Government Clarification on Airsoft/Paintball and Covid. Currently Not Allowed

[AlphaBear]

For me it's simply a matter of when it's 'safe' to do so... but what is considered safe these days? Many people will have their opinions on this topic and debate is good...  

I feel this weekend was way too soon, but then you saw all those demos in the UK happening too and all those people bunched up and I'm thinking damn that's just inviting trouble... So what is considered safe? The first measure of 'safe' in my opinion is surely when the government says it's safe to partake in such events? Not when a site owner says so. Then there is the distinction between those sites who operate as a business vs those who operate for fun. Business owners will want to open as quick as possible. That's understandable. However, safety should be paramount. It's not just the safety of the players but the potential risk they could pass on to family and friends without even realising it...  

Make no mistake, the world as we knew has changed and that's beyond doubt. The  question now is how we mitigate the risk...  Personally If I don't play this year, so be it.... it's not the end of the world... It would be nice to be able to get a few games in if possible, but think of this.... the last quarter of the year will become colder, wetter and the flu season will begin... this is when the next major hurdle will be placed in front of the nation.  However, the optimist in me is hoping a vaccine could be available by then (unlikely though)....  

The debate continues......

 

[Stratton Oakmont]

However, safety should be paramount. It's not just the safety of the players but the potential risk they could pass on to family and friends without even realising it...

Does that responsibility not lie with the participant? Or does he/she by being given permission absolve themselves of the responsibility and can blame the govt/ business. I'm all for choice and personal responsibility but It looks to me that some my need to blame others to justify their participation if a second wave occurred 

 

[AlphaBear]

Does that responsibility not lie with the participant? Or does he/she by being given permission absolve themselves of the responsibility and can blame the govt/ business. I'm all for choice and personal responsibility but It looks to me that some my need to blame others to justify their participation if a second wave occurred 

Everyone has a choice.... however many may not be able to make a choice unless guided to do so and then when things go Pete Tong they will say 'so and so said it was safe to do so' in an attempt to absolve themselves... I mean the govt is saying that pubs may re-open in a couple of weeks.... I'm more than happy getting my booze from Tecos or whatever and I certainly won't be in a rush to get to my local... and that's my choice.... My neighbour will say 'sod that' I'm going....

Interesting news today... NZ have declared themselves Covid free and will begin lifting all restrictions but their border will remain 'closed'..  they locked down very quickly.... but hey hindsight eh?

 

[Stratton Oakmont]

Until they reopen and then have a population with no immunity with the potential of an asymptomatic carrier starting it all over again

 

[AlphaBear]

Exactly..... as I said, we need to accept the new normal...... the world as we knew it has changed.... 

 

[Zarrin]

For me it's simply a matter of when it's 'safe' to do so... but what is considered safe these days? 

I suppose unless people decide to give up their sport or activity completely, this eventually does become a very subjective matter.

There have been expert medical opinions which seem to suggest the risk will remain for years to come if not to some extent actually create permanent change.

So then once the government says it's okay - we have to make our own minds up, because 'okay' seemingly is going to mean 'reduced risk'.. not risk free; but I mean such is everything in life.

The problem is world governments need to get their economies kick started - and there have been signs right from the start of this pandemic that information is being omitted to make the prospect of a return to normalcy seem less risky.

 

[Stratton Oakmont]

We will see.

expert medical opinions - read best guess based on modelling

discount the paranoid and the crazies with their illuminati and Tom cruises space alien lizards and 

it always boils down to one question - who benefits?

i don't even mean that in some grand mysterious conspiracy theory, just that people are generally motivated by self interest.

View attachment 58387

And yet to some he is still a seven time tour winner

 

[Adolf Hamster]

see a bunch of local sites re-opening now with reduced numbers.

can't say i'm entirely sure what i think of it.

on the one hand airsoft isn't essential, and my personal circumstances mean i'm anticipating being off work for at minimum another month if not moving towards the end of the year, and if my job isn't important enough for me to do in full ppe then surely airsoft isn't either.

on the other hand, it's relatively easy to keep the social distancing going if sites are keeping the numbers down, and my playstyle means generally apart from my squad mates in the safe zone i don't get near anyone especially on the field.

plus i've kind of accepted that i'm gonna be getting covid one way or another, so the choice seems to be waiting around losing sanity at the same rate as gaining weight or accepting the inevitable and getting it over and done with.

 

[Stratton Oakmont]

plus i've kind of accepted that i'm gonna be getting covid one way or another, so the choice seems to be waiting around losing sanity at the same rate as gaining weight or accepting the inevitable and getting it over and done with.

I'm with you on this one, given that lockdown was introduced to slow the spread to reduce pressure on the health service not prevent the spread. When the testing procedure is in place and the percentage of those who have recovered and hopefully have immunity has reached herd immunity levels then in theory jobs done. Getting the virus in the big picture was/is not the concern unfortunately.

just need a vaccine now then we can pew pew to our hearts content

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I'm with you on this one, given that lockdown was introduced to slow the spread to reduce pressure on the health service not prevent the spread. When the testing procedure is in place and the percentage of those who have recovered and hopefully have immunity has reached herd immunity levels then in theory jobs done. Getting the virus in the big picture was/is not the concern unfortunately.

just need a vaccine now then we can pew pew to our hearts content

i'm not convinced we're anywhere near herd immunity levels just yet.

it's a balance, if you want herd immunity then you need people to get out and about and catch it. if you want to eliminate the virus then you need people to go full hermit and not catch it for long enough that all the current cases are dealt with.

and of course inbetween those you have the problem that at a national level you can't take either route fully as one road leads to an overwhelmed healthcare system and lots of deaths and the other leads to economic ruin.

this is why i wouldn't want to be a politician right now, whichever route you choose or middle ground you take there's going to be flak coming from both sides.

 

[Stratton Oakmont]

Damned if you do damned if you don't, the joys of politics.

regarding herd immunity I doubt that the govt is even close to knowing the correct levels. Given that surgical operations have begun with Covid testing as a requirement there are numbers of Covid positives who have zero Covid symptoms even though they require serious surgery and have no idea how they could have got it, probably the tip of the iceberg

As the nightingale hospitals are empty and in theory we require herd immunity then you could argue that we should be actively encouraging the healthy to practically rub against each other whilst shielding  the vulnerable until a vaccine is found.

good luck with that, the figures point to obesity being one of the main  risk factors after age and prediagnosed illness. Which politician is brave enough to suggest that obese people are not allowed out?

Oh I forget, Donald Trump probably would, right after his daily Big Mac .

 

[GeorgePlaysAirsoft]

Why?

the tipping point occurs when enough people do something to make the rules governing it irrelevant,  thats the positive/negative of a democratic society 

At what point would you return to Airsoft, when the rules say you can?

not a question specifically to you but the does justification to do so imply safety??

i don't know, I just see lines in the sand as just that and they move a lot.

I'm as middle of the road as they come but people with strong opinions do pique my interest 

I'd return to skirmishing when the government guidelines permit it (and for my own sake, when physical distancing measures are relaxed. I cba to skirmish if I have to stay 2m apart at all times... horrible).

If the guidelines allow it then my individual attendance won't have any impact on public health in the wider sense, R values and such.

If I was in close proximity to a vulnerable person (say if i shared my house with an over 70 etc) then I'd have to conduct my own risk assessment. I was about to type "but i wouldn't begrudge anyone who wasn't, and did go skirmishing" - but I have to be honest - I probably would haha!

 

[typefish]

Elements of airsoft and paintball could meet the starting criteria of Sport England, these would be tournament speedsoft and tournament paintball.  Other competitive forms could also meet the starting criteria such as the woods ball league, and arguably our Battle Royale 'tournaments'.

We'd have sports recognition already if it wasn't for the industry not wanting to team up and sit on their laurels for two years.

 

[LoneTactix]

I'm still perplexed why tennis doubles is now allowed and airsoft is still in question.

On a previous post I saw a site saying their precautions would be:

- no travelling with anyone outside your household to site

- PPE masks to be worn outside of games 

- no safe zone, use your car

- hand sanitizer to be used

- keep your distance.

I think these seem to cover making things as safe as possible to play.

Only thing I see a problem is if people need to do a #2 and we can't use toilets ?

 

[Liam1992]

Just seen an announcement that Alton Towers is to reopen on July 4th from today's developments.

Good news for us, perhaps?

 

[Tiercel]

Sadly we're nowhere near getting a vaccine, and probably wont have one at all. To my knowledge weve never successfully vaccinated against a virus of the corona family (MERS/SARS etc), however that could simply be because they never really spread outside of small parts of the world that pharmaceutical companies didnt really care about because the limited profit probably outweighed the R&D cost, with a global pandemic with no end in sight that may be a different matter. Regarding herd immunity the big problem we have there is we simply dont know enough about the virus yet to say how long immunity is actually provided for, the working theory at the moment is that you get "at least" 2-3 months of immunity if your body has been able to produce the antibodies, beyond that we simply dont know, plus theres a good chance itll mutate. We've started doing antibody blood tests at work (the proper lab blood sample ones, not the finger prick useless scam Chinese ones) to try ans get a vague idea of how many have/havent had it. Turns out I've had it and didnt even realise, had a few days of feeling crap and losing my sense of smell but thought nothing more of it. This virus will probably become another seasonal flu type thing, we'll have little annual outbreaks and hope not too many people die and if we do get a vaccine that we manage to guess correctly which annual strain to vaccinate against each year.

However the government cant come out and say "yeah prepare for the long haul, were not getting a vaccine anytime soon if ever. Now get back to work plebs its costing us too much money to keep you all furloughed".  It needs to dangle these little tid-bits of hope and "if youre good boys you can go to the pub again soon" infront of the public to keep them on side.

 

[Dogsbody100]

There are allegedly airsoft sites open NOW never mind the 4th July and were well into the start of lockdown too, Christ only knows where they stand in all this legally speaking