Feasibility and upgrade advice for a bolt action project

[Yankee0]

Hi all,

I'm become hooked on my TM VSR 10, which is currently running at aroind 500fps. The problem being that this has lead to a love of single shot bolt action rifles in general so fancy something without the MED of a full on sniper rifle but with the fun ker-click, ker-klunk of a BAR.

To this end I am looking to pick up a fairly budget BAR, with as short a barrel as possible then upgrade for consistency, accuracy and, to an extent, range (although not looking for full on sniper rifle range) but not FPS, to give me something along the lines of a WW2 style bolt action carbine, with fairly good accuracy, around 320-350fps on .20s and easy bolt pull, thus allowing me to fulfill my bolt action needs in an environment unsuited to full on sniping.

At this stage, I am still deciding which rifle to buy. I have considered some of the WW2 bolt action rifles but either the base quality of the rifle does not appear too great, there are limits on upgradeability due to proprietary parts or the price is rather high for a weapon that is probably going to be more for fun than serious skirmishing. I did consider a stock TM VSR Gspec without supressor but this is exactly what I have already and fancy something a bit different, possibly an M1 carbine style rifle or even something soviet looking, as long as it is not simply a spring version of a normally fully automatic weapon.

Any advice on a rifle would be appreciated, the shorter the barrel the better, the only major concerns being fairly robust externals (as I can be a clumsy bugger at times) and a fairly budget price (ie £50-100 - in case I hate or balls up my first attempt). Ideally a wooden or wooden effect stock would be nice but not absolutely necessary as I can always spray it and it would need to be available in the UK to avoid shipping costs etc.

The initial planned upgrades will be something along the lines of:

Air seal mods

Barrel spacers

Hop unit shims or replacement, rifle dependent

Probably flat hop or similar

Downgrade of spring if required (got the stock TM VSR one lying around)

Replacement sears if needed although probably not required unless the stock trigger is terrible

General clean up of any shoddy stock internals, cleaning, regreasing etc.

Also, how feasible to skirmish do people think that this rifle would be? My idea being to use it in a sort of underpowered DM role with a view forcing myself to an accurate first shot over spamming the trigger, or if sufficiently quiet possible in a scouting role, hence remaining under the 350fps limit.

Again, anything I have forgotten, please let me know. With regard to mods and upgrades, I have a fair bit of tech experience, mostly with gas guns and a moderate bit with spring rifles.

Cheers

Y0

 

[Russe11]

In terms of skirmishability, a WW2 bolt action is going to be less effective than an AEG. In terms of fun, I would go for it

There is a Cyma M1 carbine springer, which fits into the budget category but is considered reasonable. How easy the internals would be to upgrade, I have no idea.

http://www.evike.com/products/44598/

For maximum fun with a bolt action, I would suggest getting a shoot and scoot SMLE and rubber bayonet. They can be bought fully made up or in kit form. You could even put VSR internals into one. If you paint the bayonet silver to look real, a bayonet charge really scares the shit out of everyone.

I personally own an Ironairsoft SMLE, which is gas powered and unfortunately broken. I will need to build a new magazine from scratch as these guns are no longer made. Once I get round to doing this, I can guarantee that I will have the most fun anyone can have with a single shot weapon. Imagine a gun able to use the mad minute technique but where the bolt only has to be moved less than an inch to load each round. Plus the ability to fix bayonet and charge. h34r:

 

[Samurai]

It's fun that I can tell you.

But it's not WW2 or wooden. And with the original stock the body is a bit fragile.

I use it on sites where the contacts are medium range. Like RIFT comm site 3. It's mostly forest so enemy can pop up within MED a lot. On a site with lots of open spaces like Strikefoce Badlands I use the more powerful boltie.

You don't have much alternative to the G-spec in this price range and with these requirements. The Well or JG clones will be fine on this power level. Do the DIY mods and put the marui rubber into it and that's about it. TDC mod, and if you want to invest some more in it then a soft maple leaf decepticon bucking and the maple leaf hopup arm too. Use at least 0.36g BBs.

 

[Yankee0]

Cheers to both of you Russe and Samurai, this is exactly the sort of advice I am after!

Russe, I have heard some good things about the CYMA M1 and it is one of the top contenders that I am considering. I have done a bit of googleage however and as you say, I can't seem to find much info on upgradeability, which in all fairness given the low price isn't a a surprise. I really do like the look of the SMLE but a bit over what I am looking to spend at the moment.

Samurai, what rifle is that? It looks awesome! What you described is very much how I am looking to use it, plus I am after a bit of a project, will be out of the field for a few months after some forthcoming surgery so something to tinker with will keep me nicely occupied.

With regards to the up/downgrades, that sounds spot on to what I was thinking, although if I go the Gspec clone route I might go with an AA hop unit instead of the TDC mod purely due to how awesome its has been in my existing Gspec.

Might even pick up a spare stock and modify that to make it a bit different to my existing boltie, perhaps go down the fake mag route and make something a bit mosin nagant-like.

Keep the advice coming though guys, all great so far and nothing is too outlandish for me to consider.....

Cheers, Y0

 

[Samurai]

Cheers. Mine is a Well MB-06 heavily modified.

I didn't recommend the AA unit because of your budget, but if you can afford it then that's the best.

 

[Yankee0]

Yeah I shouldn't but I can't help it, I do love the AA hop unit!

I do think my decision is made, going to go for a cheap as possible vsr clone, for two reasons: I've worked with one before and have parts lying around and because I can't find my other option, a cyma m14, in the uk lol.

My thoughts are that possibly the Well MB-02 which always seems to be knocking around second hand and as far as I am aware is fully vsr compatible should be the way forward, unless anyone can tell me different?

Now I just have to decide on what to do externally to make it a bit different, it did occur to me that as I am not worried about noise, I can cut the barrel down as much as I like without worrying about volume ratios, and maybe then get my (limited) puttying skills on to change the stock significantly, although I will probably try and pick up a cheap second stock to experiment on first......

I think my first move would be to fill in the dip at the top of the vsr stock to and remove the stubby grip at the bottom to give a fairly wedge shaped profile, plus remodel the barrel end to give it a more angular look.

 

[Yankee0]

Had a play with a photo earlier, hopefully will end up something like this, but with a sprayed brown stock of course....

View attachment 19689

 

[Samurai]

Are the cylinder and its internals of the mb-02 VSR compatible?

 

[Yankee0]

I believe so. As far as I am aware its a direct clone - inside and out - of a TM gspec.

 

[Yankee0]

Well I finally took the plunge and bought what will hopefully be the base rifle for this build. Although I ideally was going to go the VSR 10 route, I managed to find a broken CYMA ZM51 for £20 which was too good a deal to pass up.

I have heard that upgrading these is next to impossible due to them not actually having a trigger box, does anyone have any experience with these and can confirm?

If this is the case, I will probably go down the route of modding the stock to take the tm vsr 10 trigger box, cylinder and other bits I have lying around.

Once the internals are done, hopefully it should simply be a case of adding to the stock and receiver, using milliput or similar to try for something resembling a lee enfield .303, although I've decided that a few inaccuracies are acceptable as this is my first major external mod project.

Once again, any advice, particularly from anyone who has owned or worked on a ZM51 would be much appreciated!

Cheers,

Y0

 

[Monty]

The ZM51 isn't VSR compatible, so good luck with finding parts for it. :wacko:

 

[Yankee0]

Yeah I thought that might be the case... I think the plan will be to rip out the internals, then replace with the TM vsr cylinder, piston, hop up and trigger unit from a vsr i previously upgraded. I cant see this being a massive task beyond modding the stock/handguard to fit the replacement parts.

 

[Samurai]

So you mod a VSR to take this one's stock? Why?

I bet the cylinder diameter is different so you can't use the receiver either and the hopup is also very different so the mags too.

There is no point trying to do anything with this gun except doing the DIY mods and keep it on very low power so it won't break that easily.

 

[Yankee0]

To be honest, as I previously stated, I would have much preferred a cheapish vsr from the start to work with, but for the life of me I couldn't find one at a price that I was willing to risk butchering it. The main reason for putting the vsr parts in the zm51 is that I have bought it broken so it will need replacements anyway and from what I have heard, the stock parts aren't great and arent really available, where as you know where you are with TM plus if it then has vsr internals, future upgrades and repairs will be easy.

If it looks as if fitting the TM parts will be too much of a problem however, I will be looking to do exactly as you suggest and just do the diy mods to it, as I want to keep it under 350fps anyway, plus fix whatever is broken. To be honest though, as much as anything its a case of not wanting those TM parts lying around my house when I'm running something with (presumably) inferior parts that they could replace. Good point about the cylinder diameter though, I had forgotton about that!

I think it will be a case of awaiting the rifles arrival, diagnosing what is wrong with it then working out whether it is more cost effective; to try and source replacement parts and/or repair broken ones or simply mod the stock to take the parts I already have.