do intend to use and as such I'm wondering if I'm better off hedging my best (so to speak) and going for the CA?

The opinion question... This is something which I'm hung up on... The trades... I really can't decide whether or not it's a deal breaker for me not having the trades... I don't actually think any of my guns have the real trades and I was just wondering where you land on this and if you know if it's possible to get real trades added down the line?

Thank you so much for your help.

 

[Iceni]

I run whatever sling I happen to have in my bag on the day. Normally a 3 point, but I do own and use 2 point as well. 3 point suits the Aug, And there is nothing that gets in the way on the side of the gun. The Sling will sit just over the cocking handle and run back to the back of the stock when in use, When clipped up the gun will balance very well.

If you like the CA go for it. I can't advise you if it's the better gun, I know JG and APS both produce guns that have great potential with a few tweaks. And you can put those tweaks in place and still save money over a new TM.

The CA is better priced, so a tweaked JG will probably run over the cost of the CA. Is the CA going to need the same tweaks that you have to do to a JG?... I honestly can't answer that.

I like the scope on the A1. It's not a fancy thing, but at the same time, it doesn't feel cheap either. Optically there reasonable, not as bright as a modern design, but very rugged. It is possible to pick up new aug front ends. And all Augs are interchangeable. So if you have a spare A2 upper it will go on your A1 lower in seconds. It's one of the reasons aug owners will pick up broken guns, everything interchanges. The only real difference across all models is the upper. There is a broken aug on the classified atm with an A2 upper for £60. In effect, that's all your spare parts and a different upper for not a lot of money.
 



Trades are personal. I don't care for them. My a3 has them, I don't notice them at all. It's just the standard ASG laser etch with some white paint forced into it. I'd rather save money, get the right gun, and upgrade the hell out of the gearbox. Then spend more on having a Steyr logo on the side of the gun, I do like my upgrades tho.
 

 

[Druid799]

What he said ! When I had mine I found a 3pointer worked best for me .

As to the Classic I didn’t own one but the wife’s cousin did and he’s one of the most cack handed breaker of guns going ! He is an utter disaster with ANY gun wether gas/spring or Electric , my self and several good friends sold him a few guns over the years that never ever let us down or gave us any problems and within 2 wks to a mth they’d all imploded ! ?‍

Well he had a CA one and it survived him for near 5yrs till he sold it on and I know it’s still working so must be good AEG’s ! ???

 

[Druid799]

@Iceni you ever come across GFC guns before ? I hadn’t heard of them but gunfire have a very nice A1 for £120 somthing , which is a good £50 less than most places if not more .

edit ; just noticed couple of posts up you said the body is off , was wondering if you’d heard if the internals are ok ?

 

[Iceni]

GFC (Gunfire Corp) are re-branded APS.

It'll have APS internals.

Expect:

18:1 gears - steel - with delayer
Plastic piston head (poor design injection point on sealing face)
Plastic cylinder head.
Bearings
Plastic piston, 1 metal tooth.
Basic wires - no mosfet - all wire external, Inline fuse.
Sticker on the gearbox to invalidate the warranty.

Plastic hop, 6.08 barrel, Strange bucking with small square mound.

Spring bar trigger detent.
No single shot only safe bar position.


Out of the box they work, but arn't perfect. 
Drop in the element head set,  £15
Reshim £0
Decent bucking £10
Cut the inner barrel and recrown at 320-360mm
Total £25.

Standard upgrade path after then.

And they will shoot as well as anything you own.

Externally the bodies don't feel as solid as the JG plastic, but that is more the texture than the plastic thickness. The texture gives them a hollow feeling. Just as noisy as any other Aug.

The body is only off in this thread - because the OP is wanting the DH Karl gun, and the APS looks significantly different with the raised texture areas. 


This is the APS piston head, You can actually see the injection point on the side of the sealing face in the image!!! On my APS the injection point was sharp. It's basically a junk head. The element set solves all the issues.

View attachment 41372