UKARA Alternative - A Players Union

[GunmanAirsoft]

Not sure I understand this part, Why would you have to defend anything? Theres nothing in UK Law about UKARA entries

What you have to remember is that although UKARA does not appear in UK legislation, it has been approved by the Home Office as a method that retailers can use to be reasonably certain that a defence under section 37 of the VCR Act applies to a sale which would otherwise be prohibited under section 36 of the same act.

If someone ever got in trouble involving a RIF (let's imagine they used it in a terrorist attack of some sort as a worst case scenario) and the sale was traced back to a retailer, the retailer would say they had good reason to believe that a section 37 defence applied to the sale because the player had an active UKARA entry.

I can almost guarantee that the investigation would then focus on the site who authorised the UKARA entry and the site operator would then be required to prove that the person in question had actually attended the required number of events as recommended by the Home Office to qualify as a regular skirmisher.

The site operator would then be called upon to provide records to prove that they hadn't just stamped the forms fraudulently.

Worst case scenario: the above happens, the site operator has no records, the whole system gets declared a farce and a sham and Airsoft gets flat banned.

 

[Sacarathe]

I can almost guarantee that the investigation would then focus on the site who authorised the UKARA entry and the site operator would then be required to prove that the person in question had actually attended the required number of events as recommended by the Home Office to qualify as a regular skirmisher.

I doubt it. A separate investigation might open up, but whether someone was eligible to buy a RIF would be irrelevant if they used it in a crime.

 

[mimozine]

it would be nice if the whole system came away from being controlled by the retailers. i cant see a way it would be done without some sort of payment, as someone will need to do alot of work for it to work correctly. the problem as i see it is even if you get a union or similar going there is no guarantee that retailers will accept you, they could stil keep shouting ukara only.

on a lighter note, i have a name suggestion

Airsoft National Union of Skirmishers

and there could be database for people wanting to purchase rifs

Airsoft National Aproved List

there must be some acronym we could call them by for short though

 

[GiantKiwi]

it would be nice if the whole system came away from being controlled by the retailers. i cant see a way it would be done without some sort of payment, as someone will need to do alot of work for it to work correctly. the problem as i see it is even if you get a union or similar going there is no guarantee that retailers will accept you, they could stil keep shouting ukara only.

Been tried, both were failures. One never took off, and Qlimax I believe it was proved the other couldn't be trusted.

 

[Sacarathe]

it would be nice if the whole system came away from being controlled by the retailers. i cant see a way it would be done without some sort of payment, as someone will need to do alot of work for it to work correctly. the problem as i see it is even if you get a union or similar going there is no guarantee that retailers will accept you, they could stil keep shouting ukara only.

on a lighter note, i have a name suggestion

Airsoft National Union of Skirmishers

and there could be database for people wanting to purchase rifs

Airsoft National Aproved List

there must be some acronym we could call them by for short though

AAL? I like it.

 

[mimozine]

ANAL? I like it.

fixed :blink:

 

[Giliador]

I think online database accessible by retailers would be great way to manage defence for RIF, so you could visit any 3 random sites as long as they have insurance, and it will then be logged on secured server rather then Bac chasing sites, asking for proof, collecting data. Player will get email confirmation of attendance, renewing etc. You get unique code which you give to retailer, this code is valid when you attended 3 games, invalid of you didn't.

 

[Mack]

I think online database accessible by retailers would be great way to manage defence for RIF, so you could visit any 3 random sites as long as they have insurance, and it will then be logged on secured server rather then Bac chasing sites, asking for proof, collecting data. Player will get email confirmation of attendance, renewing etc. You get unique code which you give to retailer, this code is valid when you attended 3 games, invalid of you didn't.

 

[rc540]

Had the Essex firearms officer in today doing a routine check on bits.

Quite funny as he said from a retailers point of view, to sell a full RIF, there is no need for Ukara. As long as it is logged as the same as an air rifle sale, and the customer states it is to be used for skirmishing purposes, that suffices enough as a defence, and that the individual does not have to proove to the retailer that he does skirmish. Anyone selling rifs in the district would not be prosecuted by using the above method.

Shocked to say the least.

 

[Alex34]

Had the Essex firearms officer in today doing a routine check on bits.

Quite funny as he said from a retailers point of view, to sell a full RIF, there is no need for Ukara. As long as it is logged as the same as an air rifle sale, and the customer states it is to be used for skirmishing purposes, that suffices enough as a defence, and that the individual does not have to proove to the retailer that he does skirmish. Anyone selling rifs in the district would not be prosecuted by using the above method.

Shocked to say the least.

Not surprised. UKARA cannot be used as a "legal defense" in any case. It would be supporting evidence at best.

Legally no one is required to use it in any circumstance. It just allows for a smoother sales process and protects our hobby from possibly developing a bad rep.

 

[Mr Monkey Nuts]

This had always been the case, when you look into who started and maintains the ukara database you will see they are far from independent, and have a vested interest in controlling airsoft sales.