Well Socom Tactical won't ever be getting my money again!

[mrfoxhound]

He's rattling off making implied threats of bad things happening to people on this thread now - so much for not caring about bad press.

Also, KM -if you're going to use TTS on IG, maybe make sure its not a load of twaddle that doesn't make sense to an infant.

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why are we even entertaining behaviour like this

 

[untrust]

who did he pick out then

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Hilarious. Show how much of a twat you are to the rest of your fanbase trying to sit on some sort of high chair. Love the insinuation in a later post that calling people out for abhorrent behaviour is somehow something that is concerning or needs to be stopped.

"Why should we normalise calling out dangerous behaviour?"

 

[Cannonfodder]

He's rattling off making implied threats of bad things happening to people on this thread now

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I wonder if he was also on here trying to sell an overpriced VFC M110

 

[Adolf Hamster]

why are we even entertaining behaviour like this

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Taking that quote on its face (ie assuming the text is verifiable and attributal to mr mustang), thats basically planning assault.

Twice i've watched my friends walking off site bloodied chunk of tooth in hand phoning the dentist with the other, that is not an experience i'd wish on anyone.

Yes ok accidents can happen, yes if you're not wearing face pro there is a higher chance that it could happen. I do advocate shooting centre of mass of whats visible to maximise hit chance, and if all thats visible is a face then that is just the nature of the game and the risk we all accept by walking on the field.

But planning to hurt someone, for a bet? For clicks? Fuck off with that, and any site that doesnt insta-ban someone for that can fuck right off too.

This sort of bullshit is precisely why i left the hobby, and i wont be back until its stamped the fuck out everywhere.

Awaits obligatory triggered.jpg response......

 

[Cannonfodder]

Would anyone actually trust him to pay up if it did happen?

This is just another occasion where he knows that by saying something stupid and controversial people will be talking about him and giving him attention

 

[mrfoxhound]

Taking that quote on its face (ie assuming the text is verifiable and attributal to mr mustang), thats basically planning assault.

Twice i've watched my friends walking off site bloodied chunk of tooth in hand phoning the dentist with the other, that is not an experience i'd wish on anyone.

Yes ok accidents can happen, yes if you're not wearing face pro there is a higher chance that it could happen. I do advocate shooting centre of mass of whats visible to maximise hit chance, and if all thats visible is a face then that is just the nature of the game and the risk we all accept by walking on the field.

But planning to hurt someone, for a bet? For clicks? Fuck off with that, and any site that doesnt insta-ban someone for that can fuck right off too.

This sort of bullshit is precisely why i left the hobby, and i wont be back until its stamped the fuck out everywhere.

Awaits obligatory triggered.jpg response......

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[Adolf Hamster]

Would anyone actually trust him to pay up if it did happen?

This is just another occasion where he knows that by saying something stupid and controversial people will be talking about him and giving him attention

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And another occasion where some teenager is watching it dreaming of when they can buy their own kmcs ghillie and get them leet headshots.

Sadly i dont see any solution other than to have another voice in the room pointing out that our game of toy soldiers is just some stupid shit we do for fun of a weekend. an excuse to touch grass and have a bit of a laugh.

You want to hurt people for a hobby then find a different hobby or preferably a therapist.

I suppose this tirade has me re-thinking the original point of this thread, maybe we do want to encourage km's acolytes to rock up in his branded gear, makes it easier to tell when its time to bugger off somewhere else because the game day is about to be ruined.

 

[EvilMonkee]

So apparently he is proud of his sexism, homophobia, harassment, racism and doxxing. Interesting take

 

[Cannonfodder]

And another occasion where some teenager is watching it dreaming of when they can buy their own kmcs ghillie and get them leet heatshots.

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As I've posted before, the vast majority of his fans aren't airsofters. When was the last time you heard anyone say anything positive about him, either at a game or online outside of his pages?

Sadly i dont see any solution other than to have another voice in the room pointing out that our game of toy soldiers is just some stupid shit we do for fun of a weekend. an excuse to touch grass and have a bit of a laugh.

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I agree that it's a good idea to point out where he's being a dick, but the way some people react whenever his name comes up just gives him more ammunition for more of the same content. You put out a fire by starving it of oxygen not throwing on more petrol

 

[Adolf Hamster]

As I've posted before, the vast majority of his fans aren't airsofters. When was the last time you heard anyone say anything positive about him, either at a game or online outside of his pages?

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To be fair, i have been out of the game a while, but the attitude he (and others, but km seems the furthest gone of the big voices) peddles was becoming increasingly prevalent and part of what drove me out.

Granted we always had masochists, people running hot guns, overshooting etc but i dont think it a stretch to argue that the encounter rate used to be much lower, or at the very least you knew which sites had that reputation.

I suppose there's an argument that a dated view of things is why i'm perhaps getting more militant if the situation in general is better now, thing is i'm not keen to try for a comeback to find that same toxicity.

I agree that it's a good idea to point out where he's being a dick, but the way some people react whenever his name comes up just gives him more ammunition for more of the same content.

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Whilst my response here is somewhat of a trope for being used disingenuously, in this case its meant as a genuine query if there are any better ideas on how to handle the problem?

I can understand that getting triggered fans the flames, but i'm also unconvinced that this particular fire will stop burning if starved of oxygen, or i suppose more accurately that merely not reacting will be sufficiently oxygen restrictive.

 

[Cannonfodder]

To be fair, i have been out of the game a while, but the attitude he peddles was becoming increasingly prevalent and part of what drove me out.

Granted we always had masochists, people running hot guns, overshooting etc but i dont think it a stretch to argue that the encounter rate used to be much lower, or at the very least you knew which sites had that reputation.

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I'd say people with shitty attitudes seem to be more comfortable expressing their beliefs but this goes for life in general, not just in airsoft. Fortunately there are sites where it's not tolerated and I find they also tend to be the better run ones.

Whilst my response here is somewhat of a trope for being used disingenuously, in this case its meant as a genuine query if there are any better ideas on how to handle the problem?

I can understand that getting triggered fans the flames, but i'm also unconvinced that this particular fire will stop burning if starved of oxygen, or i suppose more accurately that merely not reacting will be sufficiently oxygen restrictive.

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Unfortunately I don't think there is a single solution for dealing with the problem short of him being removed from all social media, but there's probably more chance of me being the next pope. People need to remember to think before posting and not to react so quickly to obvious ragebait. To go back to my fire analogy we may not be able to put the fire out but we can certainly stop it from spreading

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I'd say people with shitty attitudes seem to be more comfortable expressing their beliefs but this goes for life in general, not just in airsoft. Fortunately there are sites where it's not tolerated and I find they also tend to be the better run ones.

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The problem i found was not even the good sites could stop a cadre of bad apples from rocking up and ruining it for everyone. And when there became enough bad apples to make "is my days airsofting going to be uplifting or infuriating" basically a 50/50 coin flip (well, when i realised that's what had happened at least) it becomes hard to continue.

We've all had moments of annoyance, and i'm ashamed to admit that i've shouted at folks, and even a few times held the trigger a bit longer than was strictly necessary over some percieved slight.

The keyword there though is ashamed, this new flavour is people doing those same things but with a sense of pride born out of some bullshit bravado that being the toughest toy soldier in all of weekend warrior land is some sort of flex.

Unfortunately I don't think there is a single solution for dealing with the problem short of him being removed from all social media, but there's probably more chance of me being the next pope.

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I think you're right there, as much as i hate that being the conclusion.

People need to remember to think before posting and not to react so quickly to obvious ragebait. To go back to my fire analogy we may not be able to put the fire out but we can certainly stop it from spreading

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I'm not saying that you're specifically calling me out here, but given i knew even when posting my response to the white teeth wager i had to preface it with "taking that at face value" it does make a good case study.

Its hard sometimes, the bait can be real tasty. And all i'm going off is one picture of a bush wookie (that may or may not be km) with a text overlay of a thing that triggered me. I dont follow km content closely enough to know if this is canon or if for all i know mrfoxhound fabricated it out of whole cloth or just copypastad from [social media site] uncritically. (not actually accusing fox of those things fwiw just pointing out that from where i sit it's a possibility with no contrary evidence).

Hence having to caveat to the effect of "assuming that is km and he really did say what the picture says". I suppose it doesnt matter when the next anti-afuk post has:

Fuck off with that, and any site that doesnt insta-ban someone for that can fuck right off too.

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And

find a different hobby or preferably a therapist.

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With zero context, and whilst i hope some of his flock might put the legwork in to research the quotes and see the context we all know nobody but lawyers and academics ever read the sources (the former more than the latter ime).



On the flip side i still stand by what i said, even if the context is that its a statement taylored to get people like to me to react. the issue is someone might be unstable enough to engage in the wager.

Its the same objection i have to the "km isnt real he's a character" argument, yes thats true but even if we took as a premise that the real man behind it doesnt support what the character does (i know there is evidence contrary to that this is just a hypothetical), doesnt make it any less damaging when someone decides to emulate the character and a real person gets to be on the recieving end.

Had someone taken the white teeth bet and succeeded, then some poor sod would have gotten injured and "it was a joke for the lulz" isnt going to pay his dentist bill.

 

[mrfoxhound]

The problem i found was not even the good sites could stop a cadre of bad apples from rocking up and ruining it for everyone. And when there became enough bad apples to make "is my days airsofting going to be uplifting or infuriating" basically a 50/50 coin flip (well, when i realised that's what had happened at least) it becomes hard to continue.

We've all had moments of annoyance, and i'm ashamed to admit that i've shouted at folks, and even a few times held the trigger a bit longer than was strictly necessary over some percieved slight.

The keyword there though is ashamed, this new flavour is people doing those same things but with a sense of pride born out of some bullshit bravado that being the toughest toy soldier in all of weekend warrior land is some sort of flex.



I think you're right there, as much as i hate that being the conclusion.



I'm not saying that you're specifically calling me out here, but given i knew even when posting my response to the white teeth wager i had to preface it with "taking that at face value" it does make a good case study.

Its hard sometimes, the bait can be real tasty. And all i'm going off is one picture of a bush wookie (that may or may not be km) with a text overlay of a thing that triggered me. I dont follow km content closely enough to know if this is canon or if for all i know mrfoxhound fabricated it out of whole cloth or just copypastad from [social media site] uncritically. (not actually accusing fox of those things fwiw just pointing out that from where i sit it's a possibility with no contrary evidence).

Hence having to caveat to the effect of "assuming that is km and he really did say what the picture says". I suppose it doesnt matter when the next anti-afuk post has:



And



With zero context, and whilst i hope some of his flock might put the legwork in to research the quotes and see the context we all know nobody but lawyers and academics ever read the sources (the former more than the latter ime).



On the flip side i still stand by what i said, even if the context is that its a statement taylored to get people like to me to react. the issue is someone might be unstable enough to engage in the wager.

Its the same objection i have to the "km isnt real he's a character" argument, yes thats true but even if we took as a premise that the real man behind it doesnt support what the character does (i know there is evidence contrary to that this is just a hypothetical), doesnt make it any less damaging when someone decides to emulate the character and a real person gets to be on the recieving end.

Had someone taken the white teeth bet and succeeded, then some poor sod would have gotten injured and "it was a joke for the lulz" isnt going to pay his dentist bill.

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the clip is him wagering it to a group of ghillies during a game from his own content

 

[Cannonfodder]

The problem i found was not even the good sites could stop a cadre of bad apples from rocking up and ruining it for everyone. And when there became enough bad apples to make "is my days airsofting going to be uplifting or infuriating" basically a 50/50 coin flip (well, when i realised that's what had happened at least) it becomes hard to continue.

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I guess I'm lucky to have found sites where arseholes aren't tolerated but I know frustrating it can be. After my regular site of about 15 years shut I ended up visiting quite a few and all bar one of the sites I wouldn't go back to was down to either bad staff or other players (or both).

We've all had moments of annoyance, and i'm ashamed to admit that i've shouted at folks, and even a few times held the trigger a bit longer than was strictly necessary over some percieved slight.

The keyword there though is ashamed, this new flavour is people doing those same things but with a sense of pride born out of some bullshit bravado that being the toughest toy soldier in all of weekend warrior land is some sort of flex.

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I'm sure we've all done it at some point the problem is when it happens all the time. Sites need to actively discourage this kind of behaviour as ultimately it hurts them by driving players away

I'm not saying that you're specifically calling me out here, but given i knew even when posting my response to the white teeth wager i had to preface it with "taking that at face value" it does make a good case study.

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I'm not calling anyone out, it's just that every time he's mentioned to have done something there's an almost Pavlovian response of angry posts which is exactly what he wants. It similar to the way YouTube auditors will try to provoke police/security into a reaction before playing the victim. Although I agree that his face shot post is premeditated assault.

 

[Adolf Hamster]

I guess I'm lucky to have found sites where arseholes aren't tolerated but I know frustrating it can be. After my regular site of about 15 years shut I ended up visiting quite a few and all bar one of the sites I wouldn't go back to was down to either bad staff or other players (or both).

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I suppose it could be argued that the "good" sites i've played at were more reliant on the regulars being a decent crowd than truly effective site management, hence them being unable to deal with a crowd of bad apples when they rock up.

That is straying into a different debate though about the precarious nature some sites have and how they struggle to be able to turn away paying customers even when those customers are alienating other customers.

I'm not calling anyone out, it's just that every time he's mentioned to have done something there's an almost Pavlovian response of angry posts which is exactly what he wants.

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Hence me being the one calling me out

Its true that km in particular illicits more of a reaction, but i'd argue that's the same reason debates about the ultra wealthy usually end up ranting about elon musk. Just the most visible part of the iceberg.

End of the day my viewpoint is that if he wants to play like that then he can get banned from everywhere and anywhere that doesnt ban him can expect falling player numbers until its just the toxic crowd left.

The damage he can do personally was never the issue, its the damage the character can do indirectly by inspiring others.

When i started airsoft youtube wasnt a thing like it is now, so new players had basically no radar for how the game should be played.

Site i started at had a reputation for poor understanding that fps=\=joules and for the first year i just assumed that hits were meant to sting like hell.

It wasnt until i cashed in the free game day at a different site that came as a promo offer with my first gat i realised airsoft could be so much more fun and so much less painful.

Now imagine coming in thinking that the ultra tough guy go for headshots bullshit attitude is how you're supposed to play, well, thats how you play.

Which is why a lot of his audience not being airsofters is a problem for me, because they're people who might give it a go and when they do they have a very wrong view of what the hobby is.

 

[Cannonfodder]

End of the day my viewpoint is that if he wants to play like that then he can get banned from everywhere and anywhere that doesnt ban him can expect falling player numbers until its just the toxic crowd left.

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Agreed.

Now imagine coming in thinking that the ultra tough guy go for headshots bullshit attitude is how you're supposed to play, well, thats how you play.

Which is why a lot of his audience not being airsofters is a problem for me, because they're people who might give it a go and when they do they have a very wrong view of what the hobby is.

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Which is why both site owners and experienced players need to welcome new players and show them what is and isn't acceptable

 

[Adolf Hamster]

Which is why both site owners and experienced players need to welcome new players and show them what is and isn't acceptable

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At the risk of going full circle, that's kinda what folk are doing when ranting about km bad. Guess its just a battle of the platforms.

Taking it off the internet and into the real world is definately the thing though. Wish i had the strength to be part of that but i need a hobby that lets me reliably unwind.