New hop rubber misfeeding and huge fps variations

[JinxDuh]

Hey guys, got my maple leaf 60 degree today from ak2m4 to replace the awful one that came out of the E&L. I paired it with the XT Red omega nub as it was cheaper than the ML one. I installed it with a 6.00mm XT inner barrel.
 

It seems to be firing fine but on the middle of the hop I’m getting 230 fps (Roughly), and 311 (Roughly) with the hop all the way on (Longest part of the ak hop adjuster as far as it’ll go forwards) on .25g BB’s. My father put the same combo in excluding barrel (He’s using the standard barrel) and he’s getting the same FPS readings with the hop fully on, however hop set anywhere middle and under and he’ll misfeed, shoot 4+ bb’s at once, or none at all. 
 

Do these rubbers need “breaking in” or is that a myth?

 

[Lozart]

Wait - the FPS is going UP with more hop on?

 

[JinxDuh]

Wait - the FPS is going UP with more hop on?

I think I have it backwards haha

Basically:

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[Lozart]

That makes more sense!

 

[ak2m4]

Rubbers will break-in over time, you generally end up applying a little more hop to compensate.  Not every hop chamber is the same so it takes a little playing around with.  It sounds to me like the nub is perhaps a little too large (tall) for your hop chamber, although impossible for me to tell without it in front of me.

You might try trimming a little of material off the top of the nub to reduce some of it's height.  Also as a test try a standard nub if you have one there.

 

[JinxDuh]

Rubbers will break-in over time, you generally end up applying a little more hop to compensate.  Not every hop chamber is the same so it takes a little playing around with.  It sounds to me like the nub is perhaps a little too large (tall) for your hop chamber, although impossible for me to tell without it in front of me.

You might try trimming a little of material off the top of the nub to reduce some of it's height.  Also as a test try a standard nub if you have one there.

That’s a good idea. I’ll try the rubber with a standard nub!

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I think I have it backwards haha

You do, backwards is hop fully on

 

[Asomodai]

ML rubbers with the ML nub tend to overhop and jam if the hop is turned up too much as there is much more "Mound" than on standard hop setups. The fix is just to only adjust it up to the point it doesn't jam or below. It will probably be massively overhopping at that point anyway. 

 

[JinxDuh]

So with a standard black nub, 146 fps average with hop in middle, 309 average with hop off, 96 average with hop fully on. So not the nub. I’m assuming the best thing to do is leave it until I get out to a game and test it at proper range? I don’t really have anywhere to test long range at all.

 

[Sewdhull]

misfeeds are likely to be the lip end of the rubber being too long and partially obstructing the feeding.

 

[Skara]

Wait - the FPS is going UP with more hop on?

My small M4 does this, no hop applied = 0.8something Joules, hop correctly set for 0.32 = 0.99J

I guess my particular setup doesn't seal when there is no hop..

Back to the OP,

I think you are both having terrible air seal issues, there is no way that you drop so much velocity when applying hop.

Sort the compression first, then try again.

Some hop rubbers seem to need a few hundred bbs to "break in", but I have never experienced such a thing with my Maple Leaf ones.

 

[JinxDuh]

My small M4 does this, no hop applied = 0.8something Joules, hop correctly set for 0.32 = 0.99J

I guess my particular setup doesn't seal when there is no hop..

Back to the OP,

I think you are both having terrible air seal issues, there is no way that you drop so much velocity when applying hop.

Sort the compression first, then try again.

Some hop rubbers seem to need a few hundred bbs to "break in", but I have never experienced such a thing with my Maple Leaf ones.

The compression is fine, the stock rubber was doing 0.4 variation with 25 rounds put through it to check. Putting the stock rubber in and it’s firing fine as should be, just awful range hence why we opted to get upgraded rubbers

 

[Skara]

Yeah stock E&L rubbers seem to be made for stupid high energies, certainly not around the 1J mark.

Also you did not mention what rubbers you bought. Personally had meh experiences with MR-Hops, okay-ish energy consistency but really bad BB trajectory..

Macarons/super macarons are spot on for me.

 

[JinxDuh]

Yeah stock E&L rubbers seem to be made for stupid high energies, certainly not around the 1J mark.

Also you did not mention what rubbers you bought. Personally had meh experiences with MR-Hops, okay-ish energy consistency but really bad BB trajectory..

Macarons/super macarons are spot on for me.

It was the “Maple Leaf Macaron Hop Rubber Bucking 60”

 

[Colin Allen]

With that combination, you will not need much hop applied; the adjuster bar should be a lot further forward than your middle position on 0.25g BBs.  The gap at the front of the numbers should be very small.

 

[JinxDuh]

With that combination, you will not need much hop applied; the adjuster bar should be a lot further forward than your middle position on 0.25g BBs.  The gap at the front of the numbers should be very small.

That would explain it, I reckon. I think I’ll leave it until my next game and dial it in. It can’t be any worse than it was Sunday just gone. Ideal for shooting at birds and planes though ?

 

[Adolf Hamster]

It was the “Maple Leaf Macaron Hop Rubber Bucking 60”

you using an omega nub with it?

the macaron is a great bucking, but does need the nub to be shaped accordingly.

if you're getting decent energy and consistency in the range of hop adjustment that you're using in-game, then i wouldn't worry too much.

hop fully off you can sometimes get an energy drop, i suspect it's because there needs to be some resistance delaying the bb's start whilst the pressure builds up.

likewise hop fully on you can get energy drops, and even a second sweet spot where the bb is sapped of so much energy, but also sufficiently over-spun to fly at that low energy, always better to start hop off and increment when setting to avoid this.

 

[JinxDuh]

you using an omega nub with it?

the macaron is a great bucking, but does need the nub to be shaped accordingly.

if you're getting decent energy and consistency in the range of hop adjustment that you're using in-game, then i wouldn't worry too much.

hop fully off you can sometimes get an energy drop, i suspect it's because there needs to be some resistance delaying the bb's start whilst the pressure builds up.

likewise hop fully on you can get energy drops, and even a second sweet spot where the bb is sapped of so much energy, but also sufficiently over-spun to fly at that low energy, always better to start hop off and increment when setting to avoid this.

I’m using: https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/xt-omega-nub-soft-70?search=Omega

I’ve never ran into issues with maple leaf before with a 50/60 degree macaron and omega nub - That combo is in the majority of my pews, however this is the first time using the XT version

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I’m using: https://www.ak2m4.co.uk/xt-omega-nub-soft-70?search=Omega

yeah that's the right sort of thing.

i did try an xt one a while back and found it to be a tad unsquare, so if you find curving to be an issue worth checking, sample size of one though so not concrete.

I’ve never ran into issues with maple leaf before with a 50/60 degree macaron and omega nub - That combo is in the majority of my pews, however this is the first time using the XT version

in some pews the feed lip length can be problematic, but i wouldn't say a stock e&l is one of them.

 

[JinxDuh]

yeah that's the right sort of thing.

i did try an xt one a while back and found it to be a tad unsquare, so if you find curving to be an issue worth checking, sample size of one though so not concrete.

in some pews the feed lip length can be problematic, but i wouldn't say a stock e&l is one of them.

I’ll get an omega nub and try it too, it’s interesting it’s having the same issue with two E&L’s though ?